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Re: Ice Reefer Hatches

armprem
 

Now how could I have missed that?Sorry 'bout that.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 8:25 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Ice Reefer Hatches


> Armand Premo wrote:
>> And New Orleans?
>
> Armand, read the original post: the poster asked if all bananas
> came in through Gulf Coast ports. Last time I checked, New Orleans
> qualified as one of those.
>
> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
> 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
> (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
> Publishers of books on railroad history
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.15/728 - Release Date: 3/20/2007 8:07 AM
>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Re: C&EI "Magor" copies

Paul Hillman
 

Jerry Michels,

Thanks for your info. I went to the MPHS and ordered their MP Caboose
book. Not cheap!,...but 400 pages of apparently deep-data.

It says it covers the MoPac & C&EI, and their other RR's in great
detail on the "Magor" type cabooses, and extensively all their RR's
other types.

Perhaps it will also reveal some info on another C&EI caboose that
I've been searching for,....a 4 window (per-side), wood, center-
coupola, truss-rod type. This type caboose seems to appear on pages
13 & 38, in Edward DeRouin's book, "C&EI RR In Color", but the CEIHS
has yet been unable to identify it. I used to see this type caboose
on the C&EI Clearing-freights in Chicago, in the early 1960's.

Thanks, Paul Hillman

********************************************************************
In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, asychis@... wrote:

My information indicates that the C&EI "Magor-type" cabooses were
built in 1947 by ACF. They were numbered 1-6 and all retired by mid-
1977. They were assigned MoPac numbers 13952-13958, but it is
doubtful these numbers were ever applied.

The book "Cabooses of the Missouri Pacific Lines" (available from the
Missouri Pacific Historical Society) covers the C&EI Magor copies and
MoPac Magor and Magor copies in depth.

Jerry Michels


Re: U of Cal library

Jack Burgess
 

Dave wrote:
OTOH if you go to Berkeley and visit the Bancroft Library, be sure to
check out the contents of the Roy Graves collection. Almost 5000 rail
oriented photos,
most of which are from central California, and at least some have to
include
freight cars.
I haven't checked out any of the Graves photos except his Yosemite Valley
Railroad photos. There are 58 Graves photos of the YV of which about half
are locomotive photos. About a quarter are from the two fan trip excursions
in 1944 and 1945. The rest are stations, cabooses (2 shots) and one of a M
of W crane. There are also copies of some "historic" photos that show up in
a number of collections. There aren't any freight car photos in his YV
stuff. This is typical for collections of that period since a significant
portion of the rail photography hobby was trading negatives of locomotives.
There were exceptions for west coast railfans such as Paul Darrell (who was
considered "odd" <g>) since he liked freight cars. And, of course, W.C.
Whittaker was taking freight car photos. But, at least based on his YV
photos, Graves wasn't taking many freight car photos. Maybe Graves shot more
freight cars for the large carriers such as the SP and WP but most of this
collection, as I recall, was California short lines....

Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com


Re: Ice Reefer Hatches

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Armand Premo wrote:
And New Orleans?
Armand, read the original post: the poster asked if all bananas came in through Gulf Coast ports. Last time I checked, New Orleans qualified as one of those.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Ice Reefer Hatches

armprem
 

And New Orleans? Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 6:18 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Ice Reefer Hatches


> Bill Williams wrote:
>> Does this mean that, at least in the '60's, banana ships came to
>> Seattle for eastward loading? I had always thought that bananas came
>> through Gulf Coast ports and went all over vis I.C. and G.M.& O..
>
> Seattle was a significant banana port; so were San Francisco and
> Los Angeles on the west coast. They also came in for a time at
> Philadelphia.
>
> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
> 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
> (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
> Publishers of books on railroad history
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.15/728 - Release Date: 3/20/2007 8:07 AM
>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Re: Reefer Hatches

Charlie Vlk
 

Russ-
I knew "Wood Street Yard"..... Not Robey.... but had a brain fart.
Thanks,
Charlie Vlk

----- Original Message -----
From: Russ Strodtz
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 11:36 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Reefer Hatches


Charlie,

Right, I've been there. The sellers started early
and the usual desired spot time at Wood Street, Morgan
Street and Racine was 0500.

Robey Street was a B&OCT engine facility, not the name
of any yard. CB&Q had an interlocking there but spelled
it "Roby Street".

Russ Strodtz
----- Original Message -----
From: Charlie Vlk
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, 20 March, 2007 11:51
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Reefer Hatches

There is a C&NW film that shows the interior of the Potato Yard
Office at Robey Street... there was a chalkboard
with the spots for each track painted on it and the car number
and load were chalked on it by the Yardmaster or
the guy in charge of the Terminal. I am sure that this gave the
switch crews the information they needed to remove
empties and which cars had to stay on spot or be moved at the
direction of the Terminal Manager.
The alleys in between the tracks were paved for the teams/trucks
of the buyers to directly offload the cars as was
described in a previous post; I imagine that the switching took
place after market hours in order to avoid all the
civilians and their vehicles.
Charlie Vlk


Re: Ice Reefer Hatches

Barry Roth
 

The "banana dock" was a fixture on the southern San Francisco waterfront. I remember seeing PFE reefers there marked "for banana loading only" -- but being young and carefree as well as cameraless I didn't take any notes at the time.

