Date   

Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures

smithbf@...
 

Greg Martin wrote:
. . . regarding the PRR class K7 stock cars . . . many of us agreed
that the color is muttled but the lettering is drasticly wrong as
well. There is some hopeful anticipation that these are just hand
lettering mock up's of the car prior to release and that this will be
corrected. If not I would say the car will require being stripped and
repainted in oreder to correct the brutal errors...
How they could get this so completely incorrect is beyond me. There is
a PRRT&HS Modeling committee to avoid such mistakes...
Tony replied:
Maybe BLI are taking car-decoration lessons from the good folks at
Bowser.
And perhaps door hardware lessons fron Athearn Blue box? I'm also
concerned about the oversized door tracks and door hangers, an obvious
expedient for making the doors movable.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn AL


Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Greg Martin wrote:
. . . regarding the PRR class K7 stock cars . . . many of us agreed that the color is muttled but the lettering is drasticly wrong as well. There is some hopeful anticipation that these are just hand lettering mock up's of the car prior to release and that this will be corrected. If not I would say the car will require being stripped and repainted in oreder to correct the brutal errors...
How they could get this so completely incorrect is beyond me. There is a PRRT&HS Modeling committee to avoid such mistakes...
Maybe BLI are taking car-decoration lessons from the good folks at Bowser.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Helium cars (again)

Curt Fortenberry <arrphoto@...>
 

The ones I shot at Wright Patterson AFB in Ohio were also silver, and
this was 1989.

Curt Fortenberry

I'm not so sure, Eric. The ones I looked at close-up at
Rocketdyne's siding in the 1970s were clearly silver in among the tanks
and inside the structure. The outer parts had weathered to a gray
appearance. This is always a problem with silver vs. gray for paint out
in the weather.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@s...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

There is a PRRT&HS Modeling committee to avoid such mistakes... ALL
MANUFACTURERS are welcomed.<
I think the HS's and modeling groups have to be a little bit proactive
and extremely polite. As soon as a car is heard about I think the group
should approach the manufacture as one entity, ask if they need any
information, etc. I'm convinced that the manufactures would like to deal
with one person and if they represent the Modeling and HS's very much the
better.

Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: [PRR-Modeling] Fwd: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures

Andy Miller <asmiller@...>
 

Looking at the colors of the drawings that they posted on their website
before the models were available to photograph, it appears that BLI intended
to paint the PRR K7a in the nearly correct "Seriously Orange" freight car
color and the GN version in Chinese red. Since their photos now show the GN
Car in something approximating PRR freight car color, perhaps all the cars
pictured are too dark from poor color renditioning in the photography.

regards,

Andy Miller

-----Original Message-----
From: TGREGMRTN@... [mailto:TGREGMRTN@...]
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 3:43 PM
To: STMFC@...; prr-modeling@...
Cc: prr-talk@...
Subject: [PRR-Modeling] Fwd: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures

The following exchanged developed over on the PRR-talk list regarding the
photos posted on the BLI website regarding the PRR class K7 stock cars. Ben
Hom privately posted a photo to photo comparison for the car (model Vs.
prototype) and not only have many of us agreed that the color is muttled but
the lettering is drasticly wrong as well. There is some hopeful anticipation
that these are just hand lettering mock up's of the car prior to release and
that this will be corrected. If not I would say the car will require being
stripped and repainted in oreder to correct the brutal errors...

How they could get this so completely incorrect is beyond me. There is a
PRRT&HS Modeling committee to avoid such mistakes... ALL MANUFACTURERS are
welcomed.

Greg Martin






------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70
http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/9MtolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~->


Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Helium cars (again)

Bruce Smith <smithbf@...>
 

On Aug 9, 2004, at 2:26 PM, Norman+Laraine Larkin wrote:

Were the tanks on these cars removed for loading/unloading, or did that occur through controls on the end of the car?
Norm Larkin
Norm,

If you go to the Amarillo RR Museum site on the scrapping of some of these cars, you will see that the tanks remained on the car
http://amarillorailmuseum.com/scrap_he_cars.html

Regards
Bruce


Bruce F. Smith V.M.D., Ph.D.
Scott-Ritchey Research Center
334-844-5587, 334-844-5850 (fax)
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures

Greg Martin
 

The following exchanged developed over on the PRR-talk list regarding the photos posted on the BLI website regarding the PRR class K7 stock cars. Ben Hom privately posted a photo to photo comparison for the car (model Vs. prototype) and not only have many of us agreed that the color is muttled but the lettering is drasticly wrong as well. There is some hopeful anticipation that these are just hand lettering mock up's of the car prior to release and that this will be corrected. If not I would say the car will require being stripped and repainted in oreder to correct the brutal errors...

