Date   

8.000/10.000 gallon tank car trucks [Proto 2000].

Arnold van Heyst
 

Sirs,

I've just saw severall photo's of the 8.000/10.000 gallon tank cars.
The revited type by Proto 2000.
Normal and insulated.
On the photo's you can see that all the trucks of that type is having
2 springs per side on 1 truck.
The insulated types 4!!

But the Proto 2000 is having 3!!!
Is 3 correct?
Can anyone tell me the manufacturer that has the proper type for this
car in the 1947/1960 period?

Regards,
Arnold van Heyst
Netherlands.


Re: sunshine kits

SUVCWORR@...
 

In a message dated 1/19/2006 1:09:45 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jerryglow@comcast.net writes:

Yea, those free Priority Mail boxes from the Post Office can sure run
up the bill.

Jerry Glow



You assume that the free boxes are being used. In which case, you will need
a considerable amount of packing material for one Sunshine kit box. They
don't fit in the video box so you need to use a 1097 or similar size box which
is greatly oversized. The alternative is to buy appropriate size boxes.

Rich Orr


Re: sunshine kits

Brian Paul Ehni <behni@...>
 

They ain't free. Use one and find out; you get charged for priority service.
Same for any of the Express packing materials.
--
Thanks!

Brian Ehni

From: jerryglow2 <jerryglow@comcast.net>
Reply-To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 18:05:22 -0000
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: sunshine kits

Yea, those free Priority Mail boxes from the Post Office can sure run
up the bill.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, SUVCWORR@a... wrote:

With the recent increase in postage rates (Jan. 8th $4.05 for upto 1
lbs priority mail) plus the cost of the box and packing material, an
increase of $1 in shipping charges is not unreasonable at all.

Just my nickle's worth (inflation).

Rich Orr






Yahoo! Groups Links







Re: sunshine kits

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Jerry Glow wrote:
Yea, those free Priority Mail boxes from the Post Office can sure run
up the bill.
Cute one, Jerry, but Martin ships in the kit boxes if you order onesies and twosies. Or he did as recently as last year, last time I bought one by mail. And BTW for those who don't use it enough to know, postal rates DID increase a bunch in several categories, in some cases more than the five and a half percent of the first class category.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: sunshine kits

jerryglow2
 

Yea, those free Priority Mail boxes from the Post Office can sure run
up the bill.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, SUVCWORR@a... wrote:

With the recent increase in postage rates (Jan. 8th $4.05 for upto 1
lbs priority mail) plus the cost of the box and packing material, an
increase of $1 in shipping charges is not unreasonable at all.

Just my nickle's worth (inflation).

Rich Orr


wood warping

ed_mines
 

Anyone else have a wood car warp when the decals were set with water
based decal setting solution?

I did with an Ambroid X23 box car.

I used the wood sealer from Scalecoat after that. THat wood sealer
also contained fine particles which were supposed to fill in wood
grain.

Being frugal, I started dissolving Ambroid cement in MEK and using
that solution to seal wood (it soaked right in).

I once sealed a Walthers wood passenger car roof with some sealer from
the hardware store. It stil lshowed the grain and I had some mess when
I put the MEK containing Scalecoat sealer on top of that. Fortunately
MDC sold me a couple of Harriman roofs.

Phenol is one of the chemical constituents of coal tar. It's a raw
material to make chlorophenol.

Ed


Re: Freight car floors

jaley <jaley@...>
 

On Jan 19, 9:31am, ljack70117@adelphia.net wrote:
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Freight car floors

I was in El Paso once in 1955. It rained. For the first 10 minutes it
was mud balls. It took it that long to clear the dust out of the air.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@adelphia.net
I would be inclined to think that Larry is exaggerating... except that the
same thing happened to me in Albequerque (actually Rio Rancho, NM) once.

I was driving at the time and instead of rain, I was getting mud spattered
on my windshield.

