Date   

Re: Mineral Service on your Roads

Bob McCarthy
 

Elden,
 
    It occured to me that my daughter's godfather handle AMAX properties in central GA.  I will check with him about the facts.  He was a wizard in the Atlanta legal business in the early 1970's, some of his clients were AMAX and Georgia-Pacific.
 
   He is also a model railroader, although of SP bent.  His father created the Titainium processing plant in Greenville, MS.  I will check on what he knows about cars that brought the Kaolin out of the Sandersville area.  Also, maybe he can provide information on the cars origin that brought the Titainium to Greenville, MS.
 
Bob McCarthy

--- On Tue, 10/14/08, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

From: Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...>
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Mineral Service on your Roads
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, October 14, 2008, 6:39 PM






Bob;

That is interesting. Do you know where CoG sent their cars? Were there any
specific concerns that went to CoG specifically for their kaolin? Was it
used at all in glass-making, too?

Thanks,

Elden Gatwood

____________ _________ _________ __

From: STMFC@yahoogroups. com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Bob
McCarthy
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 2:18 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Mineral Service on your Roads

Howdy!

Lately, I have been building and lettering a string of Central of
Georgia two and three bay covered hoppers. They were used in Kaolin service
that has many uses in both the paper (coating), fine china/ceramics, and
medicine (Kaopectate) , etc.

Since most of the members of this site are in HO, I can tell you that
the Central of Georgia Historical Society, Allen Tuten, President, Google it
and you can ask for Micro- scalle decals for these cars.

Bob McCarthy

--- On Tue, 10/14/08, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@ usace.army. mil
<mailto:elden. j.gatwood% 40usace.army. mil> > wrote:

From: Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@ usace.army. mil
<mailto:elden. j.gatwood% 40usace.army. mil> >
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Mineral Service on your Roads
To: STMFC@yahoogroups. com <mailto:STMFC% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Tuesday, October 14, 2008, 5:36 PM

Folks;

I have been doing a bunch more reading on minerals shipped by the railroads,
and figure you could have an interest. This may create a more interesting
through or set-out operation for you, or even an on-line industrial
interchange with your road, if we can figure out what cars were used by what
roads, in this service.

We have pretty good ideas of what roads shipped coal, and iron ore, but there
is a lot that can be done to ID some of the rest, some of which was shipped
in open hoppers, others in covered hoppers, and even box cars. Mineral
service was a huge amount of the traffic on most roads, even those you
wouldn't think of, so I hope we can figure some of this out.

Here we go:

Aluminum; source area usually overseas (Guinea, Jamaica, Brazil, India);
would have entered U.S. ports, most eastern.

QUESTIONS: What ports, and shipped by what roads, where destined, how
shipped? How much?

Ammonium Sulfate; by-product of coking industry; used as soil amendment,
white to yellow powder, shipped most often bagged, in box cars. Sources:
Coke Industry - Bethlehem Steel, Colorado Fuel & Iron, Crucible Steel,
Detroit Steel, Eastern Gas & Fuel, Ford Motor Co., Granite City Steel, Inland
Steel, Interlake Iron, International Harvester, Jones & Laughlin, Kaiser
Steel, Merritt-Chapman & Scott-Tennessee Products & Chemical, National Steel,
Pittsburgh Coke & Chemical, Pittsburgh Steel, Republic Steel, Sharon Steel,
U.S. Pipe & Foundry, U.S. Steel (numerous locations), Wheeling Steel,
Woodward Iron, Youngstown Sheet & Tube (to start) If you want more details
about any of these facilities' production rates or locations, ask!

Questions: Where did all this bagged product go first, before it went to
local feed & fertilizer distributors?

Calcium Carbide: grayish-white mineral used in de-sulphurization of iron.
Also used in deoxidization at the ladle, in treatment.

QUESTIONS: Sources? Shipped by what roads? Are these the cylindrical tanks
we have seen shipped on the NYC and RI in dedicated service rack flats? How
much of this was shipped?