How they could get this so completely incorrect is beyond me. There is a PRRT&HS Modeling committee to avoid such mistakes... ALL MANUFACTURERS are welcomed.

Greg Martin


Re: Helium cars (again)

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Norm Larkin asked:
"Were the tanks on these cars removed for loading/unloading, or did
that occur through controls on the end of the car?"

The tanks are fixed. The valves and connections are behind the doors
on the ends.

http://amarillorailmuseum.com/scrap_he_cars.html

Scroll down to the bottom left photo on the webpage. It's a little
hard to see because the photo is small, but you can clearly see the
valves on the end of each tank.


Ben Hom


Re: Helium cars (again)

Norman+Laraine Larkin <lono@...>
 

Were the tanks on these cars removed for loading/unloading, or did that occur through controls on the end of the car?
Norm Larkin

----- Original Message -----
From: benjaminfrank_hom
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 2:29 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Helium cars (again)


Tony Thompson wrote:
I'm not so sure, Eric. The ones I looked at close-up at Rocketdyne's
siding in the 1970s were clearly silver in among the tanks and inside
the structure. The outer parts had weathered to a gray appearance.
This is always a problem with silver vs. gray for paint out in the
weather.

Eric Bracher replied:
the cars i saw were in the 1955-1970's. they always looked very
gray to me as they were parked next to the 101 freeway.

Go to the Library of Congress American Memory website at
http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/ammemhome.html

and search using the keyword "Dahinda".

This will turn up are several Jack Delano photos of a troublesome
pair of USNX helium cars in a freight on the Santa Fe in March 1943.
They're black and white photos, but you can see that the tanks are
definitely more reflective than the rest of the car.


Ben Hom


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/

b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
STMFC-unsubscribe@...

c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


Re: Magnolia - Mobilgas Tank Cars

switchengines <jrs060@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@o...>
wrote:
As Tim Gilbert indicated, cars stenciled "Mobilgas" were
operated from the
'30s through the mid-'50s under several different reporting marks.
However, MOBX reporting marks did not begin to be applied
before '59, and
by that time Mobil-owned cars were being repainted black with only
reporting marks, numbers, and data. The available photographic
evidence
suggests that few cars survived into the MOBX era with the
earlier, more
colorful P/L scheme.

Richard H. Hendrickson
Ashland, Oregon 97520

I'm surprised you guy's missed this one! Magnolia was keeped
apart from Mobil because thay had to do it that way to allow
them to market in the state of Texas. Remember, under Texas
law prior to it's change about 1959, you had to be chartered
in the state of Texas (MP had I-GN, M-K-T the M-K-T of T,
SP the T&NO, etc.)to do business in Texas. Mobil was using
Magnolia to do this and using the tank fleet, not only to carry
product to outlets in Texas, but as collection cars to move
crude from the well head of it's leases in other states to Texas
refiners. It was very convenient for Mobil to buy up Magnolia
and expand this way.
I'm also sure you are right about the large Magnolia lettering
being eliminated during WWII. Not only was this a cost saver
but it was just another way to start to remove the Magnolia name
and replace it with Mobil. When the Texas law was changed, no
more need to keep the tank fleet of Magnolia separate, merge
into Mobil.

Jerry Stewart
Chicago, Ill.


Re: Helium cars (again)

ljack70117@...
 

On Monday, August 9, 2004, at 02:29 PM, benjaminfrank_hom wrote:

Tony Thompson wrote:
I'm not so sure, Eric. The ones I looked at close-up at Rocketdyne's
siding in the 1970s were clearly silver in among the tanks and inside
the structure. The outer parts had weathered to a gray appearance.
This is always a problem with silver vs. gray for paint out in the
weather.

Eric Bracher replied:
the cars i saw were in the 1955-1970's. they always looked very
gray to me as they were parked next to the 101 freeway.

Go to the Library of Congress American Memory website at
http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/ammemhome.html

and search using the keyword "Dahinda".

This will turn up are several Jack Delano photos of a troublesome
pair of USNX helium cars in a freight on the Santa Fe in March 1943.
They're black and white photos, but you can see that the tanks are
definitely more reflective than the rest of the car.


Ben Hom
To my eyes the tanks are only reflective in places and are no more so than the sides of the "Flat" car sides that the tanks sit on. In my opinion the car is all gray.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@...
If love is blind, why do we speak of love at first sight?


