Date   

Re: How is the AB brake cylinder mounted on the PRR G-22 gondola?

proto48er
 

--- In STMFC@..., Tim Gilbert <tgilbert@...> wrote:

AT Kott wrote:


Sorry - I am really a Mopac (I-GN) + M-K-T + T&NO type of guy! Mopac
always had a lot of PRR freight cars in the trains down in south
Texas...

What kinds of PRR Freight Cars were in South Texas, and in what
proportion of Total Boxcars? Total Gons? Total Hoppers? Total Stock
Cars? Total Flat Cars?

Tim Gilbert
Tim - I do not know the exact proportion of each type of PRR car, but
there were a considerable number of PRR boxcars, gondolas and flatcars
on the I-GN through freights from Austin to San Antonio in the late
1950's. The primary cars on the I-GN trains were MP boxcars, with PRR
boxcars next. There were very few NYC cars on MP trains, but they were
more common on M-K-T trains for some reason and there were very few PRR
cars on them. I was too young to understand or ask any of the
operating personnel why this traffic pattern existed - I doubt if any
knew, since we are a long way from St Louis where the brains of the
operation were. The only MP switch lists I have are OT (1961-1963).

Many shipments of steel and other mfg. goods were delivered on MP in
PRR gons. and on PRR flats (to a lesser extent). I have photos of
captive PRR GRa gons. used to haul cut limestone slabs from a quarry on
the T&NO Llano Branch to a facility in the city of Austin.

Surprisingly, there were PRR stock cars down here too. It appears that
the King Ranch in Kingsville, Texas (on the StLB&M) regularly shipped
cattle to and from Pennsylvania - they had some kind of fattening (?)
operation there.

There were very few PRR hopper cars here. Coal in south Texas was
shipped primarily in gondolas in the 1948 era of my interest. However,
I like the PRR H-21a and H-25 cars because they look very much like a
series of later-built MP quad hoppers which were everywhere down here
in the late 1950's. I saw a ton of the PRR cars when I lived in
Reading, Penna. in 1950-1951 also. These MP cars were built out of my
time frame, but the PRR hoppers are not an anachronism, so there they
are! I am the boss, so that is that! Out of 400+ cars, I do have (4)
H-21a's, (1)H-25, and (1)H-22a - even the paint and lettering on them
looks like the MP quad hoppers! Also, the top 24" of one of the PRR
GLc gons.(hoppers?) was cut off and it was used on the Midland Terminal
RR in Colorado Springs; when the MT went belly-up in 1947, it was sold
to a quarry in New Braunfels, Texas - so it is fair game too. Only
photo I have is as an MT car. ORER dimensions indicate it was a PRR
GLc, and not a UP or B&O car.

We did see a number of hoppers of coke, used by one of the local
foundrys - also a roofless boxcar or two (L&N) in that service. Have
been fighting the thought of converting an H-22a into an H-22 coke car -
one lone car was left on the PRR roster until about 1952.

Some MP trains had solid blocks of ART reefers in them. Some had large
blocks of MP gondolas and/or MP covered hoppers in them. Very few
AT&SF cars were down here on MP or M-K-T or SP - just an occasional
boxcar or reefer. Some surprising cars came through regularly on the
MP - like B&O wagon-top covered hoppers with catalytic cracking
catalyst for the FCCU's at the Corpus Christi refineries - all sent
down the SAU&G (MP) line south of San Antonio. Also an occasional
brick container car with special firebrick for the refineries (did not
ever see one of these, however). Also L&NE covered hoppers down here
on MP.

In a typical MP freight of 1954, about 65% of the cars were MP, then
10% PRR, then 5% B&O and 5% SP - I saw lots of trains with this mix
over a 15 year period. MP trains consisted mostly of boxcars, with a
good percentage of gondolas and covered hoppers in them as well. M-K-T
had more of a mix, with only 30% or so of M-K-T cars per train - mostly
boxcars.

A.T. Kott


The DS/SS split - Some data

laramielarry <ostresh@...>
 

Hi Folks

Here are the distributions of double sheathed, single sheathed and
steel box and auto cars for several RRs as of July, 1950. I'll post
more later.

ATSF . . Percent . .Number
DS . . . . 1.2%. . . . 405
SS . . . .21.6%. . . 7,549
Steel. . .67.1%. . .23,412
"Panel". . 7.9%. . . 2,755
Known. . 97.9%. . . 34,121
Unknown. . 2.1%. . . . 748
Total. . 100.0%. . .34,869
With nearly 98% of the fleet tallied, steel is about 2/3 of the Santa
Fe fleet; DS is miniscule and is almost entirely 36' cars - unless
one chooses to count the "panel" cars as DS, which the ORER does.