Chromium: blue-white ore; by 1952, 40% was coming from Turkey, 38% South
Africa, some from s. Egypt & Cuba (i.e., 79% import), with small amounts from
Montana, California, Oregon, and Alabama. Used in ferrochromium production.
Most coming through ports of Philadelphia, Baltimore (others??). Shipped
most often in open twin hoppers not filled to volumetric capacity due to
weight. Most headed to specialty steel-making facilities (and small
industrial chromium coating concerns, but first through where?)

QUESTIONS: What other ports, and shipped by what roads? How much?

More minerals, later! Any input appreciated.

Elden Gatwood

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar

David North <davenorth@...>
 

Thanks Richard

Cheers

Dave





No. The 200 Ft-V class cars were the Santa Fe's only AAR 70 ton flat
cars, and those were actually war emergency cars delivered in 1944
(though the difference between the recommended practice and war
emergency designs isn't an issue for modelers, since it was just the
replacement of metal floor stringers with wood). After the war, the
Santa Fe went to cast steel flat cars with GSC one-piece castings
(classes Ft-W, Ft-3, Ft-5, etc.).
Richard Hendrickson


Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 14, 2008, at 12:12 PM, mcindoefalls wrote:

--- In STMFC@..., "Dave Nelson" <Lake_Muskoka@...> wrote:

$30 for a flatcar?
Hey, it's ready to run and has a *real wood* deck! But seriously, the
Red Caboose SP flat was pretty pricey, too, although one might think
the tooling costs would be somewhat less than for a house car or
hopper.

Walt Lankenau










C'mon, guys, get real about prices. I have it on good authority from
a manufacturer who prefers not to be quoted that the cost of
everything in China - molding, assembly, packaging - is going up
rapidly, and gets higher every week. It won't be long before
assembled HO scale freight car models will be selling in the $40-$50
range. Remember a few years ago when a lot of modelers declared that
they'd never give $30 for a freight car model, even if it was from
Kadee. And there was such sales resistance that Kadee went broke,
right? And we all went back to shake the blue box Irv Athearn kits,
right? Ask any of us who've traveled overseas lately what the dollar
is now worth relative to other currencies (i'd add that we all know
who to blame for that, but our moderator proscribes political
comments). And then consider how much better the products we're
getting now are in accuracy and quality. $30 for an assembled flat
car? You bet, and it will be more next year. Get 'em while you can.


Richard Hendrickson


Re: NYC Rebuilt USRA Gondolas - black colour scheme

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 13, 2008, at 9:25 AM, Monk Alan wrote:

just taken delivery of my third NYC's rebuilt USRA gon (F&C kit) and,
for variety (having finished the first two in freight car red/brown) I
rather fancy finishing it in the earlier NYC black colour scheme which
was applied, according to the instructions, throught to 1942.
Couple of
questions first though...

1. Was the lettering any different to that supplied with the kit?








Alan, I built mine years ago, so I'm not certain, but my
recollection is that I supplemented the kit decals, which (as was
often true of F&C) weren't very good. Of course, they may be better
now.


2. Would the black scheme still be seen in the mid-50s (when my layout
will be set)??





Well, as they say in your part of the English speaking world, not
bloody likely. By the mid-'50s many of these cars had been retired
or rebuilt, so their numbers were declining, and though a few might
have survived that long with black paint, modeling one would verge on
the implausible.


A pointer to a pic verifying either/both would be a bonus!




