Date   

Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 4

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

OK, OK, the mooing stock car is over the top, but some “animatronics” can liven up an operating session, especially when you introduce something with no warning.

 

My bad order cars/shifted loads/etc., used to drive people nuts….

 

Elden Gatwood

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2022 11:48 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

 

Rob;

 

I did a load of hot (burning) coke in a gon, for a guy that worked with me a while ago, that wanted some operational fun.

 

The load was real coke glued on top of a base with a AAA battery and flickering red light.  Removable for turning on and off and replacing battery.   It did not show too good in day, but at night, yes.

 

I have lost track of the photo I had of that car.  Too bad.

 

I also have a model of a PRR GR gon with portions of the flooring missing, that was a hit at some train shows.  You can see the trainline through the holes.  Modeled after the real thing.

 

There was a composite gon of unknown origin that roasted on the PRR Mon Line and was shoved into a siding, and sat for years.  What were they going to do with it?  It eventually had a Sumac tree growing up through it.  Finally, one day, it disappeared.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert kirkham
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2022 3:38 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

 

Somehow, this fired the imagination a bit: how would you model a gon rolling along in a train while on fire .  .  .   

 

(Coming back to reality,) good thoughts!  No, I am not doing anything more than showing bad paint and rust, but will need to give that a re-think.  

 

I suspect it is a much more noticeable element in some regions and some portions of some railroads than other places on the same railroad, or other railroads or regions.  But that’s just conjecture.

 

Rob

 

 

 

On Mar 24, 2022, at 8:10 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

 

Folks;

 

Thought you’d enjoy the attached and see if anyone had the guts to model it.

 

I talked to a few of my friends, and we think it is a bad repair of a burned-out wooden floor.  The MRY is south of the PRR/Mon, which hosted many mills producing hot steel products like ingots and hot coil.  Correspondence has many examples of burnt-out cars.

 

These bad boys look great in a train, and then as a set-out or action (fire-fighting) in an ops session.

 

I have a number of bed order cars.  They usually cause much consternation.

 

What are your thoughts on this cool car?

 

Elden Gatwood

<PRR 751817 on MRY 1930.jpg>

 


CB&Q 36' Livestock Car Kit

Bob Chaparro
 

CB&Q 36' Livestock Car Kit

An HO kit from Leadville Designs:

https://leadvilledesigns.com/

Description from the manufacturer:

“These cars were built by AC&F in the early 1920s for the CB&Q. With Z steel bracing, a wood roof and a KC WABCO brake system, these cars had a 60,000lb capacity.  This kit represents the 58000 and 59000 36' double deck stock cars as they ran on the CB&Q. These cars are equipped with AB brakes. These revolutionary kits comprise of etched brass and nickel silver components, 3D printed ABS frame with integrate brake hardware and train line, a full set of decals.

Each side is built up from 3 large are layers of metal etchings providing 6 levels of detail. Although this may sound complicated, each side has only 3 pieces to it! By laying out the components this way, incredible detail is achievable. All the grab irons and stirrup steps are free standing with ultra fine cross sections that is just not possible with any form of casting. Every nail hole and rivet is represented in incredible detail.

The frame is 3D printed in ABS. This process allowed for a single piece casting that includes ALL rivets, fully detailed channels, and a train line that looks like it's being held in place through some miracle act. To this, the lettering includes number sets for 6 cars. Couplers just drop in and your trucks screw in place. The amount of detail in these cars is mind blowing and assemble with ACC in as little as a couple of evenings.”

I have no connection, personal or financial, with Leadville Designs.

Bob Chaparro

Moderator

Railway Bull Shippers Group

https://groups.io/g/RailwayBullShippersGroup


Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 3

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Bob;

 

That’s great!  “Expedited departure phenomenon”!

 

Elden Gatwood

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert Allan via groups.io
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2022 12:34 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 3

 

That's a remarkable model. Well done!

While working in Atchison,KS we had boxcars used for green hide service between St Joseph Mo and KC. The produced a expedited departure phenomenon similar to the one you described.

Bob Allan
Omaha


Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 3

Robert Allan
 

That's a remarkable model. Well done!

While working in Atchison,KS we had boxcars used for green hide service between St Joseph Mo and KC. The produced a expedited departure phenomenon similar to the one you described.

