Re: Multi-fuel farm tractors.
Donald B. Valentine
According to my 1938-1939 John Deere "Farmer's Pocket Ledger" from
the long defunct Munson Store in Morrisville, VT it appears that the entire John Deere line in that period was available with engines that burned either gasoline or kerosene. I learned to mow on a 1938 John Deere Model B that I can well remember, and it is still in existence. One opened a petcock on each of the two cylinders to reduce the compression, made sure the fuel valve was set for gasoline and everything else was set before giving the flywheel a spin. After warming up a minute or two the petcocks were closed and the fuel was switched over to kerosene. This was a tricyle wheel arranged tractor but could be had with a single front wheel for certain row crops, down to 16 in. between rows, or an adjustable wide front end allowing a spacing from 56 to 80 in. The latter arrangement was really beginning to take hold in the years following WW II to the point where I don't recall ever seeing a Ford tractor with a tricyle wheel arrangement. The John Deere Model B, Farmall H and Ford 8N were the most common farm tractors in use in northern Vermont around 1950 with a few Case and even fewer Allis-Chalmers to be seen as well. The Oliver line began to sow up about that time and Ferguson picked up quickly on its own after Henry and Harry had their famous falling out. IMHO Ferguson made the success of the Ford tractor line, though it continued quite well after the split. But Ford never offered any equipment worth owning to use with their tractors other than plows. Some Canadian tractors such as the Cockshutt were seen on occasion as well. How all this equipment arrived was of equal interest, and more appropriate for this list. My late friend Phil Hastings chased and photographed the local freight on the B&M's Concord to Claremont, N.H. line on day about this time with a full load of six new Farmall H's of M's on a flat car. The tractor loaded flat car shows up in two or three photos in his book on the B&M and I am fortunate to have others from that day's outing here. By the time my memory really began the Munson Store had turned the John Deere dealership in Morrisville over to Wards and the Salls Bros. has an International Harvester dealership together with their Studebaker dealership in the village as well. Given the popularity of Studebaker trucks on Lamoille County farms at that time this must have been a good arrangement. Over in Cambridge, on the west end of the county, T. J. McGovern had a large International Harvester dealership in combination with his large grain business. When the Burlington & Lamoille Branch of the Central Vermont Rwy. was abandoned in 1938 the St.J. & L.C. took over about two miles of it to serve a large saw mill in Jeffersonville. Concerned about his ability to receive grain and farm machinery, McGovern took over another five miles over which he moved single cars with a farm tractor as his sole source of motive power! Just how long that lasted I'm not sure but know a few oldtimers who still recall it. Ford farm equipment in those years seems to have come mostly from Ed Collins in Waterbury until he closed in the late 1950's. That was the beginning of a trend that saw farmers traveling further and further to go to their farm equipment dealer. Indeed, L. W. Greenwood & Sons, in East Randolph, VT is the only farm machinery dealership in Vermont which I can recall that remains in the same family, or much as it was, in the 1950's. They have survived even though they never had the advantage, in earlier years, of having rail delivery available almost right to their door. To return to Morrisville, the team track there in the post-war years was the true reflection of a community with an agricultural base. New autos and trucks arrived in box cars of the appropriate size and configuration, with larger trucks arriving on flat cars. Presumedly, other farm machinery and household appliances for the several stores in town dealing in such goods also arrived in box cars. Some scrap metal even went out in gondolas, though not nearly so much as went out that way in the scrap drives I've seen photos of from the earliest period of W.W. II. In the springtime carloads of both bagged fertilizer and bagged lime, the latter primarily from Swanton in a one railroad move, could be seen being unloaded on the two team tracks. Some was ordered direct by farmers, while the rest was for the Eastern States Farmers Exchange store, H. A. Slayton & Sons grain business or the United Farmers Creamery Association's cooperative store. From late October and about Thanksgiving these same track often held both gondolas and flat cars with high stakes along their sides. These were soon piled high with bundles Christmas trees being shipped as far south as Florida. Like everything else, unfortunately, by 1960 most of these freight movements were either gone or had been converted to truck shipment and even Ward's was in its last years as a John Deere dealership. Don Valentine --- In STMFC@..., "Douglas Harding" <dharding@...> wrote: thought they were later than that, but I was thinking of the Farmall Super H's & M's which were built in the 50'shttp://www.tractordata.com/td/001/td1113.html states the Farmall MD was the diesel version of the M. The MD was started on gasoline, by pullinga lever which enlarged the combustion chamber (to lower the compression) and closed the circuit for the spark plugs. After theengine was warm, it was switched over to diesel. Farmall built a few all fuel tractors that could operate on distillate orkerosene. Models included the F-20 built 1932-39, the F-30 built 1931-1939, and the M built 1939-1952.1954.
