Date   

Re: Sunshine and Pleasanton

Dave Nelson <muskoka@...>
 

Jon Miller wrote:
I notice that Sunshine is coming back to Pleasanton. Great!!!!!!!!!!
When?

Usual location?

Dave Nelson


Re: NKP 22100 DD 40' boxcar from NKPHS

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

Dean wrote: The Summer 2005 Nickel Plate Technical and Historical Society
Magazine has an article about these cars, with photos and NKP
diagrams. Backissues are probably available from the NKPHTS.
http://nkphts.org/store/
I have about 75 issues available in the store if anyone wants them. Ordering
procedures are on the website or drop me an email off list
Brian J Carlson P.E.
NKPHTS Special Projects Director


Re: NKP 22100 DD 40' boxcar from NKPHS

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

The car is a stand in at best. The prototype cars had Murphy roofs, and
dreadnaught ends are best described as 2.5-3-2.5 ends since as Dean mentions
the panels seem is in the middle of a wide rib. 22000-22249 have Peacock
Handbrakes, and 22250-22349 have Ureco hand brakes. Various cars in the
series were renumbered over the years for Autoparts service. The side
panel and door opening count are correct.
Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill McCoy" <wpmccoy@comcast.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 4:34 PM
Subject: [STMFC] NKP 22100 DD 40' boxcar from NKPHS


Several years ago I bought from the NKP Historical Society a specially
painted McKean Range DD 40' boxcar with a diagonal panel roof and 4-4
ends. Before I spend a lot of time making up for the underframe and
other parts shortcomings to get the car up to contemporary standards I
thought I would see if any one in the group can comment on how accurate
this model is. The car number is NKP 22101 and has a 12' door opening.
The car has 3-5 panel riveted sides and fishbelly side sills. Built
date which I expect the society researched is 10-29 and weigh data
shows AX 10-52.

Thanks,

Bill McCoy
Jax




Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: Ulrich fish belly hoppers

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

I don't think that is correct. I thought the whole point of the Vulcan design was that it allowed easy wheel changes because it has separate journal boxes. This is the main selling point ASF claims in their page in the 1922 Cyc.
I didn't say they weren't retained, only that they weren't bolted (as Richard had said). Thus:

The thing is, the boxes weren't retained by long bolts through ears and a keeper strap at the bottom of the box like an archbar, and later Andrews truck, rather the boxes were retained by a pair of jaws at the ends of the side frame, much like a modern roller bearing truck.
Exactly.

To keep the boxes from separating from the truck in the event of a derailment, the boxes have a pair of ears cast on their top surface, just behind the journal lid hinge. A bolt passed through these ears and a lug cast on the face of the sideframe, so Richard's use of the phrase "bolted on" is accurate.
I know about the bolt attachment, but it is a retainer, not a support for the entire box, as on an Andrews, and I disagree with the use of the term "bolted on" for both. The cast ear mentioned is clearly shown in photos of the castings, one of which is reproduced in my Volume 2 on SP freight cars.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: NKP 22100 DD 40' boxcar from NKPHS

Dean Payne <deanpayne@...>
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Dean Payne" <deanpayne@...> wrote:

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bill McCoy" <wpmccoy@> wrote:

Several years ago I bought from the NKP Historical Society a
specially
painted McKean Range DD 40' boxcar with a diagonal panel roof and
4-4 ends. Before I spend a lot of time making up for the underframe
and other parts shortcomings to get the car up to contemporary
standards I thought I would see if any one in the group can comment
on how accurate this model is. The car number is NKP 22101 and has
a 12' door opening.
The car has 3-5 panel riveted sides and fishbelly side sills.
Built date which I expect the society researched is 10-29 and weigh
data shows AX 10-52.