Barry Roth

Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com> wrote:
Bill Williams wrote:
Does this mean that, at least in the '60's, banana ships came to
Seattle for eastward loading? I had always thought that bananas came
through Gulf Coast ports and went all over vis I.C. and G.M.& O..
Seattle was a significant banana port; so were San Francisco and
Los Angeles on the west coast. They also came in for a time at
Philadelphia.



.





---------------------------------
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Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV.


Re: U of Cal library

Dave Nelson <muskoka@...>
 

ed_mines wrote:
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Chaparro" <thecitrusbelt@...>
provided a link to
(http://www.calisphere.universityofcalifornia.edu/), a service of the
University of California Libraries.

Has anyone gone through the many other photos? Any other freight car
photos?
Yes, I have and no, as I recall nothing online worth mentioning. OTOH if
you go to Berkeley and visit the Bancroft Library, be sure to check out the
contents of the Roy Graves collection. Almost 5000 rail oriented photos,
most of which are from central California, and at least some have to include
freight cars.

Dave Nelson


Re: Ice Reefer Hatches

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bill Williams wrote:
Does this mean that, at least in the '60's, banana ships came to
Seattle for eastward loading? I had always thought that bananas came
through Gulf Coast ports and went all over vis I.C. and G.M.& O..
Seattle was a significant banana port; so were San Francisco and Los Angeles on the west coast. They also came in for a time at Philadelphia.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Ice Reefer Hatches

bill_d_goat
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "railsnw1" <railsnw@...> wrote:

While doing research on steel ice refrigerator car NP 91366 which
is
at the Northwest Railway Museum I found the following info on this
car with dates from its visit to the NP ice dock in Seattle. Notice
the entry for October 2, 1962.

Richard Wilkens

Visits by Northern Pacific Refrigerator Car NP 91366
To Seattle Ice Dock 1960 – 1962

May 10, 1960 Re-ice with chunk ice, no salt

November 27, 1961 Install 1 heater, set for 57 ½ degrees for
bananas

December 31, 1961 Refuel heaters and set for 55 degrees for bananas

July 23, 1962 Re-ice with 500# ice each end for bananas

October 2, 1962 Reverse vents for bananas

December 17, 1962 Reverse heaters and set for 55 degrees for
bananas

December 31, 1962 Install heaters for bananas
Does this mean that, at least in the '60's, banana ships came to
Seattle for eastward loading? I had always thought that bananas came
through Gulf Coast ports and went all over vis I.C. and G.M.& O..
Bill Williams


Re: 1937 AAR box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

The car is definitely appropriate for 1945, if you reweigh it. :-)

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "j3a5405" <j3a5405@yahoo.com>
There is an Atlas box car on ebay at the moment (item #110104952981),
and I was wondering if these cars were delivered with the metal roof
walks, or if they were added later. Would this car be appropriate for
a 1945 railroad?

Thanks,
Mike


Re: 1937 AAR box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

The cars were rehab'ed in their 20's and received straight side sills
(reinforced sills) and probably got new running boards then, if ever.
But not by 1945, as you guess.

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Larry Kline <lndkline@verizon.net>

Ed's roster also says that the NP 15500-15999 series was built by ACF
in March 1940 so the cars is appropriate for a 1945 model railroad.
However, the reweigh period for all steel house cars is listed in the
1943 ORER as 30 months so the car should have been reweighed by 1945. I
don't know whether metal running boards were added later.
I would guess not by 1945 but thats only a guess.
Larry Kline
Pittsburgh, PA


Re: 1937 AAR box cars

Larry Kline
 

Mike wrote:
There is an Atlas box car on ebay at the moment (item #110104952981),
and I was wondering if these cars were delivered with the metal roof
walks, or if they were added later. Would this car be appropriate for a
1945 railroad?

Ed Hawkins' roster says that these cars were delivered with wood
running boards. See:
http://www.steamfreightcars.com/prototype/frtcars/1937aarpdfmain.html

Ed's roster also says that the NP 15500-15999 series was built by ACF
in March 1940 so the cars is appropriate for a 1945 model railroad.
However, the reweigh period for all steel house cars is listed in the
1943 ORER as 30 months so the car should have been reweighed by 1945. I
don't know whether metal running boards were added later.
I would guess not by 1945 but thats only a guess.

Larry Kline
Pittsburgh, PA


Re: ART HO decals

jerryglow2
 

Depending on the desired paint scheme, Champ's Wabash flag is too big.
It is correct for it's intended use.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

Andy

Champ's BRH-44 has color heralds, while BRH-62 has the black & white
heralds for the later scheme. Also check out ODDBALLS 108, 109, 110.

