Date   

Re: NYC Milk Car 6460

Steve Lucas <stevelucas3@...>
 

January, 2004 Trains magazine has a Chard Walker photo on page 49 of
a damaged NYC express car (that looks similar to one of these milk
cars) at Summit, California.

The caption reads--"Daughters Judy and Joy were born in '56 and '57.
They're standing on May 1, 1961 in the end of a wood New York Central
express car torn apart by too much drawbar force. Normally just the
coupler knuckle breaks, but in this case the entire end came out of
the car!"

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., "cvsne" <mjmcguirk@...> wrote:

--- In STMFC@..., "armand" <armprem@> wrote:

Marty and group,The NYC and Rutland milk cars were
essentially
the same
car,with some minor refinements.Since the Rutland was under
NYC 's
control
many of the same designs were used including,locomotives ,rolling
stock and
buildings.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
Hi Armand,

Aware of the similarities between the NYC and Rutland cars in
question. I found the Sunshine flyer last night (which is a
preliminary draft for the upcoming Naperville meet) - in the list
of
new models for 2009 it includes a "NYC Express Reefer" and
a "NYC/CV
Milk Car". I think the "CV" is a typo - as there are no
similarities between the CV's milk cars and the NYC's. I think it
should read "NYC/Rutland" milk car, which would make more sense.

Someone mentioned these cars were used in express service to the
West Coast - I learned that a long time ago when Andy Sperandeo
asked me if I knew of any models of these NYC milk cars . . . it
was
the first and only time Andy has ever built a milk car (that I know
of . . .!)

Marty


Rutland 2700-series Flat Cars - Builders/1920s Photos

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Looking for a pointer to either a builders photo or 1920s in-service
photos of the Rutland 2700-series flatcars. I'm cleaning out the stash
of Athearn flat cars and am planning to do a couple for a friend's 1926
layout. Thanks in advance!


Ben Hom


Re: paper density

Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@...>
 

As far as which roads handle the traffic in and out of the paper company, that's something Tim and I can discuss with our club. But Tim does stimulate a few thoughts that are pertinent to this list.
Posted by: timboconnor@... > The whole point of the pulp-->paper mill is that it produces fine quality, coated papers. A kraft mill or newsprint mill would be far larger, consume vast quantities of sulfuric acid and other chemicals, and would not receive pulp but would receive vast amounts of pulpwood and wood chips.
------------------------------

I'd overlooked that, but it sure makes sense. Some of the paper is being shipped to a publishing company on our own railroad. So are there any ingredients that might arrive by rail in tank cars for the pulp to quality paper process.
===================

> The mill is located on the Southern railway, and the C&LE only brings inbound loads of pulp from New England in 40 ft box cars. The Southern brings in kaolin and takes out the finished products.
----------------

The mill is in one of the corners of the junction of the Southern and C&LE railroads. That would indicate that the paper company, although it is switched by the SOU, could use either route for its outbound loads. That's one of the reasons that big industries wanted to locate where they could have access to two or more line haul carriers.

But the origin of the pulp is an interesting question. I was assuming the pulp would come from somewhere in the southeast. But then it may be that the pulp needed is of the sort that comes only from spieces of trees that grow in cooler climates. Was much pulp from NH and NE shipped to Virginia and other states that far from Maine ?

That would give us a good reason to have a bunch of MEC and B&M box cars.



