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Details of Erie 1958 cu ft covered hoppers

Mark Heiden
 

Hello everyone,

I'm making a shopping list of detail parts to model a pair of Erie
1958 cu ft covered hoppers, using Bowser 55600 kits as the basis.
From what I can tell, these cars were part of series 21100-21199,
built in 1946. Prototype photos are on Fallen Flags at:

B-end: http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/el/frt/erie21100adb.jpg
Side: http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/el/frt/erie21100bdb.jpg
3/4 side: http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/el/frt/erie21100cdb.jpg

The brakewheel is a Universal type (there's a photo and story on
page 14 of the September 1996 issue of RMJ)that I've never seen
before. Is there a part available for this? The running boards are
by Gypsum, and Plano 090 seems to be a match. This part is made for
the MDC car; will it fit the Bowser model? Any suggestions for the
trucks? I understand they are Barber Stabilized trucks, but Kato ASF-
3 trucks look close to me. For decals I am thinking of Champ HC-
72. Are these correct for this series of cars? Finally, does
anyone know who built the prototypes? I don't see a builder's
stencil in any of the photos.

Thanks,
Mark Heiden
Re: MDC OT tank car frame, was new products (was BLI vs. Walthers ...)

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Sep 27, 2005, at 9:21 AM, Dean Payne wrote:

.... There was a Sunset 3-dome tank in
a garish paint scheme on ebay, it is gone now. Were all the Type
11's 3-dome?
No. As Bruce Smith posted, most were single compartment 8K and 10K gal. cars (the Sunset models were 8K).

Assuming one could find one "cheap", how could one re-
letter one, besides the PRR? Microscale has nothing, Champ makes a D-
X gasoline set (but I don't know what era it is from). I don't see
Associated or Mid-Continent (two petroleum shippers that had them
in "large numbers", as stated in an earlier post.)
The Champ Mid-Continent D-X set is good for the late steam era. Other owners included Gulf Oil, Interstate Tank Car Co., Keith Tank LIne, Lion Oil Co., Mobilgas, National Oil Co., Oil States Tank Car Corp. (a subsidiary of Mid-Continent D-X), Sinclair, Sun Oil, Texaco (whose cars eventually went into the General American fleet), and Union Oil of Calif. Lots of possibilities there, especially since many were black cars lettered only with reporting marks, numbers, and data.

What does it take
to "rework"?
In addition to the modifications listed by Elden Gatwood, I've replaced the flimsy, oversize stamped brass sill steps with flat wire steps. Also, depending on the era you model, you may want to change the air brakes to KC and replace the trucks (most of the prototype cars came with Andrews or had their original arch bars changed to Andrews before ca. 1940). The necessary mods can be carried out by anyone who can solder, especially if you a have a resistance soldering tool.

Richard Hendrickson
Re: NYC modeling

Tim Gilbert <tgilbert@...>
 

timboconnor@... wrote:

There's only one possible explanation for the lack of interest
in New York Central freight operations: they didn't own any
articulated steam locomotives! :-)
Tim,

Incorrect - The B&A had in total of fourteen 2-6-6-2 Mallets built between 1910 and 1916 by Alco. One was transferred to the NYC&HR in 1911 while the others were retired by the B&A in 1930-1932 after the Berks arrived.

The NYC had one 0-6-6-0 built in 1913 & retired in 1932.

The NYC also had sixty 2-6-6-2's (plus the ex-B&A one) built by Alco in four orders between 1911 and 1921. Sixteen survived WW II with the last retired in November 1952.

They also owned nine 0-8-8-0's used for hump service. these were built by Alco in two orders 1915 & 1921 of which eight survived WW II barely - all eight retired in May 1947.

Tim Gilbert
Re: Naperville Price

rockroll50401 <cepropst@...>
 

Dave,
I think you're to use his PO box with your entry fee. I do beleive
you can pay at the door.
Clark propst


--- In STMFC@..., "Dave Nelson" <muskoka@c...> wrote:
What does Martin charge for attending? And does he use his usual
address
for taking such paymnets or does this one get a special PO box? Oh,
and is
it safe to assume one can still gain admission? I want to take care
of
everything today.

