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Response to Bridge Design Comments

Steven Orth
 

A couple of days ago, the list Boss's posting here generated a small discussion on railroad bridge design criteria. I forwared the comments to my friend, Chris Johnson, who has a MS in Civil Engineering and works for UP in the bridge engineering department. Assuming Mike's allowance of an off-topic post (since he started it), here is Chris's response:

Now for the bridge lecture. Feel free to pass it on.

They're both right, but mostly Jeff. Railroad bridges are
(and have been since at least 1900) designed based on a
SERIES of axle loads of varying magnitudes at a set
spacings, normally some variant of the Cooper E Loading.
One of the earliest was UP's C.S. 1006, but other roads had
similar standards. The loading is roughly a couple of
2-8-0's, with a distributed load behind them for really long
spans. Moving the load causes different stresses in each
member, and the maximum stresses as the load is moved across
the bridge are used in design. As equipment got heavier,
the magnitude of the Cooper load was increased. This is
similar in concept (but different in execution) to how
highway bridges are designed.

The problem is that the Cooper load doesn't represent any
real load. Every piece of equipment produces different
stresses in the bridge, but as long as they are less than
that produced by the imaginary Cooper load, the bridge
doesn't fall down and everyone's happy. So one large load, or two loads
closely spaced, can overload a bridge, even if the axle
loads are of acceptable magnitudes.
AREMA (American Railway Engineering and Maintenance of Way
Association) offers a very nice 3 day seminar on bridge
loading if you're interested.<<

Chris is also a model railroader and was at Cocoa Beach a couple of years ago.

Steve Orth


Re: EJ&E PS1's

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

I got the idea from a Yesteryear model I saw at my local shop today. I thought the car looked neat and was going to purchase one but I couldn't recall ever seeing a picture of a 40' PS-1in the Orange and Green scheme, so I came home to ask the question.

I don't recall the car number, and the Yesteryear site doesn't show any pictures.

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Hawkins
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2004 9:56 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] EJ&E PS1's



On Saturday, May 8, 2004, at 01:48 PM, Brian J Carlson wrote:

> I am looking for information on EJ&E 40' PS-1 boxcars. I have
> searched all
> 30000 archive messages (search string EJ&E PS1's) with no success.
>
> I am looking for build date, delivery paint (Green and Orange?), door
> size
> and type, running board type, truck type. A good picture would answer
> many
> of these questions but I keep finding only AAR car pics.
>
> I am also interested in appropriate modeling starting point in HO. IM
> or
> Kadee car? I assume that since Kadee has not done the Green and
> Orange car
> in may have had a cushion underframe or otherwise different side sill.

Brian,
The reason your search has been unsuccessful is because EJ&E had no
PS-1s (at least in the pre-1960 period). Where did you get an idea that
they had some? If you have a particular car number series, please
identify it and that will help to determine the type of car it is.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


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Re: EJ&E PS1's

Ed Hawkins
 

On Saturday, May 8, 2004, at 01:48 PM, Brian J Carlson wrote:

I am looking for information on EJ&E 40' PS-1 boxcars. I have searched all
30000 archive messages (search string EJ&E PS1's) with no success.

I am looking for build date, delivery paint (Green and Orange?), door size
and type, running board type, truck type. A good picture would answer many
of these questions but I keep finding only AAR car pics.

I am also interested in appropriate modeling starting point in HO. IM or
Kadee car? I assume that since Kadee has not done the Green and Orange car
in may have had a cushion underframe or otherwise different side sill.
Brian,
The reason your search has been unsuccessful is because EJ&E had no PS-1s (at least in the pre-1960 period). Where did you get an idea that they had some? If you have a particular car number series, please identify it and that will help to determine the type of car it is.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: EJ&E PS1's

Tim O'Connor
 

Brian Carlson wrote

I am looking for information on EJ&E 40' PS-1 boxcars. I have searched all
30000 archive messages (search string EJ&E PS1's) with no success.

I am looking for build date, delivery paint (Green and Orange?), door size
and type, running board type, truck type. A good picture would answer many
of these questions but I keep finding only AAR car pics.

Brian, AFAIK, EJ&E did not own any 40 foot PS-1's. That may
be part of the reason you can't find any pictures. EJ&E did
own some 50 foot PS-1's, the 62000 series.


