Date   

Re: SPAM-BL Re: Re: Harold K. Vollrath

Rufus Cone <cone@...>
 

Yes, I too greatly value traditional high resolution silver halide prints, for
example, builders photographs from Alco Historic Photos. Contact prints made
from historic 8x10 negatives have detail that is amazing even under a high
powered loupe magnifier.

On the other hand some of the silver halide freight car prints that I have
purchased over the years are disappointing. Many are still "the only thing out
there" on those cars, though, so the prints can be quite valuable for freight
car research despite the quality.

Either approach - silver halide or digital - can give good results in the right
hands. The right originals of old images are important in either case - good
full-range negatives that were well focused and properly exposed and developed,
instead of poor "thin" copy negatives.

I used to use Kodak Technical Pan film to make copy negatives of historic black
and white freight car photos. The negatives were great, but often it was a
challenge to control tonality in printing. Reflections on the originals also
presented challenges, even with polarized light. It is much easier to copy
prints with a digital flatbed scanner.

The digital scan generally gives you far greater ability to pull out shadow
detail on freigh car underbodies when copying prints that have "blocked-up"
shadows than does copying onto film. Scanning from negatives is always
preferred over scanning from a print; the print always has less range than the
negative unless made by an exceptionally skilled printer.

Also, I second Tony Thompson's remarks that paper and chemical supplies for
silver halide photography will continue to be available for many years.

Rufus Cone
Bozeman, MT

Rob Kirkham wrote:

I take your points Rufus, My comment arises from my experience with
prints - and scanning them at very high resolution to identify tiny details
in the background - often freight cars in a yard of interest. I have found
that a 30 or 50 year old black and white print will provide a lot more
information when blown up that way than will the typical 8x10 print I buy
from the local archives. I suspect that is simply because they scan at 300
dpi, and it isn't sufficient for those tiny details....

Rob Kirkham


Re: Harold K. Vollrath

Rob Kirkham <rdkirkham@...>
 

I take your points Rufus, My comment arises from my experience with prints - and scanning them at very high resolution to identify tiny details in the background - often freight cars in a yard of interest. I have found that a 30 or 50 year old black and white print will provide a lot more information when blown up that way than will the typical 8x10 print I buy from the local archives. I suspect that is simply because they scan at 300 dpi, and it isn't sufficient for those tiny details....

Rob Kirkham


Re: Harold K. Vollrath

Rufus Cone <cone@...>
 

All the lovely fine detail that one could pick out of a well-done chemical
process print is _not necessarily_ lost in a digital print. Quite the contrary,
even if you have middle range equipment.

With Photoshop or lower priced image processing, you can "bring up the shadows"
by manipulating "curves" or using "shadow/highlight" commands, revealing shadow
detail that would be lost to all chemical darkroom printers except the most
skilled and dedicated. This can give spectacular improvement in underbody
detail, hopper end detail, etc.

It is widely accepted among very critical fine art photographers that even if
they still shoot negatives or transparencies, color or black and white, and even
if they are still using 4x5 cameras for image capture, that they should scan
their negatives or transparencies and print them digitally. Fine art digital
printing has surpassed the quality of silver halide printing except for very
specialized situations. Fine art digital prints are concerned with the
rendering of detail and smooth tonal variation that we have associated with
silver halid photography.

Digital printers that are far less expensive than a brass locomotive are capable
of exceptional quality. Assuming you already have image processing software for
your digital camera, you can get a scanner and printer capable of this
competitive quality for less that $1000 total for both (not each).

To keep this discussion on track with freight cars, it is worthwhile to point
out that many railway historical societies are producing CD's of scanned
photographs. NPRHA is an example
http://www1.storehost.com/stores/xq/xfm/store_id.615/page_id.23/Item_ID.134651/parent_ids.0,0,11/qx/store.htm

http://www1.storehost.com/stores/xq/xfm/store_id.615/page_id.23/Item_ID.151419/parent_ids.0,0,11/qx/store.htm

I make these judgements after long personal experience with traditional silver
halide photography.

