Date   

Re: Seeing individual boards on Single Sheathed cars

StephenK
 

I agree.   Almost all models of single sheath cars have grooves molded in to delineate separate boards, and those grooves are way too large.  As Andy says, those "grooves" just don't show in this photo.   The don't show up in most photos (and that goes for wooden passenger cars too.).  The Accurail single sheathed cars (4200, 4300, and 4500 series) do a much better job here--the casting shows boards at slightly different levels with no grooves between them.   As far as I'm concerned, they are the best in the business.

Steve Kay


Re: Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford
 

Andy, Bob and Friends,

One of these cars used to sit in Jack London Square in Oakland, California. It is now in the Niles Canyon Railway in Fremont.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 1:02 PM Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:
A survivor with one side remaining in Santa Fe paint can be found in Southern California's town of Inyokern, just below Ridgecrest at a Hardware and feed store. A high desert community.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA

On Sunday, November 22, 2020, 9:39:51 AM PST, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:



Seeing individual boards on Single Sheathed cars

Andy Carlson
 

Note that coupled to the right of WP 8078 is another 8051 series car. These cars were somewhat unique in that the lumber door was located in the 'B' end. The vertical shaft brake allowed plenty of room, so I suppose other cars of the same era could have been this way as well.

One use of photos, such as this one, is in viewing the relative use of good milled wood back then. Flat grain wood was a lesser premium than vertical grain wood, but back in those days the old growth timber commonly used made flat grain wood a much higher quality than the common young growth wood milled today.

Notice that the grooves on this elderly car are still quite tight. What delineates the boards is more the opening of the face of the grains due to flat wood's greater vulnerability to weathering. This is something that toolmaking would be challenged to duplicate--I think that this would be better replicated with painting.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA

 


Re: Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Steve SANDIFER
 

1910-1931:

Mineral Brown – sides, ends, roofs, doors, underframes and trucks on repainted cars.

Black – underframes and trucks on new cars, route card boards.

 

1931-1951

Mineral Brown: sides, ends, and doors, underframes and trucks on repainted cars; wood sheathed roofs, wood running boards, edges of flooring at door openings, roof hatches on convertible stock cars.

Black: underframes and trucks on new cars only, route card boards (not on all cars).

Black Anti-slip – steel or metal sheathed roofs, steel running boards on repainted cars.

 

1951-1980

Mineral brown – sides, ends (most cars) and doors; underframes and trucks on repainted cars, wood sheathed roofs, wood running boards, steel running boards (repainted cars); ends of flooring at door openings, roof hatches on convertible stock cars.

Black: underframes and trucks (new cars only); route card boards (only in the early 50s, not on all cars).

Anti-slip mineral brown: steel or metal-sheathed roofs. Began in 1951 but black or redish brown granules continued to be used on some cars for several years. Anti-slip was discontinued in the late 50s/early 60s because trainmen seldom rode the car tops when in movement.

 

1940-47 – Santa Fe System Maps

1947-58 – Ship & Travel

 

Through 1937:  A.T.&S.F.

1938-1943 : A.T.S.F

1944+: ATSF

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of WILLIAM PARDIE
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2020 12:55 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

 

There are many Santa Fe experts that can confirm this but I have felt that the black roofs came into play around the mid 40's.  I have builders photos of the war emergency box car with rhe mineral brown roof.

 

Bill Pardie

 

 

 

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 

 

-------- Original message --------

From: Scott <repairman87@...>

Date: 11/22/20 7:57 AM (GMT-10:00)

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

 

Well, this one has a mineral red roof on it and a 1948 re-weigh. I guess I have been painting them wrong all this time which is disappointing.  I thought they still had black roofs then.  Certainly make painting then easier I suppose. 

Scott McDonald 


Missouri & North Arkansas Boxcar

Jim Gates
 

This is a very poor resolution photograph:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/12293485546/in/photostream/

But is that part of a Missouri & North Arkansas boxcar on the right?

Jim Gates


Re: Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Yeah, that car too . . .

