Date   

DS/SS split 1938 to 1950: Fort Worth and Denver City

laramielarry <ostresh@...>
 

Hi Folks

Here are the DS/SS/Steel splits for box cars on the FW&D from 1938 to
1950:

FW&D____Jan-38____Apr-42____Jan-45____Apr-49____Jul-50
DS____557____442____227____13____7
SS____494____493____489____482____481
Steel____0____0____500____496____496
Other____0____0____0____0____0
Unknown____58____19____14____2____0
Total____1,109____954____1,230____993____984

FW&D____Jan-38____Apr-42____Jan-45____Apr-49____Jul-50
DS____50.2%____46.3%____18.5%____1.3%____0.7%
SS____44.5%____51.7%____39.8%____48.5%____48.9%
Steel____0.0%____0.0%____40.7%____49.9%____50.4%
Other____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%
Unknown____5.2%____2.0%____1.1%____0.2%____0.0%
Total____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%

Thanks to Rupert Gamlin for identifying the sheathing type for the 557
DS cars in 1938.

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


DS/SS split 1938 to 1950: Great Northern

laramielarry <ostresh@...>
 

Hi Folks

Here are the DS/SS/Steel splits for box, auto and furniture cars on
the GN from 1938 to 1950.

GN____Jan-38____Apr-42____Jan-45____Apr-49____Jul-50
DS____22,114____20,700____21,246____15,551____14,326
SS____3,563____3,535____3,540____3,495____3,487
Steel____0____0____0____1,000____2,499
Plywood____0____0____826____1,994____1,988
Unknown____0____0____1____0____0
Total____25,677____24,235____25,613____22,040____22,300

GN____Jan-38____Apr-42____Jan-45____Apr-49____Jul-50
DS____86.1%____85.4%____83.0%____70.6%____64.2%
SS____13.9%____14.6%____13.8%____15.9%____15.6%
Steel____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%____4.5%____11.2%
Plywood____0.0%____0.0%____3.2%____9.0%____8.9%
Unknown____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%
Total____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%

The lone unknown in 1945 is believed to be DS.

Thanks to Robert D. Heninger for his extensive help in compiling this
information.

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


DS/SS split 1938 to 1950: B&O

laramielarry <ostresh@...>
 

Hi Folks

Here are the DS/SS/Steel splits for box and auto cars on the B&O from
1938 to 1950:

B&O____Jan-38____Apr-42____Jan-45____Apr-49____Jul-50
DS____13,434____9,650____8,991____4,989____2,437
SS____578____467____464____457____422
Steel____18,051____22,055____21,937____25,419____25,372
Other____0____0____0____0____0
Unknown____256____41____17____2____1
Total____32,319____32,213____31,409____30,867____28,232

B&O____Jan-38____Apr-42____Jan-45____Apr-49____Jul-50
DS____41.6%____30.0%____28.6%____16.2%____8.6%
SS____1.8%____1.4%____1.5%____1.5%____1.5%
Steel____55.9%____68.5%____69.8%____82.4%____89.9%
Other____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%____0.0%
Unknown____0.8%____0.1%____0.1%____0.0%____0.0%
Total____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%____100.0%

Thanks to Edwin C. Kirstatter for his help in compiling this data.

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, Wyoming


Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

charles slater
 

Yes the Rr-47 class cars were built with Diagonal Panel roofs. Did you not get my earlier E-Mail, if not I can send it to you again.
Charlie Slater



To: STMFC@...: aslmmiller@...: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 15:31:44 -0400Subject: Re: [STMFC] Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Now that we have beaten to death what the Standard Railway Equipment Co called itself , does anyone know whether the Rr-47s were really built with rectangular panel roofs in 1951?I am hoping so since I have a lot of them in my parts bin, but have been waiting for some time for an order of diagonal panel roofs from I/M.regards,Andy Miller----- Original Message ----- From: Tim O'Connor To: STMFC@... Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 3:15 PMSubject: Re: [STMFC] Santa Fe Plug Door ReefersAnd I'm not certain, but I think SRE is not to be confusedwith USRE -- United States Railway Equipment -- which was arebuilder of freight cars during the 1960's (using the easilyrecognized outline of the continental US as its builder logo)Tim O'ConnorAt 8/24/2008 03:00 PM Sunday, you wrote:>Tim O'Connor wrote:>> Correct -- I think we may apply "SRE" for the STMFC era.>> Good abbreviation. The company itself in the 1950s used "SRECo" >in their ads, which I find a little compulsive.>>Tony Thompson





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Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Andy Miller <aslmmiller@...>
 

