Date   

Sunshine Meet in S Cal in March

Jim Williams <wwww5960@...>
 

Hi all.......Has anyone received any info on the Sunshine meet in Orange County on March 2nd?.......Best Jim Williams



____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs


Re: Chips

David Smith
 

If only I'd know... All those years of wandering the open range, I
apparently should have been photographing dung instead of rocks ;-)

FYI, there's no danger of confusing cow pies and antelope droppings - cow
pies are pie-sized. Antelopes, like deer make piles of much smaller pellets.

As for colors, there's also an aging factor. As I recall, fresh ones were a
slightly greenish brown (in cattle browsing Nevada sagebrush/grass) and they
got to be a very dark brown, almost black, as they dried out.

Dave Smith

On Feb 8, 2008 11:42 AM, Mike Brock <brockm@...> wrote:

Doug Harding notes:

And Mike if you are really interested, they raise cattle in Florida,
head
inland and look down, be careful where you walk. I don't think the color
of
manure has changed through the years. It is affected by what the cattle
are
eating.
But that's the point, Doug. Florida grasses are quite different from those
in Iowa and/or Wyoming. Wouldn't it be better to match to a chip in the
area
of actual use? To add to that, chip colors have probably changed over the
yrs due to changes in grass types and....well...there must be SOME reason
but I'm not sure if the color of such chips might change over time. We
obviously need to hear from someone more versed in chip matters than I am.

Spen Kellogg adds:

"Haven't you modeled those chips on the federal grazing land alongside
your track work climbing up and over Sherman Hill? <VBG> What color are
those "chips?"

Well, yes, I've tried to determine the colors from photos from the '50's
but
one should never trust to film with its color shifts, etc. And, besides,
there's those &%*($$ analopes that were and still are found on the Hill. I
can't tell if the chip is from analope or cattle from photos. In fact, I
think the only sure fire way would be to see them being produced. Tom
Madden
doesn't live too far from there...perhaps he could take a quick trip up
there and take some photos of both during production for the archives. I'd
hate for someone to discover that I had used the color of analope chips in
my stock cars. And, don't forget... The cars...once emptied of cattle
would
have these floor colors until cleaning. One BIG advantage with this
pursuit
of knowledge is that it will help in modeling the ground in the stock pen
at
Buford. Hmmm. Wonder if they cleaned that very often?

Mike Brock




Yahoo! Groups Links



--
David L. Smith
Da Vinci Science Center
Allentown, PA
http://www.davinci-center.org


Re: Chips

WaltGCox@...
 

In a message dated 2/8/2008 11:43:26 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
brockm@... writes:

<<But that's the point, Doug. Florida grasses are quite different from those
in Iowa and/or Wyoming. Wouldn't it be better to match to a chip in the area
of actual use? To add to that, chip colors have probably changed over the
yrs due to changes in grass types and....well...there must be SOME reason
but I'm not sure if the color of such chips might change over time. >>


There is also the effect of strontium 90 on chip color to be calculated and
considered along with the amount of atmospheric nuclear testing being done
during the time period being modeled. The ingestion of strontium 90 by cows was
a serious concern back in the 50's. Walter Cox



**************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music.
(http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025
48)


Re: Southern Pacific 800-Series Freights.

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Beckert, Shawn wrote:
I did some serious digging in the timetable collection last night. In addition to confirming that 833/834 were indeed Coast Line (Ventura Subdivision) freights, I discovered that the LA-Yuma trains that Tony mentioned are actually in a lower number series. They are 814, 816 818 and 820, and are eastbound only, Indio to Yuma. My reference is Los Angeles Division Timetable #203, 1-9-55.
Shawn, please see pages 70, 71 in Signor's _Beaumont Hill_ book. It does depend on era.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Southern Pacific 800-Series Freights.

