Date   

Re: Hauling Grapes By Rail

Peter J. McClosky <pmcclosky@...>
 

A promoters view:

http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/984_1976.jpg

Peter J. McClosky
==



Bob Chaparro wrote:

I found the image below on Calisphere
(http://www.calisphere.universityofcalifornia.edu/
<http://www.calisphere.universityofcalifornia.edu/>), a service of the
University of California Libraries. The caption reads: "Grapes are
loaded onto gondola railway cars at the Turlock, California, depot."
This was taken around 1905.

Does anyone know how common this practice was before trucks and good
roads were common in these rural farm areas?

Bob Chaparro
Mission Viejo/Hemet, CA

http://tinyurl.com/yp2qao <http://tinyurl.com/yp2qao>

--
--
Peter J. McClosky
http://home.earthlink.net/~pmcclosky
pmcclosky@comcast.net


Riding the Rails DVD movie

Dean Payne <deanpayne@...>
 

I watched a documentary called "Riding the Rails" on DVD last
night. I got it out of the Cuyahoga County Library, check your
local library for availabilty or to get an interlibrary loan.
The movie is a documentary about the 250,000 teens who hopped
freight trains during the depression. It's hearbreaking in parts.
There is some nice archival movie footage showing freight cars from
the era. There is some from a movie called "Wild Boys of the Road"
which was supposed to warn teens about the dangers of hopping
freights. The action in that would be less trustworthy, because the
action was staged for the movie.
However, there are many actual shots of lots of hobos riding on top
of reefers, which is more out in the open than I would have
thought. I was under the impression that they would have to find a
less conspicuous location, to avoid unwelcome attention from the
railroad police.
Much of the freight equipment appears to be SP and CMSt.P&P, but
there is a block of Morell reefers with lettering that covers the
whole side, not just the right side ala Branchline. Are there any
commercially available cars with this version of the lettering? I
may have to watch it again to be sure.
(also posting to the 1914-1940RRing group)
Dean Payne


Re: ART HO decals

asychis@...
 

With the forthcoming Intermountain Undec ART Reefer Kit (due in April for
MSRP $17.95), I thought of what decals may be available to do later schemes than
those offered by the Amarillo Club.

I seem to recall that the 3 herald scheme was not available in HO, which when
some Southern Californians collaborated on a one-piece resin ART car a few
years ago, Jerry Glow printed up the missing 3rd herald on his ALPS printer.
Since I am more interested in the late 50's, is there a useful decal set for the
ART kit for the later scheme(s)? And has the early 50's color 3 herald scheme
since become available?

Any help is appreciated.
-Andy Carlson


I'll go Ed one better, the so-called InterMountain undecorated "ART" car is
one of our rejected test shots, and the undecorated kit for which they have
been painting assembled versions in many bogus paint schemes. The sides will
either not be correct (details such as a padlock on the door might be present),
or the rivet detail will be lacking or inaccurate. I do know positively that
they cannot be correct for ART cars. If they are our cars, then InterMountain
is violating our exclusivity contract with them. Our cars went through six
itterations of new sides before we were satisfied that they were right. These
models might be itteration 1 or 2 or 3... whatever. You might want to wait for
our 1950s scheme cars. Sometimes InterMountain (as Ed might agree) is curious
to work with.

As to decals, I believe Tom Stolte (Oddballs) has the correct "Three" Herald
ART decal set.

Jerry Michels



************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone.
Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com.


Hauling Grapes By Rail

Bob Chaparro <thecitrusbelt@...>
 

I found the image below on Calisphere
(http://www.calisphere.universityofcalifornia.edu/), a service of the
University of California Libraries. The caption reads: "Grapes are
loaded onto gondola railway cars at the Turlock, California, depot."
This was taken around 1905.

Does anyone know how common this practice was before trucks and good
roads were common in these rural farm areas?

Bob Chaparro
Mission Viejo/Hemet, CA

http://tinyurl.com/yp2qao


Re: B&O boxcar Duryea underframe

rwitt_2000 <rmwitt@...>
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "jc2fl" <jc02fl@...> wrote:

I have placed some photos illustrating the Duryea underframe in a
Yahoo photo album at

"new.photos.yahoo.com/b_and_o_boxcars/albums" (minus the quotes).

These photos are of M-53 boxcar 381538 located at the Florida Railroad
Museum, Parrish (Willow) FL. (www.frrm.org), just south of Tampa.

The album also has pictures of M-15NA #374834 and M-15PD #376330 which
are also located at the Florida Railroad Museum. These two cars do
not have the Duryea underframes.