Malcolm Laughlin, Editor 617-489-4383
New England Rail Shipper Directories
19 Holden Road, Belmont, MA 02478


Re: Bridges...and moving to/from site

Bruce Smith
 

On Jul 1, 2008, at 11:13 PM, PBowers wrote:
Also, When moving bridges on rail cars in the steam era, was it more
common to move the bridge in a gondola with flatcars to take care of
overhang or using all flatcars?
Peter,

It depends...
- what cars did the railroad have available in their fleet?
- what were the specs of the bridge? (weight, length, width)

Certainly, many railroads reused bridges and for smaller ones, transported them intact from site to site. Note that through girder bridges would need to be transported on their sides for clearance reasons. Larger bridges were usually disassembled, transported and reassembled on site. That latter traffic pattern would be nearly indistinguishable from new bridge pieces being shipped other that the point of origin differing and perhaps the old bridge being weathered (although it is highly likely that it would get repainted in the process). Girders up to about 60' in length were often transported in 65' mill gons. Longer girders were still transported in the same type of car, but with idler flat cars at either end. In this case, the girder was supported in the middle with the ends free. Alternatively, girders could also be loaded onto flat cars such as the PRR F22 "gun" flats, where the ends of the girders were supported and pivoted on the flat cars and if the girder was long enough, another flat car acted as an idler between the two carrying the load.

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/index.pl/bruce_f._smith2

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
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Re: pulp & paper

Jeff Coleman
 

There are two products that come to mind. first is "white liquor" the
caustic liquid that breaks down the wood fibers to make the pulp and a
by-product, "black liquor" which is the liquid separated from the
pulp. Both are transported in tank cars.
Jeff Coleman

--- In STMFC@..., "John Hile" <john66h@...> wrote:

--- In STMFC@..., Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@> wrote:

I think we've covered the box car side pretty well. But what about
tank cars. I'm supposing there are some used in the pulp to paper
process that would arrive in tank cars. What is known about that ?






Malcolm,


"Standard Tank Car Journeys" ca. 1931 notes the following tank car
commodities as utilized in the manufacture of paper: caustic soda,
chlorine bleach (bleaching paper pulp), alcohol, rosin (coating),
paraffin (waxing paper).

As I understand it, the type of chemicals you need depends on the type
of mill and type of paper.

There were several discussions on this group in the past regarding
paper mill chemicals and mill types. Search the archives with "paper
caustic" and you should get to them - I just did.

Hope this helps,

John Hile
Blacksburg, VA


Re: pulp & paper

John Hile <john66h@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@...> wrote:

I think we've covered the box car side pretty well. But what about
tank cars. I'm supposing there are some used in the pulp to paper
process that would arrive in tank cars. What is known about that ?






Malcolm,


"Standard Tank Car Journeys" ca. 1931 notes the following tank car
commodities as utilized in the manufacture of paper: caustic soda,
chlorine bleach (bleaching paper pulp), alcohol, rosin (coating),
paraffin (waxing paper).

As I understand it, the type of chemicals you need depends on the type
of mill and type of paper.

There were several discussions on this group in the past regarding
paper mill chemicals and mill types. Search the archives with "paper
caustic" and you should get to them - I just did.

Hope this helps,

John Hile
Blacksburg, VA


Re: paper density

Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@...>
 

First, my apology to the group for a big misstatement that should have been obvious to me and was based on a calculation error. 3700 cubic feet of paper at 60# / cu.ft. is 111 tons.
If you had rolls of the right diameter and height to completely fill that car, using a factor of pi/4 to account for the circular rolls, you get about 80 tons.
-----------------------------

, it looks like 50 tons of paper
would reuquire a box car of about 5555 cubic feet - much more than
any car of the 50's. Can someone tell me what were the typical
inside dimensions of 40 ft' box cars of that period.
=========
Canadian National Railways and Ontario Northland, both major players in the paper business, utilized their large fleet of 10' (3712 cu. ft.) and 10'6" (3900 cu. ft.) inside height cars for this purpose (CNR would have used more of the latter, whereas ONR only had 10' IH cars). It would be 1964 before CN moved to 50' cars of 11' IH/5092 cu. ft., which became the new standard for this service.
--------------

But what about in the 50's when ordinary box cars had 50 tons capacity ? When did they start to use 70 ton cars ? Rolls of four foot wide 60# paper stacked two high would put 72 tons on a 10 x 40 floor area if the rolls had a diameter of 3'4" with zero space between rolls.


