Date   

Re: Alburgh Trestle (view southward from)

Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
 

Al Brown wrote:
"Since the Rutland is kinda small and off in a corner of the country,
does this mean anything for bigger railroads elsewhere? Well, maybe.
The Seaboard Air Line had (1/53) over 1500 coal hoppers, almost all
offset triples. But they never originated much coal on line, and "the
last [on-line] mine ... closed in 1947." (Gehrke, "Freight Traffic
Geography of the SAL", p 234) So, what were all those hoppers used
for? Trans-shipped locomotive coal?"

That's one possible use, but the SAL also served Birmingham. Could they
have been used for customers there?


Ben Hom


Re: Merger mania

Schuyler Larrabee
 

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 8:10 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Merger mania

Paul Hillman wrote
. Did the tooling-costs ultimately consume their
glorious intents, as well as a below-expected sales volume?
Tim O'Connor

That may be true of Stewart,

A good part of the sale of Stewart was that Steve, having lost his first wife, and found the second,
and also having become pretty much exhausted in terms of energy to keep Stewart at the front edge,
or at least close to it, was, simply, ready to sell out and retire.

He tells me he's having a ball.

SGL


Re: trucks & trailers

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

FYI, Don Mills also has a website.

http://www.hankstruckpictures.com/don_mills_models.htm

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

----- Original Message -----
From: "lnbill" <bwelch@uucf.org>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 2:48 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: trucks & trailers


Hi Mont:

You are of course right, which I why I knew I would not land in the
moderators jail house, and you were one of the people I was thinking
about when I made the post.

BTW, for anyone looking for vintage photos of trucks, check out

www.hankstruckpictures.com

Bill Welch



--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Montford Switzer" <ZOE@I...> wrote:
Bill and all,

Trucks and trailers make good loads, are great "scenery" items for
freight houses, team tracks and drayage operations all of which
support
steam era freight car operations. I think you will stay clear of
moderator jail on this one.

Now if I put out a message like that it would be immediately be
suspect
since I like old trucks as well and the rail operations that they
supported.

Mont Switzer

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of
lnbill
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 11:29 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] trucks & trailers

Although strickly speaking, making a posting about trucks is
outside
the subject matter of this list, but knowing the interests of many
on
this list, I thought I would offer the following source for a small
range of trucks and trailers that is not widely known or available.
The
email address below is for Don Mills, who is in New England. Ask
him to
send you and email of his offerings, which are in our era. I have
several examples of his resin offerings and can testify that thye
are
very nice, and represent prototypes not available anywhere else.
The
kits can be ordered from Don.

Donmillsmodels@a...

Bill Welch





Yahoo! Groups Links




Yahoo! Groups Links






Re: trucks & trailers

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Bill, I'll second the recommendation. Don's kits build up into really nice foreground models.

SGL

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of lnbill
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 12:29 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] trucks & trailers

Although strickly speaking, making a posting about trucks is
outside the subject matter of this list, but knowing the
interests of many on this list, I thought I would offer the
following source for a small range of trucks and trailers
that is not widely known or available. The email address
below is for Don Mills, who is in New England. Ask him to
send you and email of his offerings, which are in our era. I
have several examples of his resin offerings and can testify
that thye are very nice, and represent prototypes not
available anywhere else. The kits can be ordered from Don.

Donmillsmodels@aol.com

Bill Welch





Yahoo! Groups Links






Re: Merger mania

Tim O'Connor
 

Paul Hillman wrote

What's curious to me is, after the last few years of all these greatly done RTR efforts and special issues of these various manufacturers, all of a sudden a sell-out/merger is necessary. Did the tooling-costs ultimately consume their glorious intents, as well as a below-expected sales volume?

That may be true of Stewart, but certainly not Athearn, and [probably] Life-Like.
They were like most companies bought because their success attracted buyers with
money to invest.

