Date   

Re: UTLX Decals for a Lambert Type 103 Tankcar?

Jason Sanford <parkcitybranch@...>
 

Then that presents a problem. Can I paint and letter them for SHPX? Thanks.

Jason

Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

In fact, the available evidence indicates that there weren't ANY AC&F
Type 27s in the UTL fleet. I'm not aware of any photos, and there
are no cars listed in the 1952 UTL roster that could be AC&F Type 27s.

Richard Hendrickson






------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Need a Couple of Dimensions - Pre-WW2

Walter M. Clark
 

Guy Wilber sent me (on May 11, I'm just getting caught up on my email
inbox) off list a copy of the pages from the 1918 MCB listed
requirement for Safety Appliances. The measurements for brake step
supports were to be minimum 3/8" x 1-1/2". ARA general arrangement
drawings from the mid 1920s still had the same 3/8" x 1-1/2" with
running board supports of 1/2" x 1-1/2". The 1932 car I referenced
(below) did make the 1/2" x 1-1/2" standard for brake step as well as
running board supports (and later AAR designs) standard.

Thanks a bunch to Gene, Buy and the gang at RPC.

Time stopped in November 1941
Walter M. Clark
Pullman, Washington, USA

--- In STMFC@..., "wmcclark1980" <walterclark@...> wrote:

Gene Green replied off list, saying "FWIW on every car I have ever
measured that had a brake step the step was supported by 1/2" by 1
1/2" strap bent to shape." Also I found in Railway Prototype
Cyplopedia Volume 16, in the article on running boards and brake steps
(I know, kind of obvious, isn't it?) on page 69 drawings of "a Wood
Running Board Application to a 1932 A. R. A. Box Car" showing both the
brake step supports and the end of running board supports the same
1/2" by 1 1/2" strap Gene noted. So, unless some info shows up that
contradicts this, I'll try to make my straps even smaller <g>. And I
noticed I had a typo in my original message: the MCB recommended
against brake steps in 1879, not 1979. Oh, well....

Thanks,

Walter M. Clark
Time stopped in November 1941
Pullman, Washington, USA

--- In STMFC@..., "wmcclark1980" <walterclark@> wrote:

Thanks to Google Books I have their PDF of the 1906 Car Builders'
Dictionary. What I don't have is anything newer. I'd really
appreciate is if someone who can look in some source much closer to my
modeling date of November 1941 (or at least post-Federal Safety
Appliances) and could help me with a couple of dimensions.

In the 1906 CBD, starting on page 115 is the section "Protection of
Trainmen." Under Steps (what we generally call stirrup steps) it says
"Two good substantial steps, to be made of wrought iron, about 1/2 by
1-1/2 inches section...." In HO that works out to about 0.00574 by
0.01722" which is pretty close to a 0.007 sheet of shim steel I got a
while back from Small Parts, and I can use my jeweler's snips to cut
strips just under 0.020 wide, so I've got that pretty much nailed.

What I don't find is anywhere that specifies the section for the brake
shaft step nor the straps that support the brake step (though I did
find that in 1979 the MCB "discouraged" the use of brake steps). It
seems to me that the brake shaft step and brake step supports would be
the same cross-section as the stirrup steps, but I hope someone can
prove that assumption either right or wrong, and if wrong, what the
correct dimensions were.

Thanks in advance,

Walter M. Clark
Time stopped in November 1941
Pullman, Washington, USA


Re: Repainting Prototype STMFCs, Three Questions

Walter M. Clark
 

Bruce, Elden and all,

So it seems from the two comments about PRR X31A floor boards that
there was some wear on the inside of the car(expected), but the
underside of the floor was "smooth" (Bruce) or "relatively smooth"
(Elden) wood, with 1950s - 1960s "freight car color" that had
obviously been applied AFTER the car was assembled, shown by the lack
of paint on the floor boards where stringers blocked the spray, but
apparently intentionally applied everywhere else on the underside.
I'm surprised the bottom of the floor was "quite smooth," as Bruce
said. I would have thought spray of water, mud, etc., from the wheels
over the years would have damaged the wood to a certain extent. Of
course, we don't know how old the floor boards were.

So, for the underside of floor boards it seems to me I should have the
wood unpainted, but weathered, with the weathering becoming more
pronounced, from original construction through to the first
repainting. After that first repainting the underside should be the
same color as the rest of the car, or when the underframe was painting
a different color from the body, the floor should be the same color as
the underframe. And before anyone suggests it, I don't think I'm
going to mask off a few boards and paint the rest of the underside, to
represent a few boards being replaced after the car was last painted
(then again, I just might).