Thanks,

Bill McCoy
Jax
I am gratified to be (finally) answering a question instead of
asking
one! The Summer 2005 Nickel Plate Technical and Historical Society
Magazine has an article about these cars, with photos and NKP
diagrams. Backissues are probably available from the NKPHTS.
http://nkphts.org/store/
Unfortunately, these cars aren't as prototypical as I would wish.
The paint is accurate, I bet, but there are limitations in the
McKean kit used. After looking at the article, I considered
stripping mine,
replacing all the details, etc, but then I'd be scrapping a limited-
release car! Even still, the Dreadnaught ends of the protoype had
thick, flattened ribs where the (3) panels were riveted together.
I have no idea how to model those.
What I've decided to do is to keep the kit as-built, but the
diagonal panel roof really bothers me. The prototype had a Murphy
roof, andthe kit has a very thick plastic roofwalk that represents a
metal walk. Neither will do on my 1937 layout! However, I am
betting that a Red Caboose roof (Walthers part #629-800001) will
improve things greatly, and since the roof is a press fit, it wont be
permanent and
hurt the collector's value of the car. I believe that Pollyscale
Special Oxide Red is pretty close to a match for color.
I have the twin set (with sister 3710), which were my first kits
with
non molded-on details. I remember that I was told to buy offset-
shank Kadees, as the car rides too high for standard couplers.
Besides the roof, the brake hardware on the end is crude, but I'll
live with that. (Worse for me is the anachronistic paint/lettering
scheme, but I'd start with an undec if I wanted to go whole hog as-
built, and buy the early "N.Y.C.&St.L." decals from Westerfield.)
At the time these kits came out, they were pretty good, but the grabs
and ladders are a bit thick by today's standards. You could
replace those, of course, but I find them acceptable enough,
considering. The roof, though, has to go! Luckily for me, replacing
it is easy (and reversible).
There were 350 of the 22000-series built in 1929, and 279 remained
in April 1960 (appearing in six different numbering series over their
careers!). There were also 150 end-door cars, a photo of which
appeared in a later NKPHTS Magazine.
Dean Payne
Further reading of the article (and photo captions) reveals the
following:
By 1959, the roofwalks would have been steel on some (all?) cars.
(But PLEASE replace the supplied walks with something more
accurate!) The "fishbelly side sills" should be much shorter door
gussets, extending just past the ends of the doors. The original
gussets had vertical ends, these were replaced with diagonal-end
gussets, as seen in a 1950 photo.
The doors aren't quite perfect either, but they give the proper
feel. If you are really reworking this car, you might want to try
to file down the bolsters to bring the body height down to 14' 7.5"
over the rails; with the thick running board and all, it appears to
be closer to 15' 9". It appears to ride high, I'm not sure you could
easily file down the bolsters enough to use a standard coupler. The
side ladders should be 8 rung, the end ladders aren't quite perfect
either.
Geez, it sounds like I'm slammin' this car! For my own use, I'll
keep most of what I now recognize as "inaccuracies". I have other
projects to do, and in order for me to do it "right" for my era I'd
have to strip the car! But, if you're concerned about the
underframe, these other parts are more visible; make your own
decision on what to upgrade. It is possible to replace at least some
of these parts and retain the original paint/lettering. Weathering
could hide any paint mismatches on the roof, I don't know what you'd
do if you want to replace the doors (I don't know when they stopped
painting them black, there is a photo of a car with not too long
after its second repaint, in January 1950.) If you're going to
replace anything on this car, the roof is the most visible (unless
your layout is very high), most egregious, and most easily replaced.
This is only my opinion, of course, Your Mileage May Vary.
Buffalo Creek Graphics produced this car in O scale, BTW, with the
original lettering and black doors. A later paint scheme was also
offered, both appear to be sold out:
http://www.trainresource.com/O_Scale_Freight.html#XM
Dean Payne


Minnesota RPM Meet ??????????????

Dave Powell <daveydiesel@...>
 

Hi,
Is there an RPM meet in the Twin Cities area at all? I live in
Northern Iowa and was told there is one but I can't find out anymore
info than what I have. I was hoping for a one day event. Dave
Powell Iowa


Re: DL&W

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Jace is correct on this point. .Prime Mover Decals is in the process of developing these decals,
though. He will do them in scales other than HO for a small minimum run, 25, I believe, but don't
quote me on that.