Tim O'Connor


Re: Montour Hoppers (was Alburgh Trestle)

Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
 

I wrote:
"M 18000-18299, IL 33 ft, 2081 cu ft (Offset)
M 18034 (Alburgh, 21Apr48)
M 18172 (Alburgh, 10Apr48)
M 18196 (Alburgh, 21Apr48)
M 18244 (Alburgh, 10Apr48)

M 19000-19199, IL 33 ft, 2145 cu ft (Offset)
M 19006 (Alburgh, 10Apr48)
M 19063 (Alburgh, 09Apr48)
M 19153 (Alburgh, 10Apr48)
M 19156 (Alburgh, 21Apr48)
M 19198 (Alburgh, 09Apr48)

I'll pull more details on the offsets after work tonight."

M 18000-18299, P-S, 300 cars built 7-41, oval ends, AAR alternate standard.

M 19000-19199, P-S, 200 cars built 1946, notched peaked ends, AAR standard.

Data from RP Cyc 1, p 95.


Ben Hom


Re: Merger mania

Tom Jones III <tomtherailnut@...>
 

The mergers are inevitable, especially with the advent of much of
manufacturing and assembly going to China. The "local" guys just don't need
as much - as much real estate, as much personel, as much overhead. Plus, the
cost of developing good quality models goes down if you don't have to train
you own replacement! Just buy him or her when you buy your competitor out.

Tom

----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Hillman" <chris_hillman@msn.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 5:13 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Merger mania


What's curious to me is, after the last few years of all these greatly
done RTR efforts and special issues of these various manufacturers, all of a
sudden a sell-out/merger is necessary. Did the tooling-costs ultimately
consume their glorious intents, as well as a below-expected sales volume?

I hope these companies remain by name and quality. I don't want to have to
ultimately buy from just one firm.

It's sounding like the prototype mergers. (In that respect, what happened
to the anti-trust/monopoly "laws".)

Paul Hillman
----- Original Message -----
From: cf5250<mailto:timboconnor@comcast.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com<mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 4:04 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Merger mania



Regarding Walthers + Lifelike --

It's interesting there has been no speculation here on the effect
this combination might have on Branchline for example. BL is owned
by Hobby Stores Distributing and losing the Proto1000/2000 line as
well as already having lost Athearn & Roundhouse makes me wonder if
HSD will either start on a buying spree of its own, or give up and
try to sell Branchline to someone else... in the age old game of
merge, or die!

Tim O'Connor






Yahoo! Groups Links













Yahoo! Groups Links






Re: Merger mania

Ted Culotta <tculotta@...>
 

On Jul 18, 2005, at 5:04 PM, cf5250 wrote:


Regarding Walthers + Lifelike --

It's interesting there has been no speculation here on the effect
this combination might have on Branchline for example. BL is owned
by Hobby Stores Distributing and losing the Proto1000/2000 line as
well as already having lost Athearn & Roundhouse makes me wonder if
HSD will either start on a buying spree of its own, or give up and
try to sell Branchline to someone else... in the age old game of
merge, or die!
I don't claim to know their business, but last time I checked, HSD did not survive on trains alone, but rather distributed other types of hobby kits and associated paraphernalia. I don't know if the military plastic market has gone the same route of manufacturers cum distributors or vice versa, but if not, they are not in as weak a position as one might surmise.

Regards,
Ted Culotta

Speedwitch Media
645 Tanner Marsh Road, Guilford, CT 06437
info@speedwitch.com
www.speedwitch.com
(650) 787-1912


Re: Alburgh Trestle (view southward from)

al_brown03
 

It was partly my fault we got down off the Alburgh trestle, :-) so
let's climb back up & see what we know.

To summarize several people's contributions: (see if I get it right)

(1) Rutland received coal at the Alburgh trestle in hoppers of various
railroads, mostly serving the Pennsylvania and West Virginia coal
fields. (2) One of the source railroads was the Montour; to go back to
Jace Kahn's original question, it indeed seems likely that there was
an arrangement with an operator on the Montour. (3) Rutland's own
hoppers were used to trans-ship this coal from Alburgh to other engine
terminals on the Rutland. (Ben and Tim's compilations are fascinating!)

