Date   

Re: DTI trucks

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

Add PRR to the list.
Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

----- Original Message -----


Re: Freight car distribution

armprem
 

Unfortunately there are not enough different models available to even
begin to come close to "National Averages".Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim O'Connor" <timboconnor@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 4:54 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Freight car distribution



Good work, Larry! That's what I'm talkin' 'bout!
A 40 car train with 9 SP (not counting T&NO) box
cars.. More than 5 times the 'average' value of
1.6. And the peak CMO value at 20 times its average
of 0.2! And yet, the OVERALL averages are exactly
what we expect, representing the fact that each car
has an equal chance.

Model railroad operations would be much improved if
someone could devise an easy way to do this using
paper car cards and waybills. (Since most people seem
to hate using computer switchlists.)

Tim O'Connor


At 8/17/2008 02:54 PM Sunday, you wrote:
Hi Folks

I ran my "random train" Excel program for 100,000 iterations to test
whether it was working OK. The average number of boxcars per train,
by railroad, seemed to properly mirror the national fleet as
represented by Tim Gilbert's data for 1949:

RR___Number___Nat'l %___Random %
ACL___13,831___1.99%___1.99%
AT&SF___35,234___5.08%___5.09%
B&M___2,755___0.40%___0.40%
B&O___28,683___4.13%___4.12%
C&EI___1,185___0.17%___0.17%
C&NW___23,284___3.36%___3.37%
C&O___21,699___3.13%___3.13%
CB&Q___31,634___4.56%___4.55%
CGA___5,153___0.74%___0.74%
CGW___3,622___0.52%___0.52%
CMO___3,422___0.49%___0.49%
CNJ___1,757___0.25%___0.26%
CNJ-CRP___1,247___0.18%___0.18%
CRI&P___17,160___2.47%___2.46%
D&H___2,469___0.36%___0.36%
DL&W___7,585___1.09%___1.09%
DM&IR___337___0.05%___0.05%
DRG&W___5,094___0.73%___0.74%
EJ&E___1,427___0.21%___0.21%
ERIE___12,070___1.74%___1.74%
GM&O___6,177___0.89%___0.89%
GN___22,399___3.23%___3.24%
GTW___8,556___1.23%___1.22%
IC___21,248___3.06%___3.08%
KCS___2,923___0.42%___0.42%
L&N___13,324___1.92%___1.92%
LV___5,584___0.80%___0.81%
MILW___32,076___4.62%___4.62%
MKT___5,235___0.75%___0.76%
MP___18,112___2.61%___2.61%
MP-IGN___2,572___0.37%___0.37%
N&W___8,986___1.30%___1.31%
NC&SL___3,603___0.52%___0.52%
NH___6,012___0.87%___0.86%
NKP___11,255___1.62%___1.63%
NP___19,317___2.78%___2.77%
NYC___66,867___9.64%___9.64%
P&LE___4,118___0.59%___0.59%
PRR___64,670___9.32%___9.33%
RDG___7,639___1.10%___1.11%
SAL___12,396___1.79%___1.79%
SLSF___13,255___1.91%___1.91%
SOO___8,728___1.26%___1.27%
SOU___26,331___3.80%___3.79%
SP-Pac___27,757___4.00%___4.01%
SP-T&NO___7,438___1.07%___1.07%
SSW___3,700___0.53%___0.54%
T&P___4,288___0.62%___0.61%
UP___23,758___3.42%___3.43%
WAB___11,572___1.67%___1.68%
WM___2,143___0.31%___0.31%
WP___1,995___0.29%___0.28%
Total___693,682___100.00%___100.00%

(The "Number" and "Nat'l %" columns above are from Tim's 1949 list of
boxcars. His data are at "4060totalboxcarsUSownership.xls" in the
files section of this list. The "Random %" column is the average
percentage of cars per train generated by my Excel program after
100,000 iterations. Each train consisted of 40 boxcars.)

