Date   

Re: Brass Steam Locomotives that Pull Freight Cars.

steve_wintner
 

I was unaware of that Charlie. There are any number of Brits discussing how to size continuous springs, usually under the term CSB (continuous springy beam)

http://www.clag.org.uk/beam-annex3.html

Sprung Hornblocks (aka axleboxes) have their proponents as well. The springs have to be carefully sized though, not too stiff. Paul, Eileen's and Alan Gibson in the UK may offer something suitable? 

Steve


Re: Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Bill Keene
 

I have been told that the MKT also shipped cantaloupes north from Texas in stock cars. Unfortunately, I do not have any documentation on this. 

I believe that cantaloupes and watermelons were loaded on a bedding of straw. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On May 26, 2022, at 8:20 AM, Steve SANDIFER <steve.sandifer@...> wrote:

Watermelons, potatoes, tomatoes, oranges.
 
 
J. Stephen Sandifer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charlie Duckworth
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 8:57 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)
 
I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 
 
On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:
Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.
 
When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service. 
 
 
Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN
 
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)
 
I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 
 
-Bob G.P
 
 

-- 
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne. 

<MKT 47240 stockcar watermelons.jpg><Kaw Valley potatoes, linwood, Leavenworth County KS, KSHS.jpg><PRR 134299 stockcar Tomato racks interior.jpg><1923 Virden California Citrus.jpg>


Re: Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Steve SANDIFER
 

I will add, that after the shipment of diseased animals there were specific instructions from the Bureau of Animal Industry concerning disinfecting the cars, pens, and anything they touched. However, that was an exception.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 12:22 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

Keep in mind during most of the period livestock were transported by rail the delivery points such as grazing areas and auctions. Most of these facilities had no steam cleaning equipment.

To quote Steve Sandifer: 

“Every Santa Fe employee I interviewed in Texas, Kansas, and Oklahoma who personally handled livestock shipments said the cars were shoveled and swept and put back into service. None had ever heard of steam cleaning. I read documents and correspondence from San Angelo, Silsbee, Pawhuska, Chanute and Wellington that simply said shoveled and swept.  I’m not saying they were never steam cleaned, just that I cannot find anyone among the old heads who had ever heard of it. Never say never in the railroad business. I have viewed reports of clean out and bedding contractors in San Angelo, Lometa, Silsbee and Bellville – shovel and sweep.” 

The watermelons did not require a squeaky-clean car.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA 


Re: Brass Steam Locomotives that Pull Freight Cars.

Charlie Vlk
 

All-

The continuous wire spring was a common way of springing locomotives in the 1940s.

Varney used that method and I imagine some of the Japanese builders copied it.

With proper placement and sizing there is no reason why it should not work.

Charlie Vlk


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Dennis Storzek <dennis@...>
 

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 08:12 AM, Nelson Moyer wrote:

No, you’re not entirely wrong. As I understand it, gladhands were galvanized when new but due to their location took a beating and rusted. The ends had to be kept clean for airtight fit. Floquil Old Silver is the closest to galvanized I have in Floquil paint, and I use lacquer paint for durability on air hoses. The new galvanized look is toned down during weathering. Old Silver isn’t a bright shiny silver, more of a tarnished silver if you’re ever seen really old silverware that hasn’t been polished in fifty years. I hated to see it go away.

Gladhands were cast iron, could be galvanized but eventually lost the shine. The entire sealing surface was a rubber gasket with a C shaped cross section that was folded into the opening in the gladhand. Since the air hoses were always coupled in a train, the seal surfaces stayed clean. All air hoses had a rubber label bonded to the gladhand end with the date of manufacture. During the steam era these labels were typically red rubber; about FCR color, but they were small. What's different today is the hoses have to be replaced on a regular schedule, every time the car is due for COTS, IIRC, so the gladhands are always close to new. In the steam era the hoses stayed on the car a lot longer.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Bob Chaparro
 

Keep in mind during most of the period livestock were transported by rail the delivery points usually were grazing areas and auctions. Most of these facilities had no steam cleaning equipment.

To quote Steve Sandifer: 

“Every Santa Fe employee I interviewed in Texas, Kansas, and Oklahoma who personally handled livestock shipments said the cars were shoveled and swept and put back into service. None had ever heard of steam cleaning. I read documents and correspondence from San Angelo, Silsbee, Pawhuska, Chanute and Wellington that simply said shoveled and swept.  I’m not saying they were never steam cleaned, just that I cannot find anyone among the old heads who had ever heard of it. Never say never in the railroad business. I have viewed reports of clean out and bedding contractors in San Angelo, Lometa, Silsbee and Bellville – shovel and sweep.” 