Since the Rutland is kinda small and off in a corner of the country,
does this mean anything for bigger railroads elsewhere? Well, maybe.
The Seaboard Air Line had (1/53) over 1500 coal hoppers, almost all
offset triples. But they never originated much coal on line, and "the
last [on-line] mine ... closed in 1947." (Gehrke, "Freight Traffic
Geography of the SAL", p 234) So, what were all those hoppers used
for? Trans-shipped locomotive coal?

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@o...>
wrote:
Hey, guys, this thread has been going on for a long time and there
hasn't been a word about the Alburgh trestle recently. The subject
line should have been changed to Montour Hoppers several days ago.
Doesn't matter to me, as I'm not interested either in the Alburgh
trestle or in Montour hoppers, but others on the list have doubtless
been needlessly confused.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Merger mania

Paul Hillman
 

What's curious to me is, after the last few years of all these greatly done RTR efforts and special issues of these various manufacturers, all of a sudden a sell-out/merger is necessary. Did the tooling-costs ultimately consume their glorious intents, as well as a below-expected sales volume?

I hope these companies remain by name and quality. I don't want to have to ultimately buy from just one firm.

It's sounding like the prototype mergers. (In that respect, what happened to the anti-trust/monopoly "laws".)

Paul Hillman

----- Original Message -----
From: cf5250<mailto:timboconnor@comcast.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com<mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 4:04 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Merger mania



Regarding Walthers + Lifelike --

It's interesting there has been no speculation here on the effect
this combination might have on Branchline for example. BL is owned
by Hobby Stores Distributing and losing the Proto1000/2000 line as
well as already having lost Athearn & Roundhouse makes me wonder if
HSD will either start on a buying spree of its own, or give up and
try to sell Branchline to someone else... in the age old game of
merge, or die!

Tim O'Connor






Yahoo! Groups Links


More On Merger & Buyouts

montydogsdad2 <artgriffindecals@...>
 

Group,

If anyone has wondered what the result is of all these mergers/
buyouts would or will be on the modeler, just ponder this: I just
learned from a customer who wanted to purchase 100 N scale MDC
Roundhouse box cars and reefers from Athearn was told in no uncertain
terms---"Those are discontinued!" Hold onto your hats gents and
ladies...this is not the end of the story. Only the beginning.

Art Griffin


Re: Merger mania

Charlie Vlk
 

The only major independent producers of freightcars will likely be Atlas and
Bachmann. Model Power hasn't stepped up to the plate with HO or N Scale
serious cars; Accurail, Intermountain and Red Caboose are likely acquistion
candidates. Stewart already went to Bowser. The shakeup will be in
Distributors.... the impact on manufacturers will be less significant than
the downsizing of the delivery pipeline due to the pairing of single source
distributors with Athearn, Stewart, MDC, and LifeLike. Smaller hobby
distributors like Trost, California Hobby, etc. will be likely be hurt.
Charlie Vlk


Merger mania

Tim O'Connor
 

Regarding Walthers + Lifelike --

It's interesting there has been no speculation here on the effect
this combination might have on Branchline for example. BL is owned
by Hobby Stores Distributing and losing the Proto1000/2000 line as
well as already having lost Athearn & Roundhouse makes me wonder if
HSD will either start on a buying spree of its own, or give up and
try to sell Branchline to someone else... in the age old game of
merge, or die!

Tim O'Connor


Re: Athearn/Lifelike composite hoppers

ed_mines
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com regarding the 2 aforementioned
models, "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@w...> wrote: "What do you think?"

I think for my purposes the Athearn car is just as good. I was pretty
disappointed with the LL car, especially those individual grab irons.
I like the LL weight though.