Re: tank car loads

Clark Propst <cepropst@...>
 

John's mentioned the 'color M&StL book; page 14' I've never been able to see
what the tank car lettering said. The photo was taken at Albert Lea MN the
tank car is on the Milwaukee interchange track. I wonder why the car was
interchanged at Albert Lea?
Clark Propst

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Swanson" <dwlscbq@insightbb.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 3:46 PM
Subject: [STMFC] tank car loads


In the LaSalle Illinois library is a 1910 glossy paper city directory.
It states that the LS&BC had 210 tank cars in sulpheric acid service.
there is a photo of one of their tank cars in 1956 in the color M&StL book;
page 14.
I remember seeing LS&BC tank cars spotted at the Reynolds Wire Company
when I was in high school in Dixon Illinois.
The sulpheric acid was a by product of the Zinc process at the Matheson
Heigler Zinc Company in LaSalle ILL.

John Swanson








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Re: C&O boxes, was: FGE woodies extant in Ky

Robert Daniels
 

Pardon my ignorance, but what it the STMFPH site and where might one find it?

Rob Daniels
New York, NY

ian clasper <ianclasper@yahoo.com> wrote:
I have posted the shots I took of the C & O cars in the STMFPH site,
look in the files section for a folder called
"C&O 1930 Autoboxcars"

Sorry, no roof or under body shots, I had to honer the Museums
requests regarding saftey.

Ian Clasper

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Garrett W. Rea" <Garrett.Rea@w...>
wrote:
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Smith <smithbf@m...> wrote:
Good Morning Y'all,
Finally, someone else on this list that speaks Southern....

Also in the collection were
several older C&O steel cars with end door (look like 1937 AAR
cars,
but...) and a "undec" GPEX 1947 milk tank car.

Happy Rails
Bruce
The C&O cars should be older than that, if they are the ex PM cars
(I
forgot to count ladder rungs), these were built by PSC in 1930.
Those were quite a find (a lot more interesting that the passenger
cars) and they could probably build a nice one out of all the cars
down there. Some have been cut for MOW service (how they
survived).

The milk car was ex-L&N supposedly. Also a neat car.

Garrett Rea
Nashville, TN

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Re: UTLX X-3 Tank Car

pduffin@...
 

Richard, thank you for your reply. I intend to draw both the "slant" end
version as well as the more common flat ended version. I will concentrate on
the flat frame end version first since that is the only photographic evidence I
have.
Pat


N5e HELP!

Bill Lane <billlane@...>
 

Hi All,

I just printed a Builders Photo of the N5e. Even though it is B&W, it does
not appear to have a different color for the roof. (Black) I know that the
roof sometimes was FCR earlier, but this photo was taken in 1946. My
customer wants it to be the usual black roof and FCR body for the 1950s.

Does anyone have a color photo in Circle Keystone and a black roof? If so,
what year was it taken if known? What about yellow grabs and step edges?

Since I know this will never be made in S Scale I never paid attention to
any photos. But this is the HO model imported by Alco.

Thank You,
Bill Lane

Custom Brass Painting
http://www.lanestrains.com

Importing a Brass PRR X29 in S Scale
The production for the REA Version has begun
http://www.pennsysmodels.com

Modeling the Mighty Pennsy in S Scale in 1957


Re: EJ&E PS1's

DRGW482@...
 

In a message dated 5/8/2004 6:58:30 PM Central Daylight Time,
hawk0621@sbcglobal.net writes:
Brian,
The reason your search has been unsuccessful is because EJ&E had no
PS-1s (at least in the pre-1960 period). Where did you get an idea that
they had some? If you have a particular car number series, please
identify it and that will help to determine the type of car it is.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins
I'm not sure where Brian got the idea....
I for one got it from Yesteryear's Intermountain paint job. I thought those
were reasonably prototypical. Alas, never go shopping with out a full roster of
produced cars...

They produce a 40' PS-1, 8ft Superior door, 61000 series.
http://eje.railfan.net/ does not list a 61000 series.... a bogus car? a bogus
series? A what if? What ever you want to call it...

Martin (who should pay more attention what he buys at train shows)


Re: UTLX X-3 Tank Car

Richard Hendrickson
 

Pat Duffin wrote:

I am in the process of drawing scale CAD drawings of the X-3 tank car. I
would like to do the 6500, 8000, and 10,000 gallon versions. I have been
using the 1922 CBC as a source as well as the photos on Ted Culotta's web
site and the frame drawn in the CBC is different from the photos I have as
well as the Sunshine UTLX X-3 kit. The CBC frame is not square but slants
from the coupler pocket at a shallow angle. The Sunshine kit has a square
end. Which was more common and is there any other reference material to
help me produce accurate drawings? Thanks
Early UTLX underframes had the slant end sills, later ones didn't. I can't
cite an exact date for the change, but it was at least as early as 1923, so
most of the X-3s had square-end underframes.

