Date   

Acrylic Mineral Red paint.

Scott
 

I used Polly Scale mineral red for a long time but my supply is gone.  Does anybody know of a Acrylic equivalent or a recipe of Vallejo, Mission Models, AK etc to get close?  I have Scalecoat Mineral Red and it's fine but want something that dries faster and don't have to spray outside due to fumes.  I don't use Tru-Color much at all.

Scott McDonald 


Re: NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD-Gerry Glow

Andy Laurent
 

On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 08:39 PM, George Courtney wrote:
A bit off topic, but Mr. Glow appears to have cashed the checks of perhaps hundreds of modelers, myself included, and not been heard from again.  To stick to modeling, I personally would recommend dealing with other decal and model makers.  If this is too political for our hosts, I understand.
I have had the same experience.  Paid in full, no decals.  There are some other great vendors out there that do wonderful work!
Andy L.
Madison WI


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Nelson Moyer
 

Yes, that was my eureka moment.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dennis Storzek
Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2021 8:55 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

Nelson, here is the URL: https://realstmfc.groups.io/g/main/files/Freight%20Car%20UnderbodyDetail.pdf

You are correct that the reservoir had a defined top and bottom, they were always mounted with the mounting lugs above center line.
In addition, the mounting brackets were almost always arranged to support the lugs from below. With the brackets below the lugs, in the event of a loose or broken bolt, the reservoir is still supported. Not so if it were hung from the bolts.

The secret to mounting orientation is revealed in Fig.7 on page four. Note that the air lines from the emergency and auxiliary reservoirs do not cross. Fig.s 12 & 13 on page six show the locations of the different connections on the control valve pipe bracket. The connections are not interchangeable, therefore the reservoir was always positioned in such a way that each pipe had a straight shot between it and the control valve, to make pipe fitting and maintenance easier.

Dennis Storzek


Re: NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD-Gerry Glow

gtws00
 

I have had very fast service from Jerry Glow recently.
George Toman


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...>
 

Nelson, here is the URL: https://realstmfc.groups.io/g/main/files/Freight%20Car%20UnderbodyDetail.pdf

You are correct that the reservoir had a defined top and bottom, they were always mounted with the mounting lugs above center line.
In addition, the mounting brackets were almost always arranged to support the lugs from below. With the brackets below the lugs, in the event of a loose or broken bolt, the reservoir is still supported. Not so if it were hung from the bolts.

The secret to mounting orientation is revealed in Fig.7 on page four. Note that the air lines from the emergency and auxiliary reservoirs do not cross. Fig.s 12 & 13 on page six show the locations of the different connections on the control valve pipe bracket. The connections are not interchangeable, therefore the reservoir was always positioned in such a way that each pipe had a straight shot between it and the control valve, to make pipe fitting and maintenance easier.

Dennis Storzek


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Nelson Moyer
 

Correct, and they were combined into a single pdf which was circulating some years ago. If it’s not in the archives, I will upload it.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Benjamin Hom
Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2021 6:14 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

Irv Thomae asked:

"You've mentioned Ted Culotta's "treatise on freight car brakes" and Gene Greene's [sic] "paper on freight car brakes."   Can you remind us where to find them on line?"

 

Ted Culotta's "treatise on freight car brakes" appeared as sidebars in the RMC Essential Freight Car series, AB brakes in the August 2003 issue, KC brakes in the September 2003 issue.

 

 

Ben Hom

_._,_._,_

 


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

al_brown03
 

Gene Green's paper on freight car brakes, whose title is "Freight Car Underbody Detail", is in the Files section of this group.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Benjamin Hom
 

Irv Thomae asked:
"You've mentioned Ted Culotta's "treatise on freight car brakes" and Gene Greene's [sic] "paper on freight car brakes."   Can you remind us where to find them on line?"

Ted Culotta's "treatise on freight car brakes" appeared as sidebars in the RMC Essential Freight Car series, AB brakes in the August 2003 issue, KC brakes in the September 2003 issue.


Ben Hom


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Benjamin Hom
 

Elden Gatwood wrote:
"The PRR had at least two groups of cars in classes X29 and X31 with transversely-mounted reservoirs."

Regarding Class X29, only Dreadnaught end cars built 1932-1934 had transversely-mounted reservoirs.  All other cars retrofitted with AB brakes had reservoirs mounted parallel to the center sill.  This is a glaring error on all Red Caboose X29 models (except for the Dreadnaught end models).


Ben Hom


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Group;

 

The PRR had at least two groups of cars in classes X29 and X31 with transversely-mounted reservoirs.

 

I don’t have the complete details, but know some car numbers that had them, and have furnished some details to folks on the PRR list and Society.

 

If you are interested, I can expand.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 10:19 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

I attached Gene Green’s paper to my last email to the resinfreight car builders io Group, so you can get it there or search the web for “Freight Car Underbody Detail.pdf”. Search “Modeling AB Brakes on Freight Cars.pdf” for Ted’s paper, which also covers KC brakes.

