Date   

INteresting freight car parts - parts is parts

Schuyler G Larrabee <SGL2@...>
 

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/dh/dh.html

Scroll down about 60% of the way, look for the C(larence) Tharp photos of
"Frt Cars" to see some interesting photos of Freight car parts thanks to
scrapping.

Also see:
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/dh/dh-wrk-hkk.jpg
for a good look at the underside of a modern-ish freight car. Post 1960,
sorry, but steam era cars were a lot like this too . . .

SGL


Re: PS-1 lettering help

Schuyler G Larrabee <SGL2@...>
 

I should have done this before:

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/dh/dh19360ajs.jpg
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/dh/dh20150bs.jpg

both show "THE BRIDGE LINE . . . " and 19360 is taken in 1967. 20150 is
undated. But

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/dh/dh19516ajs.jpg

is dated 1967, and

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/dh/dh19561ajs.jpg

is dated 1966, so it's possible that these cars never saw the
"SESQUICENTENNIAL" version. Unfortunately, no original scheme image is on
George's site.

SGL

----- Original Message -----
From: "Schuyler G Larrabee" <SGL2@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:56 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: PS-1 lettering help


Bud Rindfleisch asked about:


Set # 63 D&H round herald...was this scheme used
before the shield herald?
Bud, I can't tell you exactly the whole answer, but I can tell you to be
careful here. As Don said, the simple answer is yes, but exactly when do
you want to be modeling?

The D&H PS-1s originally had no circle herald , but had a "The D&H" script
logo in the upper left corner of the car. Kadee decorated their model of
18570 this way, blt date 10-50. An image of this is probably on line
somewhere. Later, they had the circle herald, but the lettering in the
circle was changed at some point. In one version it was "THE BRIDGE LINE
TO
NEW ENGLAND AND CANADA." "AND" might have been "&." Later it read
something about "SESQUICENTENNIAL" (however that's spelled . . . ). I
can't
recall the exact wording, nor exactly when it was changed, but I think
that
wasn't until the late 60's/early 70's.

At least for a long time, "THE BRIDGE LINE . . . " was hard to find in HO.

I hope this is helpful.

SGL



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
STMFC-unsubscribe@...



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


Re: Modeling Assistance

Benjamin Frank Hom <b.hom@...>
 

Some more cars identified from Pierre Oliver's list:

Boxcars:

DL&W 50256
Actually a Pratt Truss stock car with braced ends and wood roof (DL&W
50250-50299, Keyser Valley, April 1927, c.f. DL&W 1952 Equipment Diagram
Book). Train-Miniature/Walthers stock car kitbash base (new roof and
underframe).

D&H 22948
36 ft DS boxcar, built 1906-1907, rebuilt during 1920s with Burnett/ Z-bar
reinforced ends, or Hutchins ends (I don't have a specific breakdown of
which cars got what end)
Funaro & Camerlengo 3400-3406

NYC 148071
Lot 536-B, USRA-design steel 1 1/2-door auto boxcar
Westerfield 3001

SL-SF 163637
1937 AAR boxcar, 9 ft 11.5 in IH, 4/5 ends, Duryea cushion underframe
Kit - need photo to determine if square or W-section corner post (I made the
call based from an equipment diagram book)

NYC 199013
Lot 530-B, USRA-design steel boxcar
Westerfield 2901

ATSF 149341
Class Bx-36, USRA DS boxcar steel rebuild
Sunshine 9.6 (out of production), Athearn or Intermountain kitbash (new
ends, underframe, side sills)

SL-SF 148660
Frisco Howe truss SS boxcar - see Ted Culotta's article in the April 2003
RMC
Sunshine 39.1

UP 196442
Class B-50-38, postwar AAR boxcar, 6 ft door, rectangular panel roof, 4/4
early IDE
Branchline 1434 (if you can live without the ACR)


Ben Hom


Re: PS-1 lettering help

Schuyler G Larrabee <SGL2@...>
 

Bud Rindfleisch asked about:


Set # 63 D&H round herald...was this scheme used
before the shield herald?
Bud, I can't tell you exactly the whole answer, but I can tell you to be
careful here. As Don said, the simple answer is yes, but exactly when do
you want to be modeling?

The D&H PS-1s originally had no circle herald , but had a "The D&H" script
logo in the upper left corner of the car. Kadee decorated their model of
18570 this way, blt date 10-50. An image of this is probably on line
somewhere. Later, they had the circle herald, but the lettering in the
circle was changed at some point. In one version it was "THE BRIDGE LINE TO
NEW ENGLAND AND CANADA." "AND" might have been "&." Later it read
something about "SESQUICENTENNIAL" (however that's spelled . . . ). I can't
recall the exact wording, nor exactly when it was changed, but I think that
wasn't until the late 60's/early 70's.