While running the program, I tallied the maximum number of cars for
each railroad over all the iterations. In a 40 boxcar train, the
average number of cars would be 40 times the national percentage
shown in the above table. For example, the average number of SP-Pac
cars would 40 * 4% = 1.6 cars � 1 or 2 cars per train. Any
particular 40 boxcar train may have more or less SP-Pac cars (0 to
40). After 100,000 trials, there were in fact trains with no SP-Pac
boxcars, but no train had more than 9 of them. Here are the results
for all the railroads:

RR___Nat'l Avg___Max Rnd
ACL___0.80___6
AT&SF___2.03___9
B&M___0.16___3
B&O___1.65___10
C&EI___0.07___3
C&NW___1.34___9
C&O___1.25___8
CB&Q___1.82___9
CGA___0.30___5
CGW___0.21___4
CMO___0.20___4
CNJ___0.10___4
CNJ-CRP___0.07___3
CRI&P___0.99___7
D&H___0.14___4
DL&W___0.44___5
DM&IR___0.02___2
DRG&W___0.29___4
EJ&E___0.08___3
ERIE___0.70___7
GM&O___0.36___5
GN___1.29___8
GTW___0.49___5
IC___1.23___8
KCS___0.17___4
L&N___0.77___6
LV___0.32___4
MILW___1.85___9
MKT___0.30___5
MP___1.04___7
MP-IGN___0.15___4
N&W___0.52___6
NC&SL___0.21___4
NH___0.35___5
NKP___0.65___6
NP___1.11___8
NYC___3.86___14
P&LE___0.24___4
PRR___3.73___13
RDG___0.44___6
SAL___0.71___7
SLSF___0.76___7
SOO___0.50___5
SOU___1.52___9
SP-Pac___1.60___9
SP-T&NO___0.43___5
SSW___0.21___5
T&P___0.25___4
UP___1.37___8
WAB___0.67___6
WM___0.12___4
WP___0.12___3
Total___40.00___NA

("Nat'l Avg" is the average number of boxcars in a 40 car train based
on the national average; "Max Rnd" is the maximum number of boxcars
for any 40 car train after 100,000 iterations of the Excel program.)

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming

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Re: DTI trucks

Brian Leppert <b.leppert@...>
 

Tim,

Here's some railroads I know of that used the double truss coil-
elliptic sprung 40 and 50 ton trucks, with or without spring planks:

C&O, CGW, WM, BAR and Erie used them on some or all of their 1932 ARA
box cars.

N&W, DT&I and Virginian had them on all of their round roof box cars.

DT&I, Erie, CGW, WM and L&NE all had various other cars equipped with
this truck.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Brian (Carlson) sent me a great photo of a 3rd sideframe with these
springs -- This one is a Buckeye casting (circle-B foundry
mark)... very interesting. Anyone know who besides DT&I had
trucks like this?
Tim O'


Re: Union Pacific Stock car class

Tim O'Connor
 

You mean 46759? There is no 46795 in the 1940, 1950, or
1953 ORER's.

At 8/17/2008 04:28 PM Sunday, you wrote:
What class of cars does
UP #46795 Stock car belong to?
Rich Yoder
PA


Re: A Purpose For Frt Car Distribution Studies

Tim O'Connor
 

Steve, I don't see any 'danger' at all, as long as you
-ASSIGN- cars to run on the layout in the proportions to the
national fleet. In other words, suppose you have 103 box cars
and Railroad XYZ only represents 1 as a national percentage,
but you own 4 XYZ box cars. No problem -- in your computation
(like Larry's EXCEL spreadsheet) you only allow each XYZ car
to represent 0.25 (1/4) of one car.

This gives you the ability to model more of the fleets of
your favorite railroads, but has no effect on the proportions
of those cars that show up during operations.

As for the percentage of 40' vs 50', I don't see any issue.
If you need a higher percentage of 40' cars then build your
fleet that way. The numbers of cars for a typical layout are
too small to give a true proportional representation of the
entire country. You'd need about 1,000+ box cars to do that.

Tim O'Connor

The danger lies in having a model car fleet that models many
exceptional cars, rather than a good overall representation of the
national fleet. But it's too easy for the modeller to, absent
knowledge of each road's freight car fleet and its relative
percentage to the national fleet, to model those exceptions. For
example, as much as I want a model of a B&O M-53, there are other B&O
cars that I have come to learn to be more common to that road. I
have to have many CN boxcars (fortunately, I do) to justify modelling
just ONE of the three aluminum-sided cars that they had. If you model
20 B&O boxcars, you can justify having one M53 in your fleet far
sooner than I can, where I will only need one B&O boxcar for my
layout.

Likewise there is some weighting that one has to be factored in by
the modeller to represent the location that they model. Your road
may move a lot of grain in boxcars, and the ratio of cars (home road
vs. national fleet) will change whether or not the grain is running.
Likewise, boxcar precentages from the ORER are not a good way to
determine the car population for a grain-hauling layout. Preferred
will be 40' steel or steel-frame boxcars with 6' doors. Far less
common will be cars with larger doors, as they were practically
useless for grain loading. And open coal hoppers, though not part of
this discussion, will have interesting distribution variations of
their own!

