Date   

Re: NMRA publications was Re: Prototype Rails 2008

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bruce Smith wrote:
The book consists mostly of photos of freight cars taken by an un-named photographer and for years owned by John Roberts.
Um, that should read ". . . owned by Bob Charles." Confusion may be natural, as both served as NMRA President for more than one term.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: NMRA publications was Re: Prototype Rails 2008

Richard Morgan-Fine <allisd1701@...>
 

Jerry

The NMRA Site says 1898 to 1947. I just received my last week. I
think it is a have to own Book.




Not since the WWII years has the nation seen such an unprecedented number
and variety of cars on the rails - until now! NMRAR's Postwar Freight Car
Fleet hardcover book captures the beauty and historical significance of this
prolific RR era so popular with today's modelers. Railroading history comes
alive with Postwar Freight Car Fleet. Get your limited-edition copy today,
before it too becomes history.


BOOK HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:
. 350+ B&W archival photos of freight cars from 1898 - 1947

. Historical car design texts from the first half of the 20th century

. Tables and graphs depicting company and private car ownership

. Authored by RR historians Larry Kline and Ted Culotta

Richard E. Morgan-Fine



_____

From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
jerryglow2
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 12:36 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] NMRA publications was Re: Prototype Rails 2008



The new Scale Rails includes an announcement of a book "Postwar
Freight Car Fleet" Does anyone know it's actual span of
coverage? "Postwar" is a long window.

Jerry Gliow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups. <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> com, "Mike Brock"
<brockm@...> wrote:

Bob Webber asks about the room rate at Prototype Rails. Here's all
the
current information about the meet:

Some of you might notice the reference to the NMRA. The NMRA
national
management is interested in associating with RPM meets. Prototype
Rails
welcomes that interest which includes NMRA provided liability
insurance
coverage...particularly at layouts open for visitation. It is
pleasing...IMO...to see the NMRA officially take an interest in the
prototype modeling element of the hobby which can only increase the
effectiveness of both. The NMRA's involvement with historical
modeling has,
I think, been overlooked. The publishing of the 1953 ORER has been
extremely
useful, for example, as well as the Postwar Freight Car Fleet by
Larry Kline
and Ted Culotta. I'll add to that Freight Terminals and
Trains...originally
published in 1925.


Re: NMRA publications was Re: Prototype Rails 2008

Bruce Smith
 

On Thu, November 1, 2007 12:35 pm, jerryglow2 wrote:
The new Scale Rails includes an announcement of a book "Postwar
Freight Car Fleet" Does anyone know it's actual span of
coverage? "Postwar" is a long window.

Jerry Gliow
Jerry,

First, this isn't a new project but the second printing of a book that has
been discussed here a good deal. The book consists mostly of photos of
freight cars taken by an un-named photographer and for years owned by John
Roberts. These were shot in 1946-47 in the area around Harrisburg PA.
Larry Kline and Ted Culotta have artfully arranged these and a few other
photos to give a glimps as to the content of the freight car fleet, 2
years after WWII ended. Thus, most of the cars are "pre-war" although
there certainly are more than a few new cars shown. An invaluable
resource!

Regards
Bruce

Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


Re: NMRA publications was Re: Prototype Rails 2008

Tim O'Connor
 

Jerry

The emphasis is immediate post-war -- 1945 and soon after. Very
useful for people modeling the late 1940's, but largely academic for
people modeling 1960 or later.

Tim O'

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "jerryglow2" <jerryglow@comcast.net>
The new Scale Rails includes an announcement of a book "Postwar
Freight Car Fleet" Does anyone know it's actual span of
coverage? "Postwar" is a long window.

Jerry Gliow


NMRA publications was Re: Prototype Rails 2008

jerryglow2
 

The new Scale Rails includes an announcement of a book "Postwar
Freight Car Fleet" Does anyone know it's actual span of
coverage? "Postwar" is a long window.

Jerry Gliow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:

Bob Webber asks about the room rate at Prototype Rails. Here's all
the
current information about the meet:

Some of you might notice the reference to the NMRA. The NMRA
national
management is interested in associating with RPM meets. Prototype
Rails
welcomes that interest which includes NMRA provided liability
insurance
coverage...particularly at layouts open for visitation. It is
pleasing...IMO...to see the NMRA officially take an interest in the
prototype modeling element of the hobby which can only increase the
effectiveness of both. The NMRA's involvement with historical
modeling has,
I think, been overlooked. The publishing of the 1953 ORER has been
extremely
useful, for example, as well as the Postwar Freight Car Fleet by
Larry Kline
and Ted Culotta. I'll add to that Freight Terminals and
Trains...originally
published in 1925.


