Date   

IHB boxcar finished

Charlie Duckworth
 

Another NYC subject (this makes three) recent builds; the National Scale Car decals are so well researched I used them on the Tichy kit, the Westerfield modernized 1916 boxcar and Intermountain’s 10’6” 40’ boxcar. TruColor Rock Island FCB mixed with a couple drops of ART yellow for the carbody. Light weathering with colored pencils and a few chalk marks with white pencil.  I upgraded the kits parts with wire handgrabs, flexible rubber air hoses and Tangent cut levers. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Aerial Photo: U.S. Navy Brooklyn Yard (1937)

Jim Mischke
 



What a fabulous view!

Except for the P&LE long mill gondola in the foreground, the freight cars seem to be government-owned and in rolling parts inventory service. 


Re: F&C AC&F Mathieson Dry Ice Car

Ed Hawkins
 



On May 17, 2022, at 9:51 PM, Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:

Thanks!  Interestingly, the decal sheet with the early version of the F&C kit has decals for MAWX 5035. There are three sets of data, but no additional numbers to allow for numbering in the series posted below. That is, with one extra 5035, there are not enough duplicate numbers to number the car sides anything but 5035 without looking for additional decals. It does have car end decals for MAWX 5030, 5033, and 5035. The car # pictured in in the instructions is 5032, but there are no decals for that car number in the kit.

Bruce,
The 25 MAWX 5034-5058 dry ice cars built 10-47 by Despatch Shops, Inc., were similar to conventional steel refrigerator cars from an overall outward appearance to include roof hatches at each corner. The side swing doors with 8 hinges (4 per door) were significantly different than the various hinges used by PFE, URTX, ART, and many others. The rotating part of the hinges attached to the doors were long, narrow steel plate that extended horizontally from the door edge to nearly the center. Bob’s Photo has a photo of MAWX 5049 taken in July 1952 & Arnold Menke’s collection has MAWX 5040 taken ca. 1954.

I’ll also use this message to note a  fat-finger typo on my previous reply in which the 6-car series for ACF lot 2427 should be MAWX 5028-5033, built 4-42.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins





Re: Carmer uncoupling hardware

Guy Wilber
 

Bob Chaparro wrote:   “In what time frame were these levers phased out?” Eric replied, “…at a point in the 1930s, uncoupling moved to a bottom pin pull on new freight cars and the uncoupling hardware became somewhat standardized for a couple of decades."

1933 Interchange Rule 3, Section (c), Paragraph (9) Coupler operating rigging of the rotating type handle (which pulls out and up through an arc similar to type shown on Plate B of The United States Safely Appliance specifications), required on all cars built new or rebuilt on or after August 1, 1933.  Note -- It is recommended that where cars built prior to August 1, 1933, receive Class 1 general repairs and new couplers are applied, that the rotating type handle of uncoupling rigging be applied.

"Was Carmer hardware banned from interchange or outlawed by law or regulation? If so, when?"

Carmer type uncoupling devices were never prohibited in interchange.
 
Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada
_._,_._,_


Re: F&C AC&F Mathieson Dry Ice Car

Bruce Smith
 

Ed, Folks,

Thanks!  Interestingly, the decal sheet with the early version of the F&C kit has decals for MAWX 5035. There are three sets of data, but no additional numbers to allow for numbering in the series posted below. That is, with one extra 5035, there are not enough duplicate numbers to number the car sides anything but 5035 without looking for additional decals. It does have car end decals for MAWX 5030, 5033, and 5035. The car # pictured in in the instructions is 5032, but there are no decals for that car number in the kit.

Regards,
Bruce
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Ed Hawkins <hawk0621@...>
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2022 11:11 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [EXT] Re: [RealSTMFC] F&C AC&F Mathieson Dry Ice Car
 
CAUTION: Email Originated Outside of Auburn.


On May 15, 2022, at 10:26 PM, Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:

Given the SHPX markings on the early kit, is it reasonable to think the that car was built by AC&F?