I'm sure this phenomenon would make for an interesting weathering pattern
on the roof and sides of STEAM ERA FREIGHT CARS.

Regards,

-Jeff

--
Jeff Aley jaley@pcocd2.intel.com
DPG Chipsets Product Engineering
Intel Corporation, Folsom, CA
(916) 356-3533


Re: sunshine kits

SUVCWORR@...
 

With the recent increase in postage rates (Jan. 8th $4.05 for upto 1 lbs priority mail) plus the cost of the box and packing material, an increase of $1 in shipping charges is not unreasonable at all.

Just my nickle's worth (inflation).

Rich Orr

-----Original Message-----
From: Schuyler Larrabee <schuyler.larrabee@verizon.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 22:23:26 -0500
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: sunshine kits




On Wed, January 18, 2006 8:06 pm, Schuyler Larrabee wrote:

And, on the subject of changes, a recent New Products listing in a
magazine said shipping charges were $5, not the $4 we're used to.
Does anyone know if that's right?

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon

So what if it isn't? One more buck for the quality
products you get
in return won't kill the deal, will it?

SGL
Hey Schuyler,

For folks who read <fill in the blank>, we've got a very
special deal <VBG>!

The latest flyer from Martin arrived last week and it says $4.00

Regards
Bruce
My point is, Bruce, that tossing an extra buck into the check to more properly
compensate Martin for
the work he does is NOT inappropriate. If you're that tight for the buck, keep
it.

SGL




Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Freight car flooring

al_brown03
 

From H. Beyer and W. Walter, "Organic Chemistry", transl. D. Lloyd;
Albion: Chichester, England, 1997; pp 472-473:

"The first step in the industrial treatment of coal tar is to
fractionate it by distillation. About 40% of the original tar comes
over as a distillate, which may be classed into the following five
main fractions:

[paragraph on each of the four fractions boiling below 270 degrees C]
[following trimmed for concision]

270-350 degrees C Anthracene oil (18-25% of the original) In the cold
this solidifies to a ... paste, from which higher hydrocarbons ...
and nitrogen-containing substances ... are isolable. ... The
remaining oily material [i.e. after the stuff just mentioned is
removed] is used as creosote, for impregnating wood, and as fuel oil.

[discussion of coal tar finishes with a description of pitch]"

Creosote is naturally occurring, pentachlorophenol isn't (per Gene's
google search); so creosote per se doesn't contain pentachlorophenol.
From chemical descriptions of creosote in other sources, it consists
partly of hydrocarbons and partly of phenols. Hydrocarbons are
compounds containing only carbon and hydrogen; pentachlorophenol,
containing chlorine atoms, isn't a hydrocarbon. I'll readily believe
that commercial creosotes in the steam era may have had
pentachlorophenol added as a disinfectant (basically a broad-spectrum
poison).

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.
(organic chemist)


--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Green" <bierglaeser@y...> wrote:

Gene - Pentachlorophenol IS creosote. A.T. Kott, ChE
Are you sure? Pentachlorophenol is a rather odd name for a
hydrocarbon.

I found this, amoung other things, when I
googled "pentachlorophenol."

"What is pentachlorophenol?

"Pentachlorophenol is a manufactured chemical that does not
occur
naturally. Pure pentachlorophenol exists as colorless crystals.
Impure
pentachlorophenol (the form usually found at hazardous waste sites)
is
dark gray to brown and exists as dust, beads, or flakes. Humans are
usually exposed to impure pentachlorophenol (also called technical
grade pentachlorophenol).

"Pentachlorophenol was widely used as a pesticide and wood
preservative. Since 1984, the purchase and use of pentachlorophenol
has
been restricted to certified applicators. It is no longer available
to
the general public. It is still used industrially as a wood
preservative for utility poles, railroad ties, and wharf pilings."

Gene Green


Re: Freight car floors

ljack70117@...
 