Thanx Charles. Rr-49 it will be.

regards,

Andy Miller

----- Original Message -----
From: "charles slater" <atsfcondr42@...>
To: <stmfc@...>
Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 3:55 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers



Andy the Rr-47 class cars were built new in 1951 by the West Wichita shops and did have a diagonal panel roof.
The Rr-49 class cars were rebuilt in 1950 from Rr-5 class wood cars some of which had already had there original roofs replaced with Murphy streight panel roofs in the 1930/40's. The cars that had the streight panel roofs at the time they were rebuilt into Rr-49 cars kept them, and the Rr-5's that had their original roofs when rebuilt into Rr-49's got new diagonal panel roofs. So the answer is the Rr-49's used both roofs, but if there is a number series for which ones the Santa Fe folio sheet does not break that down. My GUESS is they were mixed togather.
Maybe Richard H. has more information on this.
Charlie Slater



To: STMFC@...: aslmmiller@...: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:24:56 -0400Subject: [STMFC] Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers




I am currently kitbashing some SantaFe plug door 40' iced reefers. The first model under consideration is an Rr-47. According to the ATSF Society's book on reefers these cars were built in 1951 with a rectangular panel (Murphy) roof. In 1951 wouldn't they have used a diagonal panel (Stanray) roof? Similarly, the Sunshine Models info sheet on ATSF plug door reefers claims that the Rr-49s were rebuilt retaining their rectangular panel roof from a 1930's rebuilding, but the Society book claims they had diagonal panel roofs. Which is correct?regards,Andy Miller_dels info sheet[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Boxcar Images

Bob Chaparro <thecitrusbelt@...>
 

Here are a few boxcar image links I found while looking for other
items on the `net. The captions are from the image sources.

Enjoy.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA
==========================
From a Great Northern Annual Report
http://www.gngoat.org/annual_report_57.jpg

Volunteer workers loading a truck from a boxcar for transportation to
the warehouse at this center. -- Photographer: Parker, Tom --
McGehee, Arkansas. 11/21/42 (Note that this is an "automobile" boxcar
serving another use during WW II.)
http://content.cdlib.org/ark:/13030/ft4p3005rg/

A surviving railroad legacy of the former Studebaker railway. This
Wabash boxcar was once assigned to the Studebaker Plant. For many
years this car moved parts in, out and around the Studebaker Plants.
Photo courtsey of Bob Albert and The Hoosier Valley Railroad Musuem ,
North Judson, Indiana, where the car has been restored and is on
display.
http://www.monon.monon.org/sobendpixs/wab49114.jpg

GAEX 112008 (ca. 1960)
Boxcar #112008 as it appeared when it first arrived on the GBW.
http://www.greenbayroute.com/gaex112008.jpg

GBW 15030 (ca. 1958)
These 40' boxcars were rebuilt from 14000-series double door auto
loaders.
http://www.greenbayroute.com/gbw15030.jpg

Pullman-Standard Boxcar (1965)
The Green Bay & Western added 200 boxcars to its roster in late 1951 -
- the first steel boxcars on the railroad.
http://www.greenbayroute.com/1965boxcar751.htm


Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

charles slater
 

Andy the Rr-47 class cars were built new in 1951 by the West Wichita shops and did have a diagonal panel roof.
The Rr-49 class cars were rebuilt in 1950 from Rr-5 class wood cars some of which had already had there original roofs replaced with Murphy streight panel roofs in the 1930/40's. The cars that had the streight panel roofs at the time they were rebuilt into Rr-49 cars kept them, and the Rr-5's that had their original roofs when rebuilt into Rr-49's got new diagonal panel roofs. So the answer is the Rr-49's used both roofs, but if there is a number series for which ones the Santa Fe folio sheet does not break that down. My GUESS is they were mixed togather.
Maybe Richard H. has more information on this.
Charlie Slater



To: STMFC@...: aslmmiller@...: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:24:56 -0400Subject: [STMFC] Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers




I am currently kitbashing some SantaFe plug door 40' iced reefers. The first model under consideration is an Rr-47. According to the ATSF Society's book on reefers these cars were built in 1951 with a rectangular panel (Murphy) roof. In 1951 wouldn't they have used a diagonal panel (Stanray) roof? Similarly, the Sunshine Models info sheet on ATSF plug door reefers claims that the Rr-49s were rebuilt retaining their rectangular panel roof from a 1930's rebuilding, but the Society book claims they had diagonal panel roofs. Which is correct?regards,Andy Miller_dels info sheet[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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Be the filmmaker you always wanted to beŚlearn how to burn a DVD with Windows«.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Andy Miller <aslmmiller@...>
 

Now that we have beaten to death what the Standard Railway Equipment Co called itself , does anyone know whether the Rr-47s were really built with rectangular panel roofs in 1951?