Dave Nelson
Re: MILW 40' combo door PS-1

SamClarke
 

Hello Mr. McCoy,

From the few photos we have on this MILW series of PS-1s here is a little
more information.
MILW series 29000-29499 is a 500 car order from PS lot 8449. The cars
from 29000 to 29399 came with Camel Youngtown sliding doors and cars from
29400 to 29499 had Superior doors. Our photos does not show the running
board very clear but what we see it looks like an Apex type of pattern. The
hand brake, direct side view, looks like an Equipco E-989. The trucks are
Barber S-2-A. The cars had nailable steel floors and were plywood lined. The
rivet pattern along the side sill should tell you where the larger cross
beams were located for the underframe and since this was a later production
car, more than likely there were three floor runners running the full length
of the floor on each side of the centerbeam but without the particular
underframe drawings there is no way to tell.

Sam Clarke
Kadee Quality Products

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill McCoy" <bugsy451@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:22 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: MILW 40' combo door PS-1


Ben, Thanks, I plan to use only the McKean underbody platform sans
bolsters and coupler pockets. It does have 3 longitudinal stringers
on each side which I think is right for the PS-1 which I will try to
save or replace with Evergreen strips. I've completed the side sill
modifications and they look pretty good. It really changes the car.
I had planned to use the Intermountain 40' PS-1 frame and some IM
details and kadee #78 couplers, ladders and roofwalk.

Bill McCoy
Jax

--- In STMFC@..., "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@w...> wrote:
Bill McCoy asked:
"A couple of months ago the group helped me identify a prototype
for
my McKean 40' combo plug/8' sliding door PS-1 box car (MILW 29000 -
29499). The biggest change to be made are to the side sills. I've
completed that. <<snip>> The builders photo leaves some questions
I
need to get answers for.
<<snip>>
2. Would the crossbearers have been relocated or does the side
sill
fishbelly take care of this?"

Depends on how much work you want to put into the car, as the side
sill
will hide much of the detail. Be advised that McKean reused the
underframe from their GN double door boxcar for their PS-1 models,
so
what you have may need to be reworked if you want to make it
correct
for a PS-1.


Ben Hom





Yahoo! Groups Links
1944 AAR box car kits for sale

eabracher@...
 

i have three C&BT Shops D&RGW 40' box car kits for sale.

$30 for the lot includes shipping to US address.
Contact me OFF list if interested.

eabracher@...
Re: Barrett car

Miller, Andrew S. <asmiller@...>
 

I've seen another photo somewhere of a Barret tank with two different
size domes. We used to refer to it as the dome and half tank car. I
kitbashed a crude model of it many, many years ago.

I believe that Barret was a major supplier of tar for the paving
asphalt industry. Their product name, on the side of the cars, was
"Barret Tarvia".

Champ made decals for this car in HO. I don't know if they are still
available, but their plan book provides details on what the decals
looked like.

regards,

Andy Miller

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
hoghead32
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 4:03 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Barrett car

I just posted a picture of a Barrett tankcar taken in 1961. It surely
is an odd duck. This crop of a larger photo is the best I can do at
present. Would anyone out there have any information on this car. The
Md. and Pa RR at this time was hauling slate granules; could this be a
covered hopper?

It is the last photo in the Photo File. Thanks for any info!
Barrett again

hoghead32 <buckfiveoh@...>
 

I posted a second picture of the car in question. And the photo was in
fact made in April, 1960.
Barrett car

hoghead32 <buckfiveoh@...>
 

I just posted a picture of a Barrett tankcar taken in 1961. It surely
is an odd duck. This crop of a larger photo is the best I can do at
present. Would anyone out there have any information on this car. The
Md. and Pa RR at this time was hauling slate granules; could this be a
covered hopper?

It is the last photo in the Photo File. Thanks for any info!
Re: Digest Number 2692

Jedalberg
 

Re:Roller Bearing Models.
As some of you may have noticed, RBM advertized in the last RMC. Speifically
the LHR/CNJ ore cars. I have seen a built up model at Jerry Dziedzic's and it
looks very nice. Anyway I called RBM and we talked about the model; and I
ordered a couple.
It was one of those really hot days a couple of weeks ago, and Ed said to me,
"...I'd better get out in the workshop and start making some kits---gad, that
stuff stinks!..."

He sent me by email a catalog which I haven't opened. I have dialup and it
takes a month of Sundays to download, maybe if I had started then I could open
it now, but I wouldn't have gotten any telephone calls either.
I have a couple of (much, like a quarter century) earlier RBM cars on the
railroad; they are fine.
Waiting for my cars to put into zinc ore service.
Jim Dalberg
Re: Barrett car

raildata@...
 

In the Morning Sun book "D&H Steam in Color" two of the Barrett tank/hoppers
for roofing granules can clearly seen in a train going north out of Carbondale
PA.