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RPM Returns to the NMRA National Convention!
Timothy Costello
The Western Prototype Modelers, (WPM) will sponsor the Railroad Prototype Modelers (RPM) Room at the NMRA National Convention. Location will be at NMRA convention headquarters, the Anaheim Marriott, in the “Elite Ballroom”.
The RPM Room will be open for two days only: Wednesday-Thursday, July 16-17, 2008 from 12:00pm noon, to 10:00pm. As at the annual WPM meet, tables will be elevated for improved model display and viewing. There will be a WPM/RPM staffer at the door to provide security for the display area. If attending the convention, be sure to join us. Bring your models for display; meet fellow modelers from across the country and around the world. For questions on the RPM Room at the NMRA National Convention, contact Timothy Costello through the WPM website: info@... One final note, The Western Prototype Modelers meet, WPM will be held this year on September 6, 2008 at the La Habra Community Center, La Habra (Orange County) California. For event details, go to: http://www.westernprototypemodelers.org/
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Re: RPM Returns to the NMRA National Convention!
Jack Burgess
That is great to hear...I'll be stopping by.
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Jack Burgess www.yosemitevalleyrr.com
The Western Prototype Modelers, (WPM) will sponsor the Railroad
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Re: SP Overnight service
Tim O'Connor
Thanks Paul.
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Not to mention the large number of standard 40ft box cars used in LCL service. I suspect that SP painted so many cars for the "Overnight" service to protect the uniform appearance of those trains more than anything else -- the cars were completely ordinary for the most part, although some B-50-15/16 cars had side ladders by the doors. http://www.steamfreightcars.com/modeling/models/oconnor/sp32481main.html Tim O'Connor
Tim,
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Re: Sunshine data sheets (Re: SP Overnight service)
Tim O'Connor
On that matter, if people have corrections or supplemental data
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for Sunshine model data sheets, it would be very helpful to post it -- maybe create a folder in the files section for Sunshine data sheets? Tim O'Connor
Good point, Paul, and I should not have left the impression that
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Re: B&O boxcar red
ltctilley
I use PollyS Special Oxide Red 414354. Then after decaling, I use light
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vertical brush strokes with testors dulcote (it often makes the decals run, just like the real letters chalk). Then a light overspray with very thin oxide red again and a little grime. Chris Tilley
In a message dated 7/4/2008 11:30:15 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
rstern1@... writes: Thanks Fred. Good advice, and I'll check into it. Perhaps the question I should also have asked is for color photos of &O boxcars. Recognizing that colors can come through odd on the web, seeing some next to other cars might provide some idea of how to go with this. Thanks Rick **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)
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Intermountain Erie PS-1 84000
Mark
I have three of these and found the builders outline on Elwoods site.
