Date   

Industry sites for modeling 1940-50's?

trduck@...
 

Does anyone have any favorite web sites for showing plans or photos of industries in the 1940-50's. I'm looking for a small town lumber yard and a commerical coal distributor for home delivery. I have the Sanborn maps of the towns I'm modeling so the dimensions aren't an issue just looking for more photos to help with scratch-building.

Thanks Charlie


Re: P2K tank cars

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

I going to repost this because stupid me forgot to change the subject!

Back to the new P2K insulated 10K tanks. Following is the listing
posted on the Walthers site, condensed. Could I have a year bracket (pre or
post war) for the schemes and general usage area, for the files. Time to
order!

MPCX #1563 (Magnolia White)
EORX #1133 (City Service)
GATX #37154 (General American)
MPCX #1611 (Magnolia Black)
SDRX #26148 (Sinclair)
TCX #9367 (Texaco)

Thank you

Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: SFRD rebuilt reefers

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Ed Mines wrote:
I want to build a model of a version C SFRD rebuilt reefer from an
undec. IM kit.
These cars have Gypsum roof walks. My recollection is that these are
slotted . . .
Gypsum running boards are expanded metal: slit and then stretched to open the slits. The result twists the "bars" for better traction, and the openings are kind of pointy ovals.

Plano offered an Apex set but it's not listed in the current
Walthers' catalog. Were Gypsum and Apex similar in appearance?
Not really, though both were metal.

On a new car the black is glossy, not dull like car cement. right?
For the first couple of weeks, it might be a little shiny (remember the granules) but pretty quickly got dirty enough to be matte. IMO shiny roofs are a no-no, even on passenger cars (washers didn't do the roof).

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Bohn Ventilators was Truss Rod Reefers

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

Back to the new P2K insulated 10K tanks. Following is the listing
posted on the Walthers site, condensed. Could I have a year bracket (pre or
post war) for the schemes and general usage area, for the files. Time to
order!

MPCX #1563 (Magnolia White)
EORX #1133 (City Service)
GATX #37154 (General American)
MPCX #1611 (Magnolia Black)
SDRX #26148 (Sinclair)
TCX #9367 (Texaco)

Thank you

Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: SFRD rebuilt reefers

Ted Culotta <tculotta@...>
 

On May 16, 2005, at 8:41 AM, ed_mines wrote:

I want to build a model of a version C SFRD rebuilt reefer from an
undec. IM kit.
These cars have Gypsum roof walks. My recollection is that these are
slotted, but I couldn't find any confirmation in the CBCs I had
handy. Any suggestions of what to use for running boards and hatch
platforms?
Plano offered an Apex set but it's not listed in the current
Walthers' catalog. Were Gypsum and Apex similar in appearance?
The running board and hatch platforms are black, right?
On a new car the black is glossy, not dull like car cement. right?
Plano offers Gypsum running boards and I believe they offered the SFRD running board/platform sets in Apex Tri-Lok, Morton and Gypsum. The gloss won't work in this case because the roof was coated with slate granules, which definitely were not glossy in appearance.

Regards,
Ted Culotta

Speedwitch Media
100 14th Avenue, San Mateo, CA 94402
info@speedwitch.com
www.speedwitch.com
(650) 787-1912


SFRD rebuilt reefers

ed_mines
 

I want to build a model of a version C SFRD rebuilt reefer from an
undec. IM kit.
These cars have Gypsum roof walks. My recollection is that these are
slotted, but I couldn't find any confirmation in the CBCs I had
handy. Any suggestions of what to use for running boards and hatch
platforms?
Plano offered an Apex set but it's not listed in the current
Walthers' catalog. Were Gypsum and Apex similar in appearance?
The running board and hatch platforms are black, right?
I was thinking of extending the top side sheet with a 1X4 inch
styrene sheet and "painting" that extension with a black decal
stripe. Anyone try this already? I guess I could use drafting tape,
but I need the styrene as a spacer.
On a new car the black is glossy, not dull like car cement. right?
How about painting the hinges? They are almost flat on the car
making Al Westerfield's technique iffy (for me at least).
I never had good luck with Microscale masking. It seemed to be too
viscous. Is another type better? Anyone ever dilute microscale's
with water?

Ed


Re: P2k 8k HPCX tank Car

Larry Grubb <larry450sl@...>
 

Brian,
My July 1960 ORER lists this car.
Larry Grubb

Brian J Carlson <brian@bluemoon.net> wrote:
Never mind my first question, these cars are still listed in the 1955 ORER.
Can someone check a1958 ORER of me to see if HPCX 706 is still listed?