Re: The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

William Bryk wrote:
Given Minnesota's enthusiastic support for the war effort, it stands to reason that some settlement may have named itself for him before it faded into obscurity. I don't think there's a relationship between Hamlin and Hamline.
But to have WFE shops and a reweigh location at a hamlet of 185 persons beggars belief.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

William Bryk <wmbryk@...>
 

Hannibal Hamlin was Abraham Lincoln's first vice president. A former
Senator from Maine, he returned to the Senate after his retirement from the
vice presidency. Given Minnesota's enthusiastic support for the war effort,
it stands to reason that some settlement may have named itself for him
before it faded into obscurity. I don't think there's a relationship
between Hamlin and Hamline. Remember, St. Paul was once named Pig's Eye
before the respectable element took over, and I believe there's a GN yard
that bore that name into modern times.

Regards,
William Bryk

On 11/1/07, Michael Mang <mnmang@comcast.net> wrote:

Bill,

I enjoyed your talk at Naperville. I'm not a GN expert, but I found on an
old map of the Twin Cities a GN yard (near Hamline University) called
"Hamline Transfer". There is a Koppers Coke, and some other unlabeled
trackage on the map just south and a little west of the NP's Como Shops.

There is also a GN Engineer's contract here:
http://www.jaysworks.com/1637/agree/gnhog.html that says "Transfer
assignments, as now constituted, include such service between the
following
points:

Saint Paul: Between Como Yard or points East of Como Yard and Hamline, W.
F.
E. Shop Yard, Koppers Coke, or Fair Grounds, or points West thereof."
Since
these points are all in very close proximity, I would believe that the WFE
cars weighed at Hamlin(e) are being weighed in this vicinity.

Michael Mang

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com <STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:
STMFC@yahoogroups.com <STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>] On Behalf Of
lnbill
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 9:32 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com <STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [STMFC] The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

Many questions arose during my presention on the FGE/WFE/BRE fleet
about where the heck is Hamlin, Minnesota. In exploring the documents
I copied just a few days earlier in Saint Paul, Hamlin was actually
the name of the Western Fruit shops in Saint Paul. Hopefully many of
you in attendence are also on this list. If the Dick brothers are not
on this list, can someone pass this info on to them.

Bill Welch





Re: The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

Michael Mang <mnmang@...>
 

Bill,



I enjoyed your talk at Naperville. I'm not a GN expert, but I found on an
old map of the Twin Cities a GN yard (near Hamline University) called
"Hamline Transfer". There is a Koppers Coke, and some other unlabeled
trackage on the map just south and a little west of the NP's Como Shops.



There is also a GN Engineer's contract here:
http://www.jaysworks.com/1637/agree/gnhog.html that says "Transfer
assignments, as now constituted, include such service between the following
points:

Saint Paul: Between Como Yard or points East of Como Yard and Hamline, W. F.
E. Shop Yard, Koppers Coke, or Fair Grounds, or points West thereof." Since
these points are all in very close proximity, I would believe that the WFE
cars weighed at Hamlin(e) are being weighed in this vicinity.



Michael Mang

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
lnbill
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 9:32 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota



Many questions arose during my presention on the FGE/WFE/BRE fleet
about where the heck is Hamlin, Minnesota. In exploring the documents
I copied just a few days earlier in Saint Paul, Hamlin was actually
the name of the Western Fruit shops in Saint Paul. Hopefully many of
you in attendence are also on this list. If the Dick brothers are not
on this list, can someone pass this info on to them.

Bill Welch


Re: IMWX v. IM 10' door hardware

Tim O'Connor
 

I think Speedwitch makes 10' doors with Camel roller lift devices also.
Joe Pennington made excellent replacement doors at one time for the
10' cars but I don't know what became of his masters...

Tim O'Connor

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: jim peters <mikado2206@hotmail.com>

Count the valleys and not the ones with the rivets.

For the IMWX kits the doors supplied with the kit are fine or use Sylvan 5/6/5-S
and early Camel door fixtures. This will take you through all the '37 AAR cars
built for CN to 1946 (10'-0" IH) . . . A quick check of my CP references and I
can not see anything different.

Rob, if you're by Central Hobbies on Saturday stop in and say hello, I always
enjoy meeting fellow rivet counters.