MILW . . Percent . .Number
DS . . . . 0.1%. . . . .28
SS . . . .53.9%. . .17,226
Steel. . .45.3%. . .14,493
Known. . 99.3%. . . 31,747
Unknown. . 0.7%. . . . 224
Total. . 100.0%. . .31,971
Over 99% of the Milwaukee fleet is categorized, and single sheathed
cars have a bit of an edge over steel; DS is negligible.

N&W . . Percent . .Number
DS . . . . 1.1%. . . .101
SS . . . .10.5%. . . .943
Steel. . .88.3%. . .7,900
Known. . 100.0%. . .8,944
All the box and auto cars on the Norfolk and Western are classified;
steel dominates (all that coal goes to produce something!).

RI . . Percent . . Number
DS . . . . 6.4%. . .1,153
SS . . . .43.9%. . .7,914
Steel. . .47.5%. . .8,560
Known. . 97.8%. . .17,627
Unknown. . 2.2%. . . .397
Total. . 0.0%. . . 18,024
Nearly 98% of the Rock Island cars are tallied; SS is close to steel,
but even if all the "Unknowns" go its way, it won't win the race.

Soo . . Percent . .Number
DS . . . . 3.7%. . . .344
SS . . . .60.6%. . .5,630
Steel. . .28.3%. . .2,626
Known. . 92.5%. . . 8,600
Unknown. . 7.5%. . . .694
Total. . 100.0%. . .9,294
SS wins big on the Soo, however, regardless of how the "Unknowns"
fall. This would be a great line to model if you want to escape the
blandness of the flat-sides.

I post these results with some trepidation, as is possible - maybe
even likely - that I made some major errors in classification. If
so, please know that I WOULD like to be informed of the problems, so
that I can correct them.

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

rfederle@...
 

I have a couple Silver Streak kits on the shelf awaiting construction. Maybe someday.

Robert Federle
---- Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Armand Premo wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe
and Mantua to name a few others.
There was no intention to provide a complete history of HO kits
<g>, just choosing a couple of examples. Speaking just for me, I loved
Silver Streak kits in those days.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: The DS/SS split - Thanks and an update

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

I will be most appreciative if you can provide me information on the
following car series . . .

Road, AAR, Kind, Series, IL, Door, Capy, Qty
SP, XM, Box, 66175-66674, 40'6", 10'7", 100000, 428
Class A-50-16, built in 1947, all-steel double doors (originally 500 cars).

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Armand Premo wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and Mantua to name a few others.
There was no intention to provide a complete history of HO kits <g>, just choosing a couple of examples. Speaking just for me, I loved Silver Streak kits in those days.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

George Hollwedel <georgeloop@...>
 

What is John's e-mail address?

Prototype N Scale Models
by George Hollwedel
proto.nscale@...
310 Loma Verde Street
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883

----- Original Message -----
From: "Schuyler Larrabee" <schuyler.larrabee@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:53 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us



Anthony Thompson:
Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now.
So, just how many of us are there? This list's home page says 1,244 members. Yet when I spoke with
John Engstrom at Springfield about the idea of undecorated versions of the 65' mill gon, he said
"There's only about 60 of you guys out there, you know."

Y'know, I think he's wrong. But that's what he thinks.

Now, I know that there are probably a lot of guys on this list (are there ANY women?) who simply
want to know more about when a car was built, who built them, the kind of car they are, the era
they're appropriate for, how long they lasted and that's about it. There's another subset that want
to know precisely what kind of end they have, what brake gear they have, the kind of roof walk, and
so on. And then there are those who want to know exactly how many rivets, and what size they were,
on some specific tank car.

But I'm absolutely sure that there are more, way more, than "60 of you guys out there."

There's power in numbers, and if we want kits, we have to make sure that Athearn (and BLI, IM, and
the others) know that there's more than 60 of us.

SGL




Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Anthony Thompson:
Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now.
So, just how many of us are there? This list's home page says 1,244 members. Yet when I spoke with
John Engstrom at Springfield about the idea of undecorated versions of the 65' mill gon, he said
"There's only about 60 of you guys out there, you know."

Y'know, I think he's wrong. But that's what he thinks.