John C.
Clearwater FL

Thank you posting these. Currently, I am not that near any wagon-top
boxcars to photograph their underframes. I specially appreciate those
photos of the M-53. The B&O Museum has a M-53A in its collection. The
Duryea underframe applied to the M-53A is structurally different than
the one use on the original class M-53.

Regards,

Bob Witt, Indianapolis, Indiana


Re: Atlas Trainman C&O Caboose

rgs0554
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Paul & Bernice Hillman" <chris_hillman@...> wrote:

I bought the Trainman, "Eastern 4 Window Center Cupola Caboose", used
by the C&O, PM, C&EI etc., Item #945 (undec.)
The Trainman caboose has, to me, for detail purposes, the following
repairable "faults":...............
Paul Hillman
Hi Paul, I've thought of making the MoPac version of the car. I'd suggest you add to your list
of repairable items revising the side steps from the cast iron "tender type" steps which are
correct for the C&O version to the wooden "conventional caboose type" steps of the C&EI and
MoPac versions of the prototype. It would seem a shame to do all of the items you list and
not change what to me is the most obvious difference. Regards, Don Smith


Re: Atlas Trainman C&O Caboose

rwitt_2000 <rmwitt@...>
 

"Paul Hillman" wrote:

the upcoming Athearn version of the same caboose.

Two faults of the Athearn car, as I see them, are:

1-) The cupola roof-radius/contour is too high.
2-) The car, side-windows are postioned too high, right under the
roof-line rather than about 12" below the foor-line.
Paul,

The Athearn caboose, as stated in their information, is based upon old
MDC tooling - actually from the 1950's. It is based on a different
prototype caboose than the caboose built by Magor for the C&O, etc.
Actually, I cannot recall if the old MDC 2-window caboose was based on
any particular prototype.

Bob Witt, Indianapolis, Indiana


Re: ART Reefers From the Amarillo Railroad Museum and MP Historical Society

Ed Hawkins
 

On Mar 19, 2007, at 9:14 AM, Bruce Smith wrote:

Jerry, Ed, et al.,

Was the running board (aka "roofwalk") galvanized?

I noticed the roof paint was very nicely described in the directions
in the link provided by Ed when I read them last night. Time for me
to get out the aluminum! <G>.

Regards
Bruce
Bruce,
The running boards of the earliest ART cars with horizontal side seams
were originally either aluminum or unpainted galvanized steel. This is
based on the appearance of the builder's photo of ART 24000 (built
11-39). When cars were repainted and received Inco Red roofs, the
running boards were normally also painted red. Like a lot of running
boards, they likely didn't probably get a lot of attention paid to them
to ensure the paint covered every square inch.

I would like to amplify on Jerry's post about the aluminum roofs. We
know that 1936-built ART cars had aluminum roofs because they are
specified this way in the AC&F bill of materials for 511 cars built at
that time. Presumably 510 cars built by GATC in 1936 were the same.
After locating an original 8x10 print of ART 24000, an interpretation
was made that this car originally had the roof painted aluminum. The
propped-up hatch covers were clearly a dark color, probably Inco Red.
Unfortunately ART didn't take any additional builder's photos of the
various small groups of like cars in series 24000-24449 as they were
built from 1940 to 1945.

We have not found any documentation that specifies precisely when ART
began to paint their roofs of steel reefers Inco Red. It has been
speculated that the change may have occurred during World War II due to
aluminum pigment demand for war equipment. I found documentation that
new ART reefers built in 1947 by Pullman-Standard received Inco Red
roofs, but it is not known (from 1940 to 1947) when the roof color was
changed. All we have to go by are in-service photos, and there's a
pretty slim selection taken during the 1940s. Anyone having more
information about ART's roof color during the 1940s is encouraged to
share it.

The lettering scheme applied to the models offered by the Amarillo RR
Museum was used until 1948, when a Wabash flag was added to one side of
the car and a MP "buzzsaw" emblem on the other side (above the
reporting marks). Cars lettered this way could have been found through
at least the early 1950s, and these cars would have most likely had
Inco Red roofs.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


B&O boxcar Duryea underframe

jc2fl
 

I have placed some photos illustrating the Duryea underframe in a
Yahoo photo album at

"new.photos.yahoo.com/b_and_o_boxcars/albums" (minus the quotes).

These photos are of M-53 boxcar 381538 located at the Florida Railroad
Museum, Parrish (Willow) FL. (www.frrm.org), just south of Tampa.

