Date   

Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

 

Depends on who owns the molds, though.

 

 

Thanks!
--

Brian Ehni

 

 

From: <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Jim and Barbara van Gaasbeek <jvgbvg@...>
Reply-To: <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Date: Monday, July 26, 2021 at 11:45 AM
To: <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

 

But the molds and other tooling for existing models are in China.  May be hard to move that production.

 

Jim van Gaasbeek

Irvine, CA

 

(BTW, and completely OT, it is raining here, in July!)

 

 

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve SANDIFER
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2021 9:07 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

 

I do know that Vietnam is involved in production for some manufacturers. I think some are looking elsewhere due to the political situation with China.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2021 8:56 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

 


Being an importer means all you need is money. No factory, employees, regulations, etc to worry about.
China is incredibly successful because they offer "one stop shopping" from design to production, and this
has been a boon to low-headcount importers who can simply focus on high value design and art and sales.
When most of us were much younger this is how brass models were made. Same strategy, new materials
now.

Have Accurail and Bowser out-sourced their injection molding too? I recall that some places have tried
other countries besides China - Atlas and Walthers come to mind - Brazil perhaps? And I think I read that
Moloco has tried Vietnam.

Kadee is the amazing exception. But it ain't easy - just ask Sam Clarke. :-\

Tim O'Connor


On 7/25/2021 6:20 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:

Charlie Vlk wrote:

 

If somebody wanted to go through the hassle of setting up a full-blown factory here in the US, talk to Accurail, Bowser, Con-Cor, Atlas, Inter-Mountain, or any other of the companies that eventually had to partially or completely give in to overseas production or assembly.   

 

Or maybe you would want to talk to Kadee instead. C’mon, Charlie. 

 

Tony Thompson

 


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Jim and Barbara van Gaasbeek
 

But the molds and other tooling for existing models are in China.  May be hard to move that production.

 

Jim van Gaasbeek

Irvine, CA

 

(BTW, and completely OT, it is raining here, in July!)

 

 

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve SANDIFER
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2021 9:07 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

 

I do know that Vietnam is involved in production for some manufacturers. I think some are looking elsewhere due to the political situation with China.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2021 8:56 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

 


Being an importer means all you need is money. No factory, employees, regulations, etc to worry about.
China is incredibly successful because they offer "one stop shopping" from design to production, and this
has been a boon to low-headcount importers who can simply focus on high value design and art and sales.
When most of us were much younger this is how brass models were made. Same strategy, new materials
now.

Have Accurail and Bowser out-sourced their injection molding too? I recall that some places have tried
other countries besides China - Atlas and Walthers come to mind - Brazil perhaps? And I think I read that
Moloco has tried Vietnam.

Kadee is the amazing exception. But it ain't easy - just ask Sam Clarke. :-\

Tim O'Connor


On 7/25/2021 6:20 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:

Charlie Vlk wrote:

 

If somebody wanted to go through the hassle of setting up a full-blown factory here in the US, talk to Accurail, Bowser, Con-Cor, Atlas, Inter-Mountain, or any other of the companies that eventually had to partially or completely give in to overseas production or assembly.   

 

Or maybe you would want to talk to Kadee instead. C’mon, Charlie. 

 

Tony Thompson

 


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Steve SANDIFER
 

I do know that Vietnam is involved in production for some manufacturers. I think some are looking elsewhere due to the political situation with China.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2021 8:56 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

 


Being an importer means all you need is money. No factory, employees, regulations, etc to worry about.
China is incredibly successful because they offer "one stop shopping" from design to production, and this
has been a boon to low-headcount importers who can simply focus on high value design and art and sales.
When most of us were much younger this is how brass models were made. Same strategy, new materials
now.

Have Accurail and Bowser out-sourced their injection molding too? I recall that some places have tried
other countries besides China - Atlas and Walthers come to mind - Brazil perhaps? And I think I read that
Moloco has tried Vietnam.