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian J Carlson" <brian@net.bluemoon.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 4:24 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] P2k 8k HPCX tank Car


Tony, Thanks, I don't have his Tank Car Book, but I do have his AC&F
History
book and I found some diagrams that show my error in thinking. (For
others
that may be interested see page 48, it's a more modern car but the
principle
is the same.)

Unfortunately, a picture of HPCX 1153 on the bottom of page 112 shows a
10,625 gallon, ICC 105-A-300-W, part of a 6 car lot, 1150-1155.

Does anyone know if the 8000 gallon cars continued to be leased by
Hercules
after the arrive of the above mentioned cars in 1952?

I model 1957.

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY





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Re: IC 10' boxcars

Ed Hawkins
 

On Sunday, May 15, 2005, at 08:02 PM, cobrapsl@aol.com wrote:

OK Ed, I am confused. I got a couple of the special run RC T&P car
kits,
which included extra resin doors with Union duplex fixtures, from Joe
Pennington.
I thought that is how they all came in the Society run you had done.
Your help
is appreicated, as one is never to old to learn.
Paul Lyons
Laguna Niguel, CA
Paul,
Joe Pennington once produced various detail parts in cast urethane
including some box car doors. The MoPac Historical Society did not
sponsor this project. I had Jerry Porter of Innovative Model Works
produce them for me directly. I offered the kits for sale to MPHS
members, but the project was completely funded and managed by myself.
While I knew at the time that the doors in the IMWX 1937 AAR box car
kit weren't precisely correct for the prototype cars (i.e., like ACL's
1937 AAR box cars), I chose to keep the costs within reason by offering
the kits with the Youngstown doors with Camel door fixtures offered by
IMWX. All of the T&P box cars I sold were in IMWX boxes. Jerry Porter
had just sold his tooling for the 1937 AAR box car to Red Caboose and
RC was just beginning to bring out models under their name. Jerry had a
quantity of undecorated kits available (from his own stock) having ends
with square corners, so I struck a deal with him for a quantity of
these T&P cars. Jerry painted and lettered the models to my
specifications (three different schemes depicting as-built, postwar,
and circa 1958). Once Red Caboose took over production of the car, they
immediately created new tooling for a better set of grab irons. The
original IMWX kit was incredibly good for its time (it's now been about
15 years ago when it was first introduced), but the grabs were grossly
oversize. So I purchased from Red Caboose a quantity of their grab
irons so I could furnish them in my kits. That's the history in a
nutshell.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: B-50-22 series question

jaley <jaley@...>
 

Will the real B-50-22 please stand up?

The data I have show the REAL B-50-22 as having double-truss spring
plankless trucks, Ajax hand brakes, and wood running boards.

I also see that the B-50-22 has a big "UNION PACIFIC" painted on the side.

:-)

Regards,

-Jeff

On May 15, 9:25pm, stefanelaine wrote:
Subject: [STMFC] B-50-22 series question
Tony,

These cars are listed in the 1993 RMC article as having Klasing
brakes, Apex steel roofwalks and Barber S2 trucks. However, the 1956
freight car roster reprint book published by the SPH&TS lists these as
being equipped with AAR double truss trucks with spring planks (eg:
Accurail truck).

My questions:
1.Which truck is correct? Where some sub groups of the B-50-22s with
the S2 which may not have been listed in the 1956 roster?
2.What are Klasing brakes (I suspect that these are similar to the
Ajax type)?
3. Did all these cars have steel roofwalks?

The P2k cars come with plankless trucks,wood roofwalks and Ajax brakes
as on their A-50-14 series DD cars. Is this combination in any way
correct for either series of cars?
--
Jeff Aley jaley@pcocd2.intel.com
DPG Chipsets Product Engineering
Intel Corporation, Folsom, CA
(916) 356-3533


Re: B-50-22 series question

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Lee A. Gautreaux wrote:
How far will your coverage go? I assume that you will cover all of
the 40 and 50 ton cars. Will you cover any of the early 70 or 100
ton cars?
Yes, a bunch of the 70- and 100-ton cars.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Lost cars

Rupert and Maureen <gamlenz@...>
 

Ed

Thanks for this information. I'll try to get a copy of these when they are published.

Rupert Gamlen
Auckland NZ

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Hawkins" <hawk0621@sbcglobal.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 3:53 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Lost cars


Related to this subject, plans are in work for a 2-part article on
Burlington's XA auto cars to be published in Railway Prototype
Cyclopedia. The wood-sheathed cars through the XA-14s is planned for
Volume 12 to be followed in Volume 13 with the all-steel XA-15 and
XA-16 cars built 1941 through 1946. Will advise the STMFC as the
completion time for Vol. 12 nears.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Lost cars

Ed Hawkins
 

On Sunday, May 15, 2005, at 01:48 PM, Rupert and Maureen wrote:

My first recording of these XA-15's 49500-49674 was 7/45, but there is
no
triangle denoting additions alongside the numbers, so this wasn't the
first
recording.