Re: Helium cars (again)

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Tony Thompson wrote:
I'm not so sure, Eric. The ones I looked at close-up at Rocketdyne's
siding in the 1970s were clearly silver in among the tanks and inside
the structure. The outer parts had weathered to a gray appearance.
This is always a problem with silver vs. gray for paint out in the
weather.

Eric Bracher replied:
the cars i saw were in the 1955-1970's. they always looked very
gray to me as they were parked next to the 101 freeway.

Go to the Library of Congress American Memory website at
http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/ammemhome.html

and search using the keyword "Dahinda".

This will turn up are several Jack Delano photos of a troublesome
pair of USNX helium cars in a freight on the Santa Fe in March 1943.
They're black and white photos, but you can see that the tanks are
definitely more reflective than the rest of the car.


Ben Hom


Re: IM ATSF stock cars

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

Marty,
This rumor has started on another list, any truth to it?

[I had a dealer contact Intermountain directly regarding the stock cars.
It seems that those cars will be like the original run of the Santa Fe
reefers. They will be made strictly for Train Quest]


Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: Weights of gons, and car condition

Brian Everett
 

Eldon,

Someone once showed me a photo of either a C&O or N&W hopper car that
had ripped holes in the side, stuffed with hay to keep the coal from
falling out.

Regards,
Brian Everett

--- In STMFC@..., "Gatwood, Elden -- Tt, Inc."
<elden.gatwood@t...> wrote:
All;
Oh, and another thing. I had several people reply to me that my
split-sided
G25 gon (in TKM) needed a bad order sign on it. Granted. But, when
I was
growing up, you wouldn't have BELIEVED the kind of cars that they had
running around that hadn't been taking off-line. Split sides,
knocked out
ends, huge rips at the floor level in gons, rust holes, holes in wooden
sides, missing flooring, and the ubiquitous holes in hopper sides
stuffed
with rags. No, this wasn't just PC, or even that late. Has anybody
modeled
any of these features? Were they found in other areas?

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: Gatwood, Elden -- Tt, Inc. [mailto:elden.gatwood@t...]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 9:32 AM
To: 'STMFC@...'; smithbf@m...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: Weights of gons, and car condition

Folks;
One strange process I witnessed has always had me wondering what
effect this
had on freight car re-weighs.

I used to watch crane operators drop things from great heights into
gondolas. Sometimes the magnet, some times scrap.

The resulting shower of rust, metal fragments, and wood from the car
sides
and underframe was a strange sight. They actually created an
outline of the
car on the ground, composed of former pieces of the cars! Does
anyone know
if this was something that could affect the weight of the car over time?

I also wanted to ask if the massive deterioration of cars that I saw was
largely a feature of the area in which I lived (Pittsburgh and
vicinity), or
was the horrible condition of gons, and sometimes flats and boxcars,
something one saw everywhere? Did the steel and scrap industry get the
worst cars the RRs could provide? Kind of like those offal and hide
cars?

I have never modeled a gondola in the condition that I saw many cars. I
remember numerous gons that had very large portions of the (wooden)
flooring
completely missing. Although I have done this on a very limited
basis (a
PRR GR, a G35, and one other gon), breaking portions of the flooring
out and
adding underbody details to show through, I have never gone all the
way with
this type of project. I expect I'd have to make a new underframe in
places
to make this work. What are your thoughts on this? Are there any good
photos out there that show really horrible gon floors?

Elden Gatwood

...) The weight of steel cars DID
change, which is precisely why other steel cars have a reweigh interval
of 30 months (up to 1948 and 48 months after that). Weight is affected
by paint (up to 200 lbs per repaint!), repairs, modifications (e.g. K
brakes to AB brakes) etc... The reweigh requirement provides shippers
with an accurate tare weight, so that they know that they are only
being charged for the weight of the shipment.










Yahoo! Groups Sponsor


ADVERTISEMENT

<http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129nrf6iv/M=295196.4901138.6071305.3001176/D=gr
oups/S=1705169725:HM/EXP=1091810159/A=2128215/R=0/SIG=10se96mf6/*http:/compa
nion.yahoo.com> click here


<http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=295196.4901138.6071305.3001176/D=groups/S=
:HM/A=2128215/rand=192220128>

_____

Yahoo! Groups Links
* To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/>

* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
STMFC-unsubscribe@...
<mailto:STMFC-unsubscribe@...?subject=Unsubscribe>

* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Service.



summer 2004 "Locomotive Quarterly"

ed_mines
 

On page 26 there's a photo of an "all steel" rebuilt box car (70,000-
73,000 series? with an original wood door) which has a gold Erie
diamond herald. The photo is dated Nov. '46. Anyone disagree?