SGL

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Justin Kahn
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 10:19 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] DL&W

Um, Tom, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I am pretty
sure the DL&W
didn't have any USRA 0-8-0's; their only 0-8-0's, as I
recall, were the
homebuilts from 4-6-2's to keep the shop crews employed during the
Depressions. Now the ERIE had USRA-type 0-8-0's...
Sorry to have to deal with the head end of a freight train
rather than the
contents.
Jace Kahn, General Manager
Ceres and Canisteo RR Co.


I have a buddy that just purchased a Proto-2000 USRA 0-8-0
switcher that
apparently is a match for the 0-8-0's that the Lackawanna
used. He is
asking if anyone knows who makes accurate DL&W decals for steam
locomotives. He advises that the Champ set lettering for the
tender is
too large and cannot be used.

If anyone has an idea of what would be correct to use,
please advise.
Thanking you all in advance!

Tom Olsen
__________________________________________________________
Get in the mood for Valentine's Day. View photos, recipes and
more on your
Live.com page.
http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A
0701
<http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A0701>





Re: Ulrich fish belly hoppers

Dennis Storzek
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

BTW, most Vulcans did NOT have the separate boxes bolted in
place.

Tony,

I don't think that is correct. I thought the whole point of the Vulcan
design was that it allowed easy wheel changes because it has separate
journal boxes. This is the main selling point ASF claims in their page
in the 1922 Cyc.

The thing is, the boxes weren't retained by long bolts through ears
and a keeper strap at the bottom of the box like an archbar, and later
Andrews truck, rather the boxes were retained by a pair of jaws at the
ends of the side frame, much like a modern roller bearing truck. The
outer jaws surrounding the journal boxes is what gives the sideframe
its characteristic rounded end appearance.

To keep the boxes from separating from the truck in the event of a
derailment, the boxes have a pair of ears cast on their top surface,
just behind the journal lid hinge. A bolt passed through these ears
and a lug cast on the face of the sideframe, so Richard's use of the
phrase "bolted on" is accurate. I'm not aware of the Vulcan name being
used for any later one piece sideframe design, but of course, I'm
always willing to learn something new.

The 1922 and 1931 Cyc.s have photos that show the open jaws and lugs
quite well. The seem to be gone from the 1940 Cyc., along with the
Vulcan name. For those without access to the Cyc.s, here is a link to
a photo that shows the end of a Vulcan truck on a Nevada Northern ore
car. The lug and bolt show pretty well behind the journal lid.

http://nn.railfan.net/Ingoldsby/1000/1019endAC.jpg

Dennis


Re: 2007 St. Louis RPM Meet Update

golden1014
 

All,

Unfortunately the 2007 St. Louis RPM Meet has been
postponed. As many of you already know, I'll be
leaving the St. Louis area in August 2007 for a new
military assignment and my co-hosts will be unable to
host this summer's meet as planned. The meet will not
continue under different leadership.

The good news is that we'll be back in Collinsville,
IL in August 2008. In the meantime, stay tuned for a
mini-RPM in Indianapolis with the able help of Mont
Switzer and other are RPM-ers. More to follow on that
later.

On behalf of my co-hosts, Dave Davis, Dan Kohlberg and
Loren Casey, thanks again to our first-class vendors,
historical societies, and attendees for your dedicated
support for St. Louis RPM. See you next year!

John


John Golden
O'Fallon, IL

http://www.pbase.com/golden1014


Re: The DS/SS split - More Unknowns

Ian Cranstone
 

Aha, one I can answer...

GTW, XAP, Auto, 572700-572799, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 39
GTW, XAP, Auto, 572800-572999, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 67

Both of these series are rebuilds from GTW's 575000-575999 series, all converted with single doors from the original double door arrangement. Cars originally built 1927, and rebuilt 1946. Although I don't have photos of these specific cars, the original 575000 series was a steel frame (single sheathed) design, so I would presume that this would also apply to the rebuilds.

Incidentally, my entries for the July 1950 ORER for the 572700 series show 59 cars.