Elden wrote of the quick deterioration of rebuilt X31A box cars, which
touches on a point I'd like more information about: Just what surface
preparation would have been used before repainting STMFCs prior to
World War II? Even though labor was cheap, I can't imagine a bunch of
guys with sanding blocks, hand sanding the car sides, ends and roof,
but I just don't have any idea what would have been done.

And, to follow-up on what Richard wrote regarding specific dates when
prior data stenciling standards would have to be replaced, can someone
help me with exactly what my STMFC models representing November 1941
should NOT have or should have? Maybe direct me to photos, diagrams,
etc., or maybe email me off list a copy of the most current standard
for my modeling date of what my models, especially house cars and
gondolas, but flat cars, too, should have?

Thanks, for all the discussion up to now. This has been very interesting.

Time stopped in November 1941
Walter M. Clark
Pullman, Washington, USA


Re: UTLX Decals for a Lambert Type 103 Tankcar?

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jun 1, 2008, at 3:40 PM, Bruce Smith wrote:

I believe that this car is an AC&F type 27 (The type 103 is a much
broader
characterization and therefor much less helpful). [SNIP]
Of course, you'll also need to work from a photo, since I don't
think that
there were that many of these.





In fact, the available evidence indicates that there weren't ANY AC&F
Type 27s in the UTL fleet. I'm not aware of any photos, and there
are no cars listed in the 1952 UTL roster that could be AC&F Type 27s.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: UTLX Decals for a Lambert Type 103 Tankcar?

Bruce Smith
 

On Sun, June 1, 2008 1:07 pm, ogdentowebercanyon wrote:
Which UTLX decals are correct for a Lambert Type 103 Tankcar in HO
scale? Will the Speedwitch decals work for this car? Thanks.

Jason
Jason,

I believe that this car is an AC&F type 27 (The type 103 is a much broader
characterization and therefor much less helpful). Ted's decal sheet
directions say that is for types V, X, X-3 and ZX0 (radial course GATC
built cars). He indicates that a second sheet will be forthcoming for
other types. My guess is that you could piece together enough decals from
that sheet and or the Champ UTLX sheet to do one of these cars. Of
course, you'll also need to work from a photo, since I don't think that
there were that many of these.

Regards
Bruce

Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


Re: NE prototype modelers meet

Frank Greene
 

Kurt Laughlin wrote:
I've noticed that very few of the models at these meets are on any sort ofbase, even just a couple of pieces of sectional track. It this judging rules issue?
Judging? There's no judging at the Savannah, St.Louis, and Greensboro meets I've attended. These type meets are for sharing, exchange of ideas, and socializing with like minded modelers. I don't think it's a factor in NMRA freight car contest judging, either.

--

Frank Greene
Memphis, TN


Re: NE prototype modelers meet

Dave Owens
 

Tom Murray said he will be posting descriptions as time permits. I'm
posting descriptions in the comments section for those that I can
remember off the top of my head. I also took notes.

As others have noted, we don't judge at our meet. We want all modelers
of all skills to show their models. The goal is to encourage all to
get to work on their models.

Dave Owens



--
2009 New England/Northeast Prototype Modelers Meet
May 29-30, 2009, Collinsville, CT
www.neprototypemeet.com


Re: NE prototype modelers meet

Spen Kellogg <spenkell@...>
 

Kurt Laughlin wrote:
I've noticed that very few of the models at these meets are on any sort ofbase, even just a couple of pieces of sectional track. It this judging rules issue?
Kurt,

There is no judging going on at all, not even a most popular of the show. No rules whatsoever, other that putting your name beside them. Each modeler is free to display his or her models in whatever way they want. The purpose is to encourage the sharing of information and techniques. , Comradery, respect, and education. It was a good meet.

Spen Kellogg


Re: NE prototype modelers meet

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Kurt Laughlin wrote:
"I've noticed that very few of the models at these meets are on any
sort of base, even just a couple of pieces of sectional track. It this
judging rules issue?"

It is most certainly NOT a judging rules issue, as only one Prototype
Modelers meet that I know of has any sort of judging, and that's the
Sunshine Prototype Modelers Meet at Naperville, and it's not a
requirement at the PRRT&HS meet (where contest models are judged)
either.

Whether or not models are displayed on track is up to the individual
modeler. Personally, I don't bring track because (a) it's one more
thing to pack, especially if I'm flying to a meet and (b) it's a good
way to roll a model onto the floor, esepcially if you have to display
near the edge of a table.


