Date   

Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] PRR X31A Question

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Guys;

 

Be aware that many X31A (and X31, X31B, etc.) had interior racks or Evans car loaders that resulted in exterior reinforcement plates or angles.

 

Can we see the pic?

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of gary laakso
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2022 12:42 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] PRR X31A Question

 

The current issue of Classic Trains, Summer 2022, on page 52 has an October 11, 1952 picture of a Western Maryland train with a PRR X31A in the lower center of the picture.    There is a rectangular plate with 4 small bolts at the corners and three large bolts in the center of the plate that is located at the top of the roof curve above the door with the tackboard on it.  The plate maybe 7 inches by 18 inches.   What could the plate be used for?

 

Of course, the photo does not have a car number shown. 

 

Gary Laakso

Northwest of Mike Brock

 


Re: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] F & C #6991 Pennsylvania Railroad TM8

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Definitely grey with the black lettering.  They were grey by mid-forties, but some remained in red in 1956.  See attached.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ralph W. Brown
Sent: Thursday, June 2, 2022 4:31 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [URL Verdict: Neutral][Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] F & C #6991 Pennsylvania Railroad TM8

 

Hi Sean,

 

The later PRR scheme for these cars was gray with black lettering.  The earlier scheme was FCC (red) with white lettering, but I don’t recall the timeframe for the change.

 

The PRRPro group on Groups.io (See: https://groups.io/g/PRRPro) did the PRR’s TM8 tank cars as Project No. 14 in 2008.  Messages started in April of that year with Message No. 4209. 

 

 

Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com

 

From: Sean Murphy

Sent: Thursday, June 2, 2022 2:13 AM

Subject: [RealSTMFC] F & C #6991 Pennsylvania Railroad TM8

 

Has anyone built one of F&C PRR TM8 tank car kits?  I picked up the 6991 black decal kit and assembled it but I don't know what color it should be. It looks white from the photo I have found but it could be silver. Let me know and thanks.

Sean Murphy


Northwestern green/yellow reefer color notes

Charlie Duckworth
 

I got a copy of the Northwestern article that Lloyd mentioned; lots of information but the painting details on the Y/G reefers doesn’t go into any detail for modeling. It just states the cars were painted Y/G starting in 1952.  Based on previous responses here’s an attempt to recap how a model should be painted. 

Sides; base colors yellow and green dividing line just above the lower hand grab on the left side.  Side hardware (ladders, hinges, door locking mechanism) all green.  Top hand grab on left is yellow  

Ends; green including all hardware

Roof, ice hatches, vertical brake wheel and running board all oxide red

Underframe; green 

Truck; unknown 

Any corrections or additional information.  

Thanks, 


Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Clark Propst
 

At one time some cars were leased to the trolley here - Mason City & Clear Lake RR 

Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Clark Propst
 

At one time some cars were leased to the trolley here - Mason City & Clear Lake RR
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


Re: F & C #6991 Pennsylvania Railroad TM8

Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Sean,
 
The later PRR scheme for these cars was gray with black lettering.  The earlier scheme was FCC (red) with white lettering, but I don’t recall the timeframe for the change.
 
The PRRPro group on Groups.io (See: https://groups.io/g/PRRPro) did the PRR’s TM8 tank cars as Project No. 14 in 2008.  Messages started in April of that year with Message No. 4209. 
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 
From: Sean Murphy
Sent: Thursday, June 2, 2022 2:13 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] F & C #6991 Pennsylvania Railroad TM8
 
Has anyone built one of F&C PRR TM8 tank car kits?  I picked up the 6991 black decal kit and assembled it but I don't know what color it should be. It looks white from the photo I have found but it could be silver. Let me know and thanks.

Sean Murphy


F & C #6991 Pennsylvania Railroad TM8

Sean Murphy
 
Edited

Has anyone built one of F&C PRR TM8 tank car kits?  I picked up the 6991 black decal kit and assembled it but I don't know what color it should be. It looks white from the photo I have found but it could be silver. Let me know and thanks.

Sean Murphy


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Tim O'Connor
 


This is the only color shot I have that shows the end of a Y/G wood sheathed car and it looks green to me.

I have good shots of steel end Y/G cars and their ends are always green.

Tim O'Connor

On 6/1/2022 5:23 PM, Lloyd Keyser wrote:

The Y/G cars had green ends. LK

On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 3:59 PM Dennis Storzek <dennis@...> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 12:49 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
I forgot to add that I like those two photos I sent because they clearly show that running boards
and hatches were painted an oxide red color instead of whatever the color of the roof was. This
was the same color found on the gray cars.
Actually Tim, your shot of NWX 2810 in a previous message is taken from a high enough vantage point that it shows the wood roof sheathing IS painted oxide like the running board and hatches. The brake wheel is also oxide. Anybody have a pic that clearly shows an oxide end on one of these green and yellow cars?