 

These papers should be in the files of the RealSTMC, resinfreightcarbuilders, plasticfreightcarbuilders, and proto-layouts io groups. If they aren’t, somebody needs to upload them.

 

As I said before, I leave transverse mounted air reservoirs to modelers of the PRR, ATSF, and perhaps other roads.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve SANDIFER
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 7:31 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

Santa Fe also had many cars with perpendicular air reservoirs.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of irv_thomae
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 12:28 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

Nelson,
   Thanks for a very clear explanation!

   You've mentioned Ted Culotta's "treatise on freight car brakes" and Gene Greene's "paper on freight car brakes."   Can you remind us where to find them on line?

   (And then there are the railroads that mounted air reservoirs with their long axis perpendicular to the car centerline, such as CN and the T&P  Are there any consistent rules that apply to them?)

Thanks!


Re: NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD-Gerry Glow

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

Follow Up


I have delt with Mr.  Glow both in the past and recently with EXTREMELY POSITIVE RESULTS.
He has been both meticulous and professional in his dealings.  I just got an email from Andt Carlson stating that phone calls had not been answered lately.  I hope and pray for the best

Bill Pardie
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: "George Courtney via groups.io" <gsc3@...>
Date: 5/24/21 5:39 PM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD-Gerry Glow

A bit off topic, but Mr. Glow appears to have cashed the checks of perhaps hundreds of modelers, myself included, and not been heard from again.  To stick to modeling, I personally would recommend dealing with other decal and model makers.  If this is too political for our hosts, I understand.

George Courtney


Re: NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD-Gerry Glow

George Courtney
 

A bit off topic, but Mr. Glow appears to have cashed the checks of perhaps hundreds of modelers, myself included, and not been heard from again.  To stick to modeling, I personally would recommend dealing with other decal and model makers.  If this is too political for our hosts, I understand.

George Courtney


Sorry!

WILLIAM PARDIE
 


That message was mentioned for Rich Christie

Bill Pardie

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: WILLIAM PARDIE <PARDIEW001@...>
Date: 5/24/21 4:31 PM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD

Hi Rich:

Hope you are doing well..  Have you heard anything from Jerry Glow lately?  We worked on a project for a while and it finally came together.  I sent a check and followed up several weeks later even it had not been cashed.  He cashed it about a week later and said it would ship the following week.  This was over a month ago  and I sent an email hoping that it had not been lost in the mail. I did not receive a reply.  I'm concerned not for the loss of funds but hoping that he is OK.

Bill




Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: "Rich C via groups.io" <rhcdmc@...>
Date: 3/13/21 5:03 PM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD

Bill, Here is the info on the difference, from RPI

The Northern Pacific got War Emergency cars in '44, but these were only 7-panel box cars with a Howe truss, not the 9 panel Pratt truss of what I call a true "War Emergency" car Tim O'Connor said the NP got these in '44. Ted Culotta said that Pullman built series 28000-28749, which had black ends, and Pressed Steel built series 28750-28999. These had Superior doors and rectangular panel roofs with wood running boards Culotta also pointed out that these NP cars were the largest class of War Emergency cars on a single road, representing 1,000 cars.

Rich

On Saturday, 13 March 2021, 08:15:28 pm GMT-6, WILLIAM PARDIE <pardiew001@...> wrote:



The NP 28000 series war emergency boxcars were seen with both black and box car red ends.  Was there any rhyme or reason as to which got what?

Bill Pardie


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone



Re: NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

Hi Rich:

Hope you are doing well..  Have you heard anything from Jerry Glow lately?  We worked on a project for a while and it finally came together.  I sent a check and followed up several weeks later even it had not been cashed.  He cashed it about a week later and said it would ship the following week.  This was over a month ago  and I sent an email hoping that it had not been lost in the mail. I did not receive a reply.  I'm concerned not for the loss of funds but hoping that he is OK.

Bill




Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: "Rich C via groups.io" <rhcdmc@...>
Date: 3/13/21 5:03 PM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] NORTHERN PACIFIC WAR EMERGENCY BOXCARD

Bill, Here is the info on the difference, from RPI

The Northern Pacific got War Emergency cars in '44, but these were only 7-panel box cars with a Howe truss, not the 9 panel Pratt truss of what I call a true "War Emergency" car Tim O'Connor said the NP got these in '44. Ted Culotta said that Pullman built series 28000-28749, which had black ends, and Pressed Steel built series 28750-28999. These had Superior doors and rectangular panel roofs with wood running boards Culotta also pointed out that these NP cars were the largest class of War Emergency cars on a single road, representing 1,000 cars.

Rich

On Saturday, 13 March 2021, 08:15:28 pm GMT-6, WILLIAM PARDIE <pardiew001@...> wrote:



The NP 28000 series war emergency boxcars were seen with both black and box car red ends.  Was there any rhyme or reason as to which got what?