On Jan 19, 2006, at 9:10 AM, Gene Green wrote:

This entire discussion about lumber, warped wood, etc. illustrates
perfectly why all RR museums should move their entire collections of
rolling stock to El Paso ASAP. Here nothing rots, warps or rusts.

This past November I used five sheets of 3/4" plywood that I had stored
outside since 1994. It was still OK.

I'll advise the city council that they need to condemn and confisticate
all 3 RR yards in town in anticipation of a flood of RR equipment. The
UP is talking about moving their yards several miles west into New
Mexico anyway.

Gene Green
Out in the west Texas town of El Paso
I was in El Paso once in 1955. It rained. For the first 10 minutes it was mud balls. It took it that long to clear the dust out of the air.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@adelphia.net


Re: Freight car floors

Gene Green <bierglaeser@...>
 

This entire discussion about lumber, warped wood, etc. illustrates
perfectly why all RR museums should move their entire collections of
rolling stock to El Paso ASAP. Here nothing rots, warps or rusts.

This past November I used five sheets of 3/4" plywood that I had stored
outside since 1994. It was still OK.

I'll advise the city council that they need to condemn and confisticate
all 3 RR yards in town in anticipation of a flood of RR equipment. The
UP is talking about moving their yards several miles west into New
Mexico anyway.

Gene Green
Out in the west Texas town of El Paso


Re: Freight car flooring

Gene Green <bierglaeser@...>
 

Gene - Pentachlorophenol IS creosote. A.T. Kott, ChE
Are you sure? Pentachlorophenol is a rather odd name for a hydrocarbon.

I found this, amoung other things, when I googled "pentachlorophenol."

"What is pentachlorophenol?

"Pentachlorophenol is a manufactured chemical that does not occur
naturally. Pure pentachlorophenol exists as colorless crystals. Impure
pentachlorophenol (the form usually found at hazardous waste sites) is
dark gray to brown and exists as dust, beads, or flakes. Humans are
usually exposed to impure pentachlorophenol (also called technical
grade pentachlorophenol).

"Pentachlorophenol was widely used as a pesticide and wood
preservative. Since 1984, the purchase and use of pentachlorophenol has
been restricted to certified applicators. It is no longer available to
the general public. It is still used industrially as a wood
preservative for utility poles, railroad ties, and wharf pilings."

Gene Green


Re: sunshine kits

Scott Pitzer
 

The moral of the story is:
If you buy one Sunshine kit per year, consider buying five kits every five years instead.
Oh, and order the next five kits during the fourth year.
Scott Pitzer


Re: sunshine kits

Jim and Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...>
 

Paul, you've got it right. I'm not trying to save a buck. In fact if you
send an extra buck, Patricia will probably write you a refund check for the
overpayment. I just want to get it right when my wife teaches me how to add
comments to an Excel file and I include ordering info.

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon


Re: Freight car floors

randyhees <hees@...>
 

The volunteer group, the SPCRR / SIA did not purchase the material or
chose the supplier. It was purchased by by CSRM and the CSRM
Foundation. As noted the wood was not kiln dried (not always the best
choice, and not used on large timbers like car sills) but was supposed
to be cut from a standing dead, fire killed tree. The tree was
supposed to have been dead and the log seasoned for 2 years prior to
cutting. Some of the lumber used, including the deck was cut after
the start of Railfair and only delivered 5 days into the 9 day event.

By the way, in the 19th century, some car builders advocated using
green wood, believing by fixing it as part of a car body you prevented
it from warping. I believe we now have empirical evidence on this car
that the concept doesn't work. This is one of the things we learn as
we practice "experimental archeology" by rebuilding cars following
19th century practice as we understand it. Each car we rebuild
extends our understanding.

Currently our group is dealing with issues related to double board
boxcar roofs. We now understand they never worked well, and always
leaked, and rotted in as little as three years, but that is a
different discussion.

By the way, there are many rumors and other miss-information about the
project circulating both during and after Railfair, some included in
this groups archives, including statements that it was a Carter Bros
narrow gauge car.