Jim Peters
Coquitlam, BC


Re: Cement Hoppers - Far Ranging or Mostly Home Road?

Tim O'Connor
 

Russ

Yes, of course but your examples are not specific to a commodity, or
to a particular form of that commodity. The explanations people gave
about common carrier tariff regulation makes perfect sense. Certainly
the Big John case in the 1960's was a good example of how difficult it
could be to change the rules.

Tim O'Connor

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Russ Strodtz" <railfreightcars@19main.com>
Tim,
In the late 50's, in order to avoid driving away the tourist trade, in the
state of Wisconsin much of the long haul trucking was prohibited on
weekends.


Re: New FGE/WFE/BRE kits from Sunshine

SUVCWORR@...
 

Bill:



Did Martin include the price in the announcement?? Do they need to be ordered by road name or are decals for all applicable roads included in the kit?



Rich Orr

-----Original Message-----
From: lnbill <bwelch@uucf.org>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 9:27 am
Subject: [STMFC] New FGE/WFE/BRE kits from Sunshine




As many of you know, Sunshine included in their new offerings at
Naperville kits to build the plywood sheathed cars built by FGE, WFE,
and BRE and the T&G sheathed cars built by BRE. As I engineered these
kits and did the patterns, I obviously have a vested interest in them.
I was frustrated to see that the "Prototype Data Sheet" had many
errors in it related to the history of the cars and that Martin
continues to call them "War Emergency" cars is a complete misnomer.
The quality of the photos was very weird.

Anyway volume 12 of Pat and Ed's RP CYC has a more accurate and
detailed history and the reproduction of the photos is very good.

Photos of the cars photetched details are in the Files section and I
will send to some painted and decaled model photos soon.

Bill Welch




Yahoo! Groups Links





________________________________________________________________________
Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com


Re: The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

Stokes John
 

Au contraire, there is a hamlet in Minnesota named Hamlin. See below. There is also a Hamline (with an "e") University in St. Paul, with quite a famous choir, and at one time a well known basketball team.

Hamlin is a township in Lac qui Parle County, Minnesota.
The latitude of Hamlin is 44.943N. The longitude is -96.175W.
It is in the Central Standard time zone. Elevation is 1,093 feet.

The population, at the time of the 2000 census, was 185.
John Stokes
Bellevue, WA


To: STMFC@yahoogroups.comFrom: railfreightcars@19main.comDate: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 11:23:15 -0500Subject: Re: [STMFC] The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

Bill,There is a major street in St Paul called "Hamline Avenue". That may be wherethis usage came from. I will agree that there is no such place as "Hamlin MN".The WFE car shop in St Paul was called "Jackson Street Shops". Think the buildingsare now gone. After WFE vacated them they were owned by a car scrapper that alsodabbled a little in locomotive re-sales.On a map if you follow the GN/NP up from 7th Street the GN splits and goes straightWest at Westminster St. The NP coninues North for a little ways before headingWest. The WFE shop was on the GN line just West of where it goes under I35E.Their main shop remains today at Hillyard WA. They do occasionaly bid on work.Overhauled a lot of BN waycars during the 80's and early 90's.Russ----- Original Message ----- From: lnbill To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, 01 November, 2007 09:31Subject: [STMFC] The location of the mysterious Hamlin, MinnesotaMany questions arose during my presention on the FGE/WFE/BRE fleet about where the heck is Hamlin, Minnesota. In exploring the documents I copied just a few days earlier in Saint Paul, Hamlin was actually the name of the Western Fruit shops in Saint Paul. Hopefully many of you in attendence are also on this list. If the Dick brothers are not on this list, can someone pass this info on to them.Bill WelchYahoo! Groups Links


Re: The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

Russ Strodtz <railfreightcars@...>
 

Bill,

There is a major street in St Paul called "Hamline Avenue". That may be where
this usage came from. I will agree that there is no such place as "Hamlin MN".

The WFE car shop in St Paul was called "Jackson Street Shops". Think the buildings
are now gone. After WFE vacated them they were owned by a car scrapper that also
dabbled a little in locomotive re-sales.

On a map if you follow the GN/NP up from 7th Street the GN splits and goes straight
West at Westminster St. The NP coninues North for a little ways before heading
West. The WFE shop was on the GN line just West of where it goes under I35E.

Their main shop remains today at Hillyard WA. They do occasionaly bid on work.
Overhauled a lot of BN waycars during the 80's and early 90's.