Malcolm Laughlin, Editor 617-489-4383
New England Rail Shipper Directories
19 Holden Road, Belmont, MA 02478


Re: New Tahoe Truck

Manfred Lorenz
 

--- In STMFC@..., Denny Anspach <danspach@...> wrote:

For those interested, here is some reproducible data on which I rely
on selecting Reboxx replacement wheelsets for selected Accurail and
Tahoe trucks. My goal is an amalgam of maximum rollability, and
minimum axle end play.
Aha, Denny I see you are adding a new requirement to the sets of
quality issues of trucks and wheelsets. ;-)

Since I have no layout to make my stuff roll only endplay is what I am
looking for. OTOH every layout here would never reach those gigantic
dimensions an attic in California presents to run long trains. So the
issue of rollability is a somewhat secondary thought.

I found that the internal form of the trucksides' bearings are a major
factor of how endplay and maximum rollability are interacting. It the
very end (tip) of the bearing hole has seen some wear it becomes wider
than the nominal cone is was produced with in the first place. That
means the tip of the axle is not riding on the cone but a point
somewhat closer to the wheel. Which makes the diameter of the axle
larger than the (not) ideal point at the end of the axles. Therefore
more resistance if endplay is reduced to the minimum and more
rollability if the axle becomes shorter. In the latter case the tip
comes out of the widenend area at the end of the bearing and gets back
onto the regular cone. This in turn makes the axle touch with its tip
again reducing roll resistance.

I wonder how much the rollability factors in in the pulling ability of
the loco. Would a "standard" Athearn Genesis F9 be able to pull
considerably more cars as one will put behind it anyway? I think US-
practice is to use multiple unit engines in this case. With other
words: will the rollability improvement have a real effect on trains'
length that are run on model layouts?

What is the experience here?

Manfred


Re: paper density

Ian Cranstone
 

On 1-Jul-08, at 11:34 AM, Malcolm Laughlin wrote:
Thanks Don and Russ for the input. From their density information and other stuff that I've found, it looks like 50 tons of paper would reuquire a box car of about 5555 cubic feet - much more than any car of the 50's. Can someone tell me what were the typical inside dimensions of 40 ft' box cars of that period.
Canadian National Railways and Ontario Northland, both major players in the paper business, utilized their large fleet of 10' (3712 cu. ft.) and 10'6" (3900 cu. ft.) inside height cars for this purpose (CNR would have used more of the latter, whereas ONR only had 10' IH cars). It would be 1964 before CN moved to 50' cars of 11' IH/5092 cu. ft., which became the new standard for this service.

Ian Cranstone
Osgoode, Ontario, Canada
lamontc@...
http://freightcars.nakina.net
http://siberians.nakina.net


Bridges...and moving to/from site

PBowers
 

Just a quick note to let members know there is a Bridge list at <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BridgeModeling>.

Also, When moving bridges on rail cars in the steam era, was it more common to move the bridge in a gondola with flatcars to take care of overhang or using all flatcars?

Peter



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Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car

Rich Yoder
 

Thank you Rob, I think you are right.

Sincerely, Rich Yoder
7 Edgedale Court
Wyomissing PA 19610-1913
610-678-2834 after 6:00PM est until 10:00PM
www.richyodermodels.com

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Rob Kirkham
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 10:59 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car

All I can say is that with the Tank Cars book example, the GNRHS
Reference
Sheet and the general appearance of the car, it looks like an approx.
12000
gallon AC&F type 11 tank car. What it is - that I don't know, although
I
know how I'd guess.

Rob Kirkham
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Yoder" <oscale48@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 4:55 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car


Ok Guys,
You have me confused.
Is it a 12,000 gallon type 11 car built by ACF?
Or something else?