Bob Allan
Omaha


Re: Grain door lumber size

Bob Chaparro
 

Robert Stafford commented:

“I worked BN (exCBQ) Agent/Operator positions in Western Nebraska and Colorado. These were all small-town agencies. The agents talked with their elevators about the number of boxcar shipments they forecast loading out the coming year. From this information, an order for grain doors was placed with the storehouse in Lincoln, NE for the upcoming harvest season. One boxcar of grain doors for the year was shipped to each station if the order was large enough to warrant the full 40ft boxcar. Often times the grain doors for several stations were combined into a car going to several stations in the same area as a stop-off car. The boxcar was spotted on the house track at each agency. The local elevators came and unloaded their share of the doors from the boxcar then the car. The agent kept track of how many doors each elevator took. If not watched they would often take more than their allotment. After everyone picked up their grain doors the car was billed out to the next station as non-revenue company material.

I am sure the larger elevators may have received an entire boxcar or more loaded with grain doors. This would be a one-time shipment for the season, not something that was shipped a few at a time. I have no memories of any grain doors being stored at the agencies.”

 

Mark Rickert commented:

“It need not be boxcars either. The Rock Island had some baggage cars that were surplus stenciled for grain door loading. I have in my collection a pad of forms from the IC tracking not only the grain doors but the nails used to install them. If you want realistic operation have your operators figure out how many doors and nails they used in a day, document it, then have the traffic manager figure out from the totals where to distribute kegs/boxes of nails and grain door planks.”

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Re: Contact Information for Accurail

Benjamin Hom
 

William Botkin asked:
"I have been trying to contact Accurail by phone regarding obtaining re-numbering decals and have been unsuccessful.  The phone is not answered and no messages are returned.  There does not appear to be any email contact information on their website.

Can anyone provide help?  Thanks."

From the bottom of the index page, accurail 'at' accurail 'dot' com.  Or wait for Dennis Storzek to respond on the list. :)


Ben Hom


Re: Grain industry rolling loads

George LaPray
 

A lot of grain was sold "in the car" but it was not at all like roller lumber, where circuitous routing was used to lengthen the time of the trip to permit  extra time to market the load.  In the case of grain there were two principal ways for the shipper to bill the grain "Waive Inspection Set Direct" or "Allow Inspection" .  Allow Inspection cars were held in "grain yards" where the cars would be sampled and the grain sold on the trading floor of whatever Grain Exchange or Board of Trade governed.   Once sold updated billing would be provided to the railroad.   Minneapolis was the largest cash grain market in the world and most the railroads has these grain holding yards on the west side of town.including:
Milwaukee Road -- Bass Lake Yard
Great Northern - Cedar Lake Yard (gravity hump with track skates)
Northern Pacific - Grove Yard
Soo Line - Himboldt Yard (still in use for general traffic)


Contact Information for Accurail

webotkin
 

Hi,

I have been trying to contact Accurail by phone regarding obtaining re-numbering decals and have been unsuccessful.  The phone is not answered and no messages are returned.  There does not appear to be any email contact information on their website.

Can anyone provide help?  Thanks.

William Botkin
Centennial, CO


Re: Gon interior pt 4

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Guys;

 

Here’s a couple shifted load pics from the Hagley.

 

The GR and GRA had weak ends that pretty much exploded on impact.

 

Plus, a converted G22 into G22C interior for scrap loading.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2022 11:10 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

 

Folks;

 

Thought you’d enjoy the attached and see if anyone had the guts to model it.

 

I talked to a few of my friends, and we think it is a bad repair of a burned-out wooden floor.  The MRY is south of the PRR/Mon, which hosted many mills producing hot steel products like ingots and hot coil.  Correspondence has many examples of burnt-out cars.

 

These bad boys look great in a train, and then as a set-out or action (fire-fighting) in an ops session.

 

I have a number of bed order cars.  They usually cause much consternation.

 

What are your thoughts on this cool car?

 

Elden Gatwood


Re: Grain industry rolling loads

Clark Propst
 

OK then Charlie, Beings I'm modeling a branch, the cars could be picked up, taken to the point of origin (yard) and set on the 'Grain inspection' track there?
If that works restaging cars between sessions just got even faster!  ;  ))
Clark


Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Rob;

 

I did a load of hot (burning) coke in a gon, for a guy that worked with me a while ago, that wanted some operational fun.

 

The load was real coke glued on top of a base with a AAA battery and flickering red light.  Removable for turning on and off and replacing battery.   It did not show too good in day, but at night, yes.

 

I have lost track of the photo I had of that car.  Too bad.

 

I also have a model of a PRR GR gon with portions of the flooring missing, that was a hit at some train shows.  You can see the trainline through the holes.  Modeled after the real thing.

 

There was a composite gon of unknown origin that roasted on the PRR Mon Line and was shoved into a siding, and sat for years.  What were they going to do with it?  It eventually had a Sumac tree growing up through it.  Finally, one day, it disappeared.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert kirkham
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2022 3:38 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

 

Somehow, this fired the imagination a bit: how would you model a gon rolling along in a train while on fire .  .  .   