Russ

----- Original Message -----
From: lnbill
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 01 November, 2007 09:31
Subject: [STMFC] The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota


Many questions arose during my presention on the FGE/WFE/BRE fleet
about where the heck is Hamlin, Minnesota. In exploring the documents
I copied just a few days earlier in Saint Paul, Hamlin was actually
the name of the Western Fruit shops in Saint Paul. Hopefully many of
you in attendence are also on this list. If the Dick brothers are not
on this list, can someone pass this info on to them.

Bill Welch




Yahoo! Groups Links


Prototype Rails 2008

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Bob Webber asks about the room rate at Prototype Rails. Here's all the current information about the meet:

Some of you might notice the reference to the NMRA. The NMRA national management is interested in associating with RPM meets. Prototype Rails welcomes that interest which includes NMRA provided liability insurance coverage...particularly at layouts open for visitation. It is pleasing...IMO...to see the NMRA officially take an interest in the prototype modeling element of the hobby which can only increase the effectiveness of both. The NMRA's involvement with historical modeling has, I think, been overlooked. The publishing of the 1953 ORER has been extremely useful, for example, as well as the Postwar Freight Car Fleet by Larry Kline and Ted Culotta. I'll add to that Freight Terminals and Trains...originally published in 1925.

Prototype Rails remains a Railroad Prototype Modeling meet, managed and operated in the same manner by the same team as in previous years.

NMRA PROTOTYPE RAILS NMRA

COCOA BEACH, FL, JAN 4-6 2008

AN NMRA SANCTIONED EVENT

A PROTOTYPE MODELING MEET FEATURING
MODULAR LAYOUTS IN O, HO AND N SCALE

OVER 400 MODELS ON DISPLAY, PROTOTYPE BASED LAYOUTS
PLEASE BRING MODELS

Clinicians

Mike Rose Justin May Greg Komar Dick Flock Joe Oates

Robert Hundman Bill Darnaby Tom Bisset Larry Kline Bruce Smith

Andy Sperandeo Andy Harman Richard Hendrickson Tim Frederick

Scott Chatfield Ken Edmier Jim Singer Scott Mason

Steve Orth Brian Nolan Jeff Cauthen Tom Wilson Bill Schaumburg

Greg Martin Mont Switzer Tony Koester Tony Thompson Calvin Winter

John Wilkes George Eichelberger Bill Welch Lance Mindheim Chad Hewitt

Jim Murrie Roger Hinman Jared Harper John Roberts Ted Culotta

Manufacturers/Dealers: Walthers, Branchline, Atlas Models, Broadway Limited, Southern Car & Foundry, Speedwitch Models, Tangent Scale Models, Westerfield, 5th Avenue Shops, F & C, Trolleys N' Dollies, Bob's Photos, ACL/SAL HS, Dave Hoffman

HILTON HOTEL, 1550 N. Atlantic Ave. [ highway A1a ], COCOA BEACH, FL, 1-800-526-2609 or 321-799-0003. $99 Room Rate. Refer to Prototype Rails. Preregistration $35, payable to Prototype Rails, to Marty Megregian, 480 Gails Way, Merritt Island, FL 32953.

There will be op sessions available on Thursday Jan 3 at Tom Wilson's, John Wilkes and Mike Brock's layout. Those wishing to join in a session should indicate their choices in preregistration and make direct contact with the layout owner. Selection will be on a first come basis. Layouts will be available for visitation on Sunday.

For early arrivals, there will be a dinner at Durango's in Cocoa Beach Thursday evening at 7 PM. We will meet in the Hilton lobby at 6:30. Following the dinner we will return to the hotel for slide shows and mini clinics.


A special dinner on Saturday, Jan 5, for Prototype Rails attendees only will be available for $ 20/person. Tickets are required and must be purchased no later than Saturday morning. Tickets may be purchased and reserved in advance and included with the cost of registration. Registration plus dinner is $55/person. Spouses not attending presentations do not have to register. FOR INFORMATION: Contact Mike Brock at: brockm@brevard.net or 321-453-4140.


Re: Cement Hoppers - Far Ranging or Mostly Home Road?

rockroll50401 <cepropst@...>
 

If Northside
Lumber Co., in Dixon, needed to order bag cement from the Medusa
plant in Dixon, they had to receive a carload that was, at least, the
minimum weight allowed in the tariff. The local redi-mix plant also
received covered hopper loads which moved about two miles from one
business to the other. Today the tracks are gone at the old Medusa
plant which is still in business as St. Mary's Cement.