At least for a long time, "THE BRIDGE LINE . . . " was hard to find in HO.

I hope this is helpful.

SGL


New England/Northeast Prototype meet approaches!

Owens, David <DOwens@...>
 

PLEASE EXCUSE MULTIPLE COPIES OF THIS EMAIL -- Thanks, Dave

Two days of clinics, model displays and camaraderie intended to teach you a
few new modeling tricks and to get you excited about doing some model
railroading.

New England/Northeast
Prototype Modelers Meet
Noon to whenever May 30, 8 a.m. to whenever May 31, 2003
Canton Community Center, 40 Dyer Ave., Canton/Collinsville, CT
Fee is only $10 SCHEDULE OF EVENTS (Subject to change)
Friday May 30
Noon Registration begins/Model set up
12:30 p.m. David Geisler, "A Century of Canadian National"
2 p.m. Mike Rose, "Prototype Weathering"
3 - 7 p.m. Branchline tours and dinner on your own. Branchline tours
are limited to
20 people at a time. They take about 30 minutes. Sign up
ahead of time
with Dave Owens (dowens@...
<mailto:dowens@...>).
7 p.m. First slide show - Bob LaMay, "Six Decades of Railroad Photography."
The late 1950s to 2003 - see it all - From Maine to Miami, Chicago to
Connecticut, day, night, rain, ice and snow. See trains in their environment
- action, scenics, roster, and from just about every angle to catch all
those details the modeler wants.
8 p.m. Second slide show - Pete McLachlan, "A Railfan's Career on the New
Haven, Penn Central and Conrail." Pete took a camera to work with him
darned near every day!
Saturday May 31
8 a.m. Registration/more model setup
9 a.m. Mike Tylick, "Scenery in Tight Places"
Andy Miller, "Kadee Coupler Tricks"
10:30 a.m. Jim Tylick, "Operations on the B&A"
Don Valentine, "Heavyweight Pullman Modeling"
Noon Break for lunch
1 p.m. Scott Mason, "Building Topnotch Craftsman Kits"
John Burroughs, "Wheelsets Really Matter"
2:30 p.m. George Barrett, "Modeling Prototype Vehicles"
Ben Brown, "Modeling Milk Cars"
4 p.m. John Greene, "Modeling Head End Equipment"
Al Hoffman, "Live Poultry Cars"
5:30 p.m. Dinner on your own
7 p.m. Keynote - Tony Koester, "Multilevel Design on the 1954 NKP"
8 p.m. Third slide show - Robert A. Buck, "The B&A in Photos"
9 p.m. Fourth slide show - Chuck Johnson, "NYC, PC and B&M around
Springfield, Mass."
Sunday June 1
At least six area layouts will be open to meet participants. Details
and sign-up sheets will be available at the meet.

DIRECTIONS: The meet is at the Canton Community Center, 40 Dyer Ave.,
Canton/Collinsville, Conn. From the north and east, take exit 39 off of I-84
and follow Route 4 west to Route 179 north into Collinsville. Bear right at
the gas station onto Maple Ave., then take the next left onto Dyer Ave. From
the west and south, take Route 8 to Exit 44 in Torrington, then take Route
202 east into Canton. After the 179/202 interesection, turn right onto Dyer
Avenue. (Drive all the way around the library to the back parking lot.) If
you get lost, call Dave Owens at 860-209-8155 or Fran Richard at
860-614-5333.




The heart of any prototype meet is the model display and all are encouraged
to bring models to display - even incomplete models. There are no contests
or judging. Come learn, show your models, and share your skills and
techniques with others.


Re: Farming Loads

Douglas Harding <dharding@...>
 

Ted
Am a little surprised that Clark did not add this to his answer. Lots of
ag lime is mined right here in Iowa, as in any state with limestone
deposits. It is spread on soils that are to acidic. Early limestone I
believe was hauled in gons and hoppers to crushers, then (like cement)
in boxcars, bagged or bulk. Today most is handled in covered hoppers, or
more likely covered trucks. A current check shows over 150 active
Limestone companies in Iowa alone. They produce limestone gravel,
powered ag lime, lime for cement production, etc.

Here is a link to the history of limestone in Iowa:
http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~quarries/states/iowa.html

As to Ag Lime the following is from:
http://www.soils.wisc.edu/~barak/soilscience326/may07_02.htm which also
has some interesting photos of early lime application.
"Soil Acidification and Liming: Causes and cures
Many soils are naturally acidic as a result of the pedogenic processes
that formed them. All agricultural soils receiving input of ammoniacal
fertilizers, including ammonia, urea, ammonium nitrate, ammonium
sulfate, etc., are subject to cumulative acidification ....