Chuck Yungkurth
Boulder CO
Re: MILW 40' combo door PS-1

Bill McCoy <bugsy451@...>
 

Ben, Thanks, I plan to use only the McKean underbody platform sans
bolsters and coupler pockets. It does have 3 longitudinal stringers
on each side which I think is right for the PS-1 which I will try to
save or replace with Evergreen strips. I've completed the side sill
modifications and they look pretty good. It really changes the car.
I had planned to use the Intermountain 40' PS-1 frame and some IM
details and kadee #78 couplers, ladders and roofwalk.

Bill McCoy
Jax

--- In STMFC@..., "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@w...> wrote:
Bill McCoy asked:
"A couple of months ago the group helped me identify a prototype
for
my McKean 40' combo plug/8' sliding door PS-1 box car (MILW 29000 -
29499). The biggest change to be made are to the side sills. I've
completed that. <<snip>> The builders photo leaves some questions
I
need to get answers for.
<<snip>>
2. Would the crossbearers have been relocated or does the side
sill
fishbelly take care of this?"

Depends on how much work you want to put into the car, as the side
sill
will hide much of the detail. Be advised that McKean reused the
underframe from their GN double door boxcar for their PS-1 models,
so
what you have may need to be reworked if you want to make it
correct
for a PS-1.


Ben Hom
Re: now NYC

Tim O'Connor
 

The largest and most active group appears to be the NYC-RR list.

Also check out the following NYC groups in addition to those already mentioned
<http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/NYC-RR/?yguid=589475>
Re: now NYC

Tim O'Connor
 

The largest and most active group appears to be the NYC-RR list.

Also check out the following NYC groups in addition to those already mentioned
<http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/NYC-RR/?yguid=589475>
Re: NYC modeling

Tim O'Connor
 

There's only one possible explanation for the lack of interest
in New York Central freight operations: they didn't own any
articulated steam locomotives! :-)

Tim O.

Folks;
While Jeff and Terry have certainly done more than their share, and
continue to do so, this is all very strange news. I simply do not
understand how a RR of that size would have so few people actively
pursuing an obvious host of interesting projects.

My experience with the NYCHS folks has been much the same as yours.
Write, call, e-mail; doesn't much matter; ignored anyway.

At one time, I was trying very hard to try to get information on the
NYC's (and P&LE's)container gon fleet. They had a diverse and very
interesting set of cars equipped with containers for a variety of
purposes. I eventually just tabled the project due to almost no
interest from anyone.

A friend of mine has likewise gone from one place to the next in search
of specific boxcar info.

Well, one can only hope that some of the great work that some folks are
doing will eventually be disseminated for all of us to enjoy.

Elden Gatwood


-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Westerfield
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:35 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: NYC list

We attended one annual convention of the society. The only layout was
Lionel. Sales were dismal. For the size of the railroad modeling
interest pales in comparison to PRR. - Al Westerfield

Yet the NYC Society is one of those which, upon polling
members,
determined that about 90% of their members were modelers. I'd say the
"loud complainer" was well out of there.

Tony Thompson Editor,







Yahoo! Groups Links










Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: MDC OT tank car frame, was new products (was BLI vs. Walthers ...)

Bruce Smith <smithbf@...>
 

On Sep 27, 2005, at 11:21 AM, Dean Payne wrote:
There was a Sunset 3-dome tank in
a garish paint scheme on ebay, it is gone now. Were all the Type
11's 3-dome?
No, the "3 dome" from Sunset is bogus, or represents a miniscule # of cars. You're better off sticking to the single dome "PRR TM8" which is the classic Type 11 I mentioned.


Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0
Re: NYC list

Gatwood, Elden <Elden.Gatwood@...>
 

Folks;
While Jeff and Terry have certainly done more than their share, and
continue to do so, this is all very strange news. I simply do not
understand how a RR of that size would have so few people actively
pursuing an obvious host of interesting projects.

My experience with the NYCHS folks has been much the same as yours.
Write, call, e-mail; doesn't much matter; ignored anyway.

At one time, I was trying very hard to try to get information on the
NYC's (and P&LE's)container gon fleet. They had a diverse and very
interesting set of cars equipped with containers for a variety of
purposes. I eventually just tabled the project due to almost no
interest from anyone.

A friend of mine has likewise gone from one place to the next in search
of specific boxcar info.