Steve Lucas.


Re: Freight car distribution

Tim O'Connor
 

Good work, Larry! That's what I'm talkin' 'bout!
A 40 car train with 9 SP (not counting T&NO) box
cars.. More than 5 times the 'average' value of
1.6. And the peak CMO value at 20 times its average
of 0.2! And yet, the OVERALL averages are exactly
what we expect, representing the fact that each car
has an equal chance.

Model railroad operations would be much improved if
someone could devise an easy way to do this using
paper car cards and waybills. (Since most people seem
to hate using computer switchlists.)

Tim O'Connor

At 8/17/2008 02:54 PM Sunday, you wrote:
Hi Folks

I ran my "random train" Excel program for 100,000 iterations to test
whether it was working OK. The average number of boxcars per train,
by railroad, seemed to properly mirror the national fleet as
represented by Tim Gilbert's data for 1949:

RR___Number___Nat'l %___Random %
ACL___13,831___1.99%___1.99%
AT&SF___35,234___5.08%___5.09%
B&M___2,755___0.40%___0.40%
B&O___28,683___4.13%___4.12%
C&EI___1,185___0.17%___0.17%
C&NW___23,284___3.36%___3.37%
C&O___21,699___3.13%___3.13%
CB&Q___31,634___4.56%___4.55%
CGA___5,153___0.74%___0.74%
CGW___3,622___0.52%___0.52%
CMO___3,422___0.49%___0.49%
CNJ___1,757___0.25%___0.26%
CNJ-CRP___1,247___0.18%___0.18%
CRI&P___17,160___2.47%___2.46%
D&H___2,469___0.36%___0.36%
DL&W___7,585___1.09%___1.09%
DM&IR___337___0.05%___0.05%
DRG&W___5,094___0.73%___0.74%
EJ&E___1,427___0.21%___0.21%
ERIE___12,070___1.74%___1.74%
GM&O___6,177___0.89%___0.89%
GN___22,399___3.23%___3.24%
GTW___8,556___1.23%___1.22%
IC___21,248___3.06%___3.08%
KCS___2,923___0.42%___0.42%
L&N___13,324___1.92%___1.92%
LV___5,584___0.80%___0.81%
MILW___32,076___4.62%___4.62%
MKT___5,235___0.75%___0.76%
MP___18,112___2.61%___2.61%
MP-IGN___2,572___0.37%___0.37%
N&W___8,986___1.30%___1.31%
NC&SL___3,603___0.52%___0.52%
NH___6,012___0.87%___0.86%
NKP___11,255___1.62%___1.63%
NP___19,317___2.78%___2.77%
NYC___66,867___9.64%___9.64%
P&LE___4,118___0.59%___0.59%
PRR___64,670___9.32%___9.33%
RDG___7,639___1.10%___1.11%
SAL___12,396___1.79%___1.79%
SLSF___13,255___1.91%___1.91%
SOO___8,728___1.26%___1.27%
SOU___26,331___3.80%___3.79%
SP-Pac___27,757___4.00%___4.01%
SP-T&NO___7,438___1.07%___1.07%
SSW___3,700___0.53%___0.54%
T&P___4,288___0.62%___0.61%
UP___23,758___3.42%___3.43%
WAB___11,572___1.67%___1.68%
WM___2,143___0.31%___0.31%
WP___1,995___0.29%___0.28%
Total___693,682___100.00%___100.00%

(The "Number" and "Nat'l %" columns above are from Tim's 1949 list of
boxcars. His data are at "4060totalboxcarsUSownership.xls" in the
files section of this list. The "Random %" column is the average
percentage of cars per train generated by my Excel program after
100,000 iterations. Each train consisted of 40 boxcars.)