Kadee is the amazing exception. But it ain't easy - just ask Sam Clarke. :-\

Tim O'Connor


On 7/25/2021 6:20 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:

Charlie Vlk wrote:

 

If somebody wanted to go through the hassle of setting up a full-blown factory here in the US, talk to Accurail, Bowser, Con-Cor, Atlas, Inter-Mountain, or any other of the companies that eventually had to partially or completely give in to overseas production or assembly.   

 

Or maybe you would want to talk to Kadee instead. C’mon, Charlie. 

 

Tony Thompson

 


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: St. Louis Refrigerator Car Co. models

Ed Hawkins
 



On Jul 26, 2021, at 7:54 AM, Lester Breuer <rforailroad@...> wrote:

From an estate being disposed of at a local flea market I purchased the Reefer of which photo is attached.
With hatches the number is incorrect as it should be numbered in the class RS series. 
A correct class RB , no ice bunkers, a Sunshine Models kit is shown on Tony Thompson’s blog.  After an internet search
I could not find any model of the St. Louis Reefer numbered correctly in the RS series.  All manufacture models I found had a class RB number 
on a CAR WITH HATCHES.  Wondering if I missed finding a correct lettered St. Louis Reefer model with a number in the RS series?
Lester Breuer

Lester,
The only St. Louis Refrigerator Car RS reefers that I’m aware of were SLRX 10000-10399, built in 1922 by MDT with a lease arrangement from late 1949 to 1954. The Roger Hinman class number is “M4.” 

In 1/50 & 1/51, the ORER listed 200 cars; 4/51 & 1/52 listed 400 cars; 1/53 listed 365 cars; 1/54 listed 57 cars; by 10/54 zero cars. 

Arnold Menke offers photos of 10086 & 10360 photographed 4/50 & 3/51, respectively. 
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: St. Louis Refrigerator Car Co. models

Tim O'Connor
 

Lester

I'm not sure what you are asking, but that model is a foobie. I have many images of SLRX
cars on my hard drive, and none of them is an ice reefer. Like MRS cars, they had a fleet
of insulated bunkerless refrigerators (RB).

Tim



On 7/26/2021 8:54 AM, Lester Breuer wrote:
From an estate being disposed of at a local flea market I purchased the Reefer of which photo is attached.
With hatches the number is incorrect as it should be numbered in the class RS series.
A correct class RB , no ice bunkers, a Sunshine Models kit is shown on Tony Thompson’s blog.  After an internet search
I could not find any model of the St. Louis Reefer numbered correctly in the RS series.  All manufacture models I found had a class RB number
on a CAR WITH HATCHES.  Wondering if I missed finding a correct lettered St. Louis Reefer model with a number in the RS series?
Lester Breuer

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Jerry Michels
 

Tony's comment about Kadee is very interesting.  Would really like to see comments on this.  Jerry Michels


Re: URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings

Tim O'Connor
 


Another reference article is Model Railroading, May 1991, pp.22-26

Tim O'Connor

On 7/26/2021 12:18 AM, Scott wrote:
Group,

Does anybody if there are General Arrangement drawings available for the Milwaukee Road 50ft Reefer in the photo?  According to Steam era freight car manual it was built by General American in 1938 because of the single locking bar on the door.  There is also a nice side view of this car in the book. Does anybody know if there is a survivor car hidden away in a museum somewhere?  I am particularly interested in roof details.   It appears to only have one ice hatch on each end which seems odd.  Photo is a duplicate slide, unknown photographer, my collection.

Thanks,
Scott McDonald

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Tim O'Connor
 


Underpriced and overproduced. I remember buying 6 packs of shrink wrapped P2K kits for $30 !!
Almost everything they did was available dirt cheap for a while if you bought kits. Even the "quick" kits
were dirt cheap. The only car I know that was not overproduced was the insulated Type 21 tank car,
which appeared near the end of P2K.

The P-S grain hopper was the "high hip" 4427. A fine model, but it has since been superceded by the
Tangent version of the same prototype.