I have several photos of what appear (in B/W photos) to be black NYC
gons dating from the 1930s, but none later than that.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Mineral Service on your Roads

Norman+Laraine Larkin <lono@...>
 

This is an interesting topic, Elden. Although what I'm about to say occurred 1968/1969 on the B&M, there's nothing to say something similar didn't occur in the 40s and 50s elsewhere. There were several major construction projects in the Metropolitan Boston area that required large amounts of gravel. One project, the I-95 extension north of Boston, required some 3.5M cubic yards of gravel alone over a nine month period. The B&M provided 300 70-ton hoppers, but required more. They leased 200 B&LE hoppers (5-year lease); 100 Pennsy hoppers (per diem lease) ; 50 BAR hoppers (per diem lease); and 18 Portland Terminal hoppers. Three 60-car trains and one 48-car train were run per day for the I-95 project, two additional trains were run for the Logan Airport expansion. It was a fascinating operation, but the point is the railroad had to lease cars from other carriers, in this case, five different road names in captive, regularly scheduled mineral service. I wonder how many times this occurred in our time frame. The above information was taken from the Winter 1974-1975 issue of the B&M Bulletin from an article by H. Bentley Crouch.
Regards
Norm Larkin

----- Original Message -----
From: Gatwood, Elden J SAD
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 1:36 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Mineral Service on your Roads


Folks;

I have been doing a bunch more reading on minerals shipped by the railroads,
and figure you could have an interest. This may create a more interesting
through or set-out operation for you, or even an on-line industrial
interchange with your road, if we can figure out what cars were used by what
roads, in this service.

We have pretty good ideas of what roads shipped coal, and iron ore, but there
is a lot that can be done to ID some of the rest, some of which was shipped
in open hoppers, others in covered hoppers, and even box cars. Mineral
service was a huge amount of the traffic on most roads, even those you
wouldn't think of, so I hope we can figure some of this out.

Here we go:

Aluminum; source area usually overseas (Guinea, Jamaica, Brazil, India);
would have entered U.S. ports, most eastern.

QUESTIONS: What ports, and shipped by what roads, where destined, how
shipped? How much?

Ammonium Sulfate; by-product of coking industry; used as soil amendment,
white to yellow powder, shipped most often bagged, in box cars. Sources:
Coke Industry - Bethlehem Steel, Colorado Fuel & Iron, Crucible Steel,
Detroit Steel, Eastern Gas & Fuel, Ford Motor Co., Granite City Steel, Inland
Steel, Interlake Iron, International Harvester, Jones & Laughlin, Kaiser
Steel, Merritt-Chapman & Scott-Tennessee Products & Chemical, National Steel,
Pittsburgh Coke & Chemical, Pittsburgh Steel, Republic Steel, Sharon Steel,
U.S. Pipe & Foundry, U.S. Steel (numerous locations), Wheeling Steel,
Woodward Iron, Youngstown Sheet & Tube (to start) If you want more details
about any of these facilities' production rates or locations, ask!

Questions: Where did all this bagged product go first, before it went to
local feed & fertilizer distributors?

Calcium Carbide: grayish-white mineral used in de-sulphurization of iron.
Also used in deoxidization at the ladle, in treatment.

QUESTIONS: Sources? Shipped by what roads? Are these the cylindrical tanks
we have seen shipped on the NYC and RI in dedicated service rack flats? How
much of this was shipped?

Chromium: blue-white ore; by 1952, 40% was coming from Turkey, 38% South
Africa, some from s. Egypt & Cuba (i.e., 79% import), with small amounts from
Montana, California, Oregon, and Alabama. Used in ferrochromium production.
Most coming through ports of Philadelphia, Baltimore (others??). Shipped
most often in open twin hoppers not filled to volumetric capacity due to
weight. Most headed to specialty steel-making facilities (and small
industrial chromium coating concerns, but first through where?)

QUESTIONS: What other ports, and shipped by what roads? How much?

More minerals, later! Any input appreciated.

Elden Gatwood


Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar

Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

Jim,
 
         This happens when a friend asks you to detail an N scale reefer o the same level as your HO scale one; or, being retired, the oil man is now getting your beer and hobby money.
 
Fred Freitas

--- On Tue, 10/14/08, Jim & Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...> wrote:

From: Jim & Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...>
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, October 14, 2008, 9:27 PM






Gene Green said
as vision diminishes and hand tremors increase<
I have the same problem Gene. I wonder what causes it? I know it can't be
age as I'm only 68.