From: "Ed Hawkins"
The 1/45 ORER does not list 48700-48874.
Ed
Can you check for the 49500-49674 in 1/45 - thanks
Rupert,
The 1/45 ORER lists CB&Q 49500-49674 with a triangle, but ..... for the
number of cars in service. Even though the cars are reported to have
been built in 1944, the ORER for 1/45 doesn't show any of them as being
in service at that time. A CB&Q builder's photo of #49500 has a build
date of 11-44, so the construction of the cars had begun in late 1944.

Related to this subject, plans are in work for a 2-part article on
Burlington's XA auto cars to be published in Railway Prototype
Cyclopedia. The wood-sheathed cars through the XA-14s is planned for
Volume 12 to be followed in Volume 13 with the all-steel XA-15 and
XA-16 cars built 1941 through 1946. Will advise the STMFC as the
completion time for Vol. 12 nears.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Use of black on roofs, ends, doors.

Ed Hawkins
 

On Sunday, May 15, 2005, at 02:46 PM, Scott Pitzer wrote:

d,
Do you mean 40' or 50' C&O PS-1s?  If 40' do you mean the 6' door or
8' door... the white roman lettered ones or the yellow Futura lettered
ones?
Scott Pitzer
Scott,
The C&O cars I was referring to were 50' PS-1s numbered 21000-21499,
built 1956. There's an overhead photo showing a new car in Erie In
Color (page 114).
Regards,
Ed Hawkins

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: IC 10' boxcars

Ed Hawkins
 

On Sunday, May 15, 2005, at 12:04 PM, cobrapsl@aol.com wrote:

Just remember the T&P cars done by Ed Hawkins have the correct resin
doors.
The RC kit doors are not correct.
Paul Lyons
Laguna Niguel, CA
Paul,
This isn't so. The doors used for these kits were the same doors used
in the IMWX kits, having Camel door fixtures. The T&P prototype cars
had Union Duplex fixtures.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: B-50-22 series question

Lee Gautreaux
 

Stefan,

Hey, that is why they make food stamps! Actually, Tony's Vol III is
indeed an incredible resource and answers many questions about SP's
fleet of auto boxes and early flat cars. It is certainly the most
info packed of the series and whets my appetite for the box car
volume.


Volume 3 is apparently in the mail, so that should help with the
automobile cars!(I must say that my wallet is having trouble
keeping
up with your prodigious output;-)
Tony,

How far will your coverage go? I assume that you will cover all of
the 40 and 50 ton cars. Will you cover any of the early 70 or 100
ton cars?

Lee A. Gautreaux - The RailGoat
http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/


Re: B-50-22 series question

oliver
 

Tony,
Ah, now I understand. Thanks for clarifiying that! As often happens
with historical data, an omission (in this case based on common
knowledge at the time)can get one in trouble after the fact!

Unfortunately, that does mean that I've got to get an order in to
Plano for those roofwalks, but the trucks and brake won't be correct
in any case regardless of choice for the B-50-22s. It seems that even
with all the nice trucks and brake sets available there still is room
for more.

Volume 3 is apparently in the mail, so that should help with the
automobile cars!(I must say that my wallet is having trouble keeping
up with your prodigious output;-)

Thanks
Stefan


.. --- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Anthony Thompson <thompson@s...> wrote:

Stefan Lerché wrote:
These cars are listed in the 1993 RMC article as having Klasing
brakes, Apex steel roofwalks and Barber S2 trucks. However, the 1956
freight car roster reprint book published by the SPH&TS lists these as
being equipped with AAR double truss trucks with spring planks (eg:
Accurail truck).
My questions:
1.Which truck is correct? Where some sub groups of the B-50-22s with
the S2 which may not have been listed in the 1956 roster?
Stefan, the Barber S2 feature is a bolster snubber. It is not a
truck. Many truck makers licensed the Barber feature and included it in
their proprietary trucks. Thus a buyer like SP could specify S2 trucks
and only mean trucks with S2 snubbers included. The B-50-22 class,
however, did not have S2 trucks. This is one of several (minor) errors
in the 1993 RMC articles which will be corrected in the box car volume
of my series, now in progress.
"AAR" likewise refers only to the sideframe pattern in a
general way; individual manufacturers implemented it in somewhat
varying fashion as to appearance (which modelers care about), but the
mechanical specs. were AAR. The trucks for this entire class were AAR
double-truss trucks from American Steel Foundries, and they included
Simplex spring snubbers. The SP order summary does not mention spring
planks, for the very good reason that at that time (1941) the spring
plank was standard. Spring plankless trucks were unusual and would
merit mention.

