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scrap gons
ed_mines
--- In STMFC@..., "Gatwood, Elden" <Elden.Gatwood@h...>
wrote: Scrap dealers commonly cut holes in the sides to fasten banding to cars that didn'thave tie-downs, which I am sure irritated the owner. I also remember watching magnet operators purposely bashing the ends and sides out of gons as idle amusement. Would you send your nice new gons to these guys after they came back bashed to death? Similarly, would you send good gons into hot coil service after they came back burned out? When I worked at Kodak Park in the mid '70s they used an old 1920s era NYC 40 ft. gon to move scrap from one location to another. Sometimes they tack welded large items to the sides or to each other to prevent them from shifting. They had to burn those welds to get the pieces out. Sometimes a large item would get wedged in between the sides and they's have to cut it (burn it with a torch) to get it out. Ed
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SP Harriman Head End Cars Painting
Walter M. Clark
List-
I've got two of Jon Cagle's absolutely beautiful Harriman head end car kits (and another one coming) and I want to paint/letter as they would have been in 1941. I'm looking for advice on what colors in what brands of paint would be appropriate, along with what parts of the cars would be painted which colors. Suggestions for decals, along with what the car number series would be right for each of the kits. Thanks in advance, Walter M. Clark Time stopped in November 1941 Riverside, California
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Re: (DRGW) Freight car Type designations
Bob Webber <zephyr1@...>
http://content.lib.utah.edu/cgi-bin/pview.exe?CISOROOT=/USHS_Shipler&CISOPTR=10077&CISORESTMP=/qbuild/ShiplerTemplate1.html&CISOVIEWTMP=/qbuild/ShiplerTemplate2.html&CISOROWS=6&CISOCOLS=4
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Not sure if this is a similar car or not. I *think* (without the material right at hand) that the UP cars were either taller or shorter.
At 06:51 AM 3/7/2005, you wrote:
Bob and friends,
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Re: nice pics
Shawn Beckert
Regarding the photo at Dallas in 1953: I'd say it's a classic
example of how B&O's Oxide Red paint stands out from the pack. http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collections/cushman/full/P06941.jpg Shawn Beckert
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Re: was "universal", now old car usage
Gatwood, Elden <Elden.Gatwood@...>
All still interested;
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Thanks for all the additional insights. I just wanted to add one more interesting thing onto this discussion and that is the use of different age cars in different services. If the RRs were giving their newest and best cars to the customers that most demanded them, who was getting the dregs? I remember that the worst cars I ever saw were those in scrap service. Others have pointed out that the worst boxcars they ever saw were in grain, hide, or animal remains service. I had earlier pointed out that I remember gons and flats with little flooring remaining, still being used around Pittsburgh. I also remember an older guy on the RR pointing out to me that the PRR hid gons all over the area because of a gon shortage. While the mills may have demanded really nice cars for coil service or shipping large structural shapes, the left-overs must've been shunted into scrap service. Scrap dealers commonly cut holes in the sides to fasten banding to cars that didn't have tie-downs, which I am sure irritated the owner. I also remember watching magnet operators purposely bashing the ends and sides out of gons as idle amusement. Would you send your nice new gons to these guys after they came back bashed to death? Similarly, would you send good gons into hot coil service after they came back burned out? This mighty have been the direct reason the PRR kept small numbers of really old cars in active service. Just a thought for us "nasty cars" modelers. Elden Gatwood
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Jones III [mailto:tomtherailnut@...] Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 5:18 AM To: STMFC@... Subject: Re: [STMFC] Universal Boxcars Scott: Thank you! I was unaware of when the 40 year rule was implemented, and I appreciate the knowledge! Another thing to consider is the prices of scrap during these years. While I don't know exactly what scrap was worth then, with a recession, one thing that may have contributed to the largess of cars would have been a low scrap value. It may have been less expensive to simply mothball the cars than to cut them up with low scrap values, and once scrap started getting more valuable - whack! There goes the gas ax! I do recall some pictures from time to time of yards literally full of empty equipment, steam locomotives, and early Diesels, all apparently in dead lines. Quite an awesome sight! Tom ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: [STMFC] Universal Boxcars "Tom Jones III" wrote: >A lot of us may not realize that there are rules as to how long a boxcar may stay in service. I believe (please, don't hold me exactly to this) that the maximum term for freight cars today is 40 years..... Tom, the "40-Year Rule" was not instituted until 1973, and even then it was phased in over ten years. In the late '90s the age limit was readjusted back up to 50 years for cars built after 1973, and for certain earlier types. So this doesn't explain the Pennsy's huge numbers of dead boxcars in the late '50s. I recall reading in a 1959 issue of "Trains" mag that fully one-quarter of the Pennsy's freightcar fleet was stored bad order in 1958. That figures to about 60,000 cars, if memory serves. That's a LOT of linear miles of dead cars, thus Eldon's memories of "seas of dead cars" in Pennsy yards. The reason? The Pennsy's on-line business was plummeting in that time frame, and the nation went through a nasty recession in the late '50s. The Pennsy went on a major scrapping spree in the '60s. So while the Pennsy still had sizable numbers of older classes still listed in the ORER in the '50s, my guess is few of those antiques actually saw revenue service after the late '40s. Scott C [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links