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon


Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar

Jim & Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...>
 

Gene Green said
as vision diminishes and hand tremors increase<
I have the same problem Gene. I wonder what causes it? I know it can't be
age as I'm only 68.

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon


Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar

Jim & Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...>
 

Gene Green said

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Gene
Green
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 9:04 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar

Ed,
Thanks for the description. Now I know which car we are dealing with.
The Army had some out at Fort Bliss years ago and I was afforded plenty
of opportunity to examine them closely.

Unfortunately there do not appear to be any of these 70-ton flat cars
on the 48-49-50 Landmesser hot box list. Finding myself to be ever
less of a purist as vision diminishes and hand tremors increase, I'll
probably have to have a couple of these flats anyway.

Gene Green
OitwTtoEP


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



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2:02 AM


alternate standard twin offset hopper?

Jim & Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...>
 

Five years ago Sunshine did a mini-kit for this car with very thin side
castings to be overlaid over a sanded down Atlas hopper. I built one as a
sample for Martin and have another I'll never build. It's available for $5
if anyone wants it. Contact me OFF LIST if you want more info.

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon


Re: New HO scale 70-ton flatcar

Jim & Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...>
 

AT $30 apiece for the IMRC version, it's cheaper to go with the Protowest
www.protowestmodels.com resin kit at 2 for $44.95. I just received mine a
couple of weeks ago and it's a nice kit.

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon


Re: Mineral Service on your Roads

ATSF1226
 

Hi Folks,
The Santa Fe hauled Coal and Coke into Central AZ to support the
Gold, Silver and Copper mining industry around Prescott AZ. Most of
the Coal/Coke coming from on-line mines at Gallup or the area around
Raton NM, in gons and later open hoppers. Smelters existed at
Clarkdale, Jerome and Humboldt AZ. Not all smelters were in operation
at the same time. The smelter at Jerome was feed by a narrow gauge
line from Copper AZ (now Chino Valley) where a Transfer Trestle was
located. Transfering Coal/Coke from standard gauge cars to narrow
gauge cars took place. The smelter at Jerome closed in 1920 and all
operations were moved to the Clarkdale Smelter and the narrow gauge
railroad closed. The Humboldt smelter closed in the mid 30's and all
smeltiing requirements were moved to Clarkdale. At times when the
Clarkdale smelter was unable to meet the demand Copper ore was
shipped to smelters in Bisbee AZ or El Paso TX. The Clarkdale smelter
closed in 1953 when the United Verde Open Pit mine closed. Some
Copper ore was still being mined from smaller operations but was then
moved to Bisbee for processiing in Gons. Copper Matte was moved from
the smelters was transported in Santa Fe Boxcars (thru the time of
this list). The Clarkdale smelter reopened in 1957 to produce Cement
for the Glen Canyon Dam project in Page AZ and the population growth
in the Phoenix area. After reopening Natural Gas was used to fire the
smelter, later converted to Bunker C fuel oil (Tank Cars) and then
back to Coal/Coke. In addition to the fuel, railcars imported Mill
Scale from steel mills and Fly Ash from power plants (fluxing agents)
for the manufacturing process. The plant recieved 10 cars of
Coal/Coke per day, five days a week, up until it's closing in the mid
90's. The plant used 300 tons a day for production. Most outbound
loads for the dam were shipped by truck. Covered Hoppers and Boxcars
handled the loads for other areas.

George A Walls




I have been doing a bunch more reading on minerals shipped by the
railroads,
and figure you could have an interest. This may create a more
interesting
through or set-out operation for you, or even an on-line industrial
interchange with your road, if we can figure out what cars were
used by what
roads, in this service.



We have pretty good ideas of what roads shipped coal, and iron ore,
but there
is a lot that can be done to ID some of the rest, some of which was
shipped
in open hoppers, others in covered hoppers, and even box cars.
Mineral
service was a huge amount of the traffic on most roads, even those
you
wouldn't think of, so I hope we can figure some of this out.