Randy Hees

PS, I need to apologize to Denny. Several years before Railfair, at
one of the CSRM hosted Railroad Preservation Symposiums I used him
badly. As part of a presentation on interpretation in a small
railroad museum, he was called to the front of the auditorium. We
were making the point that you can involve the visitor in the
interpretive process rather than just telling them about process.
Denny was set on a chair with a piece of lumber, and a very, very dull
hand saw (not intentional). While going on to the next point he was
abandoned to try to cut a marked tenon. He kept trying to make the
cut, without success, not due lack of effort, but due to lack of teeth
on the saw in question.


Tony Thompson wrote:

Garth, what I was told was that somebody in that volunteer group
decided to save a few bucks and not use kiln-dried wood. Maybe Denny
Anspach can tell us more on that topic.


Re: freight car floors

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Randy Hees says:


By coincidence I was the project manager for the SN MW 32 project for
the SPCRR (www.spcrr.org <http://www.spcrr.org/>). The project goal was
to rebuild the car, using hand tools, over the 9 days of Railfair 99.
As I recall, I had met Tony Thompson and Richard Hendrickson at Railfair 99 at the book store area and shortly afterward, we walked by the car...at least I think it was that car. Certainly it was a project car. I recall Tony and Richard making note of some obscure part of it or something...the trucks I believe. I, of course, was more interested in 3985 and 844. It is possible that I video taped the car.

Mike Brock


Re: Freight car flooring

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

A.T. Kott, ChE, wrote:
Gene - Pentachlorophenol IS creosote.
It may be the active part in preserving wood, but creosote contains a heck of a lot of other stuff too, as I'm sure Mr. Kott knows very well. For another example, you MIGHT say, "wine IS alcohol," and yes, it's the active part . . .

Anthony Thompson
Dept. of Materials Science & Engineering
University of California, Berkeley
thompsonmarytony@sbcglobal.net


Re: Freight car floors

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Garth Groff wrote:
You are probably right about not treating the decks on flat cars in the
past, but a preserved car today is a somewhat different matter. Back in
1999 a volunteer group restored Oakland & Antioch flat car 2002 for the
CSRM during Railfair '99. Apparently untreated lumber was used for the
deck. Within a few years the deck had warped so badly that the car had
to be withdrawn from display.
Garth, what I was told was that somebody in that volunteer group decided to save a few bucks and not use kiln-dried wood. Maybe Denny Anspach can tell us more on that topic.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Freight car floors

Barrybennetttoo@...
 

There is also a factor in the way the timber was treated after felling and
after sawing to lumber. The tree trunk may have been stored for several months,
or even years, before it was sawn, to allow the timber to dry out properly.
The same after being sawn to allow any warpage to develop and be flattened
out in the lumber pile.

Modern timber is sawn almost immediately after felling, and then dried in a
kiln. This dries it out all right but only to the extent that as soon as it
comes into contact with damp of any sort it just acts like a sponge and soaks
it up. Next step, warpage. That is tha reason for so many water proofing
treatments nowadays, but they need to be applied as soon as possible after
removing from the kiln or the plastic wrapping.

You are paying a lot of money for lumber that is little better than firewood
of a century ago.

Cheers

Barry Bennett


Decals for SAL 40ft PS-1 boxcars

Mark Heiden
 

Hello everyone,

I'm looking for decals to letter a Seaboard Air Line 40ft PS-1 boxcar
from series SAL 24000-24499, built October, 1948. The cars carried
slogans, 24000-24299 lettered The Route of Courteous Service, and
24300-24499 The Route of the Silver Comet. Would Champ HB-8 be
correct for the as-delivered Courteous Service scheme of cars 24000-
24299? Are there any decals that could be used for the Silver Comet
scheme of cars 24300-24499?

Thanks,
Mark Heiden

136961 - 136980 of 187189