Sincerely, Rich Yoder
7 Edgedale Court
Wyomissing PA 19610-1913
610-678-2834 after 6:00PM est until 10:00PM
www.richyodermodels.com




-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf
Of
Brian Leppert
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 12:22 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car

Last Wednesday I wrote:
--- In STMFC@..., "Brian Leppert" <b.leppert@...> wrote:

Rob,
It's from GN series X1125-X1164, built by PSC, 1913. 12,000
gallons.
This info from Great Northern Railway Historical Society's Reference
Sheet
No. 211.
I screwed up. The Reference Sheet states ACF, not PSC.

Sorry,
Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV



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Re: Farmers' Institutes

Walter M. Clark
 

--- In STMFC@..., "George A. Walls" <atsf1226@...> wrote:

Tom,
There is more information on this program in a book, primarily dealing
with CB&Q, I believe the name of the book is Granger Country. I think
you will find that these program where funded by USDA and the state
land grant univ. Who also sponser the County Agents in each county.
These position exist today in most agricultureal states and include not
only farming and livestock production but also visits to the home and
taught women how to cook, and preserve foods, etc:. These programs
were real popular during the depression and contiued through the post
war years. Not only as a result of the depression but also the Dust
Bowl period that affected a number of the Mid-Western states. New
farming method were being taught to keep the top soil from blowing
away.
George A Walls
formally of Treynor, Iowa


Thank you all for your informative responses. It is interesting to
me that a road as small as the CGW and presumably with a limited income
commensurate with its mileage and position among the Granger roads also
had a program to encourage agricultural development.

Tom


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
George and Tom,

I wasn't there when the SP and UC planned and implemented the
Agricultural Demonstration Trains; I can only repeat what Richard Orsi
said in his book "Sunset Limited." This is from page 299 in chapter
11 "Evangel train."

"The enterprise was conceived of as a veritable "university on
wheels," as it became popularly known, or as university president (The
University of California) Benjamin Ide Wheeler renamed it, "an Evangel
train bringing to the farms of the state the gospel of a better
agriculture." The College of Agriculture at Berkeley and Davis was to
determine the train's topics and general curriculum, develop the
lectures, outfit the special display and demonstration cars, and,
along with the (California) Horticultural Commission, provide most of
the educators and experts. The Southern Pacific was to plan the
itinerary and schedule, work with community business and farm
organizations and local rail agents to publicize the visits, furnish
locomotives, redesigned freight, passenger, sleeping, and dining cars,
equipment, food and supplies, and train crew, and, of course, pay the
bills."

So at least in the case of the SP the railroad picked up the tab, as
it did in many ways to support and expand agriculture beginning in the
mid-1860s with the establishment of the first stations and other
facilities throughout its wide area. After all, when you are
receiving a large amount of land as part of the government railroad
construction subsidy, it only makes sense to devote as much effort as
possible to advance agriculture, thereby leading to sales of the land
and crops to transport. It only made good business sense.

Time stopped in November 1941
Walter M. Clark
Pullman, Washington, USA


Re: refrigerator car hatches

Jerry <jrs060@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Marty (not signing his full name) wrote:
Hi group: I not that some refrigerator cars moved with the hatches
partially opened. I understand that some produce needed to be
ventilateded (cool) but not frozen and some were heated in winter to
prevent freezing. But what were the actual regulations contolling
hatch opening?
Shipper could choose--there were no "regulations," though there
was a tariff which specified charges for various services. This is
explained further in the PFE book.
Tony you are of course correct here, but let me add just some
more detail to help the group understand this a little better. The
tariff that covered this was the Perishable Freight, Carriers
Protective Service Tariff. A Shipper could elect to use it for his
shipment, at a charge of course, to protect the lading from
temperature changes by specifying "CPS". This obligated the
carriers enroute to adjust the the venting, and or icing, to
achieve the required optimum temperatures to protect the
loading, what ever it was.
Happiness, Jerry Stewart

Woodstock, Illinois


Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car

Rob Kirkham <rdkirkham@...>
 

All I can say is that with the Tank Cars book example, the GNRHS Reference Sheet and the general appearance of the car, it looks like an approx. 12000 gallon AC&F type 11 tank car. What it is - that I don't know, although I know how I'd guess.