 

And that after this list’s members have discussed and discussed and plain ol’ cussed the oversize gaps in most DS wood car sides.  Are we only talking to ourselves here?

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Andy Carlson
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 1:35 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

 

And not just single sheathed cars. Compare the HO and real close ups of DS cars from my attachments.

 

-Andy Carlson

Ojai CA

 

 

 

On Saturday, November 21, 2020, 10:26:54 AM PST, Claus Schlund \ > wrote:

 

 

Hi Schuyler and List members,

 

Maybe this tells us something about how our single sheathed models should look?!?

 

Claus Schlund

 

 


Re: Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Something I’ve thought for a long time.  I mean, the Accurail car with the extreme wood grain is great, but also so identifiable as “another one of those models,” as to be boring after a while (Sorry, Dennis).

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 1:27 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

 

Hi Schuyler and List members,

 

Maybe this tells us something about how our single sheathed models should look?!?

 

Claus Schlund

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 1:24 PM

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

 

Better than that, I saved a copy of the expanded image and zoomed in on that.  I >CAN< see some indication of joints but it simply was not “for sure” for me.

 

Thanks to the respondents for the clarity.

 

Schuyler

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert kirkham
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 1:21 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

 

Did you click on the expand icon before zooming?  When I do that I can see the cracks between the individual boards.  Here’s a snippet:

 

Rob 

 

On Nov 21, 2020, at 10:12 AM, Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:

 

Even though I’ve zoomed in quite a ways, could someone confirm my impression that this is a wood-sheathed car?

 

The door’s wood, but I am not completely sure that the car side is wood.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 11:52 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

 

Photo: NP Automobile Boxcar 6181 (1934)

A photo from the Denver Public Library:

Click on the arrows in the upper right hand corner of the photo to enlarge it and scroll to enlarge it further.

Car built in 1923.

The car's reporting marks are repeated on the right end.

Although not legible, there is a car inspection card above the right wheel of the left truck. 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

 


Re: Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Jack Mullen
 

I also think this is a black roof.  There's a significant contrast between the tone of the vertical side extension and the overlapping edge of the roof panels. The contrast is pretty clear on the left half of the car, but obscured by light colored weathering to the right of the door.

Jack Mullen


Re: Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Steve SANDIFER
 

I don’t know that this photo tells us what color the roof is. The official date where roofs began to be painted mineral brown was 1951, but some continued to be repainted black for another year or two.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Scott
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2020 11:58 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

 

Well, this one has a mineral red roof on it and a 1948 re-weigh. I guess I have been painting them wrong all this time which is disappointing.  I thought they still had black roofs then.  Certainly make painting then easier I suppose. 

Scott McDonald 


Re: Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

There are many Santa Fe experts that can confirm this but I have felt that the black roofs came into play around the mid 40's.  I have builders photos of the war emergency box car with rhe mineral brown roof.

Bill Pardie



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: Scott <repairman87@...>
Date: 11/22/20 7:57 AM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Well, this one has a mineral red roof on it and a 1948 re-weigh. I guess I have been painting them wrong all this time which is disappointing.  I thought they still had black roofs then.  Certainly make painting then easier I suppose. 

Scott McDonald 


1956 ORER has been sold

 

1956 ORER has been sold.  Thank you!  HTG


Re: Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

brianleppert@att.net
 

I think that's a black roof, just not much contrast from the red.

Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV


Re: GTW 583200 series autocar with 7' door - what era?

Robert kirkham
 

Thanks Tim - I have received off list some help on the CV and GTW cars, but at the end of this, no solution for this odd ball kit.  

Rob


On Nov 22, 2020, at 8:31 AM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

On 11/21/2020 2:27 PM, Robert kirkham wrote:
Hi Andy - Am I missing a referent to the 7’ side doors?   The asterisk indicates more than one door per side.  So - I remain puzzled . . . 

Rob

On Nov 21, 2020, at 11:21 AM, Andy Laurent via groups.io <andy.laurent@...> wrote:

On Sat, Nov 21, 2020 at 06:35 AM, James Brewer wrote:
Perfect, Jim.