Now, I know that there are probably a lot of guys on this list (are there ANY women?) who simply
want to know more about when a car was built, who built them, the kind of car they are, the era
they're appropriate for, how long they lasted and that's about it. There's another subset that want
to know precisely what kind of end they have, what brake gear they have, the kind of roof walk, and
so on. And then there are those who want to know exactly how many rivets, and what size they were,
on some specific tank car.

But I'm absolutely sure that there are more, way more, than "60 of you guys out there."

There's power in numbers, and if we want kits, we have to make sure that Athearn (and BLI, IM, and
the others) know that there's more than 60 of us.

SGL


Will value of dollar and oil prices bring back kits?

colormydreams2 <LMP@...>
 

I watched an interesting financial show this morning where the guest
was talking about the trillions of dollars that we have in debt to
other nations is coming back to haunt us. Will the Chinese have so
many American dollars that we will start building kits for them? Will
$100 a barrel oil run up the cost of model cars that we will build our
own kits instead of shipping them overseas, assembling them then
shipping them back here? Will we have lost all our skills of assembly?
One O scaler who still sniffs glue,
Ken Towler


Kits? 50 + years ago.

Edwin C. Kirstatter <Q1xaMacArthur1@...>
 

Now if you go back to 1956 and glance through the
adds in the MR for that year you will find many more
kit makers listed than you already mentioned.

Aunthenticast, Ayres, Binkly/Laconia, Cliff Line, Gilbert,
Kurtz-Kraft, L-W Models, M.Dale Newton/Red Ball, M.E.W.,
Main Line, Roundhouse/MDC and Selly.

In years before that we had A-C Models, Ideal, Lehigh, Megow
Walthers & etc. This is just HO.

And how many of those "Dollar Cars" did you build before
the advent of styrene? Could you do better now?
Edwin C. Kirstatter, B&O Modeler.


Re: trucks for flatcar?

Stephen Bishop
 

Thanks.

Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote: On Feb 2, 2007, at 6:18 PM, Steve Bishop superlab2003 wrote:

I am finishing an Eastern Car Works depressed center flat for the New
Haven RR. My information on the trucks says they were simply "low
profile, friction bearing, four-wheel trucks". Any idea what HO trucks
would be closest to the prototype?
The correct trucks for these models are Eastern Car Works' own
Commonwalth High Capacity trucks, stock #9063.

Richard Hendrickson






---------------------------------
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast
with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut.


Hutchins boxcar end

destron@...
 

Does anyone know of a source for good photos and drawings of the Hutchins
boxcar end?

Frank Valoczy
Modelling the Piedmont & Northern in TT.


Re: Kits? 50 + years ago.

eabracher@...
 

How many kit builders? Well, there are more than a few. I have been
manufacturing Ho/HOn3 kits for 35+ years and am still going strong and adding new
ones each month.

Of course the narrow gauge ones sell more than the standard gauge kits but
both are doing well.

check my web www.riograndemodels.com

eric


Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

rfederle@...
 

Might as well throw Walthers and Red Ball out there too.

Robert Federle
---- Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...> wrote:

Guyz,

Allow me to fill in 3 more; Megow, Kaisner, and Laconia.
Fred Freitas

ljack70117@... wrote:
Did I see John English in the list?
Thank you
Larry Jackman
Boca Raton FL
ljack70117@...
I was born with nothing and
I have most of it left

On Feb 3, 2007, at 10:40 AM, <rfederle@...> <rfederle@...>
wrote:

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name
a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@...> wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central
Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Another point worth making is that there really wasn't
all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts
all
over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too
much
trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building
great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable
then.
Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into
view.
People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
information being published; practically no modelers had
discovered the
Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the
hobby
is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail,
thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history




Yahoo! Groups Links





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Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

Guyz,

Allow me to fill in 3 more; Megow, Kaisner, and Laconia.
Fred Freitas

ljack70117@... wrote:
Did I see John English in the list?
Thank you
Larry Jackman
Boca Raton FL
ljack70117@...
I was born with nothing and
I have most of it left

On Feb 3, 2007, at 10:40 AM, <rfederle@...> <rfederle@...>
wrote:

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name
a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@...> wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central
Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Another point worth making is that there really wasn't
all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts
all
over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too
much
trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building
great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable
then.
Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into
view.
People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
information being published; practically no modelers had
discovered the
Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the
hobby
is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail,
thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history




Yahoo! Groups Links





--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
1/30/2007 9:31 AM


----------------------------------------------------------
-----------




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---------------------------------
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.