Ian Cranstone
Osgoode, Ontario, Canada
lamontc@nakina.net
http://freightcars.nakina.net
http://siberians.nakina.net


DL&W

Justin Kahn
 

Um, Tom, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I am pretty sure the DL&W didn't have any USRA 0-8-0's; their only 0-8-0's, as I recall, were the homebuilts from 4-6-2's to keep the shop crews employed during the Depressions. Now the ERIE had USRA-type 0-8-0's...
Sorry to have to deal with the head end of a freight train rather than the contents.
Jace Kahn, General Manager
Ceres and Canisteo RR Co.



I have a buddy that just purchased a Proto-2000 USRA 0-8-0
switcher that
apparently is a match for the 0-8-0's that the Lackawanna used. He is
asking if anyone knows who makes accurate DL&W decals for steam
locomotives. He advises that the Champ set lettering for the
tender is
too large and cannot be used.

If anyone has an idea of what would be correct to use, please advise.
Thanking you all in advance!

Tom Olsen
_________________________________________________________________
Get in the mood for Valentine's Day. View photos, recipes and more on your Live.com page. http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A0701


benjaminfrank_hom [b.hom@worldnet.att.net]

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Thanks, Ben, that's what I figured, but wanted to know for sure.

SGL

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of benjaminfrank_hom
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 9:54 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Re: B&O Hoppers with yellow stripes

Schuyler Larrabee wrote:
"When did the B&O apply yellow stripes to the sides of hoppers? And
why? If it was past the end of this list's era, just say so."

It was past the end of this list's era. The yellow stripes first
appeared on the 90-ton Class W-10 offset triple hoppers built in 1964
and denotes a car assigned to unit train service. It came to be
applied to other classes of hopper cars, including earlier Class W-8
and W-9 triples, ex-C&O cars transferred to the B&O as a result of the
takeover, and even a group of secondhand ex-B&LE triple hoppers.
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo527077ago.jpg
<http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo527077ago.jpg>
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo529000ago.jpg
<http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo529000ago.jpg>

Ben Hom





Re: B&O Hoppers with yellow stripes

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Schuyler Larrabee wrote:
"When did the B&O apply yellow stripes to the sides of hoppers? And
why? If it was past the end of this list's era, just say so."

It was past the end of this list's era. The yellow stripes first
appeared on the 90-ton Class W-10 offset triple hoppers built in 1964
and denotes a car assigned to unit train service. It came to be
applied to other classes of hopper cars, including earlier Class W-8
and W-9 triples, ex-C&O cars transferred to the B&O as a result of the
takeover, and even a group of secondhand ex-B&LE triple hoppers.
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo527077ago.jpg
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo529000ago.jpg


Ben Hom


Re: transverse tank tank cars

Kurt Laughlin <fleeta@...>
 

Found in the archives:

Um, does anyone have any kind of answer to the original
question, about
the possibly Army-owned tranverse-tank cars?
The chlorine tank/flats? There is a USAX 16500-16509, AAR class
TMU, in
the 7/50 ORER.
In the 1/1945 ORER, War Department cars of the same number series
and AAR
mechanical code carry the reporting marks "CWSX".
The CWS was the Chemical Warfare Service. The TMU cars carried "1-
ton containers" which were used for all manner of hazardous
materials, including chemical warfare agents like Chlorine, Mustard
Gas, and Nerve Gases. Until recently (if not still) the 1-ton
containers were used to store various agents at Army depots around
the country.

KL


B&O Hoppers with yellow stripes

Schuyler Larrabee
 

When did the B&O apply yellow stripes to the sides of hoppers? And why?

If it was past the end of this list's era, just say so.

TIA

SGL


The DS/SS split - More Unknowns

laramielarry <ostresh@...>
 

Hi Folks

Here is a new list of car series from the July 1950 ORER whose
classification into DS, SS, or Steel is currently Unknown. This is
the entire set of Unknowns with 25 or more cars. Those marked "(N19)"
are all that remain of my Nasty Nineteen. There are almost 8,000 cars
in this list and slightly over 9,000 Unknowns in the entire database.