 

(Coming back to reality,) good thoughts!  No, I am not doing anything more than showing bad paint and rust, but will need to give that a re-think.  

 

I suspect it is a much more noticeable element in some regions and some portions of some railroads than other places on the same railroad, or other railroads or regions.  But that’s just conjecture.

 

Rob

 

 

 

On Mar 24, 2022, at 8:10 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

 

Folks;

 

Thought you’d enjoy the attached and see if anyone had the guts to model it.

 

I talked to a few of my friends, and we think it is a bad repair of a burned-out wooden floor.  The MRY is south of the PRR/Mon, which hosted many mills producing hot steel products like ingots and hot coil.  Correspondence has many examples of burnt-out cars.

 

These bad boys look great in a train, and then as a set-out or action (fire-fighting) in an ops session.

 

I have a number of bed order cars.  They usually cause much consternation.

 

What are your thoughts on this cool car?

 

Elden Gatwood

<PRR 751817 on MRY 1930.jpg>

 


Re: Grain industry rolling loads

Claus Schlund &#92;(HGM&#92;)
 


Hi Charlie and List Members,
 
With respect to 'resells', charlie asked: "Was this a practice on the eastern mines?"
 
Yes, on the east coast coal was re-sold while rolling in transit - this was called 'reconsignment'
 
Claus Schlund
 
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2022 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Grain industry rolling loads

Clark
Yes, a move to an open track in town or just holding the cars for inspection would make sense.  While my comments were specifically about Kansas City; smaller county elevators also had the moisture content inspected prior to selling the grain.  

During the initial discussion on ‘rolling loads’ lumber, produce and coal were mentioned. I’m familiar with the lumber and produce resells while enroute but I never saw this practice on the coal mines served by the Mopac or UP. 

Was this a practice on the eastern mines?  

Charlie 

On Mon, Mar 28, 2022 at 9:07 AM Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst=q.com@groups.io> wrote:
Charlie,
I bill my empty grain boxes to elevators to be divvied out as the train crew desires. Before pickup I add a waybill with a destination. Should I be just adding a card that says "For inspection"? I have an employee magazine from the late 50s showing a string of loaded box cars waiting for inspection and the RR's complaining about the per diem it's costing to have the cars sit waiting inspection.
Sure would be easier, quicker to just pull in a "for inspection" card than looking for one with a destination for each RR.
Clark


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Grain industry rolling loads

Charlie Duckworth
 

Clark
Yes, a move to an open track in town or just holding the cars for inspection would make sense.  While my comments were specifically about Kansas City; smaller county elevators also had the moisture content inspected prior to selling the grain.  

During the initial discussion on ‘rolling loads’ lumber, produce and coal were mentioned. I’m familiar with the lumber and produce resells while enroute but I never saw this practice on the coal mines served by the Mopac or UP. 

Was this a practice on the eastern mines?  

Charlie 

On Mon, Mar 28, 2022 at 9:07 AM Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst=q.com@groups.io> wrote:
Charlie,
I bill my empty grain boxes to elevators to be divvied out as the train crew desires. Before pickup I add a waybill with a destination. Should I be just adding a card that says "For inspection"? I have an employee magazine from the late 50s showing a string of loaded box cars waiting for inspection and the RR's complaining about the per diem it's costing to have the cars sit waiting inspection.
Sure would be easier, quicker to just pull in a "for inspection" card than looking for one with a destination for each RR.
Clark


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Jim;

 

It was far more than I certainly thought!

 

I think there was reluctance to (immediately) send the cars to a RIP track, because the guys who rounded up the gons were hoping they’d be accepted.  A load of structural steel did not necessarily need a tight floor.

 

You are right:  lawsuit-ready.

 

There were RIP tracks, and then there were RIP tracks.  I never saw 2 the same.

 

I suspect some of these pics were for documentation of damage to be submitted to the shipper.  Some were evidence for rebuilds.  Some are definitely wreck or shifter load pics.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of np328
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2022 7:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

 

I think I have off handedly commented when talking about open-top load cars - like gons. 
     My modeled railroad - regarding drop bottom gons, had some extended correspondence about the damage to the drop bottom doors done by the
teeth of clam shell buckets being used to unload coal and other commodities. The teeth would grab at the protruding corners of the doors and buckle them,
and damage in other ways so as to render the doors no longer useable. Corrugated doors were noted to promote the teeth to slide over them and sustain less damage. 
    In the summer when gondola cars were in commercial usage, my railroad tried laying heavy timbers on the floor, IIRC, 6 x 12 inch timbers laid flat, as sacrificial flooring. 
Equipping a good number of cars and the tight fisted and frugal nature in spending of my railroad, the benefits must have out weighed the cost. Part of the above conversation I found. 
Gons were typically loaded over the trucks so to see boards missing there, could have well been done by clamshell bucket teeth after being dropped into the car. 