Here we go:



Aluminum; source area usually overseas (Guinea, Jamaica, Brazil,
India);
would have entered U.S. ports, most eastern.



QUESTIONS: What ports, and shipped by what roads, where destined,
how
shipped? How much?



Ammonium Sulfate; by-product of coking industry; used as soil
amendment,
white to yellow powder, shipped most often bagged, in box cars.
Sources:
Coke Industry - Bethlehem Steel, Colorado Fuel & Iron, Crucible
Steel,
Detroit Steel, Eastern Gas & Fuel, Ford Motor Co., Granite City
Steel, Inland
Steel, Interlake Iron, International Harvester, Jones & Laughlin,
Kaiser
Steel, Merritt-Chapman & Scott-Tennessee Products & Chemical,
National Steel,
Pittsburgh Coke & Chemical, Pittsburgh Steel, Republic Steel,
Sharon Steel,
U.S. Pipe & Foundry, U.S. Steel (numerous locations), Wheeling
Steel,
Woodward Iron, Youngstown Sheet & Tube (to start) If you want more
details
about any of these facilities' production rates or locations, ask!



Questions: Where did all this bagged product go first, before it
went to
local feed & fertilizer distributors?



Calcium Carbide: grayish-white mineral used in de-sulphurization
of iron.
Also used in deoxidization at the ladle, in treatment.



QUESTIONS: Sources? Shipped by what roads? Are these the
cylindrical tanks
we have seen shipped on the NYC and RI in dedicated service rack
flats? How
much of this was shipped?



Chromium: blue-white ore; by 1952, 40% was coming from Turkey, 38%
South
Africa, some from s. Egypt & Cuba (i.e., 79% import), with small
amounts from
Montana, California, Oregon, and Alabama. Used in ferrochromium
production.
Most coming through ports of Philadelphia, Baltimore (others??).
Shipped
most often in open twin hoppers not filled to volumetric capacity
due to
weight. Most headed to specialty steel-making facilities (and small
industrial chromium coating concerns, but first through where?)



QUESTIONS: What other ports, and shipped by what roads? How much?





More minerals, later! Any input appreciated.



Elden Gatwood







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Mineral Service on your Roads

Robert <riverob@...>
 

Tech speaking, neither sand nor gravel are minerals. They, and coal,
are rocks. Rocks are composed of minerals. A mineral is a
geologically-formed solid consists one specific chemical composition
and can be an element like sulpher or a compound like feldspar or
quartz.

Coal is usually classed as a sedimentary rock (on the soft peat end
of the scale) to a metamorphic rock (on the hard anthracite end of
the scale).

Of course in the RR world, we usually refer to sand, gravel, and coal
transportation as "mineral" service.

Rob Simpson



--- In STMFC@..., "Dave Nelson" <Lake_Muskoka@...> wrote:

Nobody has mentioned ordinary sand and gravel, which, after bit
coal, was, IIRC, the second most common commodity shipped in open top
cars... a fact that likely makes it the #1 mineral, as coal isn't a
mineral (it's combustable dirt) and most sand and gravel is. And
even better, virtual every railroad moved sand and gravel so such
loads can be used by almost everybody who has a layout.

A search thru the archives for the word gravel will turn up a
number of posts citing tonnages.

Dave Nelson


nice IC box car

Tim O'Connor
 

The photo is listed on fallen flags as a caboose
shot... Appears to be from the late 1950's.

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/ic/ic-c9377jya.jpg

Tim O'


Re: Mineral Service on your Roads

seaboard_1966
 

The Seaboard and the coast line both had significant traffic in phosphate. It was mined as a slurry and transported in what were called "wet rock" cars. After being processed, cleaned and dried, it was transported in covered hoppers. Some of these were purpose built for this job. Phosphate was also carried in conventional covered hoppers of the era as well.