Bob Hundman's drawings of a 10K gal. X-3 appeared some years ago in
Mainline Modeler and would doubtless be helpful, though they contain some
errors and should be used with caution (as with all drawings, they need to
be compared carefully with photographic evidence). And speaking of that, I
have some photos that Ted doesn't have on his website which might be
useful. I'll contact you off-list about this.

Richard H. Hendrickson
Ashland, Oregon 97520


Re: Atlas 11.000 tank cars.

Richard Hendrickson
 

Mr. Hendrickson,

Do you perhaps also know the decalsetnumbers for my "Shell" RPX
(white) and "Sinclair" SDRX (Silver) -Proto 2000- tank cars?

I hope.........so i can finish them.
Arnold, I'm not aware of any lettering sets for RPX Shell tank cars.
However, Life-Like produced a factory painted and lettered model for those
cars.

As for the Sinclair cars, Microscale has never done decals for them but
Champ has a set, HT-181, which is correct for them and is, I think, still
available.

Richard H. Hendrickson
Ashland, Oregon 97520


EJ&E PS1's

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

I am looking for information on EJ&E 40' PS-1 boxcars. I have searched all
30000 archive messages (search string EJ&E PS1's) with no success.

I am looking for build date, delivery paint (Green and Orange?), door size
and type, running board type, truck type. A good picture would answer many
of these questions but I keep finding only AAR car pics.

I am also interested in appropriate modeling starting point in HO. IM or
Kadee car? I assume that since Kadee has not done the Green and Orange car
in may have had a cushion underframe or otherwise different side sill.

Finally using the Model Train magazine Index, I came across an entry for
Model railroading's April 1989 issue. According to the index it has an
article titled "History of 40-foot box cars, 1933-1948, part II." can
someone confirm if this article dealt with AAR or PS1 type cars.

Thanks for any help.

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Re: Shell RPX 8.000 gallon tank cars.

Richard Hendrickson
 

Can anyone tell me the railroadnumbers of the Shell RPX 8.000 gallon
tank cars, around the year 1947?
Was it beginning with 2300 or 2301?
The cars in this series were numbered 2301-2500.

Richard H. Hendrickson
Ashland, Oregon 97520


Sunshine Rebuilds

Paul Lyons
 

My saga with building these kits goes on. With a lot of help from a number of
people on the list I have completed the NYC, NKP, and L&N cars. Thanks again
to all who helped. To finish the series I have a C&O, series 2000-799 and a WP
series 14301-332 or 14501-514(Hutchins ends) under construction. As with the
NKP cars there are no B end photos in the kit PDS info. So does anyone have a
B end photo they can share with me or can you provide me with a book or
periodical photo reference. A verbal description of what rib the brake wheel
platform goes on, where the retainer valve is located, and whether the cut liver is
bottom or top mounted would probably suffice for the C&O car. As always any
help is appreciated.
Paul Lyons
Oceanside, CA


Shell RPX 8.000 gallon tank cars.

Arnold van Heyst
 

Can anyone tell me the railroadnumbers of the Shell RPX 8.000 gallon
tank cars, around the year 1947?
Was it beginning with 2300 or 2301?


Re: C&O boxes, was: FGE woodies extant in Ky

ian clasper <ianclasper@...>
 

I have posted the shots I took of the C & O cars in the STMFPH site,
look in the files section for a folder called
"C&O 1930 Autoboxcars"

Sorry, no roof or under body shots, I had to honer the Museums
requests regarding saftey.

Ian Clasper

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Garrett W. Rea" <Garrett.Rea@w...>
wrote:
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Smith <smithbf@m...> wrote:
Good Morning Y'all,
Finally, someone else on this list that speaks Southern....

Also in the collection were
several older C&O steel cars with end door (look like 1937 AAR
cars,
but...) and a "undec" GPEX 1947 milk tank car.

Happy Rails
Bruce
The C&O cars should be older than that, if they are the ex PM cars
(I
forgot to count ladder rungs), these were built by PSC in 1930.
Those were quite a find (a lot more interesting that the passenger
cars) and they could probably build a nice one out of all the cars
down there. Some have been cut for MOW service (how they
survived).