Chet French
To add to what Chet said and to make Larry Jackman grit his teeth.

If Andrews Pre-stress were to order a bulk load from NW States in the
50s. The plant would load an M&StL hopper. The M&StL would pick up the
car and take it passed Andrews (1 mile SE from plant) to weigh the car
(3-4 miles SE from plant) then take it back north and spot it at
Andrews.

If a lumber yard in town on the Milwaukee wanted a car of bags. Then
the Milwaukee would give one of the RRs servicing the plants an mty box
car for the plant pool on a transfer track. That RR would take the car
to a plant and pick up the box car billed to that lumber yard. They
would spot the car on the transfer and the Milwaukee switch crew would
pull the transfer and eventually spot the car at the lumber yard.

We modelers call this 'operations'.
Clark Propst


Re: IMWX v. IM 10' door hardware

jim peters
 

Count the valleys and not the ones with the rivets.

For the IMWX kits the doors supplied with the kit are fine or use Sylvan 5/6/5-S and early Camel door fixtures. This will take you through all the '37 AAR cars built for CN to 1946 (10'-0" IH) . . . A quick check of my CP references and I can not see anything different.

Rob, if you're by Central Hobbies on Saturday stop in and say hello, I always enjoy meeting fellow rivet counters.

Jim Peters
Coquitlam, BC


To: STMFC@yahoogroups.comFrom: rdkirkham@shaw.caDate: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 20:50:15 -0700Subject: [STMFC] IMWX v. IM 10' door hardware




I'm assembling a bunch of kits that I've had sitting around for quite a while and noticed that the door hardware at the bottom of the Youngstown (?) 6/6/6 (or is that 6/8/6? - how does one count the overlapping panel section?) doors in the two kits differ, with one a more rectangular shape and the other more triangular. Are these differences based on different prototype designs - and if so, can anyone provide names & dates when they were introduced or that sort of thing. Obvious;y for modelling if I just match a photo I won't go too wrong, but I'm curious....Rob Kirkham






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The location of the mysterious Hamlin, Minnesota

lnbill <bwelch@...>
 

Many questions arose during my presention on the FGE/WFE/BRE fleet
about where the heck is Hamlin, Minnesota. In exploring the documents
I copied just a few days earlier in Saint Paul, Hamlin was actually
the name of the Western Fruit shops in Saint Paul. Hopefully many of
you in attendence are also on this list. If the Dick brothers are not
on this list, can someone pass this info on to them.

Bill Welch


New FGE/WFE/BRE kits from Sunshine

lnbill <bwelch@...>
 

As many of you know, Sunshine included in their new offerings at
Naperville kits to build the plywood sheathed cars built by FGE, WFE,
and BRE and the T&G sheathed cars built by BRE. As I engineered these
kits and did the patterns, I obviously have a vested interest in them.
I was frustrated to see that the "Prototype Data Sheet" had many
errors in it related to the history of the cars and that Martin
continues to call them "War Emergency" cars is a complete misnomer.
The quality of the photos was very weird.

Anyway volume 12 of Pat and Ed's RP CYC has a more accurate and
detailed history and the reproduction of the photos is very good.

Photos of the cars photetched details are in the Files section and I
will send to some painted and decaled model photos soon.

Bill Welch


Re: new Bob's Photo address

Spen Kellogg <spenkell@...>
 

Anthony Thompson wrote:
I picked up a new business card from Bob at the Naperville meeting but seem to have lost it since. Does anyone have the new Kentucky address handy? TIA.
Tony,

The most important thing on the card is his e-mail address. You can now e-mail him at:

bobsphoto.train@yahoo.com

Regards, Spen Kellogg


Re: [SPAM] Re: Re: Cement Hoppers - Far Ranging or Mostly Home Road?

Russ Strodtz <railfreightcars@...>
 

Tim,

In the late 50's, in order to avoid driving away the tourist trade, in the
state of Wisconsin much of the long haul trucking was prohibited on
weekends.

It was just something the trucking companies had to live with.

Even today most rural Wisconsin Counties ban anything other than milk
trucks from all secondary roads during the period when the frost is
coming out of the ground.

Russ

----- Original Message -----
From: Schuyler Larrabee
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, 31 October, 2007 21:39
Subject: RE: [SPAM] Re: [STMFC] Re: Cement Hoppers - Far Ranging or Mostly Home Road?




From: timboconnor@comcast.net

Was it ILLEGAL to ship cement in bulk by truck before 1959???
That's just goofy!

125401 - 125420 of 192670