Dennis Storzek


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Photo: Rock Island Hide Loading Boxcar 141137 (1956)

Bruce Hendrick
 

Thanks, Mike

Bruce


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Lloyd Keyser
 

The Y/G cars had green ends. LK

On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 3:59 PM Dennis Storzek <dennis@...> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 12:49 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
I forgot to add that I like those two photos I sent because they clearly show that running boards
and hatches were painted an oxide red color instead of whatever the color of the roof was. This
was the same color found on the gray cars.
Actually Tim, your shot of NWX 2810 in a previous message is taken from a high enough vantage point that it shows the wood roof sheathing IS painted oxide like the running board and hatches. The brake wheel is also oxide. Anybody have a pic that clearly shows an oxide end on one of these green and yellow cars?

Dennis Storzek


Re: headlight operation on Spectrum non-DCC 4-6-0

Richard McQuade
 

Thanks. I don't know what to think I bought it new at Amherst a few years ago and have never used it.


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Dennis Storzek <dennis@...>
 

On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 12:49 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
I forgot to add that I like those two photos I sent because they clearly show that running boards
and hatches were painted an oxide red color instead of whatever the color of the roof was. This
was the same color found on the gray cars.
Actually Tim, your shot of NWX 2810 in a previous message is taken from a high enough vantage point that it shows the wood roof sheathing IS painted oxide like the running board and hatches. The brake wheel is also oxide. Anybody have a pic that clearly shows an oxide end on one of these green and yellow cars?

Dennis Storzek


For Sale

Bill J.
 

T’is a painful time, downsizing.  Moving along a lifetime’s collecting. 

In the early 2000s, Westlake Publishing did 3 sets of annuals.  They are superb soft cover books, containing tons of inspiration and information.  I have 3 sets of their annuals, all in near-perfect condition:

[year] Modelers Annual, 2007 2013, 7 issues; 

[year] Narrow Gauge Annual, 2002-2014, 13 issues;  and

[year] Logging, Mining & Industrial Annual 2003-2013, 11 issues.

They need a new home.

They’re available on the used market, when you can find them.  Sellers want $19 for them.  I’ll take $9 each but only as a set.  That means $63 for the Modelers, $117 for Narrow Gauge and $99 for Logging.  OBO.  Plus shipping.  PayPal f&f is good.

Please contact me off line if you’re interested, jolitzwr  [at] yahoo   dotcom.  I'm posting this on a couple of different groups.

Thanks,

Bill Jolitz

 


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Charlie Duckworth
 

Lloyd
Thanks again. 

Charlie 

On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 3:10 PM Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:
Charlie, the 6000 series of 6000-6700 were  built in 1926. 700 cars were on the roster on 5/31. By 10/42 139 were listed and 7/45 Only 16 listed. These cars were rebuilt over time into other number series. Various rebuildings changed the end color from red to green on the Y&G cars starting in 1952.  The cars rebuilt at PC&F Renton WA,had steel ends and galvanised roofs. Original hardware was black and underframe black. If you can get a hold of one of the C&NW modelers in the area and get a copy of NORTH WESTERN LINES Winter 1987 for a comprehensive article  including many pictures. Best LK 

On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 10:20 AM Charlie Duckworth <omahaduck@...> wrote:
Thanks for everyone’s input I just need to make a run up to House of Trains and buy some paint.  I probably won’t get to this project for a few weeks I’ve got to finish the X23 (working on the underframe today) and the three RI stock cars need to have their underframes finished. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Lloyd Keyser
 

Charlie, the 6000 series of 6000-6700 were  built in 1926. 700 cars were on the roster on 5/31. By 10/42 139 were listed and 7/45 Only 16 listed. These cars were rebuilt over time into other number series. Various rebuildings changed the end color from red to green on the Y&G cars starting in 1952.  The cars rebuilt at PC&F Renton WA,had steel ends and galvanised roofs. Original hardware was black and underframe black. If you can get a hold of one of the C&NW modelers in the area and get a copy of NORTH WESTERN LINES Winter 1987 for a comprehensive article  including many pictures. Best LK 

On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 10:20 AM Charlie Duckworth <omahaduck@...> wrote:
Thanks for everyone’s input I just need to make a run up to House of Trains and buy some paint.  I probably won’t get to this project for a few weeks I’ve got to finish the X23 (working on the underframe today) and the three RI stock cars need to have their underframes finished. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Tim O'Connor
 


I forgot to add that I like those two photos I sent because they clearly show that running boards
and hatches were painted an oxide red color instead of whatever the color of the roof was. This
was the same color found on the gray cars.