Note that the Railroad Prototype Cyclopedia #9 has photos on pages 17
and 19 that show some of the parts visible from the sides of the cars.

The album also has pictures of M-15NA #374834 and M-15PD #376330 which
are also located at the Florida Railroad Museum. These two cars do
not have the Duryea underframes.

John C.
Clearwater FL


Re: ART Reefers From the Amarillo Railroad Museum and MP Historical Society

Bruce Smith
 

On Mar 19, 2007, at 8:31 AM, asychis@aol.com wrote:

It has come to my attention that there is a concern about the roof colors on
our new reefers. In our advertising, we have mentioned that the reefers are
painted in the "as delivered" scheme. While almost correct, I want to point
out that our reefers have Inco Red roofs rather than aluminum roofs. The
reefers were delivered with aluminum roofs, which changed to Inco red in the
mid-1940s. So, this is a mistake in our advertising and I apologize for it. If a
person prefers to paint their cars with the aluminum roofs, please note that
roof hardware (hatches, latches etc.) were Inco red from the start. Only the
main part of the roof was aluminum and the roofwalk was unpainted steel.
Jerry, Ed, et al.,

Was the running board (aka "roofwalk") galvanized?

I noticed the roof paint was very nicely described in the directions in the link provided by Ed when I read them last night. Time for me to get out the aluminum! <G>.

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


Re: Question about reefer hatches

Bruce Smith
 

On Mar 19, 2007, at 8:23 AM, asychis@aol.com wrote:

Over on the reefer madness list there is a discussion on the normal position
of reefer hatches. I was under the impression that reefer ice hatches were
normally closed whether the car was loaded or empty unless it was specifically
carrying a load that needed ventilation only, when the hatches were opened. I
thought I read this on this list, but might be mistaken. Can anyone confirm
the typical or normal practice?
Jerry,

That is correct. About the only time an empty reefer would have an open hatch was if a hobo had opened it and was riding on the stage.

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


PFE R-40-18 trucks

Bruce Smith
 

Folks,

I'm finally getting around to building my Terry Wegman PFE R-40-18
kits and I wondered, what are the correct trucks for this car?

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


ART Reefers From the Amarillo Railroad Museum and MP Historical Society

asychis@...
 

It has come to my attention that there is a concern about the roof colors on
our new reefers. In our advertising, we have mentioned that the reefers are
painted in the "as delivered" scheme. While almost correct, I want to point
out that our reefers have Inco Red roofs rather than aluminum roofs. The
reefers were delivered with aluminum roofs, which changed to Inco red in the
mid-1940s. So, this is a mistake in our advertising and I apologize for it. If a
person prefers to paint their cars with the aluminum roofs, please note that
roof hardware (hatches, latches etc.) were Inco red from the start. Only the
main part of the roof was aluminum and the roofwalk was unpainted steel.

If anyone has any questions, please let me know. We did not intend to defraud
or falsely advertise the reefers, as one customer has mentioned in a separate
e-mail. We will correct the advertising as soon as possible.

Jerry Michels
Amarillo Railroad Museum



************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone.
Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com.


Question about reefer hatches

asychis@...
 

Over on the reefer madness list there is a discussion on the normal position
of reefer hatches. I was under the impression that reefer ice hatches were
normally closed whether the car was loaded or empty unless it was specifically
carrying a load that needed ventilation only, when the hatches were opened. I
thought I read this on this list, but might be mistaken. Can anyone confirm
the typical or normal practice?

Thanks,

Jerry Michels



************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone.
Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com.


Re: ADMIN: Full names please

Jared Harper <harper-brown@...>
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:
So perhaps it's a good
day to remind the members that they must sign their full name...
Aye Captain!
Dr. Jared Vincent Harper


Re: Bob Liljestrand's ear

Paul Lyons
 

Ed, I guess I should have looked BEFORE responding to the this tread. In the upper right hand corner it clearly states "Complied by Ed Hawkins"

Paul Lyons
Laguna Niguel, CA

-----Original Message-----
From: hawk0621@sbcglobal.net
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 5:49 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Bob Liljestrand's ear



On Mar 15, 2007, at 6:12 PM, cobrapsl@aol.com wrote:

Bill,
I find this tread somewhat interesting in that I bought a list of
Bob's Photos from Bob himself at Cocco Beach this year. At the time of
purchase he explained that it was no where complete , but it was a
start. I thanked him and encouraged him to continue the effort as
there was a large demand for it.