Tim


1937 AAR box cars

Mike Williams
 

There is an Atlas box car on ebay at the moment (item #110104952981),
and I was wondering if these cars were delivered with the metal roof
walks, or if they were added later. Would this car be appropriate for
a 1945 railroad?

Thanks,
Mike


Great Northern covered hopper

dphobbyman <peardo@...>
 

Hi all-can some one give me the correct gray (light or dark) to use
with Champ CN-421 red letter decal, thanks, Doug Pearce.


Re: Reefer Hatches

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Russ Strodtz wrote:
While beyond the scope of this group as packaging practices changed the cars started getting cleaner. Crated lettuce leaves a mess but when packaged in large, heavy, cardboard boxes it could be unloaded and the car would be perfectly clean inside.
Unloaders could and did still throw empty cartons or bad produce back inside the car. This happened in the 1950s and all through the 1960s with mechanical cars (as you say, beyond this group's scope). The big factor, starting well before 1960, was the use of pallets, since it was then the practice to pick up a forklift load out of the car. For years, though, PFE strongly encouraged shippers to use slip sheets under the loads to permit the shipper to remove the pallet (saving the shipping weight and volume of the pallet), but requiring the folks at the other end to figure out how to get a pallet back under the stack.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: B&O boxcar Duryea underframe

rwitt_2000 <rmwitt@...>
 

"Ted Anderson" wrote:

Give me a date and builder & I'll see if we have a B&O Durea
underframe drawing for that car in the Pullman Library - usually $25
for a copy of the builder's linen drawing for personal use only.
Builders currently available are Standard Steel and Pullman.
Ted Anderson, IRM Pullman Library
Some Builder/dates are Pullman/1940-1941

In 1940-41, the B&O ordered from Pullman their 50-ft class M-57
automobile car and their 40-ft class M-55a and M-55b boxcars. These
cars had the early Pullman ends with "W" corner posts and plain panel
roofs or whatever the Group currently terms them. The auto car had an
IH of 10'-6" and the 40-ft boxcars had an IH of 10'-0"

Note: From my searches of the O.C. Duryea patents there were continual
changes to the design and components used in these underframes. After
reviewing the drawings the only differences I found between the class
M-55a and M-55b appears to be in the construction of their Duryea
underframes.

FWIW, Bethlehem Steel built the underframes for the class M-53
wagon-top boxcars and the B&O completed the construction of these cars
in their shops.

Bob Witt, Indianapolis, Indiana


Re: Reefer Hatches

Russ Strodtz <sheridan@...>
 

Tony,

As to the magazine loading PFE usually picked specific
cars. I would think that over time they would have a
pretty good idea which terminals or customers would
usually produce a clean car.

While beyond the scope of this group as packaging
practices changed the cars started getting cleaner.
Crated lettuce leaves a mess but when packaged in
large, heavy, cardboard boxes it could be unloaded
and the car would be perfectly clean inside.

Russ Strodtz

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Thompson
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, 20 March, 2007 11:55
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Reefer Hatches


PFE and SFRD had many active agents in eastern cities, but
their job was to make sure empties were promptly moved westward
(and
not confiscated), not to check on open ice hatches or to clean
cars.
Certainly for PFE, all decisions on cleaning and repair were
made when
the cars arrived at a PFE facility.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705
www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail,
thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Riding the Rails DVD movie

Dean Payne <deanpayne@...>
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Dean Payne" <deanpayne@...> wrote:

I watched a documentary called "Riding the Rails" on DVD last
night. I got it out of the Cuyahoga County Library, check your
local library for availabilty or to get an interlibrary loan.
The movie is a documentary about the 250,000 teens who hopped
freight trains during the depression. It's hearbreaking in
parts.
There is some nice archival movie footage showing freight cars
from the era. There is some from a movie called "Wild Boys of the
Road" which was supposed to warn teens about the dangers of hopping
freights. The action in that would be less trustworthy, because
the action was staged for the movie.
However, there are many actual shots of lots of hobos riding on
top of reefers, which is more out in the open than I would have
thought. I was under the impression that they would have to find
a less conspicuous location, to avoid unwelcome attention from the
railroad police.
Much of the freight equipment appears to be SP and CMSt.P&P, but
there is a block of Morell reefers with lettering that covers the
whole side, not just the right side ala Branchline. Are there any
commercially available cars with this version of the lettering? I
may have to watch it again to be sure.
(also posting to the 1914-1940RRing group)
Dean Payne
A second viewing shows 2 Morrell Ham reefers (ala Branchline #1317)
followed by a truss rod reefer with the "Morrell Pride" covering the
full side (including the door). After that was another reefer with
full-side lettering, but channel side sills instead of truss rods.
I've looked at Atlas and Red Caboose, none of their reefers have the
proper lettering. Art Griffin has the proper decals, page 77, for a
40' car from the 20's-30's. Finding the proper 40' truss rod reefer
carbody is going to be a problem! I was expecting 36'.
Dean Payne

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