583200-583701

XM

Boxcar

502

2/1929-7/1977

40.6

10.0

10.6*

3712

PSC

4-5/29

Stl. frame. 9'1" end dr. some re#441500-441849 series 12/46-5/47, 585203-585388 series 6-10/48 & 585389-585884 series 3-10/49.



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts <gtw_583675 40ft_DD_box_SS.ebay.jpg>


Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Andy Carlson
 

A survivor with one side remaining in Santa Fe paint can be found in Southern California's town of Inyokern, just below Ridgecrest at a Hardware and feed store. A high desert community.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA

On Sunday, November 22, 2020, 9:39:51 AM PST, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:



Re: Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Scott
 

Well, this one has a mineral red roof on it and a 1948 re-weigh. I guess I have been painting them wrong all this time which is disappointing.  I thought they still had black roofs then.  Certainly make painting then easier I suppose. 

Scott McDonald 


Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: ATSF Boxcar 212625 Bx-12 (1948)

A photo from the Denver Public Library:

https://digital.denverlibrary.org/digital/collection/p15330coll22/id/55053/rec/56

Click on the arrows in the upper right hand corner of the photo to enlarge it and scroll to enlarge it further.

Car built in 1930. The car height was extended with a new steel panel roof and upper side and end panels during a minor rebuilding program in 1941-1944.

Car has a switching tag or card ("52") on the door.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Photo: Rock Island Boxcar 22335 (1952)

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: Rock Island Boxcar 22335 (1952)

A photo from the Denver Public Library:

https://digital.denverlibrary.org/digital/collection/p15330coll22/id/46500/rec/40

Click on the arrows in the upper right hand corner of the photo to enlarge it and scroll to enlarge it further.

Built 1951 by Pullman-Standard.

Note "New Roof" stencil at upper right hand corner.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: GTW 583200 series autocar with 7' door - what era?

Tim O'Connor
 

On 11/21/2020 2:27 PM, Robert kirkham wrote:
Hi Andy - Am I missing a referent to the 7’ side doors?   The asterisk indicates more than one door per side.  So - I remain puzzled . . . 

Rob

On Nov 21, 2020, at 11:21 AM, Andy Laurent via groups.io <andy.laurent@...> wrote:

On Sat, Nov 21, 2020 at 06:35 AM, James Brewer wrote:
Perfect, Jim.

583200-583701

XM

Boxcar

502

2/1929-7/1977

40.6

10.0

10.6*

3712

PSC

4-5/29

Stl. frame. 9'1" end dr. some re#441500-441849 series 12/46-5/47, 585203-585388 series 6-10/48 & 585389-585884 series 3-10/49.



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Fw: [RealSTMFC] Photos: "New Roof" Stencil (1945-1946)

Thomas Evans
 

That's what I get for assuming stuff.
Should let the NG experts do the talking!

Tom


Re: Slide and Negative Scanners

Steve SANDIFER
 

This looks great, but I don’t have a Canon 100 mm macro that will go 1:1.  That will set me back over $1000.  But it is interesting.

Back in my film days I did use a film camera on a bellows with an El Nikkor enlarging lens and a slide carrier to duplicate slides. A pin registered mount allowed double, triple, etc. exposure for titles, etc.  Those days are (happily) gone.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of devansprr
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 12:04 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Slide and Negative Scanners

 

Charlie,

This is an interesting alternative, although it only works for 35mm slides. It came up on the RR Historical Society SIG group. Credit to Jeff Eggert over at CNWHS:

http://www.yardoffice.com/archives/howto/slideshootingdslr.html

In addition to being pretty fast, if you already have a slide projector and DLSR, it is of nominal cost.

At some point I need to use this setup for my non-RR family slide collection. I used a Canon film scanner in the past, and liked it very much, but it has suffered a hardware failure after about 15 years and I have not yet attempted a repair (nor do I know if parts are available.)

But my Canon scanner could never scan close to the 300 slides per hour rate that Jeff claims.

Dave Evans

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