Ed


Re: Canadian open hoppers in USA

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Max Carey wrote:
"I am guessing that a lot of coal moved from the USA into Canada by
rail during the steam era, and it seems reasonable that some of it may
have moved on hoppers of Canadian railroads. However, I can't recall
ever actually seeing a Canadian hopper in the States back then. I would
appreciate information on the subject, including specifics on the
names of the Canadian roads and the kinds of cargo."

Another data point - so far, out of 414 foreign road hoppers at Alburgh
between 1947-1951, not a single one was CN or CP.


Ben Hom


Re: 1920's-1950's Penmanship in Conductor and Yard Reports

Tim Gilbert <tgilbert@...>
 

Richard Hendrickson wrote:

I'll add that on the Santa Fe the common abbreviation was "AT," not
"SF," and I know that this practice was followed on other RRs as well.
Richard,

Different Strokes for different folks - on the UP and SOU, it was either ATSF, SF or Sf.

Tim


Re: Athearn/Lifelike composite hoppers

Scott Pitzer
 

And speaking of the (Athearn) steel offset twin, I wonder if there's more hope for such a car to join the Life-Like line in the upcoming "Walthers Era."
Scott Pitzer
----------------------------------------------


- Correct interior on the Proto 2000 car (the Athearn car reuses the
same interior from their offset twin model)
-
Ben Hom


Re: Alburgh Trestle - 1920's-1950's Penmanship in Conductor and Yard Reports

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jul 18, 2005, at 4:50 AM, Tim Gilbert wrote:

There were many "local" abbreviations of reporting marks: - the "C" and
"P" for the NYC and PRR on the Rutland, but not on the CP in Vermont;
the "M" for the B&M on the CP in Vermont, but not on the Rutland.

The "CB2" reference for the "CBQ" is perfectly understandable because
kids in school were taught to write in script the capital of the letter
"Q" - it looked like a "two" - at least I was taught that way in New
Canaan CT around 1950. I suppose most mid-western roads abbreviated the
CB&Q to "Q" (or "2").

On the UP, "Rd" was an abbreviation of SFRD which could easily be
confused with "RI" - a capital "I" could look like a small case "d".
I'll add that on the Santa Fe the common abbreviation was "AT," not "SF," and I know that this practice was followed on other RRs as well.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Alburgh Trestle

Richard Hendrickson
 

Hey, guys, this thread has been going on for a long time and there hasn't been a word about the Alburgh trestle recently. The subject line should have been changed to Montour Hoppers several days ago. Doesn't matter to me, as I'm not interested either in the Alburgh trestle or in Montour hoppers, but others on the list have doubtless been needlessly confused.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: trucks & trailers

lnbill <bwelch@...>
 

Hi Mont:

You are of course right, which I why I knew I would not land in the
moderators jail house, and you were one of the people I was thinking
about when I made the post.

BTW, for anyone looking for vintage photos of trucks, check out

www.hankstruckpictures.com

Bill Welch



--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Montford Switzer" <ZOE@I...> wrote:
Bill and all,

Trucks and trailers make good loads, are great "scenery" items for
freight houses, team tracks and drayage operations all of which
support
steam era freight car operations. I think you will stay clear of
moderator jail on this one.

Now if I put out a message like that it would be immediately be
suspect
since I like old trucks as well and the rail operations that they
supported.

Mont Switzer

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of
lnbill
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 11:29 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] trucks & trailers

Although strickly speaking, making a posting about trucks is
outside
the subject matter of this list, but knowing the interests of many
on
this list, I thought I would offer the following source for a small
range of trucks and trailers that is not widely known or available.
The
email address below is for Don Mills, who is in New England. Ask
him to
send you and email of his offerings, which are in our era. I have
several examples of his resin offerings and can testify that thye
are
very nice, and represent prototypes not available anywhere else.
The
kits can be ordered from Don.

Donmillsmodels@a...

Bill Welch





Yahoo! Groups Links

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