Bruce,
Following is a list of ACF dry ice cars built with sides in which the upper part are sloped. Build dates range from 1935 to 1946. Several prior orders built from 1932 to 1935 had straight sides. In the list the 4-digit ACF lot no. is followed by the reporting marks, car no. series, quantity built, and build date. As the roster denotes, there were relatively few cars of this type built by ACF with all 38 built at the Chicago plant.

1409 - LCIX 1006-1010, 5, 5-35
1487 - MALX 5016-5017, 2, 5-36
1643 - MAWX 5018-5019, 2, 5-37
1681 - MAWX 5020, 1, 1937 (month unknown)
1801 - MAWX 5021-5023, 3, 4-38
2206 - MAWX 5024-5027, 4, 5-41
2427 - MAWX 5028-5032, 6, 4-42
2828 - SHPX 1500-1514, 15, 3-46 (leased to Mathieson) 

Painting specs for all cars: aluminum superstructure; black underframe, grabs, hand brake, brake rigging, and trucks. Stencils for the LCIX cars were green & vermillion. Stencils were black for MALX, MAWX, SHPX. Incidentally, these cars were not all of the same exact design. ACF drawings denote the same general arrg’t drawing applied to lots 1487, 1643, and 1681. A difference g/a drawing applied to lots 2206, 2427, and 2828. Lots 1409 and 1801 both had a g/a drawing unique to each lot number. In addition are 4 g/a drawings for dry ice cars with straight sides for MALX and LCIX. Four brake arrg’t drawings cover one lot with straight sides and three that apply to all 8 lots with sloped sides. 

The National Museum of Transportation has these g/a and b/a drawings plus numerous detail parts these cars. 

Contact me OFF-LIST if interested in obtaining a PDF of the available drawings. While I can provide the drawing list, the NMOT processes the orders.

Regards,
Ed Hawkins









Re: Photo: Second Brooke Avenue Yard (Circa 1950s)

Jason P
 

At minimum that photo would be 1958. Scanning the identifiable cars parked along the road, I can spot a pair of 1958 Chevrolets among the group. That's the newest model that I can make out. I can see several 57 models too including an Oldsmobile, several Fords, a Chevrolet and Mercury Commuter wagon.

-Jason P

On 05/17/2022 1:10 PM Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:


Photo: Second Brooke Avenue Yard (Circa 1950s)

Photo and information from the U.S. Military Railroad blog:

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-vq23lqNxtAc/WOZN5nGNHEI/AAAAAAAAKRU/SZh2AiQzCYIBz8RFmaANIh5SvHLSs3pngCLcB/s1600/BrookeAveOverallView.jpg

Click on the photo to enlarge it.

The location was the Southgate Terminal Corporation at the former C&O Railroad Brooke Avenue Yard in Norfolk, Virginia. The terminal was an isolated switching district that was only served by rail via a car float from Newport News. The C&O yard was surrounded by warehouses, factories, a brewery, a concrete freight depot, and a large molasses tank.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Photo: Second Brooke Avenue Yard (Circa 1950s)

Todd Sullivan
 

Wow!  Some of those turnouts look like No.3s.  Amazing what you can get away with when space is tight.

Todd Sullivan.


Re: Photo: Car Ferry At Brooke Avenue Yard

Scott
 

Can't remember if it was Model Railroader or Model Railroader planning put they did a really nice track plan for this location.  Think it was 2x16 if I remember.

Scott McDonald 


Re: Photo: Second Brooke Avenue Yard (Circa 1950s)

O Fenton Wells
 

Great photo Bob, thanks for sharing
Fenton

On Tue, May 17, 2022 at 2:10 PM Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:

Photo: Second Brooke Avenue Yard (Circa 1950s)

Photo and information from the U.S. Military Railroad blog:

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-vq23lqNxtAc/WOZN5nGNHEI/AAAAAAAAKRU/SZh2AiQzCYIBz8RFmaANIh5SvHLSs3pngCLcB/s1600/BrookeAveOverallView.jpg

Click on the photo to enlarge it.