The milk car was ex-L&N supposedly. Also a neat car.

Garrett Rea
Nashville, TN


Re: REA car

Rupert and Maureen <gamlenz@...>
 

Thanks Ed. We wondered about that possible heritage but couldn't get far
enough back to really look at it.

Rupert

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Hawkins" <hawk0621@sbcglobal.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2004 3:08 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] REA car



On Friday, May 7, 2004, at 02:20 AM, Rupert and Maureen wrote:

I found one numbered REX 6786 in Milwaukee last week, stored on
private tracks. It looked like a box car with plug doors, and it
appeared to have plates welded or riveted over the side panels. It
was dusk at the time and the car was between others, so there was not
a clear view.

Any information would be gratefully received.
Rupert,
The car is a former troop sleeper built by Pullman-Standard and
modified for use as an express refrigerator car. There were 275 such
cars in series 6600-6874 owned by Central West Refrigerator Despatch
(CRDX). An in-service photo of #6787 is shown in Railway Prototype
Cyclopedia Vol. 7 on page 68.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins





Yahoo! Groups Links






UTLX X-3 Tank Car

Pat Duffin <pduffin@...>
 

I am in the process of drawing scale CAD drawings of the X-3 tank car. I would like to do the 6500, 8000, and 10,000 gallon versions. I have been using the 1922 CBC as a source as well as the photos on Ted Culotta's web site and the frame drawn in the CBC is different from the photos I have as well as the Sunshine UTLX X-3 kit. The CBC frame is not square but slants from the coupler pocket at a shallow angle. The Sunshine kit has a square end. Which was more common and is there any other reference material to help me produce accurate drawings? Thanks


Re: Dow Tank Cars and Anhydrous Ammonia

Jeff Coleman
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Beckert, Shawn" <shawn.beckert@d...>
wrote:
Elden,

As I mentioned earlier, I'm not going to get a chance
to do any in-depth research on your question about the
various companies that made or used anhydrous ammonia
until sometime this weekend. However, as I ran out the
door to work this morning, I grabbed a Dow Chemical Co.
publication that I acquired some time ago. It's called
"Tank Car Facts", and was intended for use by the Dow
Tank Car Department (Yes, they actually had one). The
publication is dated June 5, 1950.

In the entire book they only mention Anhydrous Ammonia
once, in reference to the ICC-106A500 class of tank car:

"SPECIFICATIONS FOR ICC 106A500

This specification covers welded steel tanks to be
mounted on or to form part of a car. This class of
tank car is called, the Multi-Unit or Cradle car,
and is used for the transportation of 15 one-ton
cylinders.

Tanks or cylinders built under this specification
must be cylindrical with heads dished convex inward.
All openings must be located in the heads. Tanks must
be securely attached to a car structure in such a
manner that they may be removed for filling by the
consignor and emptying by the consignee. Each tank
must be tested to 500 pounds per square inch.

There are many products which this type of car may
carry. It was originally designed for Chlorine and
Anhydrous Ammonia, however, the bulk of our Chlorine
and Anhydrous Ammonia, today, is carried in tank cars.
This car is very serviceable for customers which require
cylinder use, and is used by our Great Western Division
to very good advantage."

So there you have it. That Dow mentions Anhydrous Ammonia hints
that they did carry it, but whether they produced it themselves
or bought it elsewhere still needs to be researched. More details
as they become available...

As an aside, I believe somebody made this car in H.O. brass once
upon a time. Whether it fits your period of modeling I can't say.
I'm not even sure how far past the early 1950's this car was used
on American railroads.

Shawn Beckert


Train Shed Cyclopedia #12 has couple of photos of 106A, GATX & ACF.
Also ACF general arrangement.

Jeff Coleman


tank car loads

John Swanson <dwlscbq@...>
 

In the LaSalle Illinois library is a 1910 glossy paper city directory.
It states that the LS&BC had 210 tank cars in sulpheric acid service. there is a photo of one of their tank cars in 1956 in the color M&StL book; page 14.
I remember seeing LS&BC tank cars spotted at the Reynolds Wire Company when I was in high school in Dixon Illinois.
The sulpheric acid was a by product of the Zinc process at the Matheson Heigler Zinc Company in LaSalle ILL.

John Swanson

157861 - 157880 of 187867