Did these cars have Apex roofwalks? It appears they had A-3 trucks. Any help will be appreciated. Sincerely, Mark Morgan
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Re: Intermountain Erie PS-1 84000
al.kresse
Mark,
From my AMC Cleveland Erie 9-19 diag sht we have for ERIE 84000-84009, blt 1954, lot 8160 - > Superior doors > P-S Cushion Underframes > Cast steel for A-3 Ride Control trucks > No supplier listed for the running boards Al Kresse PS: The C&O had 10 similar cars for shipping plate glass -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Mark Morgan" <bnonut@...> I have three of these and found the builders outline on Elwoods site. Did these cars have Apex roofwalks? It appears they had A-3 trucks. Any help will be appreciated. Sincerely, Mark Morgan
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Re: 1940s tank car questions
D. Scott Chatfield
Steve Sandifer wrote:
Not sure exactly what you are asking, but I have photos from Eureka, I recall a bulk oil dealer in Lebanon, TN whose storage tanks were on the other side of the road from their spur (served by Tennessee Central). Scott Chatfield
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Re: Intermountain Erie PS-1 84000
Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
Note, these Erie cars need new underframes since they had the PS cushion
underframe. I've held off on building any of these small lots, until I can find an underframe drawing. I've never found out how PS persuaded these roads to try the cars with cushion underframes. Roads that had these cars include: BAR 5 C&O 10 Erie 10 GN 15 N&W 5 NYC 25 PRR 20 WP 10 May have been others. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY
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Re: Intermountain Erie PS-1 84000
al.kresse
The diagram sht for C&O 2990-2999, last revised in 1968 (vs. drwg 1955, no revisions for the Erie 84000 sht) for these 1954 built cars has the following note --
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PULLMAN CUSHION UNDERFRAME - Rubber Cushion Gear - 8" Travel Also notes APEX TRI-LOK running board & brake step (might have been an upgrade) Lot 8160-E Also notes a " 10" channel center sill 28.3 # per Ft. Pullman Cushion So get you CBCs out and check out END-OF-CAR Cushioning systems and see what you have to add. I notes standard Pullman underframe. My source: C&OHS DS 7-049 FC diagram book updated 1969 Al Kresse
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From: "Brian J Carlson" <brian@...> Note, these Erie cars need new underframes since they had the PS cushion underframe. I've held off on building any of these small lots, until I can find an underframe drawing. I've never found out how PS persuaded these roads to try the cars with cushion underframes. Roads that had these cars include: BAR 5 C&O 10 Erie 10 GN 15 N&W 5 NYC 25 PRR 20 WP 10 May have been others. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY
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web site updated
Peter Ness
I've updated my "Work in Progress" page which includes a very mini
review of the IM (CSS) NE-5 caboose...my updated "Links" page includes a link to a more detailed review on this product as well. New pages added for New Haven fans include cab units, head end cars and electrics (beyond the scope of this group, but still 1959) Happy modeling, Peter http://www.freewebs.com/newhavenrailroad1959/
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Re: Intermountain Erie PS-1 84000
al.kresse
It would be intersting to find out if all eight of these RRs used the same Pullman lot number.
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Also, were they true P-S 1s in Feb 1954? Al Kresse
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From: "Brian J Carlson" <brian@...> Note, these Erie cars need new underframes since they had the PS cushion underframe. I've held off on building any of these small lots, until I can find an underframe drawing. I've never found out how PS persuaded these roads to try the cars with cushion underframes. Roads that had these cars include: BAR 5 C&O 10 Erie 10 GN 15 N&W 5 NYC 25 PRR 20 WP 10 May have been others. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY
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Re: Intermountain Erie PS-1 84000
Ed Hawkins
On Jul 5, 2008, at 4:06 PM, water.kresse@... wrote:
It would be intersting to find out if all eight of these RRs used theAl, All 100 of the cars with Pullman cushioned underframes were built under the same lot number, however, there were different letters applied (lot 8160A through H). All of them are listed on the 40' PS-1 roster list on the STMFC web site. Regards, Ed Hawkins
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Re: 1940s tank car questions
Dennis Storzek
--- In STMFC@..., blindog@... wrote:
I recall a bulk oil dealer in Lebanon, TN whose storage tanks wereon the other side of the road from their spur (served by Tennessee Central). Someplace I have a forties era survey map of my little corner of the world in Elburn, IL. It shows two bulk oil jobbers lined up along a C&NW spur, and IN BETWEEN the two, a third unloading stand piped out to the street, then under the public street, to a jobber located across the street from the other two. Ah, the American way of life, with good ol' capitalistic competition. Most modelers want to build a model of a town that has one of everything; one elevator, one coal dealer, one lumberyard, one bulk oil dealer... The problem is, the reality of the situation is that most places that were large enough to support one of a type of merchant normally had two, in competition with each other: two oil dealers, two places to buy coal, two places to buy lumber, and certainly more than one elevator. Often times, one of the two was a Co-op, which didn't have to compete on price, since they offered special credit terms to their members that the "public" merchants couldn't match. So, you could get gasoline at the oil dealer, or at the Co-op, coal at the coal dealer, or at the Co-op, some limited lumber yard supplies at the Co-op, and well-to-do farmers sold their crop to the public elevator, while everyone else sold theirs through the Co-op. Dennis
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Re: Multi-fuel farm tractors.