I am hoping so since I have a lot of them in my parts bin, but have been waiting for some time for an order of diagonal panel roofs from I/M.

regards,

Andy Miller

----- Original Message -----
From: Tim O'Connor
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2008 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers



And I'm not certain, but I think SRE is not to be confused
with USRE -- United States Railway Equipment -- which was a
rebuilder of freight cars during the 1960's (using the easily
recognized outline of the continental US as its builder logo)

Tim O'Connor

At 8/24/2008 03:00 PM Sunday, you wrote:
>Tim O'Connor wrote:
>> Correct -- I think we may apply "SRE" for the STMFC era.
>
> Good abbreviation. The company itself in the 1950s used "SRECo"
>in their ads, which I find a little compulsive.
>
>Tony Thompson


Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Tim O'Connor
 

And I'm not certain, but I think SRE is not to be confused
with USRE -- United States Railway Equipment -- which was a
rebuilder of freight cars during the 1960's (using the easily
recognized outline of the continental US as its builder logo)

Tim O'Connor

At 8/24/2008 03:00 PM Sunday, you wrote:
Tim O'Connor wrote:
Correct -- I think we may apply "SRE" for the STMFC era.
Good abbreviation. The company itself in the 1950s used "SRECo"
in their ads, which I find a little compulsive.

Tony Thompson


Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Correct -- I think we may apply "SRE" for the STMFC era.
Good abbreviation. The company itself in the 1950s used "SRECo" in their ads, which I find a little compulsive.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Tim O'Connor
 

Correct -- I think we may apply "SRE" for the STMFC era.

At 8/24/2008 01:50 PM Sunday, you wrote:
Andy Miller wrote:
In 1951 wouldn't they have used a diagonal panel (Stanray) roof?
It's a pretty tiny nit, Andy, but Standard Railway Equipment
didn't call themselves "Stanray" until after the validity period of
this list.

Tony Thompson


Re: The 1956 UP Box Car Data

Aley, Jeff A
 

Mike,

I am not aware of any Kansas fllods in 1956. There was a very large flood (greatly impacting traffic for many railroads) in July 1951. While the '51 flood was a great human and economic tragedy, it benefits us historians because everyone got out their camera and took photos of industries, railroad yards, etc.

Regards,

-Jeff


________________________________
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Mike Brock
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2008 9:13 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] The 1956 UP Box Car Data


Here's the much anticipated results of the 1956 UP train box car composition
over Sherman Hill. There were 31 trains. Of these, there were 5 EB "lumber"
trains containing 11, 10, 8, 9, and 10 SP box cars for a total of 48 cars.
If these were missed, the SP position changes quite a bit. UP, NYC and PRR
cars were rather evenly distributed. The 1956 data matches very well with
that of 1949 as far as UP, PRR, NYC, and SP is concerned. GN was a surprise
and I was pleased to see that NP had reached a level which could support
Brock's Fifth Rule of frt cars...although I have not the courage to check
each train for at least one NP car. ATSF was apparently upset with their
somewhat puny showing and responded by sending 98 SFRD reefers [ MT ] in one
train. Perhaps this was due to the Kansas floods...I have not checked on the
dates. Practically every RR was represdented. Box cars of special interest
were one CV, a few BAR and a MEC. I am most proud of the 2 N&W hoppers [
bless their dirty souls ] plus 2 PRR hoppers, one MKT, 2 Mopac and my
favorite, a WAB hopper.

Position RR cars
1. UP: 249
2. PRR: 126
3. NYC: 107
4. SP: 101
4a. SP & TNO: 115
5. GN: 57
6. NP: 43
7. C&O: 41
8. C&NW: 40
8. B&O: 40
9. Milw: 38
10. SR: 32
11. CB&Q: 24
12. ATSF: 23

Mike Brock


Re: Different color running boards on Erie/NKP box cars

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Aug 24, 2008, at 8:59 AM, Dean Payne wrote:

I recently saw a photo (I forget where) of a Des Plaines Hobbies Erie
box car with a black Viking roof, but body-color running board. This
is kind of odd, kind of neat, I can't decide which. Is this
prototypical?
In favor of yes, I have a Proto 2000 50' Erie box car with gray roof
and black running board.
In favor of no, I remember that the kit that I got included body-color
grabs and ladders for the ends, which I painted black, since the ends
were black. I have a Des Plaines NKP box that came with the same
color scheme. Should I paint the running boards on those cars black?
If so, I still find it odd that the Proto kit had only the running
board black, not the ends or roof (before weathering...)