Tim O'Connor



On 7/25/2021 10:13 PM, Brian Carlson via groups.io wrote:
Life-like Underpriced their initial ready to run models. I was buying Greenville gons and type 21 tank cars for $10-$15 built. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On Jul 25, 2021, at 10:02 PM, Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...> wrote:

A story. Back in the early days of production in China, LifeLike brought their P-S grain hopper (I forget exactly what the prototype was) both ways; both fully assembled and as a kit. At one of the trade shows I was talking to a hobby shop owner from the KC area who had bought both, only to watch the kits sit on the shelf... and sit... and sit. He finally solved this problem by having the high school kid he had as an afternoon counter clerk build them. Then they sold.

Dennis Storzek

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Tim O'Connor
 


Being an importer means all you need is money. No factory, employees, regulations, etc to worry about.
China is incredibly successful because they offer "one stop shopping" from design to production, and this
has been a boon to low-headcount importers who can simply focus on high value design and art and sales.
When most of us were much younger this is how brass models were made. Same strategy, new materials
now.

Have Accurail and Bowser out-sourced their injection molding too? I recall that some places have tried
other countries besides China - Atlas and Walthers come to mind - Brazil perhaps? And I think I read that
Moloco has tried Vietnam.

Kadee is the amazing exception. But it ain't easy - just ask Sam Clarke. :-\

Tim O'Connor


On 7/25/2021 6:20 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:
Charlie Vlk wrote:

If somebody wanted to go through the hassle of setting up a full-blown factory here in the US, talk to Accurail, Bowser, Con-Cor, Atlas, Inter-Mountain, or any other of the companies that eventually had to partially or completely give in to overseas production or assembly.   

Or maybe you would want to talk to Kadee instead. C’mon, Charlie. 

Tony Thompson


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings

Guy Wilber
 

Scott wrote:

“I am particularly interested in roof details. It appears to only have one ice hatch on each end which seems odd.”

The ice hatch cover (right) is either in the open position or missing entirely. You can see the latch mount and the straight line of the bunker flange as well…the car definitely has four hatches.

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


St. Louis Refrigerator Car Co. models

Lester Breuer
 

From an estate being disposed of at a local flea market I purchased the Reefer of which photo is attached.
With hatches the number is incorrect as it should be numbered in the class RS series.
A correct class RB , no ice bunkers, a Sunshine Models kit is shown on Tony Thompson’s blog.  After an internet search
I could not find any model of the St. Louis Reefer numbered correctly in the RS series.  All manufacture models I found had a class RB number
on a CAR WITH HATCHES.  Wondering if I missed finding a correct lettered St. Louis Reefer model with a number in the RS series?
Lester Breuer


Re: URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings

al_brown03
 

The article says, about brake equipment: "The cars ... were equipped with Westinghouse AB-schedule 4-12 air brakes, as well as steam and air-signal pipes" [ p 54]

"[U]nlike the cars that were built in following years, [URTX 89000-89024] had independent dual AB-schedule air brake systems acting on individual trucks" [p 55]

And that's it.

Al B.


Re: URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings

vapeurchapelon
 

Al,
 
many thanks for that hint. Does the article contain some information regarding brake equipment/ arrangement? The OMI brass model unfortunately is just plain wrong. I redetailed it at least to a point it would be functionable - but I am still not convinced of its accuracy.
 
Scott - many thanks for the good photo.
 
Many greetings
 
Johannes
Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1954
 
Gesendet: Montag, 26. Juli 2021 um 06:49 Uhr
Von: "al_brown03" <abrown@...>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [RealSTMFC] URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings
There's an article on these cars in RP CYC 16, pp 53-63.

Hth,

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


Re: URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings

Ed Hawkins
 



On Jul 25, 2021, at 11:18 PM, Scott <repairman87@...> wrote:

Does anybody if there are General Arrangement drawings available for the Milwaukee Road 50ft Reefer in the photo?  According to Steam era freight car manual it was built by General American in 1938 because of the single locking bar on the door.  There is also a nice side view of this car in the book. Does anybody know if there is a survivor car hidden away in a museum somewhere?  I am particularly interested in roof details.   It appears to only have one ice hatch on each end which seems odd.  Photo is a duplicate slide, unknown photographer, my collection.