Re: Branchline AAR boxcar

Ed Hawkins
 

On Feb 2, 2007, at 6:51 PM, Richard Hendrickson wrote:

On Feb 2, 2007, at 2:02 PM, Camas74 wrote:

> In looking at the end ladders supplied with the branchline kit and
> referencing protoype photos of NP boxcars, it looks to me like the
end
> ladders are the same width as the side ladders...
>
> All my photos are at an angle however so I can't be sure one way or
> the other...Can someone enlighten me if the branchline end ladders
are
> accurate, either for the NP or other RR's cars of this type???
To which Richard replied:

I've always been puzzled about why the BLT end ladders are narrower
than the side ladders. There may have been prototype cars on which
that was true, but if so I'm not aware of it. And I have several
photos that clearly show the end ladders on the NP's post-WW-II AAR
box
cars to be the same width as the side ladders.

Richard Hendrickson
Matt and Richard,
Side and end ladders came in multiple ways for the 10'-6" IH AAR box
cars built from 1945 to 1960. Cars of this type built in "Richard's
era" of October 1947 and before often had side and end ladders of the
same width. Side ladders were commonly, but not universally, 18-1/2"
apart (measurement between the rung bolt head centers). Some cars built
during the 1945-1960 period had end ladders 2" narrower than the side
ladders. There were other fractional differences in widths.

Complicating the matter for modelers and manufacturers of plastic
"standard" AAR box cars, during the 1950s the bottom part of the end
ladders were sometimes flared on one side (like Kadee tooled for PS-1
box cars), and there were at least two variations of this arrangement
I've found. Common examples of these end ladders have the top 5 rungs
at 16-1/2" wide and the bottom 2 rungs at 18-1/2" wide (again, measured
to the bolt centers). Additional variations included the common use of
both 7-rung and 8-rung ladders, different types of ladder rungs, each
with different methods of attachment, and different rung spacing. For
example, 18-3/8" spacing was common for 7-rung ladders but was not a
universal dimension.

When Branchline Trains tooled their "standard" AAR 50' and 40'
Blueprint Series AAR box cars, they had numerous challenges that
resulted in having to make judgment calls and compromises on the many
variations found in the technical data and photographs they used. I can
vividly recall conversations with Bill Schneider when we discussed
variations of side and end ladders. Bill kept reminding me about the
tooling cost that needed to be kept within reason. Originally BLT
settled on one set of 7-rung ladders that they tooled, and they chose
to have the end ladders narrower than the side ladders. With some
"encouragement" they later produced a set of 8-rung ladders.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


SAL B-7 Box Coming in BOTH S Scale AND HO!!!

John Degnan <Scaler164@...>
 

Everyone is probably already familiar with my efforts to get the SAL's B-7 Round Roof (or Turtle-Back), 19000-19499 series boxcars produced in my new scale of interest - S scale. But I have just this morning received comfirmation from my manufacturer that this model will definitely be offered in HO as well. The S scale version will come first (hopefully by the end of this year), and the HO version second (date still to be determined).

ALL reservations should be made with Jim King (jimking3@...) of www.smokymountainmodelworks.com. And if anyone has any photographs of these cars you can offer as helps for this project and its accompanying, promotional web page (below), they should be sent to myself (scaler164@...) AND Jim King.

Promotional Web Page:
http://www.trainweb.org/seaboard/SALRoundRoofBoxCarProject.htm

If one man can make it happen in S scale, surely there is enough interest amongst HO scalers to see this car made in HO. So send Jim and e-mail and let him know how many you'd like to have!


John Degnan
Scaler164@...
The Seaboard Air Line Information Collective and Photo Archive
www.trainweb.org/seaboard or
www.trainweb.org/seabonard/index.htm
P.S. ALSO coming in S and HO : SAL LOW-Side Gondolas!!!


The DS/SS split - Thanks and an update

laramielarry <ostresh@...>
 

Many thanks to the following people answered my request for help in
pinning down the split between double sheathed and single sheathed
box and auto cars for the U.S. fleet in July, 1950: Jim Brewer, Al
Brown, Brian Ehni, Richard Hendrickson, and Dennis Storzek. Thanks to
their efforts, over 8,000 cars have been removed from "Unknown"
status and categorized into DS, SS, steel, or "Other". Here is the
current breakdown:

U.S. box, auto, and ventilator cars in interchange service, July,
1950 ORER:
Type_____ %_____ number
DS _____ 9.0% __ 64,629
SS ____ 21.1% _ 150,612
Steel _ 66.5% _ 475,872
Other __ 0.7% ___ 4,758
Unknown_ 2.7% __ 19,258
Total __ 100% _ 715,129

This means that over 97% of the fleet is categorized; two-thirds of
it is steel and the rest is a combination of DS, SS, or "Other". The
DS/SS split is 30% DS and 70% SS. Nearly all of the "Other" category
consists of the Santa Fe's "panel" cars or the GN's "plywood" cars.
The ORER classifies the "panel" cars as DS, and the "plywood" cars
are often considered DS also, so shifting them would add a little to
the DS side of the ledger.