The customers of Jack's high end lab would not accept the change to digital if
improved quality were not provided by that lab after the change. They have to
face their own commercial customers who demand the best.

Rufus Cone
Bozeman, MT

Rob Kirkham wrote:

But surely in the process all of that lovely fine detail that one could pick
out of a chemical process print is lost on a digital print (unless they are
going to huge resolution files)? No?

Rob Kirkham
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Burgess" <jack@yosemitevalleyrr.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 10:30 AM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: Harold K. Vollrath

I've long used a high-end professional lab for developing slide film, B/W
printing, etc. When I recently took some original negs in to have them
make
prints, I discovered that they had gotten rid of all of the traditional
photography equipment...chemicals, trays, enlarger, etc. Now, if you want
a
print from a negative, they scan the neg and make prints from the scans.
In
fact, if you just want scans on a CD, it is cheaper to order prints and
ask
for the scans to also be written to a CD for an extra nominal charge...

Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com


Re: Sunshine kits...

Scott Pitzer
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Jack Burgess" <jack@...> wrote:

Did I really write "...for sell"?
------------------------------------
Last time I looked, the group rules included a section about "items for
sell"-- and Mike didn't seem like he was going to change it (when I
pointed it out.) He had a justification for it... or something.
Scott Pitzer


Re: Question re 12-Panel boxcars

Larry Jackman <Ljack70117@...>
 

I do not believe that either. How many 10s of thousand mold makers are there in this world. One could not stop the project> If one wont do it then find a second or third. The person doing the project is at fault.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@comcast.net
Boca Raton FL 33434
I was born with nothing and
I have most of it left.

On Jan 17, 2008, at 8:31 PM, SUVCWORR@aol.com wrote:


Tony, I can't argue with that. The die cutter is why we don't have the X29b
and X29d.

Rich


Re: Harold K. Vollrath

Rob Kirkham <rdkirkham@...>
 

But surely in the process all of that lovely fine detail that one could pick out of a chemical process print is lost on a digital print (unless they are going to huge resolution files)? No?

Rob Kirkham

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Burgess" <jack@yosemitevalleyrr.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 10:30 AM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: Harold K. Vollrath


I've long used a high-end professional lab for developing slide film, B/W
printing, etc. When I recently took some original negs in to have them make
prints, I discovered that they had gotten rid of all of the traditional
photography equipment...chemicals, trays, enlarger, etc. Now, if you want a
print from a negative, they scan the neg and make prints from the scans. In
fact, if you just want scans on a CD, it is cheaper to order prints and ask
for the scans to also be written to a CD for an extra nominal charge...

Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com




Yahoo! Groups Links





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Re: Question re 12-Panel boxcars

Larry Jackman <Ljack70117@...>
 

You may have hit it on the head. But I have never seen a mold or die that could not be changed.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@comcast.net
Boca Raton FL 33434
My parents did not raise
any stupid children. They
sent the ten of us to the
neighbors to play and then
moved. They raised the four
of us that found them.

On Jan 17, 2008, at 8:25 PM, SUVCWORR@aol.com wrote:


Larry,

I can only state what the die cutter told Dick Schweiger. Not my area of
expertise. Maybe the die cutter just didn't want to do it. I don't know.

Rich Orr

In a message dated 1/17/2008 8:05:20 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
Ljack70117@comcast.net writes:

see below


Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@comcast.net
Boca Raton FL 33434
I want to die in my sleep like
my grandfather did, not screaming
like the other people in his car.