Acid soils are weak acids, but unlike dissolved weak acids such as
acetic acids, the reserve acidity is in the solid phase instead of the
liquid phase. ...

The remedy for acid soils is adding base. Usually the base is a weak
base such as calcium carbonate, ....

Liming can be considered as part of sustainable agriculture for
noncalcareous soils but the mechanics of incorporation are more
difficult with conservation tillage practices. With moldboard plows,
aglime would be applied dry to the soil surface and then mixed
thoroughly, and relatively uniformly, with the plow. With minimum
tillage or no tillage practices, it is difficult or impossible to mix
aglime into the entire soil volume that needs pH correction and simple
surface application of aglime will not react with the underlying soil
with requisite speed.

Liming Materials
The standard of aglime is pure calcium carbonate, ... Aglime materials
are often sieved to various mesh sizes to analyze the particle size,
with each sieve size assigned a relative value reflecting its
reactivity, ...

In addition to calcitic limestone, "dolomite" [=dolostone] or dolomitic
limestone containing the mineral dolomite [CaMg(CO3)2 or CaCO3MgCO3] is
often used as a liming material, ...

Other liming materials are waste products from other industries. For
example, spent lime from chimney scrubbing operations designed to remove
S from emissions of power plants and incinerators still contain
considerable neutralizing power. Fly ash, slag, kiln dust, and papermill
slurry are other liming materials that wastes that would otherwise have
to be disposed of in landfills. ...."

Now freight car fans, as I said, I assumed how the traffic was handled.
But truly, what kind of cars transported ag lime? Any Photo's?

Doug Harding
Iowa Central Railroad
www.iowatelecom.net/~dharding/


Re: PS-1 lettering help

Don Valentine
 

Quoting BlackDiamondRR@...:

Hello, I have recently purchased 10 resin 40' PS-1 kits in S scale from
Kaslo
Shops. These are the 6' door variety. I plan to letter one of them in
D&H
using a CDS dry transfer set. Set # 63 D&H round herald...was this
scheme used
before the shield herald?
Simple answer, yes.


Good luck, Don Valentine


Re: Caboose brakes

Don Strack <donstrack@...>
 

To all who are lamenting the lack of detailed brake information in the UPHS
UP caboose book.

I am embarassed to admit that the subject never crossed my much-befuddled
mind, nor did it come up among the reviewers, at least until Bill Metzger
asked, "So when did the CA-1s get power hand brakes?"

<big pause>

Umm...

I have copies of the general arrangement drawing for the CA-1, which
Walthers borrowed to make its great model. But it doesn't show brake
arrangement. As to when power brakes were applied, as Dick Harley wrote,
only additonal research will discover that data.

I have been asked why the Walthers model does not have a tool box (which may
or may not have later been a battery box, like on the steel cars). The
answer is that the drawing I sent Walthers did not have the tool box, but I
have another drawing that does have the tool box. I guess I should have
thought of that. Like I said, Umm...

I am working on a web page as a location to add updates and corrections for
the caboose book. Having brake information there seems like a good idea. The
next problem would be how to scan large drawings. I can convert them to PDF,
but they'd still be awful big files, as in almost 50 meg each.

Don Strack
http://utahrails.net


Farming Loads

JGG KahnSr <jacekahn@...>
 

There is a photo in Ed Lewis's Arcade and Attica book of six or eight woodside gondolas (the lead one is an Erie) and a large placard announcing "a trainload of Michigan limestone for Wyoming County agriculture" (or something very similar), taken in the 1920's. I conjecture some lime came as a by-product of quarrying limestone, some may have been a primary product of a rock-crusher operation.
Jace Kahn

Does anybody know the source of lime for agricultural use?
It too is a fertilizer, but has to be applied very sparingly. I've been told it
will 'burn' the soil.
Clark Propst
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail


Re: Farming Loads

Clark Propst <cepropst@...>
 

Ted Larson wrote: Should I assume that Iowa coal came straight from the coal
fields via rail?

Yes, maybe. Most rural locations had no way to unload hoppers. The gondola
loaded with coal was shoveled into sheds. These sheds had sliding doors tracked.
The bottoms of the doors were well above track height. There were doors on the
back of the sheds at ground level for loading trucks. The shed had several bins
with separate doors for different grades of coal.