Later today (if time permits), I'll post the breakdown for several
specific railroads.

*****

Answers have been given for about half of the cars on my "help
needed" list, but the other half still remains.

I will be most appreciative if you can provide me information on the
following car series. Most important is whether the cars are DS, SS,
steel (or steel rebuild), or "other" (if "other", what?). If in
addition you can provide the date when built (and rebuilt, if
appropriate), that would be great! Further information such as
class, sub-category (e.g., "Fowler" or "Ribside") would be nice, but
is not necessary. Of course, references to photographs would be
wonderful. The classification should reflect the status of the
series as of July, 1950. If these cars can be classified, over 98% of
the fleet will be categorized.

Road, AAR, Kind, Series, IL, Door, Capy, Qty
CNW, XM, Box, 63000-64898, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 515
CNW, XM, Box, 74900-76898, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 971
CNW, XM, Box, 111000-111998, 40'6", 10'0", 80000, 482
CNW, XMR, Auto, 54000-54798, 40'6", 12'0", 80000, 393
CG, XM, Box, 40300-40699, 39'10", 6'0", 80000, 351
IC, XM, Box, 15500-15796, 40'2", 6'0", 80000, 291
IC, XM, Box, 25000-25499, 40'3", 6'0", 80000, 258
IC, XM, Box, 37500-37993, 40'6", 10'0", 80000, 486
IC, XM, Box, 40250-40499, 50'5", 12'0", 75000, 242
L&N, XM, Box, 13500-13999, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 244
L&N, XM, Box, 48700-48949, 40'6", 10'0", 100000, 243
MEC, XM, Box, 35301-35650, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 243
MP, XM, Box, 44000-44410, 40'4", 6'0", 80000, 408
MP, XM, Box, 45251-45494, 40'3", 6'0", 80000, 239
MP, XAR, Auto, 75280-75479, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 200
MP, XAR, Auto, 75480-75999, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 338
MP, XAR, Auto, 76150-76999, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 308
SB&M, XM, Box, 20051-20550, 40'0", 6'0", 80000, 384
SP, XM, Box, 66175-66674, 40'6", 10'7", 100000, 428
T&P, XM, Box, 30000-30316, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 312

Thanks in advance!

Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

ljack70117@...
 

Did I see John English in the list?
Thank you
Larry Jackman
Boca Raton FL
ljack70117@...
I was born with nothing and
I have most of it left

On Feb 3, 2007, at 10:40 AM, <rfederle@...> <rfederle@...> wrote:

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@...> wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history




Yahoo! Groups Links





--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
1/30/2007 9:31 AM


---------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------




Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

armprem
 

Ambroid too.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: <rfederle@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Cc: "A. Premo" <armprem@...>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 10:40 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


> And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name a few more.
>
> Robert Federle
> ---- "A. Premo" <armprem@...> wrote:
>> Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and
>> Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@...>
>> To: <STMFC@...>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
>> Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us
>>
>>
>> > Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
>> > much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
>> > you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
>> > Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
>> > over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
>> > and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
>> > trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
>> > models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
>> > what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
>> > look at the magazine photos.
>> > Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
>> > Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
>> > couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
>> > with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
>> > People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
>> > locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
>> > free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
>> > information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
>> > Cyc and other resources.
>> > The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
>> > quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
>> > golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
>> > is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.
>> >
>> > Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
>> > 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
>> > (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
>> > Publishers of books on railroad history
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > No virus found in this incoming message.
>> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> > Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
>> 1/30/2007 9:31 AM
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date: 1/30/2007 9:31 AM
>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Re: Kits? Yep...they're still with us

rfederle@...
 

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@...> wrote:

Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


> Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
> much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
> you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
> Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
> over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
> and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
> trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
> models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
> what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
> look at the magazine photos.
> Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
> Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
> couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
> with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
> People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
> locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
> free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
> information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
> Cyc and other resources.
> The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
> quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
> golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
> is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.
>
> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
> 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
> (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
> Publishers of books on railroad history
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
1/30/2007 9:31 AM
>
>


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