On Jan 17, 2008, at 7:50 PM, SUVCWORR@aol.com wrote:


In a message dated 1/17/2008 12:10:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
mikado2206@hotmail.com writes:

In your post from a month ago, Mark you mentioned C&BT kits 10'-6"
IH,
12-pnl boxcar. Looking at Walthers "Reference" book, I see 3
different kit
numbers listed (193-13500, -10500, -11300) . . . it was my
understanding most of
C&BT's later efforts are more like "Blue-Box" wanna-be's. The
question is are
any of the kit number above the older style kit with separate
ladders,
grabs, etc? All I really want is the body shell/s.




NO.

C&BT on the advice of several well known modelers changed from
separate
grabs, ladders etc. to molded on parts by recuting the dies. Once
the ladders,
grabs etc, were cut into the dies,
Wrong. you can fill any cavities that you do not want. If Brass molds
you use soldier. If steel you can weld. Then you can re-cut the area
as you want it. In My machine shop experience I have saves several
dies and molds that way.
Some times you make a mistake and you cut the area out weld or
soldier a new block in the hole and start cutting again. Easy to fix
mistakes or change things.
there was no going back without making all
new dies. All boxcars produced since that fateful time, have the
details
molded on.

Rich Orr






**************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489






Yahoo! Groups Links



Sunshine kits...

Jack Burgess
 

Did I really write "...for sell"? My 8th grade English teacher would be
rolling in her grave...try "...for sale"!

Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com


Sunshine kits...

Jack Burgess
 

I've got 4 Sunshine kits (which I now realize are inappropriate for my
era/prototype) for sell on eBay. Search for seller "yvrr"....

Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com


ATSF Idler Cars

rdietrichson
 

Hey,
Does anyone have photos of the idler cars used by the Santa Fe at
Ferry Point, Richmond, CA? I have seen the Ft-N photo in the SF MOW
book, but I am not sure that these cars were used there in the early
50's era.
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Rick Dietrichson
Wilmington, NC


Re: Athearn C&NW 65 ft mill gon

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

One Question, Does anyone know for sure is the RMJ Feb 2006 issue is
available? The RMJ website doesn't list it. I'd like to get a copy of the
issue if possible.

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

----- Original Message -----


Re: Question re 12-Panel boxcars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Rich Orr wrote:
I can only state what the die cutter told Dick Schweiger.
Given some of the other claims and performances of Dick's die cutter, Rich, you need to consider the source.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Question re 12-Panel boxcars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Larry Jackman wrote:
Wrong. you can fill any cavities that you do not want . . . then you can re-cut the area
as you want it.
Larry's exactly right. This is how it works.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Question re 12-Panel boxcars

Larry Jackman <Ljack70117@...>
 

see below


Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@comcast.net
Boca Raton FL 33434
I want to die in my sleep like
my grandfather did, not screaming
like the other people in his car.


On Jan 17, 2008, at 7:50 PM, SUVCWORR@aol.com wrote:


In a message dated 1/17/2008 12:10:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
mikado2206@hotmail.com writes:

In your post from a month ago, Mark you mentioned C&BT kits 10'-6" IH,
12-pnl boxcar. Looking at Walthers "Reference" book, I see 3 different kit
numbers listed (193-13500, -10500, -11300) . . . it was my understanding most of
C&BT's later efforts are more like "Blue-Box" wanna-be's. The question is are
any of the kit number above the older style kit with separate ladders,
grabs, etc? All I really want is the body shell/s.




NO.

C&BT on the advice of several well known modelers changed from separate
grabs, ladders etc. to molded on parts by recuting the dies. Once the ladders,
grabs etc, were cut into the dies,
Wrong. you can fill any cavities that you do not want. If Brass molds you use soldier. If steel you can weld. Then you can re-cut the area as you want it. In My machine shop experience I have saves several dies and molds that way.
Some times you make a mistake and you cut the area out weld or soldier a new block in the hole and start cutting again. Easy to fix mistakes or change things.
there was no going back without making all
new dies. All boxcars produced since that fateful time, have the details
molded on.