Rob Kirkham

----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Yoder" <oscale48@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 4:55 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car


Ok Guys,
You have me confused.
Is it a 12,000 gallon type 11 car built by ACF?
Or something else?

Sincerely, Rich Yoder
7 Edgedale Court
Wyomissing PA 19610-1913
610-678-2834 after 6:00PM est until 10:00PM
www.richyodermodels.com




-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Brian Leppert
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 12:22 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car

Last Wednesday I wrote:
--- In STMFC@..., "Brian Leppert" <b.leppert@...> wrote:

Rob,
It's from GN series X1125-X1164, built by PSC, 1913. 12,000 gallons.
This info from Great Northern Railway Historical Society's Reference
Sheet
No. 211.
I screwed up. The Reference Sheet states ACF, not PSC.

Sorry,
Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV



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Re: New Tahoe Truck

Denny Anspach <danspach@...>
 

For those interested, here is some reproducible data on which I rely on selecting Reboxx replacement wheelsets for selected Accurail and Tahoe trucks. My goal is an amalgam of maximum rollability, and minimum axle end play.

The Accurail tests have been repeated several times over the years, and they are remarkably consistent.

Maximum rollability is a pretty obvious concept, but the effect of excessive end play is perhaps more subtle: excessive end play can cause significant problems with coupler centering, particularly with scale-sized couplers; and because of the relationships of the conical axle ends and the conical bearing holes into which they fit, excessive end play can also cause a significant drop or dip in coupler height, in addition to the unfortunate visual effects of just wallowing along like a drunken sailor.

Accurail's Bettendorf trucks are reportedly produced from four different molds (#s 1-4 stamped on underside of bolster ), which creates some natural variability. However, although the 1.010" axle sets do provide superior rollability (an average of 21 or 22 rolls on the Rolltester, scale 1-26), there is far too much irritating end play for my taste. However, by just substituting the Reboxx 1.025" axles instead, the end play is reduced to only a few thousandths, without a whit less rollability. A fine combination of truck and wheel set.

Tahoe trucks: I have only tested the Dalman two level, and Brian is right on: the Reboxx 1.010" axles provide an ideal mix of maximum rollability (21 rolls) and minimum sideplay. You can use a 1.015" axle, but there is a significant drop off in rollability (17), and ditto for 1.005 or 7" axles, with side play now added in.

Denny


Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Re: Farmers' Institutes

Walter M. Clark
 

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

California and the other western states also had strong "progressive"
and anti-railroad viewpoints. Remember "The Octopus?" What was
interesting from "The Sunset Limited" was how newspapers would print
vitriolic pieces against the SP while at the same time lauding the
SP/UC farm demonstration train programs, even in the same issue.
So? The SP wasn't a monolith and wasn't so perceived, though
there has been a strain of historian (the "robber baron" cult) which
has tried to so insist.
It's worth reminding readers of this list that "The Octopus" was
bogus as history and by no means revealed the popular perception of the
railroad--as was clear in contemporary book reviews. OF course those
who like to excoriate railroads tend to think "The Octopus" was a kind
of Gallup poll of public opinion. As if.
It's of course true that California elected a strong Progressive
governor (Hiram Johnson) and enacted a number of Progressive political
reforms, but the railroads generally and the SP in particular had
became a "straw man" in politics by that time--fun to sling mud at, but
no longer a real player politically.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
I had a boss one time who would say "We're not making it up, only
reporting it." I was only passing on what I read in "Sunset Limited."