Why was the coal from the twin ports in boxcars rather than hoppers?
I would assume to keep it from freezing. One of the local cement plants
received a hopper of iron ore in the winter. It took six weeks to unload! I can
list all the box car loads on coal from Fairfax MN, there were alot. It has been
mentioned on this list that there was a special elevator for loading coal into
box cars.

Does anybody know the source of lime for agricultural use?
It too is a fertilizer, but has to be applied very sparingly. I've been told it
will 'burn' the soil.

This car of phosphate was loaded from a barge at the Mississippi river terminal
at Keithburg Iowa 11/24/59 M&StL 54356 XM phosphate

These three car loads are from the M&StL Fairfax MN agent's seal book.
4/2/48 CofG 6941 PHOSPHATE XM 6300-6999 FARMERS COOP
4/5/48 IHB 10140 PHOSPHATE XM 10000-10599 RENVILLE,SIBLEY AGENT
1/12/48 L&A 16014 PHOSPHATE XM 16001-16300 PACIFIC GRAIN
Clark Propst

"Beckert, Shawn" wrote: Wonder what the phosphate was for?
Fertilizer Shawn. I should again mention this was a Minnesota elevator
and shipped crops not grown in Iowa and received coal from Duluth in
box cars. Iowa elevators received coal in gondolas.
Clark<<<

Several comments;

Should I assume that Iowa coal came straight from the coal fields via
rail?

Why was the coal from the twin ports in boxcars rather than hoppers?

Does anybody know the source of lime for agricultural use? I remember
seeing many hopper loads of lime unloaded at the team track in my
central Minnesota home town. I never paid attention to what road name
was on the hoppers.

Many grain elevators also had a feed mill for grinding the grain for
use by local farmers.

An enclosed "shed" on the side opposite the tracks was for unloading
the farmer's truck or grain wagon. At the facilities that I saw,
trucks were not loaded in these sheds.


=====
Ted Larson

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com


To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
STMFC-unsubscribe@...



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


Re: (Fwd) Caboose brakes and cupolas

Andy Sperandeo <asperandeo@...>
 

I recall that several of the photos in the Strack and Ehernberger book do
show CA-1s with AB brakes, but I don't remember trying to correlate that
feature with dates.

For myself, I'm intrigued by the CA-1s with straight-sided cupolas - its an
LA&SL thing. Does anyone have a drawing for one of these cupolas, or know
where to find one? I've tried fitting a cupola from an old Roundhouse kit to
the Walthers CA-1 just to see if it would work, but it doesn't. I might be
motivated enough to scratchbuild a straight cupola, even if I have to
estimate dimensions from photos - as if I didn't have enough projects
already!

So long,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
MODEL RAILROADER Magazine
262-796-8776, ext. 461
Fax 262-796-1142
asperandeo@...


(No subject)

lrkdbn <ab8180@...>
 


Re: (Fwd) Caboose brakes

philgulley
 

Thanks to everyone who answered my questions.

Dick Harley said:

As others have said, the two hand brake wheels connect to the same
mechanism
at the single brake cylinder that actuates brakes on both trucks.
"philgulley" did not say what era he is modeling, and that does
affect what
brake system he should install.
The drawing for the change to AB brakes is 154-C-9548, and it
was drawn in June of 1947. How soon and/or fast this change was
implemented
is not clear.
Well, I model 1952 so I have assumed AB brakes but... tonight I will
look carefully at photos in the UP cabooses book. Since cabooses were
not in interchange I don't know if they were subject to the 1953 AB
brake deadline. In an earlier post Tony T mentioned typically the
lever connecting to the cylinder was simply longer on a caboose. I
assume he meant then the rod from the A end brake wheel connects to
the lever near where the rod to the B end truck connects.Do I have
this correct? I don't own any Cycs (where Tony mentioned to look)
just a few of the Train shed reprints.

Phil Gulley


Re: PFE Decal Confusion

Bruce F. Smith <smithbf@...>
 

Shawn asks:
I'm in need of PFE decals to do Intermountain's R-40-23
reefer kits. Awhile back someone mentioned that Champ's
SHS-190 set was the way to go for this, but in checking
the Champ site this morning I see there is also an HR-61
set for "Orange Car, UP-SP All Black Lettering". If the
SHS-190 set is the "main" PFE set, what does HR-61 do?

Also, Champ lists the SHS-190 set as for "Express Reefer".
I don't have any express cars, but I'm acquiring quite a
lot of plain vanilla R-40-23's.

Is the SHS-190 still the right set for my needs?
IIRC, the SHS-190 is the "Blue Ribbon set" and pretty much the set to get
to letter any PFE reefer up to 1960 or so. If you need color UP
medallions, I think you need to order them seperately (at least I did).