While running the program, I tallied the maximum number of cars for
each railroad over all the iterations. In a 40 boxcar train, the
average number of cars would be 40 times the national percentage
shown in the above table. For example, the average number of SP-Pac
cars would 40 * 4% = 1.6 cars ­ 1 or 2 cars per train. Any
particular 40 boxcar train may have more or less SP-Pac cars (0 to
40). After 100,000 trials, there were in fact trains with no SP-Pac
boxcars, but no train had more than 9 of them. Here are the results
for all the railroads:

RR___Nat'l Avg___Max Rnd
ACL___0.80___6
AT&SF___2.03___9
B&M___0.16___3
B&O___1.65___10
C&EI___0.07___3
C&NW___1.34___9
C&O___1.25___8
CB&Q___1.82___9
CGA___0.30___5
CGW___0.21___4
CMO___0.20___4
CNJ___0.10___4
CNJ-CRP___0.07___3
CRI&P___0.99___7
D&H___0.14___4
DL&W___0.44___5
DM&IR___0.02___2
DRG&W___0.29___4
EJ&E___0.08___3
ERIE___0.70___7
GM&O___0.36___5
GN___1.29___8
GTW___0.49___5
IC___1.23___8
KCS___0.17___4
L&N___0.77___6
LV___0.32___4
MILW___1.85___9
MKT___0.30___5
MP___1.04___7
MP-IGN___0.15___4
N&W___0.52___6
NC&SL___0.21___4
NH___0.35___5
NKP___0.65___6
NP___1.11___8
NYC___3.86___14
P&LE___0.24___4
PRR___3.73___13
RDG___0.44___6
SAL___0.71___7
SLSF___0.76___7
SOO___0.50___5
SOU___1.52___9
SP-Pac___1.60___9
SP-T&NO___0.43___5
SSW___0.21___5
T&P___0.25___4
UP___1.37___8
WAB___0.67___6
WM___0.12___4
WP___0.12___3
Total___40.00___NA

("Nat'l Avg" is the average number of boxcars in a 40 car train based
on the national average; "Max Rnd" is the maximum number of boxcars
for any 40 car train after 100,000 iterations of the Excel program.)

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


Re: Battleship Gons trucks

Westerfield <westerfield@...>
 

Al - C&O battleships can reasonably be modelled from Buckeyes. N&W early battleships used Pilchers which are available from Bethlehem Car Works. The Lewis trucks are unlike anything on the market but are simple enough to scratch build. - Al Westerfield

----- Original Message -----
From: water.kresse@...
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Battleship Gons trucks


Folks,

In reseaching the C&O, N&W and Virginian high capacity gons, of the late-teens and early-twenties, one see a great number of experimental 6-wheel trucks being "tried" : ASF Lewis, ASF Equalizing Arm, ASF Lemont, Buckeye, etc. Do we have any of these covered in HO scale for the modeler to "kit bash" a body on. The C&O's 1941-1942 WW2 125-ton flat car trucks might be close enough for a potion of the early VGN 120-ton cars and their upgraded 105-ton Virginian cars.

Al Kresse


Re: DTI trucks

Tim O'Connor
 

Brian sent me a great photo of a 3rd sideframe with these
springs -- This one is a Buckeye casting (circle-B foundry
mark)... very interesting. Anyone know who besides DT&I had
trucks like this?
Tim O'

Tim: I attached a photo of the truck and car. I don't know what DTI series
this car was in besides I was a 60-early 70's repaint. Brian I copied you
since it is a truck.

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim O'Connor" <timboconnor@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 2:50 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] DTI trucks


Brian

You may not be aware but the earliest version of those trucks
I've seen were cast in 1934 by ASF, while the DT&I cars were
built (with different castings from unknown foundry) in 1949.
So someone had the coil-leaf-coil trucks before DT&I. (Or they
were applied to some other DT&I cars.)

Tim


At 8/17/2008 02:43 PM Sunday, you wrote:
I have 5-6 of the DT&I cars located nearby some still have those trucks.
I
posted some photos to the list years ago 2004 but removed them later.
Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Union Pacific Stock car class

Rich Yoder
 

What class of cars does
UP #46795 Stock car belong to?
Rich Yoder
PA


Re: What HO truck(s) do we STMFC'ers want?

al_brown03
 

I withdraw "several series". Thought I'd remembered them on the A-1
auto cars, which would've implicated some gondolas and flats too, but
on re-inspection the A-1 has regular Andrews.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


--- In STMFC@..., "Brian Leppert" <b.leppert@...> wrote:

--- In STMFC@..., "gn3397" <heninger@> wrote:

--- In STMFC@..., "al_brown03" <abrown@> wrote:

--- In STMFC@..., "gn3397" <heninger@> wrote:
<snip>

I would like to see a Dalman-Andrews. Unfortunately, only GN,
Soo
Line, and ACL
modelers could use it, to my knowledge. Oh well, I can hope.
To your Dalman-Andrews list, I'd add several series of SAL
cars.
That
ACL had them too, I didn't know.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.
Mr. Brown,

Now that you mention it, I am in error. I meant SAL. Thanks for
correcting my error. I need
them for my GN cars, which I am most familiar with.