2.What are Klasing brakes (I suspect that these are similar to the
Ajax type)?
Klasing is a make of handbrake. They are not the same as Ajax.
See any Cyc in the 1937 to 1953 period.

3. Did all these cars have steel roofwalks?
Yes, Apex as you list.

The P2k cars come with plankless trucks,wood roofwalks and Ajax brakes
as on their A-50-14 series DD cars. Is this combination in any way
correct for either series of cars?
See my volume 3: all three features are wrong for this
class. The cars had AAR trucks with spring planks (half Scullin, half
Bettendorf), Apex steel running boards, and Equipco handbrakes.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@s...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: B-50-22 series question

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

I wrote:
See my volume 3: all three features are wrong for this class. The
cars had AAR trucks with spring planks (half Scullin, half Bettendorf), Apex steel running boards, and Equipco handbrakes.<<

I should have stated that the features described are for Class A-50-14. But obviously these features are equally wrong for B-50-22. In both cases, of course, they are easily corrected.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: B-50-22 series question

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Stefan Lerché wrote:
These cars are listed in the 1993 RMC article as having Klasing
brakes, Apex steel roofwalks and Barber S2 trucks. However, the 1956
freight car roster reprint book published by the SPH&TS lists these as
being equipped with AAR double truss trucks with spring planks (eg:
Accurail truck).
My questions:
1.Which truck is correct? Where some sub groups of the B-50-22s with
the S2 which may not have been listed in the 1956 roster?
Stefan, the Barber S2 feature is a bolster snubber. It is not a
truck. Many truck makers licensed the Barber feature and included it in
their proprietary trucks. Thus a buyer like SP could specify S2 trucks
and only mean trucks with S2 snubbers included. The B-50-22 class,
however, did not have S2 trucks. This is one of several (minor) errors
in the 1993 RMC articles which will be corrected in the box car volume
of my series, now in progress.
"AAR" likewise refers only to the sideframe pattern in a
general way; individual manufacturers implemented it in somewhat
varying fashion as to appearance (which modelers care about), but the
mechanical specs. were AAR. The trucks for this entire class were AAR
double-truss trucks from American Steel Foundries, and they included Simplex spring snubbers. The SP order summary does not mention spring
planks, for the very good reason that at that time (1941) the spring
plank was standard. Spring plankless trucks were unusual and would
merit mention.

2.What are Klasing brakes (I suspect that these are similar to the
Ajax type)?
Klasing is a make of handbrake. They are not the same as Ajax.
See any Cyc in the 1937 to 1953 period.

3. Did all these cars have steel roofwalks?
Yes, Apex as you list.

The P2k cars come with plankless trucks,wood roofwalks and Ajax brakes
as on their A-50-14 series DD cars. Is this combination in any way
correct for either series of cars?
See my volume 3: all three features are wrong for this
class. The cars had AAR trucks with spring planks (half Scullin, half
Bettendorf), Apex steel running boards, and Equipco handbrakes.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: IC 10' boxcars

Paul Lyons
 

OK Ed, I am confused. I got a couple of the special run RC T&P car kits,
which included extra resin doors with Union duplex fixtures, from Joe Pennington.
I thought that is how they all came in the Society run you had done. Your help
is appreicated, as one is never to old to learn.
Paul Lyons
Laguna Niguel, CA


Re: B-50-22 series question

Doug Brown <brown194@...>
 

It appears that the term "double truss" is often misused and
misunderstood in this hobby. See Richard Hendrickson's article on
freight trucks in RPC. The term refers to the construction of a
stiffener in the lower chord of the sideframe. Accurails "Bettendorf"
truck does not have this feature. Kadeee's "Bettendorf" truck does have
this feature and has always been called a double truss truck. Although
not originally labeled as such (correctly), Kadee is now labeling their
T-section and Vulcan trucks as double truss trucks also, which they are
not.

Doug Brown

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
stefanelaine
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 4:25 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] B-50-22 series question

Tony,

These cars are listed in the 1993 RMC article as having Klasing
brakes, Apex steel roofwalks and Barber S2 trucks. However, the 1956
freight car roster reprint book published by the SPH&TS lists these as
being equipped with AAR double truss trucks with spring planks (eg:
Accurail truck).

My questions:
1.Which truck is correct? Where some sub groups of the B-50-22s with
the S2 which may not have been listed in the 1956 roster?
2.What are Klasing brakes (I suspect that these are similar to the
Ajax type)?
3. Did all these cars have steel roofwalks?

The P2k cars come with plankless trucks,wood roofwalks and Ajax brakes
as on their A-50-14 series DD cars. Is this combination in any way
correct for either series of cars?

Many thanks in advance
Stefan Lerché
Duncan, British Columbia






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