Bill Pardie


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone



Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Nelson Moyer
 

I attached Gene Green’s paper to my last email to the resinfreight car builders io Group, so you can get it there or search the web for “Freight Car Underbody Detail.pdf”. Search “Modeling AB Brakes on Freight Cars.pdf” for Ted’s paper, which also covers KC brakes.

 

These papers should be in the files of the RealSTMC, resinfreightcarbuilders, plasticfreightcarbuilders, and proto-layouts io groups. If they aren’t, somebody needs to upload them.

 

As I said before, I leave transverse mounted air reservoirs to modelers of the PRR, ATSF, and perhaps other roads.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve SANDIFER
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 7:31 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

Santa Fe also had many cars with perpendicular air reservoirs.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of irv_thomae
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 12:28 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

Nelson,
   Thanks for a very clear explanation!

   You've mentioned Ted Culotta's "treatise on freight car brakes" and Gene Greene's "paper on freight car brakes."   Can you remind us where to find them on line?

   (And then there are the railroads that mounted air reservoirs with their long axis perpendicular to the car centerline, such as CN and the T&P  Are there any consistent rules that apply to them?)

Thanks!


Re: AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

Steve SANDIFER
 

Santa Fe also had many cars with perpendicular air reservoirs.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of irv_thomae
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 12:28 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] AB Air Reservoir Orientation Question

 

Nelson,
   Thanks for a very clear explanation!

   You've mentioned Ted Culotta's "treatise on freight car brakes" and Gene Greene's "paper on freight car brakes."   Can you remind us where to find them on line?

   (And then there are the railroads that mounted air reservoirs with their long axis perpendicular to the car centerline, such as CN and the T&P  Are there any consistent rules that apply to them?)

Thanks!


Re: Photo: Gondola & Flat Car (Circa 1940s)

Jeffrey Gray <bigsix@...>
 

Thank you, an interesting explaination.



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...>
Date: 5/24/21 2:27 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Gondola & Flat Car (Circa 1940s)

On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 08:45 AM, Jeffrey Gray wrote:
On the Monon gondola. That end is interesting. I would think that a pattern like that for the press die would be expensive to make. And then on a Composite car too?
No more expensive than any of the Dreadnaught variations that came after. I suspect this was a Haskell & Barker proprietary design... All three orders of cars on which it was used were built by H&B, and when I was organizing H&B drawings at the Pullman Library, there were more detailed drawings of the pressing than was normal. I also suspect that the main design intent was patent avoidance. The Murphy patent claimed "tapered ribs" and had been upheld in court, thus driving both Van Dorn and Hutchins out of the car end business. This end has ribs, but they can hardly be said to be tapered.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Photo: Gondola & Flat Car (Circa 1940s)

Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...>
 

On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 08:45 AM, Jeffrey Gray wrote:
On the Monon gondola. That end is interesting. I would think that a pattern like that for the press die would be expensive to make. And then on a Composite car too?
No more expensive than any of the Dreadnaught variations that came after. I suspect this was a Haskell & Barker proprietary design... All three orders of cars on which it was used were built by H&B, and when I was organizing H&B drawings at the Pullman Library, there were more detailed drawings of the pressing than was normal. I also suspect that the main design intent was patent avoidance. The Murphy patent claimed "tapered ribs" and had been upheld in court, thus driving both Van Dorn and Hutchins out of the car end business. This end has ribs, but they can hardly be said to be tapered.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Photo: Gondola & Flat Car (Circa 1940s)

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Jeff and Friends,

Here is a similar end on a Sierra MW car. Note the difference though; this one does not spiral but instead has concentric ovals. I've also included a view of the very interesting brake wheel. Sorry this can't be sharper.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 11:45 AM Jeffrey Gray <bigsix@...> wrote:
On the Monon gondola. That end is interesting. I would think that a pattern like that for the press die would be expensive to make. And then on a Composite car too?



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: "Bob Chaparro via groups.io" <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io>
Date: 5/22/21 11:05 AM (GMT-05:00)
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Gondola & Flat Car (Circa 1940s)

Photo: Gondola & Flat Car (Circa 1940s)

Photo from the Indiana Historical Society:

https://images.indianahistory.org/digital/collection/p16797coll35/id/1740/rec/48

Click on the arrows and scroll to enlarge.

While the main subject of this photo is the delivery of ice to a Monon train, notice the gondola with a spiral end discussed here before and a flat car with a possible granite or other stone load.

Another example of the spiral end:

http://monon.org/bygone_site/mines/CIL33149LittleBettyLinton-0001.jpg

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Photo: Mineral Range RR Flatcar 69 (Circa 1900)

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: Mineral Range RR Flatcar 69 (Circa 1900)

Photo from Michigan Technological University:

https://cchi.mtu.edu/copper-country-image-detail?duid=d708c913-d1dc-4d5f-98b9-751307c0b610&width=1242&height=732&nid=19339

Only fair quality.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

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