The watermelons did not require a squeaky-clean car.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA 


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Nelson Moyer
 

Tru Color has several metalics, and I think the closest to Old Silver is Dark Aluminum. I haven’t tried Tru Color on gladhands, but since it’s lacquer, it should work.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Todd Sullivan via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 10:15 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

 

Nelson,

Thanks for the correction and very useful additional information! 

I will look for a paint color similar to Floquil's 'Old Silver'.  I don't believe I have any in my stock of old and older paints.

Todd.


Re: F&C B&O Wagontop Covered Hopper build instructions

Bruce Griffin
 

Bob,

I will send you what I have this weekend. There was an article in the first B&O Modeler on modeling these cars.
 

Bes Regards,

Bruce D. Griffin
Ashland, MD
https://bomodeling.com/blog/

 


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Eric Hansmann
 

That has been my experience, Jim.


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN


On 05/26/2022 8:37 AM Jim Betz <jimbetz@...> wrote:


Eric,

  Thanks.  What you are telling me is that acrylics will stick to the HiTech hoses.

  I like this car.  Thanks for posting it.
                                                                     - Jim in the PNW



Re: Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Steve SANDIFER
 

Watermelons, potatoes, tomatoes, oranges.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charlie Duckworth
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 8:57 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 

 

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

 

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 

 

-Bob G.P

 

 


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Todd Sullivan
 

Nelson,

Thanks for the correction and very useful additional information! 

I will look for a paint color similar to Floquil's 'Old Silver'.  I don't believe I have any in my stock of old and older paints.

Todd.


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Nelson Moyer
 

No, you’re not entirely wrong. As I understand it, gladhands were galvanized when new but due to their location took a beating and rusted. The ends had to be kept clean for airtight fit. Floquil Old Silver is the closest to galvanized I have in Floquil paint, and I use lacquer paint for durability on air hoses. The new galvanized look is toned down during weathering. Old Silver isn’t a bright shiny silver, more of a tarnished silver if you’re ever seen really old silverware that hasn’t been polished in fifty years. I hated to see it go away.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jim Betz
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 10:02 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

 

Nelson/all,

  I'm under the impression that "silver glad hands" are a relatively late change and
that for much (most?) of the steam freight car era they were metal (rusty).  Am I
wrong on that?  Does it depend upon the RR?
                                                                                  - Jim in the PNW


Re: F&C B&O Wagontop Covered Hopper build instructions

Bruce Hendrick
 

Bob, I should be able to supply the directions. I’ll look for them.

Bruce


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Todd Sullivan
 

My recollections from working around freight cars in the 1960s is that clad hands were made of bronze or a similar metal, and were not bright silver, but a bronze color. 

I could be wrong ... does anyone have a catalogue that includes air hoses and related equipment?  Maybe it would show what the glad hands are made of.

Todd Sullivan


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Jim Betz
 

Nelson/all,

  I'm under the impression that "silver glad hands" are a relatively late change and
that for much (most?) of the steam freight car era they were metal (rusty).  Am I
wrong on that?  Does it depend upon the RR?
                                                                                  - Jim in the PNW


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Jim Betz
 

Eric,

  Thanks.  What you are telling me is that acrylics will stick to the HiTech hoses.

  I like this car.  Thanks for posting it.
                                                                     - Jim in the PNW


Re: Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Tim O'Connor
 


Tomatoes were loaded seasonally into PRR stock cars for delivery to Campbell's soup factory in Camden NJ.
Not a long distance, but I'm sure the traffic was pretty substantial during the harvest season.


On 5/26/2022 9:57 AM, Charlie Duckworth wrote:
I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Charlie Duckworth
 

I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

 

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 

 

-Bob G.P

 

 


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

Nelson Moyer
 

On some cars, I install the air hoses before priming and painting, then paint the hose with one of the Floquil blacks and  gladhand Floquil Old Silver. For other cars, I add the air hoses after painting and paint the stopcock freight car red for whatever color I used on the car, then galvanize the gladhand. I haven’t run the painted hoses enough to know if the paint is durable.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jim Betz
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 6:17 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Westerfield ATSF BX-12 Rebuilt boxcar

 

Charlie,

  Nice work!  As always.

  Anyone adding paint to their Hi-Tech air hoses?  What paint (brand) are you using?
I'd prefer mine to look like they've been on the road for a couple of years (at least) but
haven't experimented with paint on them.  What sticks.  I'd be using a wash over the
whole hose and then some touches of solid color to the metal parts.

                                                - Jim in the PNW


Re: Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Eric Hansmann
 

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

 

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 

 

-Bob G.P

 

 

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