Shawn Beckert
 

Paul Catapano asked:

Can anyone tell me what train 833/834 was?
These were eastward and westward freights between
LA and Yuma (and maybe further east,such as Tucson).
Paul, and Tony,

I did some serious digging in the timetable collection
last night. In addition to confirming that 833/834 were
indeed Coast Line (Ventura Subdivision) freights, I
discovered that the LA-Yuma trains that Tony mentioned
are actually in a lower number series. They are 814, 816
818 and 820, and are eastbound only, Indio to Yuma. My
reference is Los Angeles Division Timetable #203, 1-9-55.

Hope this helps,

Shawn Beckert


Re: Chips

Tom Madden <tgmadden@...>
 

Mike Brock regales us with . . . the large number of "analopes" (an
interesting misspelling considering the subject at hand - and
underfoot) . . .
Glad someone besides me noticed this <g>.

Tony Thompson
I can see it now, next January in Mike's layout room: Stock extra 4012
West, the "Fecal Flyer", Cheyenne to Laramie.....

Tom Madden


Re: Chips

Frank Fertitta <frank1357@...>
 

Great stuff!
And lots OF it!!!

Frank

Mike Brock <brockm@...> wrote:
Doug Harding notes:

And Mike if you are really interested, they raise cattle in Florida, head
inland and look down, be careful where you walk. I don't think the color
of
manure has changed through the years. It is affected by what the cattle
are
eating.
But that's the point, Doug. Florida grasses are quite different from those
in Iowa and/or Wyoming. Wouldn't it be better to match to a chip in the area
of actual use? To add to that, chip colors have probably changed over the
yrs due to changes in grass types and....well...there must be SOME reason
but I'm not sure if the color of such chips might change over time. We
obviously need to hear from someone more versed in chip matters than I am.

Spen Kellogg adds:

"Haven't you modeled those chips on the federal grazing land alongside
your track work climbing up and over Sherman Hill? What color are
those "chips?"

Well, yes, I've tried to determine the colors from photos from the '50's but
one should never trust to film with its color shifts, etc. And, besides,
there's those &%*($$ analopes that were and still are found on the Hill. I
can't tell if the chip is from analope or cattle from photos. In fact, I
think the only sure fire way would be to see them being produced. Tom Madden
doesn't live too far from there...perhaps he could take a quick trip up
there and take some photos of both during production for the archives. I'd
hate for someone to discover that I had used the color of analope chips in
my stock cars. And, don't forget... The cars...once emptied of cattle would
have these floor colors until cleaning. One BIG advantage with this pursuit
of knowledge is that it will help in modeling the ground in the stock pen at
Buford. Hmmm. Wonder if they cleaned that very often?

Mike Brock




Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Chips

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tom Madden wrote:
Mike Brock regales us with . . . the large number of "analopes" (an interesting mispelling considering the subject at hand - and underfoot) . . .
Glad someone besides me noticed this <g>.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Adding weight to a stock car

Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@...>
 

I like what Tony said. It should look full, but with some degree of ambiguity. If the load clearly looks like animals, then it will look wrong for half of the car's miles and when it's in the origin yard waiting for distribution.


Malcolm Laughlin, Editor 617-489-4383
New England Rail Shipper Directories
19 Holden Road, Belmont, MA 02478


Re: Three freight cars...

balryan@...
 

Frank,

On the Bamberger 50' box car from the photo Ive seen it looks to be a Freight Car Red. This off a color slide.

Ryan Ballard

-----Original Message-----
From: destron@...
To: stmfc@...
Sent: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 11:59 pm
Subject: [STMFC] Three freight cars...








I've found some photos online, and I'm wondering if anyone might be able
to provide some further details or information on these cars so as to
allow models to be made?