I have 52 images of NWX reefers and not a single overhead shot ! :-D

Also note this photo of a freshly painted GRAY reefer with a shop date of 7-1954. So the two paint
schemes overlapped each other.

Tim O'Connor


On 6/1/2022 7:03 AM, Charlie Duckworth wrote:

Lloyd 
thanks for the clarifications; what color was the ladders and door hardware?  I ‘assume’ green and the underframe? Black?   Also the Odd Ball decal set has numbers in the 6000 range is this accurate for the wood cars?  
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Final Wash For Flat Car Decks

steve_wintner
 

For staining real wood, Tools for Working Wood, Lee Valley, and others offer a multitude of products, using a variety of solvents. 

Steve


Re: Help with Northwestern green/yellow reefer

Tim O'Connor
 


I don't know about those numbers but NWX had many different wood ice reefers while the Branchline
and Westerfield models represent ACF Type 2 and Type 3
reefers built in the 1920's. Of course the
Westerfield instructions are an excellent source for prototype information. :-)

I think there are exact color matches for CNW yellow and green. Call Des Plaines Hobbies because I
know they used to have custom CNW mixes too.

Tim O'Connor


On 5/31/2022 5:37 PM, Charlie Duckworth wrote:

Friend recently gave me two Branchline reefers one for the Northwestern with the gray sides.  The car unfortunately lettering is as built in 1927 and I’m modeling the early 1950’s.  I found an Odd Ball set for the Northwestern green and yellow scheme and have the sides stripped down to the bare plastic.  This reefer is totally out of my expertise and need some SME help.  

the decal sheet has the following car numbers 6201, 6311 and 6700 for NWX. Are these good for the wood reefers?

What’s recommended for the green and yellow colors and finally what color was the roof, ends and underframe?

lots of questions but I couldn’t find anything with a google search or a search on .io. 

thanks. 
--
Charlie Duckworth


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Final Wash For Flat Car Decks

Tim O'Connor
 


Either isopropyl alcohol or denatured alcohol, depending on the precise results you want. (They evaporate differently.)

I also usually use a warm/hot air gun because evaporation time can make a difference.

The dilution can vary greatly. If I am using a brush, I also keep a pad of assorted dry pigments handy to pick up a few grains
of color to add to the wash.


On 5/31/2022 10:18 PM, WILLIAM PARDIE wrote:

Some time ago thinned India Ink was a recommended final wash for weathering flat car decks.  Does anyone recall what was used to thin the ink?

Thanks:

Bill Pardie


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Photo: Rock Island Hide Loading Boxcar 141137 (1956)

hubert mask
 

I offer the hide loading car Rock Island.  Decal set 87-315 all decals are listed in alphabetical order.  Maskislanddecals.com

Hubert Mask 


On Jun 1, 2022, at 1:07 PM, Schleigh Mike via groups.io <mike_schleigh@...> wrote:


Yes, Bruce, & Group----

Hide cars possessed a ruinous stink!  The smell was so bad that city fathers at Salamanca, New York requested that resident ERIE RR keep the accumulating westbound empties out of town rather than in the local yard.

Yes, Bruce, these tended to be older, single-sheathed cars but there were exceptions such as all steel cars and even cars less than five years old.

This particular car, RI 141137, was from the 141000-141999 group of 1929 and later.  These first 1000 (8'-7" I.H.) can be modeled using Sunshine Models Kit 57.1.  My long-ago study of hide cars show four other cars of this group loading from late 1952 to mid-1956.  These were four of 22 Rock Island cars that were found in the sampling done for that study.  At or slightly after 1960 this railroad started collecting all hide cars into a 'catch-all' series, 40000-40999.  After 1960 nine more RI cars were also found in this service.

There was earlier mention of ATSF's Bx-39 50 foot 'Emergency' cars.  These 40180-40244 cars show up four times between 1954 and 1966 in my survey.

Hide loaded cars were smelly and ruined for general service but were necessary for the work of their day.  While small compared to other 'finer' loadings, this was an important part of the tanning industry once conducted throughout much of the northeast and elsewhere.

Regards form Mike Schleigh in western Penna. (Grove City)

On Wednesday, June 1, 2022, 10:44:02 AM EDT, Bruce Hendrick <brucehendrick@...> wrote:


Note the stencil HIDE LOADING ONLY. I have read in several places that the stench from the hides was so bad that any car so used was ruined for any other type of service. Therefore, older cars were usually used, which seems to be the case in this 1956 view.

Thanks for sharing.

Bruce Hendrick
Brea, California





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