Well, one can only hope that some of the great work that some folks are
doing will eventually be disseminated for all of us to enjoy.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Westerfield
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:35 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: NYC list

We attended one annual convention of the society. The only layout was
Lionel. Sales were dismal. For the size of the railroad modeling
interest pales in comparison to PRR. - Al Westerfield

Yet the NYC Society is one of those which, upon polling
members,
determined that about 90% of their members were modelers. I'd say the
"loud complainer" was well out of there.

Tony Thompson Editor,

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: MDC OT tank car frame, was new products (was BLI vs. Walthers ...)

Gatwood, Elden <Elden.Gatwood@...>
 

Dean;
I upgraded a Sunset single-dome "TM8" (Type 11) a while ago. I added
styrene strip as an overlay to the poor-relief tank straps to make them
stand out better; I added brake piping, and I highlighted the sheets to
make it look a little better. Unfortunately, the model has cast-on
grabs on both the underframe and tank, which I, for lack of talent, was
unwilling to replace with separate parts. One could do that, however.
It certainly looks better than most of what was available at the time,
but is certainly not state of the art.

I hope this helps.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Dean Payne
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:21 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: MDC OT tank car frame, was new products (was BLI
vs. Walthers ...)

--- In STMFC@..., Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@o...>
wrote:
On Sep 26, 2005, at 2:54 PM, Dean Payne wrote:

Are there any magazine articles about kitbashing or scratch
building a new underframe for the MDC Old Time tank car? I This
sounds cheaper (and more fun!) than looking for a Sunset brass tank
("coarse by today's standards").

Dean, you're confusing the MDC Class X (MDC model) with the AC&F
Type 11. The Sunset brass model has its shortcomings but it's
currently the only model of the Type 11 in HO scale and can be
reworked fairly easily into a very nice model. <Snip>
Richard Hendrickson
I worded that rather poorly, so you misunderstood. Either of the
different tank cars are an option, versus yet another Proto Type 21.
I should have said "In order to get a little variety in pre-WWII tank
cars, it seems cheaper (and more fun) to bash an MDC tank rather than
looking for a Sunset bra$$ tank." There was a Sunset 3-dome tank in
a garish paint scheme on ebay, it is gone now. Were all the Type
11's 3-dome? Assuming one could find one "cheap", how could one re-
letter one, besides the PRR? Microscale has nothing, Champ makes a D-
X gasoline set (but I don't know what era it is from). I don't see
Associated or Mid-Continent (two petroleum shippers that had them
in "large numbers", as stated in an earlier post.) What does it take
to "rework"?
Dean Payne







Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: now NYC

Mark P.
 

I have received more NYC information, especially from the west end (in particular the Toledo & Ohio Central and Zanesville & Western, and to a lesser extent the Big Four), on the PennsyWest list than I have on all the NYC groups I have been a member of. I listed other NYC groups not yet mentioned that I have been a member of in the past that I have used for my steam era modeling.

Also check out the following NYC groups in addition to those already mentioned (I have been or am still a member of each):
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/newyorkcentralsystem/?yguid=589475>
<http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/NYC-RR/?yguid=589475>
<http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/NYC-RR2/?yguid=589475> (spillover for NYC-RR)
<http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/NYC-RRsignaling/?yguid=589475>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NYCclinics/?yguid=589475> - Jim Six's modeling clinics
<http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/NYCS-RR/?yguid=589475>
<http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/Alltimeinterlockingtowerlist/?yguid=589475> - tower list for all railroads, with a healthy PA and OH exchange of knowledge

Mark Plank

Allen Rueter wrote:
NYC-Railroad - bigger
New-York-Central-Railroad - smaller, but photo of a model!
Tim Gilbert added:
There is a third, too - go to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NYCmodeler/
for more information.

--
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Re: MDC 6000 galon tank underframes

John Swanson <dwlscbq@...>
 

There is a "bit" more materials to work with now than in the late 1980's to attain a more correct underframe thickness. With Evergreen tubing and strip, the project should be easier.
I used a piece of plastruct rectangular tubing for a more correct underframe. Richard was right, I used it to provide a secure coupler box mounting which resulted in the underframe being 6 inches too thick as I recall.
The cars were built to "layout quality" standards in today's terms. I had Ron Roberts (Rail Graphics) make up a set of U.T.L . white decals for the cars to fit my era.
Still the cars looked so much better than with the seemimngly umpteen feet thick cast underframe.

To add weight to tank cars I use old tire weights bought by the pound and held in place with white glue.

John Swanson
148841 - 148860 of 194713