The Ann Arbor, Santa Fe, B&O, I-GN, and SEABOARD series have no
description in the ORER that is helpful for our effort to classify;
all the rest are described as Steel Frame, Steel Underframe, or Steel
Center Sill.

The L&N series with the double asterisks (**) is described as "Steel
Underframe and Body Frame"; the two with the triple stars (***)
as "Steel Underframe, Steel Ends, Steel Body Frame, Staggered Doors".

Maybe "Steel Body Frame" implies SS??? The phrase only occurs in
fourteen series in the entire ORER, nine of which have been
classified, all as SS.


Happy Hunting!

Best wishes
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


Road, AAR, Kind, Series, IL, Door, Capy, Qty
GA, XM, Box, 17000-17099, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 97
WofA, XM, Box, 17000-17147, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 120
A&WP, XM, Box, 37000-37133, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 102
AA, XM, Box, 41002-41246, 40'6", 10'0", 80000, 98
AA, XM, Box, 74000-74147, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 139
ATSF, XAP, Auto, 5865-5968, 50'6", 14'6", 80000, 79
ATSF, XAP, Auto, 5969-6006, 50'6", 14'6", 80000, 37
ATSF, XAP, Auto, 6022-6067, 50'6", 14'6", 80000, 35
ATSF, XAP, Auto, 6100-6151, 50'6", 14'6", 80000, 52
ATSF, XAP, Auto, 6400-6444, 50'6", 14'6", 80000, 40
ATSF, XME, Auto, 7355-7399, 50'6", 7'4", 98000, 44
ATSF, XAR, AL, 9000-9199, 50'6", 14'6", 80000, 198
ATSF, XAP, Box, 10509-10788, 50'6", 15'0", 78000, 36
ATSF, XI, Box, 40100-40141, 39'8", 6'0", 80000, 41
B&O, XAP, Box, 292800-292979, 50'6", 15'1", 100000, 39
B&O, XAP, Box, 293000-293096, 50'6", 15'1", 100000, 97
C&EI, XAR, Auto, 3100-3139, 40'6", 12'0", 80000, 38
CMO, XM, Box, 19400-19998, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 130
C&O, XAP, Auto, 254551-254593, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 41
C&O, XM, Box, 288000-288349, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 107
CGW, XM, Box, 40000-40598, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 197
CGW, XM, Box, 43000-43398, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 139
DL&W, VS, Ice, 6700-6889, 33'0", 4'0", 75000, 48
DM&IR, XM, Box, 3100-3149, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 43
DT&I, XAP, Box, 27000-27999, 40'6", 7'0", 80000, 30
DT&I, XAP, Auto, 47009-47948, 40'6", 7'0", 80000, 51
DT&I, XAP, Auto, 57007-57976, 40'6", 7'0", 80000, 111
GM&O, XM, Box, 30000-30024, 40'6", 12'7", 100000, 25
GM&O, XAR, Auto, 35200-35249, 40'6", 14'0", 80000, 50
GM&O, XAR, Auto, 35250-35299, 40'6", 14'0", 100000, 50
GM&O, XAR, Auto, 35300-35379, 40'6", 14'0", 100000, 44
GM&O, XM, Box, 35300-35379, 40'6", 14'0", 100000, 36 (same as above)
GM&O, XAR, Auto, 50000-50049, 50'6", 15'0", 100000, 50
GTW, XAP, Auto, 572700-572799, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 39
GTW, XAP, Auto, 572800-572999, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 67
HC, XM, Box, 851-971, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 65
IN, XM, Box, 1400-1499, 40'0", 10'0", 80000, 43
IN, XM, Box, 1500-1599, 40'0", 6'0", 80000, 46
L&A, XM, Box, 36001-36200, 50'6", 9'0", 100000, 196
L&N, XM, Box, 9800-9899, 50'4", 10'0", 100000, 94
**L&N, XM, Box, 13500-13999, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 244 (N19)
***L&N, XMR, Auto, 46000-46199, 40'6", 12'0", 100000, 34
***L&N, XMR, Auto, 46300-46399, 40'6", 12'0", 100000, 99
MILW, XAP, Auto, 510100-510289, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 150
MILW, XAP, Auto, 272500-272524, 50'6", 6'0", 100000, 25
I-GN, XM, Box, 14350-14399, 50'6", 15'0", 100000, 50
NLC, XM, Box, 115-141, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 27
MP, XM, Box, 44000-44410, 40'4", 6'0", 80000, 408 (N19)
MP, XM, Box, 45251-45494, 40'3", 6'0", 80000, 239 (N19)
MP, XAR, Auto, 75280-75479, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 200 (N19)
MP, XM, Box, 75480-75999, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 124
MP, XAR, Auto, 75480-75999, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 338 (Same as above;
N19)
MP, XAR, Auto, 76150-76999, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 308 (N19)
MP, XM, Box, 79000-79199, 40'6", 12'0", 80000, 192
MP, XM, Box, 84000-84099, 40'6", 12'1", 80000, 87
MP, XAR, Auto, 88000-88099, 50'6", 14'6", 100000, 82
MP, XAR, Auto, 88100-88149, 50'6", 14'6", 100000, 45
MP, XAR, Auto, 88150-88199, 50'6", 14'7", 100000, 42
NOT&M, XM, Box, 20001-20050, 40'0", 6'0", 80000, 43
NB, XM, Box, 701-867, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 164
NB, XM, Box, 901-950, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 49
NJI&I, XM, Box, 2000-2149, 40'6", 10'0", 80000, 136
NJI&I, XM, Box, 3000-3199, 40'6", 10'0", 80000, 29
NJI&I, XM, Box, 78000-78199, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 165
NP, XM, Box, 8100-8199, 40'6", 12'0", 80000, 55
NP, XM, Box, 8100-8199, 40'6", 12'0", 80000, 44 (Same as above)
NP, XM, Box, 31100-35452, 40'3", 5'6", 80000, 36
SEABOARD, XMR, Auto, 9011-9060, 40'6", 12'6", 100000, 49
SEABOARD, XMR, Auto, 9100-9149, 50'0", 15'11", 100000, 50
SLSF, XM, Box, 151000-151099, 40'6", 12'6", 100000, 97
SLSF, XME, Box, 151100-151199, 40'6", 12'6", 100000, 98
SLSF, XM, Box, 151200-151284, 40'6", 12'6", 100000, 84