The location was the Southgate Terminal Corporation at the former C&O Railroad Brooke Avenue Yard in Norfolk, Virginia. The terminal was an isolated switching district that was only served by rail via a car float from Newport News. The C&O yard was surrounded by warehouses, factories, a brewery, a concrete freight depot, and a large molasses tank.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Photo: Second Brooke Avenue Yard (Circa 1950s)

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: Second Brooke Avenue Yard (Circa 1950s)

Photo and information from the U.S. Military Railroad blog:

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-vq23lqNxtAc/WOZN5nGNHEI/AAAAAAAAKRU/SZh2AiQzCYIBz8RFmaANIh5SvHLSs3pngCLcB/s1600/BrookeAveOverallView.jpg

Click on the photo to enlarge it.

The location was the Southgate Terminal Corporation at the former C&O Railroad Brooke Avenue Yard in Norfolk, Virginia. The terminal was an isolated switching district that was only served by rail via a car float from Newport News. The C&O yard was surrounded by warehouses, factories, a brewery, a concrete freight depot, and a large molasses tank.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Carmer uncoupling hardware

Jeff Coleman
 

When I hired out as a brakeman in 1976 I saw one boxcar with a Carmer uncoupling leaver. It was right after I hired on and was the “pin man” switching at night, didn’t get reporting mark of car.

Jeff Coleman 

On Tue, May 17, 2022 at 12:13 PM Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:

To the question, “In what time frame were these levers phased out?” Eric replied, “…at a point in the 1930s, uncoupling moved to a bottom pin pull on new freight cars and the uncoupling hardware became somewhat standardized for a couple of decades. As the older cars with the Carmer hardware were retired, the design slowly disappeared. Some lines replaced the Carmer hardware early with the rotating rod similar to what I installed on the Canadian Pacific car in this post. I think the NYC did that on all of their USRA freight cars. You can still find freight cars in museums with the Carmer hardware. The last time I visited the Cass Scenic Railroad, a couple of their excursion cars had Carmer uncoupling levers.”

 

Was Carmer hardware banned from interchange or outlawed by law or regulation? If so, when?

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


--
Jeff Coleman 


Re: Carmer uncoupling hardware

Bob Chaparro
 

To the question, “In what time frame were these levers phased out?” Eric replied, “…at a point in the 1930s, uncoupling moved to a bottom pin pull on new freight cars and the uncoupling hardware became somewhat standardized for a couple of decades. As the older cars with the Carmer hardware were retired, the design slowly disappeared. Some lines replaced the Carmer hardware early with the rotating rod similar to what I installed on the Canadian Pacific car in this post. I think the NYC did that on all of their USRA freight cars. You can still find freight cars in museums with the Carmer hardware. The last time I visited the Cass Scenic Railroad, a couple of their excursion cars had Carmer uncoupling levers.”

 

Was Carmer hardware banned from interchange or outlawed by law or regulation? If so, when?

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: [ResinFreightCarBuilders] Carmer uncoupling hardware

Lawrence Rast
 

Thank for a clear and helpful approach to these levers. Very much appreciated, Eric!

Lawrence Rast
Fort Wayne, Indiana

Lawrence R. Rast, Jr.
Concordia Theological Seminary
Fort Wayne, Indiana


From: ResinFreightCarBuilders@groups.io <ResinFreightCarBuilders@groups.io> on behalf of Eric Hansmann <eric@...>
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2022 6:55:54 AM
To: realstmfc@groups.io <realstmfc@groups.io>; ResinFreightCarBuilders@groups.io <ResinFreightCarBuilders@groups.io>; Proto-Layouts@groups.io <Proto-Layouts@groups.io>
Subject: [ResinFreightCarBuilders] Carmer uncoupling hardware
 
I installed Carmer uncoupling levers on a few models recently. Prototype details and installation tips are featured in the latest DesignBuildOp blog post. 


Carmer uncoupling hardware

Eric Hansmann
 

I installed Carmer uncoupling levers on a few models recently. Prototype details and installation tips are featured in the latest DesignBuildOp blog post. 