A significant quantity of this product was destined for export markets and were shiped from ports in the Tampa Bay area to markets around the world.

Denis Blake
Marysville, OH


Re: Mineral Service on your Roads

Dave Nelson
 

Nobody has mentioned ordinary sand and gravel, which, after bit coal, was,
IIRC, the second most common commodity shipped in open top cars... a fact
that likely makes it the #1 mineral, as coal isn't a mineral (it's
combustable dirt) and most sand and gravel is. And even better, virtual
every railroad moved sand and gravel so such loads can be used by almost
everybody who has a layout.

A search thru the archives for the word gravel will turn up a number of
posts citing tonnages.

Dave Nelson


Re: US Army Air Corp Pics - Major cities

Thomas Baker
 

Will longitude and latitude help?

Tom


Re: US Army Air Corp Pics - Major cities

Jared Harper <harper-brown@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., richtownsend@... wrote:

This site tells you what the National Archives has.? I was right;
they're at College Park.

http://www.archives.gov/publications/general-info-
leaflets/26.html#aerial1

I have 1942-43 images of the towns on the Alma branch (just my era.)
However, it is very difficult to make out any details. I was very
disappointed. To make any use of them whatsoever you need a lot of
other information, i.e. station plats, on site visits, interviews with
locals. Even then they are not very useful.
Jared Harper
Athens, GA


Re: USRA Standard 100-ton Gondola Car Design

rwitt_2000
 

Al Kresse wrote:

Many of those B&O Quad Hops would eventually be reblt at the C&Os
Raceland Car Shops in the late-60s.

Al,

Actually the cars rebuilt at Raceland in the 1960's were the B&O classes
W-7, W-8 and W-9 AAR off-set side triple hoppers. The W-7 were build
after WWII (1947 and 1948) and the class W-8 and W-9 were added in 1956
and 1958 respectively.

Although ouside the time period for this group, I did a chart of these
B&O hoppers showing their disappearance from the B&O roster and their
addition to the C&O roster after the re-buildings. According to the ORER
of 1969 the B&O received ~1720 of these rebuilt hopper cars.

Bob Witt


Re: Availabilty of Superior hand brakes castings ?

ron christensen
 

Bernd
I'll check if CNWHS still has them, we no longer list them.
If the society doesn't have them I still think I can get some.
contact me off list.
Ron Christensen
CNWHS

--- In STMFC@..., "Bernd Schroeder" <schroed2.bears@...> wrote:

Hello list,

does anybody here have any information whether the castings for the
Superior hand brakes (that used to be available from the CNWHS as mentioned
in message 72129, but are not listed anymore on their website) can be
obtained somewhere, somehow ?


thanks

Bernd Schroeder

Adelsdorf, Germany


Re: Mineral Service on your Roads

Bob McCarthy
 

Elden,
 
    Allen Tuten emailed me since I emailed you.  He is forwarding to me a article on the Central of Georgia car loading of Kaolin.  At this time I only know about the types of industries that I mentioned, but I am sure more answers will become known.
 
     Some of these cars were used for grain shipment and labled as such.  It seems that the loading of Kaolin occured in the Sandersville, GA area, where there are large deposits of this mineral.  When I lived in Augusta, GA in the 1950's you would see these cars at the Continental Can plant on the southside.  Also, I saw them at a DIXIE CUP plant, where my guess is that they used it in some way to manufacture their glazed hot cups for coffee.  I am only speculating.
 
     The Central of Georgia Historical Society has decals for these cars.  They were light grey with black undercarriage and trucks.  I can forward images to those that might want to model these cars.  Since, I am in S scale, I have had Microscale blow up the HO version  for me.  If any S scaler reads this contact me off site about the decals. 
 
      This whole topic is very timely given my current covered hopper building program.
 