Scott,
Check with the Milwaukee Public Library, who received a substantial collection of builder photos & technical data from the railroad. 
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings

al_brown03
 

There's an article on these cars in RP CYC 16, pp 53-63.

Hth,

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


URTX/Milwaukee Road Reefer General Arrangement Drawings

Scott
 

Group,

Does anybody if there are General Arrangement drawings available for the Milwaukee Road 50ft Reefer in the photo?  According to Steam era freight car manual it was built by General American in 1938 because of the single locking bar on the door.  There is also a nice side view of this car in the book. Does anybody know if there is a survivor car hidden away in a museum somewhere?  I am particularly interested in roof details.   It appears to only have one ice hatch on each end which seems odd.  Photo is a duplicate slide, unknown photographer, my collection.

Thanks,
Scott McDonald


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Brian Carlson
 

Life-like Underpriced their initial ready to run models. I was buying Greenville gons and type 21 tank cars for $10-$15 built. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On Jul 25, 2021, at 10:02 PM, Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...> wrote:

A story. Back in the early days of production in China, LifeLike brought their P-S grain hopper (I forget exactly what the prototype was) both ways; both fully assembled and as a kit. At one of the trade shows I was talking to a hobby shop owner from the KC area who had bought both, only to watch the kits sit on the shelf... and sit... and sit. He finally solved this problem by having the high school kid he had as an afternoon counter clerk build them. Then they sold.

Dennis Storzek 


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sun, Jul 25, 2021 at 04:38 PM, Ken Adams wrote:
I thought Accurail and Moloco were still manufacturing in the US. Accurail of course keeps their kits very simple. 
Accurail keeps their kits very simple for a reason; beyond a certain level of complexity there is very little market.

A story. Back in the early days of production in China, LifeLike brought their P-S grain hopper (I forget exactly what the prototype was) both ways; both fully assembled and as a kit. At one of the trade shows I was talking to a hobby shop owner from the KC area who had bought both, only to watch the kits sit on the shelf... and sit... and sit. He finally solved this problem by having the high school kid he had as an afternoon counter clerk build them. Then they sold.

Dennis Storzek 


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Brian Carlson
 

I have enough kits fit the rest of my life lol. About 200 resin and plastic. I’m a slow builder. Things are always available if you look long enough. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On Jul 25, 2021, at 7:38 PM, Ken Adams <smadanek44g@...> wrote:



I thought Accurail and Moloco were still manufacturing in the US. Accurail of course keeps their kits very simple. 

It's unfortunate that the hobby has gone the way it has. Tariff wars and mass and technological changes favoring produced 3 D prints may change the industry in the near future.  The longer future may bring raw material prices for plastic and resin both for 3D printing and casting to unaffordable levels due to climate change impact on future production of hydrocarbon based materials. 

Perhaps the future may make our modeling of layouts structures and railroad equipment affordable only a virtual exercise in super realistic simulator software.

--
Ken Adams
Still in splendid Shelter In Place solitude, about half way up Walnut Creek
Owner PlasticFreightCarBuilders@groups.io


Re: InterMountain HO Scale Two-Bay Hoppers (Re-Release)-now Why Aren't There Production Kits?

Ken Adams
 

I thought Accurail and Moloco were still manufacturing in the US. Accurail of course keeps their kits very simple. 

It's unfortunate that the hobby has gone the way it has. Tariff wars and mass and technological changes favoring produced 3 D prints may change the industry in the near future.  The longer future may bring raw material prices for plastic and resin both for 3D printing and casting to unaffordable levels due to climate change impact on future production of hydrocarbon based materials. 

Perhaps the future may make our modeling of layouts structures and railroad equipment affordable only a virtual exercise in super realistic simulator software.

--
Ken Adams
Still in splendid Shelter In Place solitude, about half way up Walnut Creek
Owner PlasticFreightCarBuilders@groups.io

3601 - 3620 of 189722