There are several listings in the ORER for the following Frisco
series; the first 3 are described as "Staggered Doors, Steel Frame
(See Exception)"
SLSF, XM, Box, 151285-151499, 40'6", 10'0", 100000, 112
SLSF, XM, Box, 151285-151499, 40'6", 13'0", 100000, 48
SLSF, XMR, Auto, 151285-151499, 40'6", 13'0", 100000, 49
This has "Steel Sides & Ends, Stagg.Doors"
SLSF, XMR, Auto, 151285-151499, 40'6", 13'0", 100000, 1
This is "All Steel"
SLSF, XMR, Auto, 151285-151499, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 3
This is "Stagg.Doors, Steel Frame,Exception"
SLSF, XMR, Auto, 151408, 40'6", 6'0", 100000, 1

SLSF, XMR, Auto, 152000-152099, 40'6", 12'6", 80000, 97
SLSF, XME, Box, 152100-152228, 40'6", 12'6", 80000, 74
SLSF, XMR, Auto, 152100-152228, 40'6", 12'6", 80000, 45 (Same as
above)
SOUTHERN, XM, Box, 409000-409999, 36'0", 6'0", 80000, 153
T&P, XM, Box, 30000-30316, 40'6", 6'0", 80000, 312 (N19)
T&P, XAR, Auto, 61000-61099, 40'6", 12'0", 80000, 71
T&P, XAR, Auto, 72000-72024, 50'6", 15'0", 100000, 25
UP, XM, Box, 75000-75397, 40'5", 6'1", 100000, 42 (B-50-28, Blt
1911,Reblt '39)
WP, XM, Box, 19001-19050, 40'4", 6'1", 100000, 48
WP, XM, Box, 27001-27600, 40'3", 6'0", 80000, 62
WP, XM, Box, 316001-318500, 40'3", 6'0", 80000, 56