Gene Green <bierglaeser@...>
My father used to tell about being hired to help unload and assemble
box car loads of farm machinery (no tractors, though) consigned to Clyde Stonebreaker (sic?) in Chapin, Iowa. If "Stoney" had a name for his dealership, I never heard of it. Point of this story is that, at least between 1930 and 1940, small farm machinery such as plows, disc and spike harrows, planters and so on was delivered in box cars. Sure makes it easy to model. But on my model RR flat cars of tractors are a must. So far I have material for loads of John Deeres, Farmalls and Massey-Harris 44s. Gene Green OitwTtoEP
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Re: Multi-fuel farm tractors.
ken_olson54022 <kwolson@...>
--- In STMFC@..., "Gene Green" <bierglaeser@...> wrote:
So far I have material for loads of John Deeres, Farmalls and Massey-Harris 44s. Who makes a model of the Masseys????? Ken Olson
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Re: 1940s tank car questions
Kurt Laughlin <fleeta@...>
You can add to the example list Beaver Falls PA which had both Armour and Cudahy packing houses, in adjacent buildings. Also, curiously, three to four scrap yards at any given time.
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KL
----- Original Message -----
From: Dennis Storzek . . . the reality of the situation is that most places that were large enough to support one of a type of merchant normally had two, in competition with each other. . .
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Re: Intermountain Erie PS-1 84000
al.kresse
Ed,
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I looked for the site listing or files on the this subject to no avail. Has there been anything published about this group of Pullman End-of-Car Cushioned box cars . . . . Pullman advertisements, proto journals, railway age, CBC, etc.? The C&O equipped theirs with special racks for shipping laminated plate glass. Larger pieces went on flats with special A-frames and aluminum plates to sandwich the glass between. Al
-------------- Original message --------------
From: Ed Hawkins <hawk0621@...> On Jul 5, 2008, at 4:06 PM, water.kresse@... wrote: It would be intersting to find out if all eight of these RRs used theAl, All 100 of the cars with Pullman cushioned underframes were built under the same lot number, however, there were different letters applied (lot 8160A through H). All of them are listed on the 40' PS-1 roster list on the STMFC web site. Regards, Ed Hawkins
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Re: B&O boxcar red
rwitt_2000
Bruce Smith wrote:
boxcars timewas a bright red, but not as deep in tone as a caboose red. over new,this red seems to have faded toward a pink".Rick, these cars were a very brown red. I used Poly Scale Roof Brown with abit of Boxcar Red. That might be a bit too brown, but my M-26 in thatcolor looks pretty good. Post WWII, the B&Os color became significantlyredder. On Virtual Modelers the consensus seems to be Boxcar Red pre 1945 adn Rick, Bruce's suggestions are essentially correct. If you can find a Red Caboose model of a B&O M-26 ARA boxcar it is very close to what color was used in the mid to late 1950's. Chris Barkan worked very closely with Red Caboose to get both the lettering and the paint colors correct. The pre-WWII boxcar paint colors were a darker brown. Post 1960, beyond the time frame for this list, some shops use a paint color that had a hint of "orange". I never observed a B&O boxcar weathering to "pink". Bob Witt Indianapolis, Indiana
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