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Re: IMWX/Des Plaines boxcars with Viking roofs
Bill Darnaby
You're kidding?? When I was last there a couple of months ago there were
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still a bunch on the shelf. I will admit, I didn't look very carefully at the road names as I got the ones I wanted long ago. Bill Darnaby
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Re: IMWX/Des Plaines boxcars with Viking roofs
benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
Mike Aufderheide wrote:
"I was at Des Plaines last week and they have the Erie car in stock with the large herald for 18 bucks. They also have one for CEI. Is this car correct?" The prototype C&EI cars had square corner post ends. Double check the kit to see which IMWX/Red Caboose body was used. More information on 1937 AAR boxcar details is posted on Ted's website at: http://www.steamfreightcars.com/prototype/frtcars/1937aarpdfmain.html Ben Hom
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Re: IMWX/Des Plaines boxcars with Viking roofs
Michael Aufderheide
Dean,
I was at Des Plaines last week and they have the Erie car in stock with the large herald for 18 bucks. They also have one for CEI. Is this car correct? Mike Aufderheide Dean Payne asked: __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/
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Re: Paint Matches
jerryglow2
I'd go for it but would much prefer to see it in the Accupaint line.
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Jerry Glow
--- In STMFC@..., "Jerry Dziedzic" <jerdz@e...> wrote:
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Re: (DRGW) Freight car Type designations
Garth Groff <ggg9y@...>
Bob and friends,
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Once again this points to the need for a model of the D&RGW's GATC 46' GS gons. They are Rio Grande signature cars. And of course the WP bought identical cars. :-P The UP also rostered some 46' GS gons. I have never seen any pictures of these. Does anyone know how these compared to the D&RGW/WP cars? Kind regards, Garth G. Groff Bob Webber wrote:
. . . Look at what Jim Eager put together on the web page at the listed web site for starters. If you want to provide a date and locale I can provide a better idea. Be prepared for one major disappointment if modeling pre 1960 - and that is that a large part of the fleet and the percentage in the trains (and that goes for the ATSF trains going to Fortuna) were cars that have not been massed produced (for the Rio Grande) yet - GS Gons.
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Re: nice pics
buchwaldfam <duff@...>
The photo entitled, "Dallas, Texas, 1953" shows what appears to be
one of the NH 10'PS-1 box cars that have been discussed in this past weekend's string. Those cars were built in 1948. The photo shows that the car has a red door, instead of a black door. Did the NH repaint cars that often? Or did some of them get delivered without black doors? Thanks, Phil Buchwald
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decal removal chemical
Bill Lane <billlane@...>
Here is Joe's website
http://www.joesmodeltrains.com It is called Joes Gel. I have used it in die cast vehicles as well. He also has an interesting system for painting the sides of rail for weathering. Thank You, Bill Lane Importing a Brass S Scale PRR X29 http://www.pennsysmodels.com The freight versions are currently in production Modeling the Mighty Pennsy in S Scale in 1957
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Re: decal removal chemical
Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
Justin Turpin asked:
"A vendor at a model train show selling some of his collection told me that some hobby shops have a chemical sold in small bottles that can remove decals without harming paint. What is the name of this chemical if it exists?" I've had success with a fine abrasive gel product sold by Joe Polchlopek. His e-mail is eriebay@... . Ben Hom
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decal removal chemical
birdbiz2003 <birdbiz2003@...>
A vendor at a model train show selling some of his collection told
me that som e hobby sshops have a chemical sold in small bottles that can remove decals without harming paint. What is the name of this chemical if it exists. I could use it to remove some 1970's lettering on some otherwise perfect cars I have bought at various shows and store sale tables ect. I have a Nickle Plate lettered 1932 AAR type boxcar that the roadname was lettered using some excess letters from a model ship kit from Revell. I could recognize the source easily. Sincerely, Justin Turpin
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Boxcar colors
I agree with Ed Hawkins on the need for some more generic boxcar colors. It would still be necessary to mix and match, but a few more could be done straight from the bottle.