Sincerely,
Robert D. Heninger
Iowa City, IA
Spokane, Portland & Seattle can be added to the list. These were
ex-
GN gons aquired in the '50s and converted to wood chip cars.

I am aware of SAL B-5 boxcars with these trucks, but what were
other
SAL classes?

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV


Re: DTI trucks

James F. Brewer <jfbrewer@...>
 

N&W used them on at least its B-1, B-2 and B-3 boxcars. Drawings are available from NWHS here:

http://nwhs.org/archivesdb/listdocs.php?index=rs&id=1980

Jim Brewer
Glenwood MD

----- Original Message -----
From: Tim O'Connor
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 2:50 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] DTI trucks


Brian

You may not be aware but the earliest version of those trucks
I've seen were cast in 1934 by ASF, while the DT&I cars were
built (with different castings from unknown foundry) in 1949.
So someone had the coil-leaf-coil trucks before DT&I. (Or they
were applied to some other DT&I cars.)

Tim

At 8/17/2008 02:43 PM Sunday, you wrote:
>I have 5-6 of the DT&I cars located nearby some still have those trucks. I
>posted some photos to the list years ago 2004 but removed them later.
>Brian J Carlson P.E.
>Cheektowaga NY


A Purpose For Frt Car Distribution Studies. Was: Re: Re

Steve Lucas <stevelucas3@...>
 

Tony--

After reading this thread for some time, I have to agree with your
basic premise. Most major through transcon routes such as the UP in
Wyoming would very likely have over a given period, percentages of
each road's boxcars in keeping with the national averages. The law
of averages supports this.

The danger lies in having a model car fleet that models many
exceptional cars, rather than a good overall representation of the
national fleet. But it's too easy for the modeller to, absent
knowledge of each road's freight car fleet and its relative
percentage to the national fleet, to model those exceptions. For
example, as much as I want a model of a B&O M-53, there are other B&O
cars that I have come to learn to be more common to that road. I
have to have many CN boxcars (fortunately, I do) to justify modelling
just ONE of the three aluminum-sided cars that they had. If you model
20 B&O boxcars, you can justify having one M53 in your fleet far
sooner than I can, where I will only need one B&O boxcar for my
layout.

Likewise there is some weighting that one has to be factored in by
the modeller to represent the location that they model. Your road
may move a lot of grain in boxcars, and the ratio of cars (home road
vs. national fleet) will change whether or not the grain is running.
Likewise, boxcar precentages from the ORER are not a good way to
determine the car population for a grain-hauling layout. Preferred
will be 40' steel or steel-frame boxcars with 6' doors. Far less
common will be cars with larger doors, as they were practically
useless for grain loading. And open coal hoppers, though not part of
this discussion, will have interesting distribution variations of
their own!

Steve Lucas.



When translated --- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson
<thompson@...> wrote:

Malcolm Laughlin wrote:
Let's not get too hung up on averages. After all, the average
day
rarely happenned. If 10 % of the cars were wagon tops, then
there
were probably days when out of ten cars five would be wagons . . .
Of course, but the average is a place to start. Otherwise
you
are just winging it. I don't understand the excitement of many
posters,
to point out that there are substantial swings from the average.
That
doesn't eliminate the importance of the average as the core datum.
Moreover, my instinct is that what "looks right" is probably the
average, not the extremes of the data. Without more specific data,
and
we have precious little, I believe that trying to look typical is
an
excellent beginning.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: A Purpose For Frt Car Distribution Studies

Bruce Smith
 

On Fri, August 15, 2008 5:06 pm, Anthony Thompson wrote:
Bruce Smith wrote:
A large portion of the national fleet of tank cars was concentrated in
a series of linear routes between the gulf coast oil fields and the
north eastern refineries . . . So for us lucky PRR modelers, we get to
model a great percentage of the national fleet as it traversed Pennsy
rails, but someone modeling, say the ATSF, would see very few of those
cars. So in this particular case, both time and location are
absolutely critical!
So Bruce, what railroads do you think served those Gulf Coast
refineries? Could Santa Fe be among them? But of course to model the
tank trains, you'd have to model the right part of the Santa Fe at the
right time--just as a Pennsy modeler has to model the right part of the
PRR at the right time.
Absolutely, I should have been more specific... and indicated that the
statement applied to someone model, for example, Cajon Pass, or an obscure
ATSF branch near Alma ;^)

Interesting, in my continued reading last night of "The Petroleum
Administration at War" I found that the Kansas oil fileds were run at
excess production in late 1942 and early 1943 to provide additional crude
for the northeast's refineries, so another possible ATSF origin for crude?