On p. 48 there's a photo showing a LV. 40 ft. composite hopper. Does
anyone know of good photos of these cars besides the Standard Steel
builders photo from Keith Retterer and the photo in the Wales
collection? Any ideas on how to model the corrugated hopper doors in
HO?

Ed


NYC WWII composite gon

ed_mines
 

Deos anyone know whewre I can get a good photo of said car which is
shown on p. 213 of the 1943 CBC (Trainshed Cyclopedia No. 70) and in
the RMC plan book?

Ed


Re: Cuban Freight Cars

Al & Patricia Westerfield <westerfield@...>
 

The gentleman is Luis Dominguez of Coral Gables. He has sent me photos
(mostly from Cycs) of Cuban cars he wants to model and I have given him
suggestions of which of my kits would be best candidates for 'bashing. In
turn he was able to identify a mystery GL hopper photographed in Cuba (and
probably still in use) as having run on the Hershey Cuban RR.
- Al Westerfield

----- Original Message -----
From: "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 7:47 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Cuban Freight Cars



Last year at Cocoa Beach, a gentleman from Miami (whose name I should
have written down) had on display a train of Cuban Railway rolling
stock c. 1950s. At first glance, I thought, "great, Brock's letting
fantasy crap wander into the display room." But he had his reference
material at his display, and it showed equipment that was
contemporary with US railroads at the time. There were Fowler
boxcars (nicely done from Westerfield kits), a postwar steel boxcar,
and some other really nice models - all prototype, and none fitting
the caricature of what you would have first expected. I hope he
comes again next year.


Ben Hom


Re: Cuban Freight Cars

rfkennedy.dsm@...
 

Hi Group,

As a child in the early 50s, I visited my grandparents who were wintering over in Palm Beach, Fl. My grandfather would take me down to the SeaTrain piers where we would watch the early roll-on/roll-off ships unloading boxcars that were bringing in items from Cuba and loading up again for shipment to Cuba. I remember that intermixed with U. S. railroad cars were cars registered to companies in Cuba.

Bob Kennedy



-------------- Original message from "benjaminfrank_hom" : --------------
Garth Groff wrote:
"From what I've seen in photos, most Cuban equipment was pretty
primitive and probably wouldn't have met U.S. safety standards."

It wasn't all crap:
http://www.steamfreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cuba17204main.html

Last year at Cocoa Beach, a gentleman from Miami (whose name I should
have written down) had on display a train of Cuban Railway rolling
stock c. 1950s. At first glance, I thought, "great, Brock's letting
fantasy crap wander into the display room." But he had his reference
material at his display, and it showed equipment that was
contemporary with US railroads at the time. There were Fowler
boxcars (nicely done from Westerfield kits), a postwar steel boxcar,
and some other really nice models - all prototype, and none fitting
the caricature of what you would have first expected. I hope he
comes again next year.


Ben Hom



Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT






Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
STMFC-unsubscribe@...

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


Re: Cuban Freight Cars

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Garth Groff wrote:
"From what I've seen in photos, most Cuban equipment was pretty
primitive and probably wouldn't have met U.S. safety standards."

It wasn't all crap:
http://www.steamfreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cuba17204main.html

Last year at Cocoa Beach, a gentleman from Miami (whose name I should
have written down) had on display a train of Cuban Railway rolling
stock c. 1950s. At first glance, I thought, "great, Brock's letting
fantasy crap wander into the display room." But he had his reference
material at his display, and it showed equipment that was
contemporary with US railroads at the time. There were Fowler
boxcars (nicely done from Westerfield kits), a postwar steel boxcar,
and some other really nice models - all prototype, and none fitting
the caricature of what you would have first expected. I hope he
comes again next year.


Ben Hom


Re: Cuban Freight Cars

Garth Groff <ggg9y@...>
 

Rich,

The West Indies Fruit & Steamship Co. ran a ferry service from Florida to Havana, and had a modest roster of boxcars and reefers. I believe this was a subsidiary of the Florida East Coast.

I don't know if any cars of strictly Cuban roads ran in the U.S. No Cuban lines are listed in my 1958 ORER, and so it is a sure bet that by then no Cuban cars were interchanged (if they ever were). A check of earlier ORERs might turn up something. From what I've seen in photos, most Cuban equipment was pretty primative and probably wouldn't have met U.S. safety standards.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff

richtownsend@... wrote:

Did any Cuban freight cars make it to the US on the pre-Castro car ferries, or was it all US cars?

163621 - 163640 of 196858