I don't know about Erie or NKP practice, but from the early 1930s
through the mid-'50s, Santa Fe standard practice was to paint the
roofs with black car cement into which a gritty material was added to
provide secure footing in case a trainman stepped off the running
boards. From the mid-'50s until running boards were removed, the
Santa Fe continued to use the gritty material, but it was sprinkled
onto wet mineral brown paint instead of black. Wood running boards
were always mineral brown. Steel running boards were unpainted
galvanized metal on new or rebuilt cars, black or mineral brown on
repainted cars, depending on when the repainting was carried out.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Andy Miller wrote:
In 1951 wouldn't they have used a diagonal panel (Stanray) roof?
It's a pretty tiny nit, Andy, but Standard Railway Equipment didn't call themselves "Stanray" until after the validity period of this list.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Dan Hall doors

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

Does anyone know where I can get some Dan Hall 7 panel Superior doors, like
Ted C used in his Jan 2008 PS-1 build in RMC?

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Re: TRUCK WEAR - was What HO truck(s) do we STMFC'ers want?

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

The original question/comment was about the ECW trucks. These are made of
styrene and when metal wheel sets were used, the metal axle wore out the
sideframe cones. Now this was awhile ago, before Reboxx introduced their
truck tool. The original sideframes may not have had true cones which
exasperated the problem.

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Re: Different color running boards on Erie/NKP box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

Dean

I think the most common practice was not to apply black
"car cement" to wooden running boards. But the only builder
roof photo I've seen is Erie 75893, a 1930 built car -- the
roof panels are galvanized, and the seam caps and running
board appear to be painted body color.

Tim O'

At 8/24/2008 11:59 AM Sunday, you wrote:
I recently saw a photo (I forget where) of a Des Plaines Hobbies Erie
box car with a black Viking roof, but body-color running board. This
is kind of odd, kind of neat, I can't decide which. Is this prototypical?
In favor of yes, I have a Proto 2000 50' Erie box car with gray roof
and black running board.
In favor of no, I remember that the kit that I got included body-color
grabs and ladders for the ends, which I painted black, since the ends
were black. I have a Des Plaines NKP box that came with the same
color scheme. Should I paint the running boards on those cars black?
If so, I still find it odd that the Proto kit had only the running
board black, not the ends or roof (before weathering...)
Dean Payne


Different color running boards on Erie/NKP box cars

Dean Payne
 

I recently saw a photo (I forget where) of a Des Plaines Hobbies Erie
box car with a black Viking roof, but body-color running board. This
is kind of odd, kind of neat, I can't decide which. Is this prototypical?
In favor of yes, I have a Proto 2000 50' Erie box car with gray roof
and black running board.
In favor of no, I remember that the kit that I got included body-color
grabs and ladders for the ends, which I painted black, since the ends
were black. I have a Des Plaines NKP box that came with the same
color scheme. Should I paint the running boards on those cars black?
If so, I still find it odd that the Proto kit had only the running
board black, not the ends or roof (before weathering...)
Dean Payne


Santa Fe Plug Door Reefers

Andy Miller <aslmmiller@...>
 

I am currently kitbashing some SantaFe plug door 40' iced reefers. The first model under consideration is an Rr-47. According to the ATSF Society's book on reefers these cars were built in 1951 with a rectangular panel (Murphy) roof. In 1951 wouldn't they have used a diagonal panel (Stanray) roof?

Similarly, the Sunshine Models info sheet on ATSF plug door reefers claims that the Rr-49s were rebuilt retaining their rectangular panel roof from a 1930's rebuilding, but the Society book claims they had diagonal panel roofs. Which is correct?

regards,

Andy Miller_dels info sheet


Re: TRUCK WEAR - was What HO truck(s) do we STMFC'ers want?

Steve Lucas <stevelucas3@...>
 

If you are showing .005" wear on Code 83 rails in HO track, then to
be totally prototypical, the rail probably needs changing out due to
head wear per AAR specs for 127#/132# RE rail. Or you could follow
the steam-era prototype practice of transposing inside and outside
rails on curves to equalise wear. ;)

I'm rather curious as to what the profile is like of the wheels that
you're replacing due to wear.

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., SUVCWORR@... wrote:


On another note, this past year we measured the track which has
been in use
the longest time -- code 83 Microengineering rail on CV ties and
found less
than .005 wear on code 83 track.

Rich Orr
Western Pennsylvania Model Railroad Museum

120181 - 120200 of 195620