Regards
Bruce


Re: Battleship Gons trucks

water.kresse@...
 

Folks,

In reseaching the C&O, N&W and Virginian high capacity gons, of the late-teens and early-twenties, one see a great number of experimental 6-wheel trucks being "tried" : ASF Lewis, ASF Equalizing Arm, ASF Lemont, Buckeye, etc. Do we have any of these covered in HO scale for the modeler to "kit bash" a body on. The C&O's 1941-1942 WW2 125-ton flat car trucks might be close enough for a potion of the early VGN 120-ton cars and their upgraded 105-ton Virginian cars.

Al Kresse


Re: Freight car distribution

laramielarry <ostresh@...>
 

Hi Folks

I ran my "random train" Excel program for 100,000 iterations to test
whether it was working OK. The average number of boxcars per train,
by railroad, seemed to properly mirror the national fleet as
represented by Tim Gilbert's data for 1949:

RR___Number___Nat'l %___Random %
ACL___13,831___1.99%___1.99%
AT&SF___35,234___5.08%___5.09%
B&M___2,755___0.40%___0.40%
B&O___28,683___4.13%___4.12%
C&EI___1,185___0.17%___0.17%
C&NW___23,284___3.36%___3.37%
C&O___21,699___3.13%___3.13%
CB&Q___31,634___4.56%___4.55%
CGA___5,153___0.74%___0.74%
CGW___3,622___0.52%___0.52%
CMO___3,422___0.49%___0.49%
CNJ___1,757___0.25%___0.26%
CNJ-CRP___1,247___0.18%___0.18%
CRI&P___17,160___2.47%___2.46%
D&H___2,469___0.36%___0.36%
DL&W___7,585___1.09%___1.09%
DM&IR___337___0.05%___0.05%
DRG&W___5,094___0.73%___0.74%
EJ&E___1,427___0.21%___0.21%
ERIE___12,070___1.74%___1.74%
GM&O___6,177___0.89%___0.89%
GN___22,399___3.23%___3.24%
GTW___8,556___1.23%___1.22%
IC___21,248___3.06%___3.08%
KCS___2,923___0.42%___0.42%
L&N___13,324___1.92%___1.92%
LV___5,584___0.80%___0.81%
MILW___32,076___4.62%___4.62%
MKT___5,235___0.75%___0.76%
MP___18,112___2.61%___2.61%
MP-IGN___2,572___0.37%___0.37%
N&W___8,986___1.30%___1.31%
NC&SL___3,603___0.52%___0.52%
NH___6,012___0.87%___0.86%
NKP___11,255___1.62%___1.63%
NP___19,317___2.78%___2.77%
NYC___66,867___9.64%___9.64%
P&LE___4,118___0.59%___0.59%
PRR___64,670___9.32%___9.33%
RDG___7,639___1.10%___1.11%
SAL___12,396___1.79%___1.79%
SLSF___13,255___1.91%___1.91%
SOO___8,728___1.26%___1.27%
SOU___26,331___3.80%___3.79%
SP-Pac___27,757___4.00%___4.01%
SP-T&NO___7,438___1.07%___1.07%
SSW___3,700___0.53%___0.54%
T&P___4,288___0.62%___0.61%
UP___23,758___3.42%___3.43%
WAB___11,572___1.67%___1.68%
WM___2,143___0.31%___0.31%
WP___1,995___0.29%___0.28%
Total___693,682___100.00%___100.00%

(The "Number" and "Nat'l %" columns above are from Tim's 1949 list of
boxcars. His data are at "4060totalboxcarsUSownership.xls" in the
files section of this list. The "Random %" column is the average
percentage of cars per train generated by my Excel program after
100,000 iterations. Each train consisted of 40 boxcars.)