Re: Photo: Car Ferry At Brooke Avenue Yard

Nolan Hinshaw
 

On May 16, 2022, at 11:48, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

Photo: Car Ferry At Brooke Avenue Yard
Photo and information from the U.S. Military Railroad blog:
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-cjArUMBygZA/WOZOBjHJ-XI/AAAAAAAAKRY/jZ_-zlQZH90dO9x21_cWbvAGeLfpEquOgCLcB/s1600/CarFloat.jpg
The location was the Southgate Terminal Corporation at the former C&O Railroad Brooke Avenue Yard in Norfolk, Virginia. The terminal was an isolated switching district that was only served by rail via a car float from Newport News. The C&O yard was surrounded by interesting warehouses, factories, a brewery, a concrete freight depot, and a large molasses tank. In the steam era there was a small coal dock to service the 0-6-0 locomotive that worked it. The car ferry was a 370 long monster that could hold 28 40-ft cars.
There were some glorious monsters in the good old days, including the Solano and the Contra Costa, both over 400 feet long. <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solano_(ferry)>
--
The thong is ended but the malady lingers on


Re: PFE 9245x R-30-5 in April 1943 - still in late 1920s paint?

Robert kirkham
 

It's a bit of a revelation for me.   Tony answered my basic question about PFE colours the other day, but my long understanding of PFE car colour - and especially the colour it faded to - was not as extreme as it should have been.    Here is another colour study from the same image as the Dry Ice reefer: https://www.loc.gov/item/2017878179/.  The Milwaukee cabooses, the other (non PFE reefers behind and also right) all show variations in colours that (to me at least) help make sense of the colour evident on PFE 72721 or 73781 - immediately above the cabooses ad partly behind the power pole.  

I’ve never done a PFE model with that colour on the sides.  Seems i have some work to do.

   

Rob

On May 16, 2022, at 8:47 AM, ed_mines via groups.io <ed_mines@...> wrote:

I've seen many B&W photos of long strings of PFE reefers on the Erie.
Some cars are light colored; some are dark.
Erie had at least one tunnel which would get very smokey with a steam locomotive. The dark colored car are probably covered with soot and grime.)
Many colorants blanch (lighten in color) in sunlight. Old Westerfield boxes are a good example.
PFE inspected every car being returned and washed some cars. I think the cleaning solution may have encouraged the color shift.
Car servicing including washing and repainting was probably limited during WWII.
Tony's excellent book has pictures of steam era PFE cars in color and they were orange.
I've seen early '50s era color pictures of PFE reefers where the car side is yellow/gold and the reweigh data is on an orange, repainted background. 




Re: Single Sheathed vs. Double Sheathed

Charlie Duckworth
 

David
Thanks for the additional information on the interior.   I’d learned something new today  
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Single Sheathed vs. Double Sheathed

David
 

While wood sheathing is applied to the interior of steel cars, they are not referred to as “double sheathed”, even if they really are.
The early outside-steel sheathed cars in the 1910s and '20s were referred to as "double-sheathed" in the literature of the time. This can sometimes make it difficult to know if a given car had wood or steel exterior sheathing without some other context or knowledge.

It is worth noting that wood double-sheathed cars typically had interior sheathing from the floor to about halfway up the side. Above that was open framing.

David Thompson


Photo: Car Ferry At Brooke Avenue Yard

David
 

Who did the C&O interchange with via car ferry at Norfolk?  PRR at Cape Charles perhaps?
The Brooke Avenue terminal was a shared facility with the New York Philadelphia & Norfolk (PRR), so they certainly could have interchanged there, though that would a rather roundabout way to do so.

David Thompson


Re: Rapido USRA double sheath and single sheath boxcar question

Dave Parker
 

On Mon, May 16, 2022 at 01:52 PM, np328 wrote:
one must recall that at the time, the billboard ban on freight cars was well into the future.
This is not my area of expertise, but I thought the billboard ban of 1937 targeted privately-owned cars (or RR subsidiaries like PFE) generally, and refrigerator cars rather specifically.  How would it have impacted the ability of the NP (or any railroad) to paint as large and elaborate a herald on the side of a box-car as it desired?  Am I missing something?
 
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

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