1. Kansas City, Kaw Valley reefer #208

I found two photos of Kaw Valley refrigerators from the Don Ross
collection. The one I would like to model is number 208. What the picture
shows is a truss-rod reefer with light coloured sides (yellow? white?),
darker coloured (red of some sort, I'd guess) kickboards, end and (I
think!) roof; the underframe and the arch bar trucks are also a darker
colour, but I can't tell if it would've been red or black. The lettering
seems darker than the end, so I'd guess it is black, apart from the
lighter-coloured (red?) "Kaw Valley Line" herald above the "VENTILATED
REFRIGERATOR SERVICE" inscription to the right of the door; to the left is
"KAW VALLEY REFRIGERATOR EXPRESS" on two lines over the road number. No
data is on the sides, but the photo of car #209, which looks fairly
similar (apart from the presence of ladder and grabs on the end, which 208
lacks), is marked CAPY 40000, but I can't make the rest out in the photo.

2. Chicago, North Shore & Milwaukee flat #1613

Another photo I found is of a long flat car (60'?) of the North Shore
Line. It has some funky braces on the side to I guess secure the load; in
the photo it is three North Shore Line-lettered short truck trailers. Any
dimensional information and colour information (my guess is black) would
be of great interest.

3. Bamberger 50' boxcar #800

Does anybody know what colour this was?

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC

-----
http://hydrorail.hostwq.net/index.html - Rails along the Fraser
http://hydrorail.rrpicturearchives.net/ - Rail Photos





________________________________________________________________________
More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com


Re: Chips

Tom Madden <tgmadden@...>
 

Mike Brock regales us with tales of colorful cow chips and the
confusion he experiences because the large number of "analopes" (an
interesting mispelling considering the subject at hand - and underfoot)
mix their food byproducts with those of the UP's cattle passengers,
then suggests:

Tom Madden doesn't live too far from there...perhaps he could take
a quick trip up there and take some photos of both during
production for the archives.
Of course. Laramie is always where I want to be in February. But I
should thing the chips, during production, would be frozen before they
hit the ground right now. Or blown past Chian.

Tom "always interested in the end product" Madden


Re: Adding weight to a stock car

Jerry Dziedzic
 

--- In STMFC@..., "Douglas Harding" <dharding@...> wrote:

Stockcars were typically shoveled out and then steam cleaned after
use. The
steam caused the paint to peel and the wood to fade. You might
consider a
grey for weathered wood with an off-white to represent the lime that
was
used for a disenfectant, but I concur on the flat black as far less
visible.

FWIW, I have begun shooting the interior of my stock cars with a medium
gray, weights and all. You'd be surprised how subtle the effect is; in
my opinion, gives the sides more visual "pop" than otherwise.

Jerry Dziedzic
Pattenburg, NJ


Re: Adding weight to a stock car

Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@...>
 

I use a thin layer of lead sheet on the floor, painted black like the floor. The lighting is rarely good enough to notice the floor inside a stock car and besides my eyes aren't small enough to see through the slats.

Malcolm Laughlin, Editor 617-489-4383
New England Rail Shipper Directories
19 Holden Road, Belmont, MA 02478


Chips

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Doug Harding notes:

And Mike if you are really interested, they raise cattle in Florida, head
inland and look down, be careful where you walk. I don't think the color of
manure has changed through the years. It is affected by what the cattle are
eating.
But that's the point, Doug. Florida grasses are quite different from those in Iowa and/or Wyoming. Wouldn't it be better to match to a chip in the area of actual use? To add to that, chip colors have probably changed over the yrs due to changes in grass types and....well...there must be SOME reason but I'm not sure if the color of such chips might change over time. We obviously need to hear from someone more versed in chip matters than I am.

Spen Kellogg adds:

"Haven't you modeled those chips on the federal grazing land alongside
your track work climbing up and over Sherman Hill? <VBG> What color are
those "chips?"

Well, yes, I've tried to determine the colors from photos from the '50's but one should never trust to film with its color shifts, etc. And, besides, there's those &%*($$ analopes that were and still are found on the Hill. I can't tell if the chip is from analope or cattle from photos. In fact, I think the only sure fire way would be to see them being produced. Tom Madden doesn't live too far from there...perhaps he could take a quick trip up there and take some photos of both during production for the archives. I'd hate for someone to discover that I had used the color of analope chips in my stock cars. And, don't forget... The cars...once emptied of cattle would have these floor colors until cleaning. One BIG advantage with this pursuit of knowledge is that it will help in modeling the ground in the stock pen at Buford. Hmmm. Wonder if they cleaned that very often?