Time stopped in November 1941
Walter M. Clark
Pullman, Washington, USA


Re: New Tahoe Truck

Walter M. Clark
 

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Walter Clark1980 wrote:
To summarize (if my spreadsheet got everything),
Bettendorf T-section 26,165
ASF T-section 10,764
Columbia Steel T-section 1,253
Symington T-section 100
Tennessee CI&R T-section 500
I gather this doesn't include the gondolas and stock cars in my
Volume 1, nor (of course) the hoppers and tank cars from my
not-quite-yet-issued Volume 5 on those car types. But I think the trend
in numbers is not going to change much.
There is the further problem, Walter, that these designs evolved
with time. For example, compare pages 72 and 94 in my Volume 1 on SP
gondolas and stock cars--and this is just Bettendorf. The _Car Builder
Cyc_ volumes are helpful, but not every design of every manufacturer
was pictured in them, even if you have a complete set available for
examination at a local archive. For more details, additional pictorial
info was in the ads in _Railway Age_ and in _Railway Mechanical
Engineer_ among other journals.
In my opinion it is not useful to ask (or try to answer) "which
model truck comes closest" unless you have an exact prototype with
which to compare. Some modelers, of course, will be content with
anything which looks like a T-section <g>--obviously I'm not referring
to Walter Clark in that comment.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
That's right, Tony. I want all the errors in my models to be there
because I didn't execute something correctly, not because I made the
wrong choice in some part.

Time stopped in November 1941
Walter M. Clark
Pullman, Washington, USA


Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car

Rich Yoder
 

Ok Guys,
You have me confused.
Is it a 12,000 gallon type 11 car built by ACF?
Or something else?

Sincerely, Rich Yoder
7 Edgedale Court
Wyomissing PA 19610-1913
610-678-2834 after 6:00PM est until 10:00PM
www.richyodermodels.com

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Brian Leppert
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 12:22 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GN1152 - type 11 tank car

Last Wednesday I wrote:
--- In STMFC@..., "Brian Leppert" <b.leppert@...> wrote:

Rob,
It's from GN series X1125-X1164, built by PSC, 1913. 12,000 gallons.
This info from Great Northern Railway Historical Society's Reference
Sheet
No. 211.
I screwed up. The Reference Sheet states ACF, not PSC.

Sorry,
Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV



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Re: ADMIN: Bridges Terminated

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Tony Thompson says:

"What makes sense to me is to restrict any bridge discussions to
their applicability to freight car design."

Yes. The termination is with regard to stand alone bridge discussion. Discussion about "bridge" designs used in frt cat construction, just as discussion regarding the advantages of wood vs steel, various brake systems or end designs in frt car design is within scope.

"BTW, Mike, I bet those conductors CROSSED plenty of bridges,
without which their runs would have been WAY shorter . . . <g>

True enough...but luckily for you...my frt conductor book covers Laramie to Green River. Had it covered only Sherman Hill...it would not be true. Nary a true bridge in sight...much to my chagrin <G>. Bridges are neat things...just not on a frt car group.

Mike Brock


Painting & Weathering Detail Castings with Dave Revelia DVD Ready for Pre-Order

smason22000 <smason2@...>
 

Good afternoon folks,

I've begun taking orders on my latest DVD, "Painting and Weathering Detail Castings with
Dave Revelia".

This 60-minute DVD covers Dave's award-winning techniques on several types of castings
including barrels, trash cans, wooden shelving, workbenches, tin roofing and more. If
you've had the opportunity to see Dave's work in person, you know what an incredible
modeler he is. Dave demonstrates his techniques, and also shows you the many non-
model railroad-related products that he incorporates into his modeling.

The DVD also includes a bonus feature, "How They Did That". In it, Dave demonstrates his
technique for creating a cobblestone road.

The DVD is $29.95 plus $3.00 domestic postage, and $6.00 international postage. I expect
them to ship on August 1st.

As always, you can order direct through my website, or send a check or money order
made out to me at:

9 Lee Street
Franklin, MA 02038

Thanks,

Scott Mason

www.scottymason.com

121781 - 121800 of 195610