Paul Lyons
Laguna Niguel, CA
Paul,
Bob called me about a week before the Cocoa Beach meet and asked if I
would send him a copy of my Excel photo listing that I compiled from
photos that either Pat Wider or I bought over the past 6 years. Are the
first two items on your list identify an unnumbered milk car for
Sheffield Farms and a flat car with unknown reporting marks with number
123200? If so, that's the list I provided Bob.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins





________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com.


Re: Micro Engineering Co.

Park Varieties <parkvarieties@...>
 

Based on recent invoices and sales sheets, Micro Engineering has yet to embrace the Internet as a sales tool; no web site and no e-mail address listed.
Frank Brua

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul & Bernice Hillman
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2007 3:30 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Micro Engineering Co.


Is there a web-site for Micro Engineering?

In a Google, etc. search, I was only able to really find a WigWag.com
company which appears to be only selling their parts.

Thanks, Paul Hillman


Atlas Trainman C&O Caboose

Paul Hillman
 

I bought the Trainman, "Eastern 4 Window Center Cupola Caboose", used
by the C&O, PM, C&EI etc., Item #945 (undec.)

It appears that the main model body is a pretty accurate rendition of
the prototype, as per Fritz Milhaupt of the Pere Marquette H.S., and
Bob Lehnen of the C&EI H.S., as versus the upcoming Athearn version of
the same caboose.

Two faults of the Athearn car, as I see them, are:

1-) The cupola roof-radius/contour is too high.
2-) The car, side-windows are postioned too high, right under the roof-
line rather than about 12" below the foor-line.


The Trainman caboose has, to me, for detail purposes, the following
repairable "faults":

1-) The car-end and cupola-roof, grab-irons, are molded onto the car.
These can be removed and replaced with 3-D grabs, but it's a touchy
demo-job because of the fine rivet-detail on the car-ends.
2-) The underbody brake components could/should be replaced and brake-
rigging-lines added.
3-) The trucks could be replaced, or reworked, by cutting out for the
void above the leaf-springs and changing the wheels, (the axles are too
large a dia.)
4-) The end-doors have no window openings. It is yet for me to
determine whether these doors were full, closed-panel doors without
windows or not, as per each prototype.
5-) The roof-walk is a molded-on saftey-tread type which would have to
be removed and replaced with a 3-D type.

I intend to model this caboose as a C&EI type. The brake-wheel was
vertical on the C&EI #5, and this would have to be reworked from what's
on the Trainman Car. Also, yet to be determined is whether the C&EI
caboose had a wood or steel/safety-tread roof-walk.

Over-all the car proportions seem to be a good starting-point, as
apparently no other caboose is available which is closer than the
Trainman's. The rivet detail and steel details are very fine and nicely
done. The car-side, curved grabs are applied separately. Would have
been great if they had done this with all of the grabs.

Paul Hillman


Re: Santa Fe Map Question

up4024 <thekays100@...>
 

Sorry, I should have been more clear. The car in question is indeed a
BX 57, and there is no map, but instead the "Ship and Travel Santa Fe"
slogan. And I was surprised to see this descrepancy on a Kadee model,
considering their reputation for accuracy.

It looks like the reputation is still intact!!

Steve Kay

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


PS painted the Bx-57 series backwards from Santa Fe specs -- they
put slogans on the right side and Ship&Travel on the left. Whenever
the cars were repainted before 1960, this was reversed! (After 1960
the style changed.)

But if you're talking about "map" cars I suppose that must be the
Bx-52 built in 1947. Those should have slogans on the left side as
far as I know.

Kadee is darn careful about stuff, and they only work from photos.
They may have found an oddball car -- they did a "one-of" C&NW car
so why not?

Tim O'Connor



Steve Kay wrote:
I read in MR a few issues back a question about which side of the car
the ATSF put the map and which side it put the slogan. According to
MR (and confirmed in the Champ decal catalog), when you face the side
of the car with the slogan, the brake wheel is on the right.

I checked my cars, and they followed that rule, EXCEPT for one, an
Kadee PS-1 40' El Capitan box, which was reversed.

Do all ATSF map cars follow that rule, or was Kadee correct?
Since Kadee likely got the info from Richard Hendrickson,
you can
be confident it is correct (unless, of course, the factory messed it
up). Richard is in Hawaii at the moment but will surely answer this
when he returns.

Tony Thompson


Micro Engineering Co.

Paul Hillman
 

Is there a web-site for Micro Engineering?

In a Google, etc. search, I was only able to really find a WigWag.com
company which appears to be only selling their parts.

Thanks, Paul Hillman

123341 - 123360 of 184354