Mike Brock


Re: Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler No. 3

Doug Brown <g.brown1@...>
 

I closed Outlook, reopened it and now the main page link works.

Doug

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Doug
Brown
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 10:29 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler No. 3



I got to the index page last night through the link on the aclsal.org main
page. Today that link does not work. The /index.htm is still on the link but
not on the page URL.

Doug Brown

-----Original Message-----
From: HYPERLINK "mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com"STMFC@...
[mailto:HYPERLINK "mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com"STMFC@...] On
Behalf Of ROB
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 7:40 AM
To: HYPERLINK "mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com"STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler No. 3

I had to go to the site and take the / index.htm off of the link.....

Rob

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1266 - Release Date: 2/8/2008
10:06 AM

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1266 - Release Date: 2/8/2008
10:06 AM







No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1266 - Release Date: 2/8/2008
10:06 AM



No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1266 - Release Date: 2/8/2008
10:06 AM


Re: Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler No. 3

Doug Brown <g.brown1@...>
 

I got to the index page last night through the link on the aclsal.org main
page. Today that link does not work. The /index.htm is still on the link but
not on the page URL.



Doug Brown

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of ROB
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 7:40 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler No. 3



I had to go to the site and take the / index.htm off of the link.....

Rob






No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1266 - Release Date: 2/8/2008
10:06 AM



No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1266 - Release Date: 2/8/2008
10:06 AM


Re: Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler No. 3

ROB <lawdog99999@...>
 

I had to go to the site and take the / index.htm off of the link.....

Rob


---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.


Re: Adding weight to a stock car

Spen Kellogg <spenkell@...>
 

Mike Brock wrote:
Flat black? Have you studied the...uh....floor colors of these cars? Wouldn't you be better off coming up with a...uh...chip color [ somewhat akin to "buffalo chips" that were used supposedly long ago in the west for camp fires ] from...uh...cattle to compare to? The question would depend, I suppose, on the type of cattle. Hereford Brown perhaps? Angus Dark Brown or maybe Long Horn Greenish Brown? Obviously, I'm not much on cattle but might not the color of "chips" depend upon the food source? I cannot imagine how one might come up with the "correct" color without a "chip" to match. Hmmm. Wonder where one might obtain such "chips" from the steam era?
Mike,

Haven't you modeled those chips on the federal grazing land alongside your track work climbing up and over Sherman Hill? <VBG> What color are those "chips?"

Regards, Spen Kellogg


Re: Adding weight to a stock car

Spen Kellogg <spenkell@...>
 

Garth G. Groff wrote:
As for loaded and unloaded cars, I wonder if you could load the car with some animals on one side, but put in some sort of baffle or curtain on the other (safely back from the slats). Then the cars would appear loaded from one side, and empty from the other. At the start of of an operating session, they could be turned for the appropriate loads/empties direction.
Except I think the most striking feature of an empty stock car is being able to see through to the other side.

Regards, Spen Kellogg


Re: Adding weight to a stock car

Douglas Harding <dharding@...>
 

Stockcars were typically shoveled out and then steam cleaned after use. The
steam caused the paint to peel and the wood to fade. You might consider a
grey for weathered wood with an off-white to represent the lime that was
used for a disenfectant, but I concur on the flat black as far less visible.

And Mike if you are really interested, they raise cattle in Florida, head
inland and look down, be careful where you walk. I don't think the color of
manure has changed through the years. It is affected by what the cattle are
eating. But think a green brown if fresh, or a grey brown if dried. Cow
chips are still used in throwing contests. They hold one every year at the
Iowa State Fair, the ladies do pretty good, the TV celebrities less so. But
they have to import the chips from elsewhere, Iowa gets to much rain and we
don't produce good solid cow chips.

Doug Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date: 2/7/2008
11:17 AM

127241 - 127260 of 196982