Thanks,  
 
Bob McCarthy

--- On Tue, 10/14/08, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

From: Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...>
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Mineral Service on your Roads
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, October 14, 2008, 6:39 PM






Bob;

That is interesting. Do you know where CoG sent their cars? Were there any
specific concerns that went to CoG specifically for their kaolin? Was it
used at all in glass-making, too?

Thanks,

Elden Gatwood

____________ _________ _________ __

From: STMFC@yahoogroups. com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Bob
McCarthy
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 2:18 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Mineral Service on your Roads

Howdy!

Lately, I have been building and lettering a string of Central of
Georgia two and three bay covered hoppers. They were used in Kaolin service
that has many uses in both the paper (coating), fine china/ceramics, and
medicine (Kaopectate) , etc.

Since most of the members of this site are in HO, I can tell you that
the Central of Georgia Historical Society, Allen Tuten, President, Google it
and you can ask for Micro- scalle decals for these cars.

Bob McCarthy

--- On Tue, 10/14/08, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@ usace.army. mil
<mailto:elden. j.gatwood% 40usace.army. mil> > wrote:

From: Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@ usace.army. mil
<mailto:elden. j.gatwood% 40usace.army. mil> >
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Mineral Service on your Roads
To: STMFC@yahoogroups. com <mailto:STMFC% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Tuesday, October 14, 2008, 5:36 PM

Folks;

I have been doing a bunch more reading on minerals shipped by the railroads,
and figure you could have an interest. This may create a more interesting
through or set-out operation for you, or even an on-line industrial
interchange with your road, if we can figure out what cars were used by what
roads, in this service.

We have pretty good ideas of what roads shipped coal, and iron ore, but there
is a lot that can be done to ID some of the rest, some of which was shipped
in open hoppers, others in covered hoppers, and even box cars. Mineral
service was a huge amount of the traffic on most roads, even those you
wouldn't think of, so I hope we can figure some of this out.

Here we go:

Aluminum; source area usually overseas (Guinea, Jamaica, Brazil, India);
would have entered U.S. ports, most eastern.

QUESTIONS: What ports, and shipped by what roads, where destined, how
shipped? How much?

Ammonium Sulfate; by-product of coking industry; used as soil amendment,
white to yellow powder, shipped most often bagged, in box cars. Sources:
Coke Industry - Bethlehem Steel, Colorado Fuel & Iron, Crucible Steel,
Detroit Steel, Eastern Gas & Fuel, Ford Motor Co., Granite City Steel, Inland
Steel, Interlake Iron, International Harvester, Jones & Laughlin, Kaiser
Steel, Merritt-Chapman & Scott-Tennessee Products & Chemical, National Steel,
Pittsburgh Coke & Chemical, Pittsburgh Steel, Republic Steel, Sharon Steel,
U.S. Pipe & Foundry, U.S. Steel (numerous locations), Wheeling Steel,
Woodward Iron, Youngstown Sheet & Tube (to start) If you want more details
about any of these facilities' production rates or locations, ask!

Questions: Where did all this bagged product go first, before it went to
local feed & fertilizer distributors?

Calcium Carbide: grayish-white mineral used in de-sulphurization of iron.
Also used in deoxidization at the ladle, in treatment.

QUESTIONS: Sources? Shipped by what roads? Are these the cylindrical tanks
we have seen shipped on the NYC and RI in dedicated service rack flats? How
much of this was shipped?

Chromium: blue-white ore; by 1952, 40% was coming from Turkey, 38% South
Africa, some from s. Egypt & Cuba (i.e., 79% import), with small amounts from
Montana, California, Oregon, and Alabama. Used in ferrochromium production.
Most coming through ports of Philadelphia, Baltimore (others??). Shipped
most often in open twin hoppers not filled to volumetric capacity due to
weight. Most headed to specialty steel-making facilities (and small
industrial chromium coating concerns, but first through where?)

QUESTIONS: What other ports, and shipped by what roads? How much?

More minerals, later! Any input appreciated.

Elden Gatwood

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