While running the program, I tallied the maximum number of cars for
each railroad over all the iterations. In a 40 boxcar train, the
average number of cars would be 40 times the national percentage
shown in the above table. For example, the average number of SP-Pac
cars would 40 * 4% = 1.6 cars – 1 or 2 cars per train. Any
particular 40 boxcar train may have more or less SP-Pac cars (0 to
40). After 100,000 trials, there were in fact trains with no SP-Pac
boxcars, but no train had more than 9 of them. Here are the results
for all the railroads:

RR___Nat'l Avg___Max Rnd
ACL___0.80___6
AT&SF___2.03___9
B&M___0.16___3
B&O___1.65___10
C&EI___0.07___3
C&NW___1.34___9
C&O___1.25___8
CB&Q___1.82___9
CGA___0.30___5
CGW___0.21___4
CMO___0.20___4
CNJ___0.10___4
CNJ-CRP___0.07___3
CRI&P___0.99___7
D&H___0.14___4
DL&W___0.44___5
DM&IR___0.02___2
DRG&W___0.29___4
EJ&E___0.08___3
ERIE___0.70___7
GM&O___0.36___5
GN___1.29___8
GTW___0.49___5
IC___1.23___8
KCS___0.17___4
L&N___0.77___6
LV___0.32___4
MILW___1.85___9
MKT___0.30___5
MP___1.04___7
MP-IGN___0.15___4
N&W___0.52___6
NC&SL___0.21___4
NH___0.35___5
NKP___0.65___6
NP___1.11___8
NYC___3.86___14
P&LE___0.24___4
PRR___3.73___13
RDG___0.44___6
SAL___0.71___7
SLSF___0.76___7
SOO___0.50___5
SOU___1.52___9
SP-Pac___1.60___9
SP-T&NO___0.43___5
SSW___0.21___5
T&P___0.25___4
UP___1.37___8
WAB___0.67___6
WM___0.12___4
WP___0.12___3
Total___40.00___NA

("Nat'l Avg" is the average number of boxcars in a 40 car train based
on the national average; "Max Rnd" is the maximum number of boxcars
for any 40 car train after 100,000 iterations of the Excel program.)

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


Re: DTI trucks

Tim O'Connor
 

Brian

You may not be aware but the earliest version of those trucks
I've seen were cast in 1934 by ASF, while the DT&I cars were
built (with different castings from unknown foundry) in 1949.
So someone had the coil-leaf-coil trucks before DT&I. (Or they
were applied to some other DT&I cars.)

Tim

At 8/17/2008 02:43 PM Sunday, you wrote:
I have 5-6 of the DT&I cars located nearby some still have those trucks. I
posted some photos to the list years ago 2004 but removed them later.
Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


DTI trucks

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

I have 5-6 of the DT&I cars located nearby some still have those trucks. I
posted some photos to the list years ago 2004 but removed them later.
Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Re: A Purpose For Frt Car Distribution Studies

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Gene Green wrote:
-Does- average always mean the same thing? I learned (correctly, I hope) that "average" could be one of three things; mean, median or mode. Usually when folks - those unencumbered by formal education - say "average" they actually mean "arithmetic mean."
Yes, Gene, I agree that the person in the street thinks of the arithmetic mean as the "average," and that definition is fixed, which is why I expressed doubt about the concept of a "true average." For a unimodal symmetrical distribution, the mean, median and mode lie at the same place, so for many situations you can lump them all together as the "average." But the minute the distribution is skewed, and many real-world distributions are skewed, the three definitions give different answers, and the "middle" of the distribution no longer lies at the most frequent value (the mode).

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Union Pacific Stock car class

dmueller183@...
 

You mean 46759? There is no 46795 in the 1940, 1950, or
1953 ORER's.

...and ditto for july 1959 dave





</HTML>


Re: What HO truck(s) do we STMFC'ers want?

Tim O'Connor
 

Brian

I was looking at a drawing but now I can't find it -- but
now I think I'd rather have those coil-leaf-coil trucks as
found on the DT&I 14000-14299 box cars.

This spring package was applied to at least two different
sideframe castings. I'll send you the excellents scans I
have of each sideframe with these interesting springs. One
of the castings (which does not match the DT&I cars) has
an ASF foundry mark.

Tim O'Connor

Another truck high on my list wish is a 50 ton roller
bearing truck... Let's see...

50t rolling bearing (Buckeye/National/ASF/Barber/Scullin)
50t Barber S-2 w/ spring plank
50t National C-1
50t Gould
Tim,

Gould made a lot of trucks. Which one did you have in mind?

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV

120361 - 120380 of 195433