Re: NKP 22100 DD 40' boxcar from NKPHS

Dean Payne <deanpayne@...>
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bill McCoy" <wpmccoy@...> wrote:

Several years ago I bought from the NKP Historical Society a
specially
painted McKean Range DD 40' boxcar with a diagonal panel roof and 4-
4 ends. Before I spend a lot of time making up for the underframe and
other parts shortcomings to get the car up to contemporary
standards I thought I would see if any one in the group can comment
on how accurate this model is. The car number is NKP 22101 and has a
12' door opening.
The car has 3-5 panel riveted sides and fishbelly side sills. Built
date which I expect the society researched is 10-29 and weigh data
shows AX 10-52.

Thanks,

Bill McCoy
Jax
I am gratified to be (finally) answering a question instead of asking
one! The Summer 2005 Nickel Plate Technical and Historical Society
Magazine has an article about these cars, with photos and NKP
diagrams. Backissues are probably available from the NKPHTS.
http://nkphts.org/store/
Unfortunately, these cars aren't as prototypical as I would wish.
The paint is accurate, I bet, but there are limitations in the McKean
kit used. After looking at the article, I considered stripping mine,
replacing all the details, etc, but then I'd be scrapping a limited-
release car! Even still, the Dreadnaught ends of the protoype had
thick, flattened ribs where the (3) panels were riveted together. I
have no idea how to model those.
What I've decided to do is to keep the kit as-built, but the diagonal
panel roof really bothers me. The prototype had a Murphy roof, and
the kit has a very thick plastic roofwalk that represents a metal
walk. Neither will do on my 1937 layout! However, I am betting that
a Red Caboose roof (Walthers part #629-800001) will improve things
greatly, and since the roof is a press fit, it wont be permanent and
hurt the collector's value of the car. I believe that Pollyscale
Special Oxide Red is pretty close to a match for color.
I have the twin set (with sister 3710), which were my first kits with
non molded-on details. I remember that I was told to buy offset-
shank Kadees, as the car rides too high for standard couplers.
Besides the roof, the brake hardware on the end is crude, but I'll
live with that. (Worse for me is the anachronistic paint/lettering
scheme, but I'd start with an undec if I wanted to go whole hog as-
built, and buy the early "N.Y.C.&St.L." decals from Westerfield.) At
the time these kits came out, they were pretty good, but the grabs
and ladders are a bit thick by today's standards. You could replace
those, of course, but I find them acceptable enough, considering.
The roof, though, has to go! Luckily for me, replacing it is easy
(and reversible).
There were 350 of the 22000-series built in 1929, and 279 remained in
April 1960 (appearing in six different numbering series over their
careers!). There were also 150 end-door cars, a photo of which
appeared in a later NKPHTS Magazine.
Dean Payne


Re: Proviso RIP Track - T&NO W-50-4 Ends

Jerry Dziedzic
 

Independently, I gave the cover a close look this evening. How about
those ends on 40954? Have we already discussed this on list?

Jerry Dziedzic
Pattenburg, NJ

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Steve and Barb Hile" <shile@...> wrote:

I find myself facinated by the cover photo on Volume 2 of Ted's
Prototype Railroad Modeling. You, too, can have your own 134
Megabyte copy from the Library of Congress website, if you like.

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/I?
fsaall:370:./temp/~ammem_8iYi::displayType=1:m856sd=fsac:m856sf=1a3465
8:@@@

I have been trying to ID the visible cars from the end reporting
marks and determine any available models. It is interesting to see
how many of the more common cars are present, as well as some unique
ones.

Here is what I have ID'd so far and would welcome corrections or
suggestions.