Five years ago, when working on a project that did boxcars from a bunch of different road, I wanted to use the paint mix formulas in RPCyc 3, but with ModelFlex paint. I ended up comparing the chips on the paint racks in the hobby shop to link ModelFlex colors with old Floquil. Here is my notes from that exercise. YMMV Floquil 186 Oxide Red - ModelFlex 14 Light Tuscan Oxide Red Floquil 74 Boxcar Red - ModelFlex 13 Dark Tuscan Oxide Red Floquil179 ATSF Mineral Brown - ModelFlex 45 Milwaukee Brown Floquil 88 DH Caboose Red - ModelFlex 15 Maroon Tuscan Oxide Red Floquil 175 Southern Freight Car Brown - No good match, but I eventually used ModelFlex 74 IC Brown Then I used the formulas in RPCyc 3, at least for some models. Then my notes for the actual cars say: CB&Q and CP - 1/2 and 1/2 mix of Poly Scale Boxcar and Tuscan Reds Soo and B&O - Polyscale Zinc Chromate Primer B&M - ModelFlex 13 Dark Tuscan Oxide Red Wabash and Milwaukee - 1/2 and 1/2 mix of ModelFlex numbers 14 and 74 NYC - 3 parts ModelFlex 74 and 1 part ModelFlex 14 CNW, RI, NP and SP - 1/2 and 1/2 mix of ModelFlex 13 and 14 Of course, these colors are the base for weathering processes, anyway. The overall results create a nice variation in the yard on a train. It does look like ModelFlex could do well with at least a couple of more colors like Halfway between 13 and 14 A good Southern Brown The 3 parts brown, 1 part tuscan mix A zinc cromate primer color (bright red, ala' B&O) One or two out of the bottle Pennsy colors Again YMMV Regards, Steve Hile
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Re: IMWX/Des Plaines boxcars with Viking roofs
Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
Dean Payne asked:
"The IMWX/Des Plaines Hobbies boxcars with Viking roofs are scarce, and getting pricey. Is it possible to make these cars myself out of an Intermountain undec kit (while it is still available) along with the Des Plaines Viking roof and the appropriate decals?" If you use the Intermountain kit, Erie and NS only. The other prototypes had square corner post ends. Red Caboose #8001 would be a better starting point - it's listed as out of stock on Red Caboose's website, so you might have to strip a decorated model. Ben Hom
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Re: CB&Q GS-1 and 2 train-line
There are some drawings in a data sheet published by the Q society that show the train line running quite close to the center sill up close to the underside of the floor. The doors still clear the line and the rest of the brake gear.
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I hope this helps. Steve Hile
----- Original Message -----
From: Tom Lawler To: Steam Era Freight Cars Group Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 9:04 AM Subject: [STMFC] CB&Q GS-1 and 2 train-line Since no one had suggestions on where the train-line runs on the CB&Q rebuilt GS-1 and 2 drop bottom gons maybe I should pose a more general question. In general, where would the train-line run on a drop bottom gon where the doors open towards the sides of the car (hinged towards the center sill)? I have looked at my two CBC's and found no detailed drawings of the bottoms of the drop-bottom cars that show the train-line. My best guess would be that the train-line ran inside the center sill. Anywhere else it seems like it would interfere with the doors or door mechanisms. Thank you for any assistance. Tom Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: STMFC-unsubscribe@... c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
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Re: nice pics
Bob Webber <zephyr1@...>
http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/cushman/search/index.jsp
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and use the search feature.
At 06:45 PM 3/6/2005, you wrote:
Serendipity = checked STMFC while taking a break from trimming NC&StL
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Re: nice pics
Jerry Dziedzic
Serendipity = checked STMFC while taking a break from trimming NC&StL
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decals for the Sunshine car. Can you let us know how to access this collection?
Cleveland, Cuyahoga River, 1941 (note "Dixieland" box car)
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IMWX/Des Plaines boxcars with Viking roofs
Dean Payne <deanpayne@...>
The IMWX/Des Plaines Hobbies boxcars with Viking roofs are scarce,
and getting pricey. Is it possible to make these cars myself out of an Intermountain undec kit (while it is still available) along with the Des Plaines Viking roof and the appropriate decals? (NKP, C&O, Erie with the small herald... take your choice. The NKP would be harder, as it had the NYC&St.L lettering, those decals are only available from Westerfield, I think). I checked the Intemountain site, the 1937 AAR box is available for $10.94, the roofs are $4 from Des Plaines, the decals few bucks more... The Erie went for $31 on ebay back in February! (The large herald Erie is available from Des Plaines for $18.) I saw an NKP version go for $14.51 back in June, shoulda bid on that! :-( Dean Payne
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