I think damage like this is more common than thought. 

      Elden, why would this car not be sent to the nearest RIP track?
Should a brakeman or some other person be walking through the car at night, for any reason, and injure themself, it would be a slam dunk lawsuit. And something car inspectors would call out the moment they saw it. Having paged through more than a few railroad investigations, I could see folks who would have had their career ended had they noted this car, someone got injured and they not flagged it.   
      Given the building to the left looking like a railroad structure, might this be a RIP track photo documenting in preparation for a invoice to be sent out.    
                                                                                                                                                                                           James Dick - Roseville, MN 
  


Re: Unbuilt kits

Jim Betz
 

Hi,
  I've been doing this model railroading thing since the middle 80's.  I'm not telling you this
because it makes me an "expert" ... simply to add depth/weight to the following.

  If I could roll back time I'd do "one, excellent, model at a time" - taking as far as I could
towards that elusive goal of 'perfect'.  Rather than "buying and stashing for when I have
time".  As time rolls on my skills would improve and earlier models might not be good
enough any more - so be it ... replace them.  But fairly soon you'd become known as
"that guy with all of those fantastic models".  It would only take about 10-15 finished
models to be that guy ... 
  Yes, of course gaining proper skills would be critical - but instead of just consuming
you become a 'creator' and gain respect.  

  I have passed this advice/wisdom on to anyone who is just starting out.  I don't know
how often it has been listened to - I hope a few times.
  Now, "all" I have to do is to start divesting myself of "the hobby shop in the closet" -
that became the hobby shop in the spare bedroom - that even out grew that much
space ...
  I knew I had a problem when my wife started complaining about not having enough
space on the dining room table to have friends over for dinner ... thankfully I have 
one of those keepers that we all need for our support system.  
                                                                                                             - Jim

P.S. A "keeper" is someone who keeps you - not the other way around.


Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 3

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

My friend Al Buchan had a series of stories on the PRR’s offal gons, that he related to me when I built my model.

 

First, it was the most unpopular load on the RR, for obvious reasons.  Management did not want to hear reasons they shouldn’t entertain it.  They, of course, would never encounter it.

 

PRR chose their worst, close-to-retirement gons for loading.  They were lined with asphaltum to minimize leakage.  Good luck with that.

 

The load, wherever it originated, consisted of unusable hides, guts, animal parts, and liquids, in a vile, stinking brew of rotting toxicity.  See attached from my friend Dave Wilson.

 

The cars, when unloaded, retained a milky mixture of the above.  There was no way to clean out the cars.

 

No one wanted to have the loaded car around, due to its far-ranging vapor, so tower crew would sometimes “accidentally” switch it into an outbound train just to get it out of town.  This apparently happened numerous times, and sometimes ended up in a loaded car being mis-routed over and over until someone put an end to that particular car’s mis-routing.

 

There were at least a couple instances of junior switching crew “taking a bath” on the brake platform, when an anxious (overwhelmed) engine crew hard coupled the car.  There’s the “surprise”.

 

The worst of all was the story of the junior car repairman who was forced to crawl under one when it sprung a leak in the brake line, stopping the train.  He had to work for hours to find (and repair) where the brake line had pulled apart.  It leaked all over him.  Everyone abandoned him at the siding.

 

His wife would not let him in the house for a week.  His clothes were burned, but it just stunk up the neighborhood.  He had to take daily baths of tomato juice, a supposed cure for skunk sprayings at that time.  To no avail.

 

Al was not the only person to confirm these stories…..

 

Lunch, anyone?

 

Elden Gatwood

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of akerboomk
Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2022 11:24 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Gon interior pt 1

 

Or back in the day where meat processing offal was carried in gondolas.
There were a few brakemen who encountered a not so pleasant "surprise"
--
Ken Akerboom


Re: Unbuilt kits

Jared Harper
 

Bill,

So  this is the story behind the SP automobile car kit you gave me.  Like my other kits I paid someone to build it for me.  Thanks!

Jared Harper
Athens, GA


Re: Unbuilt kits

Jared Harper
 

Bill,

Do like I did,  just pay someone to build your models for you.

Jared Harper
Athens, GAA


Re: Unbuilt kits

Jared Harper
 

I hate building models.  I payed several people to build my freight cars.

Jared Harper
Athens, GA


Re: Unbuilt kits

Jared Harper
 

I just payed folks to build mine.  I have plenty of other stuff to occupy my time.

Jared Harper

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