Rich Orr



**************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489






Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: Harold K. Vollrath

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Jon Miller wrote:
At some time in history there will be no more chemicals, paper, and other items needed for printing.
Undoubtedly true, but not soon. For example, it is still possible to buy everything you need to set metal type and hand-print it--though it's not remotely commercial. It's just become a specialty market for a very few hobbyists. I strongly suspect the same will be true for "silver halide" photography throughout the lifetime of anyone on this list. But as Jon says, of course at SOME TIME it will go.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


another source of scale scrap

James Mischke <jmischke@...>
 

I have been progressing through a trio of Speedwitch Duryea
underframes for Red Caboose boxcars as B&O class M-26d.

Doing things in threes means either I learn from mistakes on the
first one, or make three consecutive mistakes for fleet uniformity.

My beedy eyes noticed that the resin flash between parts is
perfect sheet metal scrap. Thin. Stiff. Flat. Holds paint.
Does not cut flesh unless provoked.

The first 1000 rectangular shards were done by hand on a block
of wood with an exacto blade. Then I remembered I had a
Northwest Shortline "Chopper" and made a billion more.

I tried to keep the size down to two-three scale feet in any
dimension, processed scrap needs to fit into the furnace mouth.
I made some attempt at orthagonality, but not always.

I hope someone finds this idea inspiring.


Re: Speedwitch web site (Was Athearn C&NW 65 ft mill gon)

Don Worthy
 

I can get on the site but, I can't go to his other pages.
This had not been a problem except for the last couple of days.
Don Worthy
Ivey, Ga.

tbarney2004 <tbarney@hvc.rr.com> wrote:
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Gatwood, Elden J SAD "
<Elden.J.Gatwood@...> wrote:

Anybody else having no luck pulling up Ted's website? Been going on
several
days...



Elden Gatwood

I just tried here Elden, about 6:$5pm Thursday...came right up, no
hesitation.

Tim Barney






---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.


Re: another source of scale scrap

ogdentowebercanyon
 

Sounds like a good idea. Do you have a picture you can post?

Jason

James Mischke <jmischke@worldnet.att.net> wrote:


I have been progressing through a trio of Speedwitch Duryea
underframes for Red Caboose boxcars as B&O class M-26d.

Doing things in threes means either I learn from mistakes on the
first one, or make three consecutive mistakes for fleet uniformity.

My beedy eyes noticed that the resin flash between parts is
perfect sheet metal scrap. Thin. Stiff. Flat. Holds paint.
Does not cut flesh unless provoked.

The first 1000 rectangular shards were done by hand on a block
of wood with an exacto blade. Then I remembered I had a
Northwest Shortline "Chopper" and made a billion more.

I tried to keep the size down to two-three scale feet in any
dimension, processed scrap needs to fit into the furnace mouth.
I made some attempt at orthagonality, but not always.

I hope someone finds this idea inspiring.



Yahoo! Groups Links






---------------------------------
Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.


Re: Speedwitch web site (Was Athearn C&NW 65 ft mill gon)

tbarney2004
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Gatwood, Elden J SAD "
<Elden.J.Gatwood@...> wrote:

Anybody else having no luck pulling up Ted's website? Been going on
several
days...



Elden Gatwood

I just tried here Elden, about 6:$5pm Thursday...came right up, no
hesitation.

Tim Barney


Re: Harold K. Vollrath

Jeff Coleman
 

not to worry, B&W film photography is still very popular!
Jeff Coleman

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, MOFWCABOOSE@... wrote:

I was recently checking the Ilford website and they affirmed their
committment to the "silver halide process". I don't think that
Kodak dropped their paper
because it was no longer profitable. I think it is more likely that
it was no
longer profitable enough. Big companies tend to think that way,
unfortunately
for the rest of us.

John C. La Rue, Jr. [Still using the silver halide process]
Bonita Springs, FL


**************
Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay
in shape.

http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?
NCID=aolcmp00300000002489


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