Happy Rails
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith V.M.D., Ph.D.
Scott-Ritchey Research Center
334-844-5587, 334-844-5850 (fax)
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ____________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|____________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


PFE Decal Confusion

Shawn Beckert
 

List,

I'm in need of PFE decals to do Intermountain's R-40-23
reefer kits. Awhile back someone mentioned that Champ's
SHS-190 set was the way to go for this, but in checking
the Champ site this morning I see there is also an HR-61
set for "Orange Car, UP-SP All Black Lettering". If the
SHS-190 set is the "main" PFE set, what does HR-61 do?

Also, Champ lists the SHS-190 set as for "Express Reefer".
I don't have any express cars, but I'm acquiring quite a
lot of plain vanilla R-40-23's.

Is the SHS-190 still the right set for my needs?

Thanks,

Shawn Beckert


Re: PS-1 lettering help

BlackDiamondRR@...
 

Hello, I have recently purchased 10 resin 40' PS-1 kits in S scale from Kaslo
Shops. These are the 6' door variety. I plan to letter one of them in D&H
using a CDS dry transfer set. Set # 63 D&H round herald...was this scheme used
before the shield herald?
One other I want to do in C&NW Route of the "400" Streamliners scheme.
The CDS set for this has a car number of 1098. I can't find this # in the PS-1
listing. My question is....does anyone know if this # is a PS-1 car #, and
how early (early 50's, mid 50's?) was this slogan used, and was it used on the
PS-1's at all?

Thanks, Bud Rindfleisch


Farming Loads

Ted Larson
 

"Beckert, Shawn" wrote: Wonder what the phosphate was for?
Fertilizer Shawn. I should again mention this was a Minnesota elevator
and shipped crops not grown in Iowa and received coal from Duluth in
box cars. Iowa elevators received coal in gondolas.
Clark<<<

Several comments;

Should I assume that Iowa coal came straight from the coal fields via
rail?

Why was the coal from the twin ports in boxcars rather than hoppers?

Does anybody know the source of lime for agricultural use? I remember
seeing many hopper loads of lime unloaded at the team track in my
central Minnesota home town. I never paid attention to what road name
was on the hoppers.

Many grain elevators also had a feed mill for grinding the grain for
use by local farmers.

An enclosed "shed" on the side opposite the tracks was for unloading
the farmer's truck or grain wagon. At the facilities that I saw,
trucks were not loaded in these sheds.


=====
Ted Larson

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com


Re: Back in chambers

Don Valentine
 

Quoting Dave Nelson <muskoka@...>:



-----Original Message-----
Say what?? There are really 300 of us???? Now I feel better
not wanting to be outnumbered by those who play pasture pool.

Actually Don there are almost 700 people on this list.
Great!! We may triumph over pasture pool yet!

Take care, Don Valentine


Re: Grainloading Facilities in the 1950's

Don Valentine
 

Quoting ljack70117@...:

Plant peanuts. They will do the same thing and do it better.
Thank you
Larry Jackman

You've got to be kidding, Larry. In So. Car. and Georgia probably but
not at this latitude. When visiting friends in Moultrie I can get all the
peanut fields I want....and a bellyache from eating too many raw right out
of the field if not careful. Thus I buy them wholesale by the case of 6 lb.
cans, usually from the Fitzgerald Peanut Co."s office in Sylvester. They ship
them out by the truck and carload (required qualifying statement not that The
Judge is back!) You must know those towns. They were all on the Pidcock's
various shortlines. The Southern (pardon me, New Southern) has what is left of
them but the younger Frank Pidcock still has a nice plantation called Ashburn
Hill not far southwest of Moultrie where you can ride the "Sugar Pippin" on
rails to the skeet range, enjoy his private car, which he was shocked to find
me identify immediately upon sight as the former CPR superintendent's car from
Revelstoke, BC (I believe it was sold after Mr. Paffard retired as super at
Revelstoke in the late 1970's) or dine on grouse or sip bourbon in the former
Moultrie station, now used as a club house on the Plantation.


Re: 1922 CBC

Kathe Robin <kathe@...>
 

Two questions:

Are any other years besides 1922 available?

What is the name/address/email/phone # of person or firm selling the
CDs, since I'm definitly interested.

Thanks,

Max
-----------------------------------------------------
email: m_robin@...

smail: Max S. Robin, P.E.
Cheat River Engineering Inc.
23 Richwood Place / P. O. Box 289
Denville, NJ 07834 - 0289

voice: 973-627-5895 / 973-627-5460
cell.: 973-945-5007
-----------------------------------------------------

177681 - 177700 of 197081