Ben Hom


Re: NE prototype modelers meet

Kurt Laughlin <fleeta@...>
 

I've noticed that very few of the models at these meets are on any sort ofbase, even just a couple of pieces of sectional track. It this judging rules issue?

KL

----- Original Message -----
From: Schuyler Larrabee

Thanks to Tom Murray for posting these images. I hope that he will provide some ID for some of
these most interesting images. I'm particularly curious about the steam locomotive 'bash shown, but
also some of the freight cars.


NE prototype modelers meet

Schuyler Larrabee
 

http://www.pbase.com/tom_murray/ne_prototype_modelers_meet_2008&page=all

Thanks to Tom Murray for posting these images. I hope that he will provide some ID for some of
these most interesting images. I'm particularly curious about the steam locomotive 'bash shown, but
also some of the freight cars.

SGL
La vita e breve, mangiate prima il dolce!


UTLX Decals for a Lambert Type 103 Tankcar?

ogdentowebercanyon
 

Which UTLX decals are correct for a Lambert Type 103 Tankcar in HO
scale? Will the Speedwitch decals work for this car? Thanks.

Jason


Re: Milwaukee RD Single Sheath timeline

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jun 1, 2008, at 9:56 AM, tgregmrtn@... wrote:


Here may be a question addressed before? Did the Milwaukee ever
rebuild
their single sheathed cars with Steel boxes as so many railroads
did around the
second World War?





No. They replaced most of them with thousands of horizontal-rib
welded cars built between the mid-1930s and late 1940s.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: PRR Presentation

water.kresse@...
 

Bill,

Wish you had published this in 1989!

Al Kresse

-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Bill Lane" <bill@...>

Hi All,

I have uploaded a new PowerPoint presentation that can be downloaded from my
page here http://www.lanestrains.com/S_Scale_Today.htm Please give it a
look. It is 97 slides and 38 MB of "Modeling The Mighty PRR In S Scale
Today". I have had a similar page on my website for years, but this is
updated and includes many photos. If you do not have PowerPoint you can
download the free PPT viewer from my page as well.

I am giving the presentation this Saturday at the Phila Chapter PRR T & HS
Modelers Meeting. http://www.prrths.com/Phila_Upcoming.htm If you are going
to the meeting and can't wait to see the show, give it a download. Just
bring your first piece of rolling stock that you are going to sell in your
conversion movement to S Scale for show n tell. Otherwise if you are not
going to the meeting, this is your chance to see the presentation. You can
go if you live locally. Attendance is free but joining the chapter is
encouraged.

Finally, I have learned about making PowerPoint presentations the hard way.
Make the photos smaller FIRST. I had to do this show twice. It originally
ended up at 550 MB because I was using photos right from my camera at 4MB+.
That is acceptable for a few slides, but this turned out to be a large show.
My laptop was having some issues playing the original version. Replacing the
photos with smaller files does NOT significantly reduce the PPT file size.
It was not fun! FYI.........

I hope to see some new faces at the Modelers Meeting on Saturday. Any
questions, email me directly please.

Thank You,
Bill Lane

Modeling the Mighty Pennsy & PRSL in 1957 in S Scale since 1988

See my finished models at:
http://www.lanestrains.com
Winner of the 2007 Josh Seltzer NASG Website Award
Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!

Custom Train Parts Design
http://www.lanestrains.com/SolidWorks_Modeling.htm

PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded
(Trading is MUCH preferred)
http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls

***Join the PRR T&HS***
The other members are not ALL like me!
http://www.prrths.com
http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRTHS_Application.pdf

Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society
It's FREE (for now) http://www.prslhs.com
Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL



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Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: Milwaukee RD Single Sheath timeline

al_brown03
 

The 1/53 ORER lists 737 cars in this series. The date and the swift
disappearance of the series lead me to wonder: did these cars receive
AB brakes?