Reading from near to far and left to right:

Track 1

CNW nine panel high side gondola 94171
Caboose
Caboose
Caboose
PRR 62748 - X31b double door auto car - Sunshine, Bowser

Track 2

MP 66067 gondola
T&NO 40954 gondola class W-50-4
PRR 152130 hopper class GL or GLCa - Westerfield
I-GN boxcar 9354
Unknown boxcar
NYC boxcar

Track 3

PRR 300000 gondola class GS - F&C, Bowser
NYC 109474 boxcar Lot 490-B - Westerfield
Unknown boxcar
T&NO 39887 auto boxcar class A-50-6 - F&C
GN 50027 boxcar woodsided 1937 AAR - Sunshine
Unknown tank car
Unknown boxcar

Track 4

Flatcar with beams
NWX 7708 refeer - Westerfield, Branchline
Unknown hopper
CNW boxcar

Thanks,
Steve Hile



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Dalman Trucks - How Many of Each?

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Feb 9, 2007, at 3:58 PM, Beckert, Shawn wrote:

Well, I tried searching the archives to get an idea of which type
of Dalman was more common, plain bolster or lateral motion. I
found little information on this. So, if I have a lot of steam-era kits
in the closet (and I do) what percentage of each design should I
have on hand: 50/50, 25/75? Some other proportion?
From what I can tell, it was somewhere around 50/50 in the freight car fleet as a whole. But, of course, it depends on the cars you want to model. Some RRs (e.g. Santa Fe) preferred lateral motion Dalmans, others the plain bolster Dalmans. Buy a bunch of both; whatever you don't use can be sold later, as we're highly unlikely to get better HO scale Dalman trucks any time soon (maybe never).

Richard Hendrickson


Drawings

Justin Kahn
 

I think Tony summarized the matter very well: I didn't notice any glaring errors in Hundmann's work (but perhaps I wasn't looking closely enough), and in the simpler, less-demanding days when Harold Geissel regularly produced drawings for MRR, we were glad to get them. It was only later that one began to notice the errors in the latter's work: I think I first began to realize the problem when I bought my first O scale locomotive, a Custom Brass 44-tonner, and found details that didn't match any 44-tonner I was familiar with. And then I checked the Geissel drawings from MRR... Unhappily, Custom Brass then used his drawings from MRR for their RS-1; it took me months of research and effort to correct the errors on mine, but probably most of the original buyers were so happy to have an O scale RS-1 that the errors didn't bother them.
I think he generally started with CBC's and perhaps issues of the older trade periodicals and redrew them with a clear line, suited to modelling. It is easy to be critical of him from our enlightened perspective now, but at the time, it was good to have him, and his work, with its characteristic clarity, was a welcome feature whenever it appeared.
I was under the impression that he was an architect, although I can't say where I got that; Ed Mines, however, suggests he worked for Kodak?

Jace Kahn, General Manager
Ceres and Canisteo RR Co.

.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Charlie Vlk" <cvlk@...> wrote:
J.Harold Geissel, the Dean of Railroad Draftsmen, was not perfect
either....and I believe Bob has surpassed him in terms of volume of
work and accuracy.

If I'm not mistaken Mr. Geissel worked for a big company that
allowed employees to do personal work at work. Bruce Smith and I
worked for that same company; Kodak isn't doing so well now.

Bob Hundman worked for himself and spent a lot of time doing time
consuming drawing (including copying drawings from CBCs) that brought
few readers to his magazine. I'll bet at least half of us on this
list have steam era CBCs or Trainshed reprints.

Bob tried to be a one man show - many of his employees knew little or
nothing about trains or modeling.

I wrote an article for him in the early '80s. My gripe was no one
edited my text. It read like a cave man wrote it.

Ed
Bob Hundman worked for himself and spent a lot of time doing time
consuming drawing (including copying drawings from CBCs) that brought
few readers to his magazine. I'll bet at least half of us on this
list have steam era CBCs or Trainshed reprints.
Certainly true. It's well known that Geissel, though producing
superb-looking drawings, was prone to inventing things that he had no
documentation for, sometimes producing "howlers" of inaccuracy. There
are certainly long lists of Geissel errors out there. I would never
accuse Hundman of that tendency, but at the same time, Hundman did make
errors, many of them errors which could have been easily corrected with
a quick check through someone knowledgeable about the subject. My own
impression, though, is that usually Hundman regarded HIMSELF as that
person.

Tony Thompson
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