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


--- In STMFC@..., Ed Hawkins <hawk0621@...> wrote:


On Jun 1, 2008, at 10:51 AM, George wrote:

In the excellant group file on USRA single sheath boxcars it
shows
the Milwaukee Rd boxcars ending in the mid-fifties. In the
Essential
Freight Cars: 3 article in RMC it notes "from the 1920's through
the
1960's."
I notice two different styles of boxcars with the ends being the
easy difference. Does this explain the difference in end dates
for
these cars or is there a different explanation? I'm wanting to
justify one in 1958.
Thanks,
George Courtney
George,
Milwaukee Road's 4,000 USRA SS box cars were numbered 700000-
703999.
The 1/52 ORER lists 1,414 cars in service in this series. The 4/55
ORER
does not list the series. Someone having ORERs between these dates
can
better define the decline in numbers to determine when the last
cars
were removed from interchange service, but in any event there's no
justification for one in 1958.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Milwaukee RD Single Sheath timeline

Ed Hawkins
 

On Jun 1, 2008, at 10:51 AM, George wrote:

In the excellant group file on USRA single sheath boxcars it shows
the Milwaukee Rd boxcars ending in the mid-fifties. In the Essential
Freight Cars: 3 article in RMC it notes "from the 1920's through the
1960's."
I notice two different styles of boxcars with the ends being the
easy difference. Does this explain the difference in end dates for
these cars or is there a different explanation? I'm wanting to
justify one in 1958.
Thanks,
George Courtney
George,
Milwaukee Road's 4,000 USRA SS box cars were numbered 700000-703999.
The 1/52 ORER lists 1,414 cars in service in this series. The 4/55 ORER
does not list the series. Someone having ORERs between these dates can
better define the decline in numbers to determine when the last cars
were removed from interchange service, but in any event there's no
justification for one in 1958.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Milwaukee RD Single Sheath timeline

George Courtney
 

In the excellant group file on USRA single sheath boxcars it shows
the Milwaukee Rd boxcars ending in the mid-fifties. In the Essential
Freight Cars: 3 article in RMC it notes "from the 1920's through the
1960's."
I notice two different styles of boxcars with the ends being the
easy difference. Does this explain the difference in end dates for
these cars or is there a different explanation? I'm wanting to
justify one in 1958.
Thanks,
George Courtney


ADMIN:Re: Re: New Standards for Freight Cars Models

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Jared Harper writes:

"To muddy the waters, how about the women who use "guys" in the context
of "Hey, you guys." when addressing other women?"

I don't know about that, but I DO know that this thread has been terminated...see my message of May 29 at 2:11 PM. Obviously this subject has nothing whatever to do with frt cars and is entirely out of scope.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: Modified 1937 AAR Boxcars

Tim O'Connor
 

Sunshine still has mini-kits for the square corner versions.
At least, they had some at Naperville last fall.

Tim O'Connor

The IM model can reasonably
accurately represent nearly all cars listed in the roster. Cars built
for Erie and EJ&E are considered exceptions and cannot accurately be
modeled using the IM kit without making major changes.
Brian,
Sorry for the extra bandwidth, but after sending my reply I realized
that the IM model (having ends with round corners) cannot be used to
accurately represent prototype cars with square-corner 5/5 Dreadnaught
Ends. Thus, I revise my statement by limiting it to nearly all cars
listed in the roster having round-corner ends, which excludes cars for
Soo Line, DSS&A, and some IC cars.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: USG/Tichy Tank Car Articles, RMJ 1990-91; FPLX 1027?

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Thanks for the expansion and clarification.

Regards,
Steve Hile

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...>
Sent: May 31, 2008 5:06 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] USG/Tichy Tank Car Articles, RMJ 1990-91; FPLX 1027?

On May 31, 2008, at 10:29 AM, shile@... wrote:

The USQX cars are a bit more problematic. The builder's photo in
RMJ 10/90 shows an ACF builder's mark, but the underframe looks
more like a General American, in that it lacks, completely, the sub
sills from the truck bolster to the car ends that the Type 27
underframe clearly show in the FPLX photo below. The tank saddles
are identical, however. Could it be that this is a case of reusing
parts of older underframes to speed the process in wartime?

Fun speculating, isn't it.









Perhaps, but in this case let's not speculate where we have
information. The Quartermaster Corps purchased 285 USG-A 10K gal.
tank cars from AC&F ca. 1943. These differed from the USG-A type
cars AC&F built for its own Shippers Car Line leasing subsidiary in
several respects, most notably in the underframes, which in all
photos of these cars appear to be of similar (though not identical)
design as those on the GATC cars purchased by the QMC at about the
same time. Those underframes were built new for the USQX cars in
question. AC&F was, of course, perfectly capable of building such
underframes if that's what the QMC wanted, and apparently that's what
was specified. Note that the underframes for AC&F tank cars weren't
built at the Milton, PA tank car plant; they were built at the
Berwick, PA freight car plant and sent to Milton on their own wheels
to have tanks applied.

Richard Hendrickson




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