bill davis <billcheri72@yahoo.com> wrote:

>>While in Chicago area I went to the Illinois RR Museum. There was a
>>outside braced door and a half boxcar that I was told was an Alton car
>>later a C&IM car. Does anyone have information on this car and are
>>there any plans for it. Thanks for any help here.


Hi Bill,

C&A 39000-39249, Pullman 1924. To GM&O 39000-39249 in 1947. 2 cars on roster in 7/1950, off roster by 1/1951.

I've got one photo of the car at IRM, plus the Alton's 1924 diagram page for the car, which is about as close as you're likely to get to a "plan" for these cars. I'll email them to you offlist.

Regards,

Ray Breyer

Bill Davis asked:
"While in Chicago area I went to the Illinois RR Museum. There was a
outside braced door and a half boxcar that I was told was an Alton car
later a C&IM car. Does anyone have information on this car and are
there any plans for it."

First, "outside braced" is a modelers term that really means nothing.
These cars are more properly referred to as single sheathed boxcars.

Here's the listing from the IRM website:
http://www.irm.org/cgi-bin/rsearch.cgi?
freight=Chicago+&+Illinois+Midland=X-81

Do you have photo that you can upload?


Ben Hom

Hi All,
While in Chicago area I went to the Illinois RR Museum. There was a outside braced door and a half boxcar that I was told was an Alton car later a C&IM car. Does anyone have information on this car and are there any plans for it. Thanks for any help here.
BILL

Good Day All,

I have been told that Mainline Modeler did a feature article on the
RDG XMu boxcar. I've tried searching the online indexes but couldn't
find anything. Anyone know of this article? I am specifically
interested to know if the car represented in the plans is from the
first (1925?) or second batch (1930?).

Thanks

Brian

I am looking for some decals to do an Overland Models Boston and Maine
XM-1 boxcar. Any suggestions on decals for this car? I model 1942.
I saw that F&C does a minute man decal for the car but I think I read
somewhere the minuteman scheme wasn't introduced until 1946.

Jason Sanford

I've been under the impression that the Duryea underframe was an early
form of what became known as a "cushion" underframe in the 60's. So I
can certainly understand its application to boxcars. And I suppose
some flatcar and gondola loads would benefit from a cushion underframe.

But I see that Duryea underframes were even applied to hoppers. Why?

Walt Lankenau

Any chance you'll be sharing those pics? I sure would love to see them.

Best,
Lawrence Rast

On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 8:41 PM, william darnaby
<WDarnaby@worldnet.att.net> wrote:

Be wary of any instructions in the Sunshine kit as it seems they rarely get
it correct concerning Duryea UF's. Their B&O M55 version is completely
wrong for example. A couple of weekends ago I photographed the Duryea UF of
an ex-B&O M26d or e in a park north of Milan, OH and, while many of the
details found in Sunshine kits are there, the parts application and
orientation are different from any Sunshine instructions I have seen.

Bill Darnaby

In a message dated 10/22/2008 4:44:14 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
jimandlisa97225@verizon.net writes:

Sunshine sells "4 General American Duryea underframe parts/details for
modification of plastic & resin 40' boxcar kits" which might be useful.

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon

-----Original Message-----

Does anyone make a Duryea underframe conversion kit? Or is the

best thing

to fake it by extending the coupler pockets?

Rich Orr

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your
favorites,
no registration required and great graphics – check it out!
(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211202682x1200689022/aol?redir=
http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

Be wary of any instructions in the Sunshine kit as it seems they rarely get it correct concerning Duryea UF's. Their B&O M55 version is completely wrong for example. A couple of weekends ago I photographed the Duryea UF of an ex-B&O M26d or e in a park north of Milan, OH and, while many of the details found in Sunshine kits are there, the parts application and orientation are different from any Sunshine instructions I have seen.

Bill Darnaby

Hi list members,

Thanks Bob.

Some more nice images from this site. The url's are long and will need to be re-combined into one line after the email program gets thru with them. I'm including the image id (I assume one can use this to bring up the image) in case the urls are totally unusable.

- Claus Schlund

Image ID: 21670
Cincinnati Northern Auto box
https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullRecord.asp?id=21670&;qstring=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ewisconsinhistory%2Eorg%2Fwhi%2Fresults%2Easp%3Fpageno%3D35%26keyword1%3Drailroad%26search%5Ftype%3Dbasic%26sort%5Fby%3Ddate

Image ID: 17807
C&NW flat
https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullRecord.asp?id=17807&;qstring=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ewisconsinhistory%2Eorg%2Fwhi%2Fresults%2Easp%3Fpageno%3D38%26keyword1%3Drailroad%26search%5Ftype%3Dbasic%26sort%5Fby%3Ddate

Image ID: 48988
BREX reefer
https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullRecord.asp?id=48988&;qstring=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ewisconsinhistory%2Eorg%2Fwhi%2Fresults%2Easp%3Fpageno%3D40%26keyword1%3Drailroad%26search%5Ftype%3Dbasic%26sort%5Fby%3Ddate

URTX reefer
Image ID: 9479
https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullRecord.asp?id=9479&;qstring=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ewisconsinhistory%2Eorg%2Fwhi%2Fresults%2Easp%3Fpageno%3D41%26keyword1%3Drailroad%26search%5Ftype%3Dbasic%26sort%5Fby%3Ddate

CGW box car
Image ID: 46459
https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullRecord.asp?id=46459&;qstring=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ewisconsinhistory%2Eorg%2Fwhi%2Fresults%2Easp%3Fpageno%3D41%26keyword1%3Drailroad%26search%5Ftype%3Dbasic%26sort%5Fby%3Ddate

CB&Q box car
Image ID: 59415
https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullRecord.asp?id=59415&;qstring=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ewisconsinhistory%2Eorg%2Fwhi%2Fresults%2Easp%3Fpageno%3D49%26keyword1%3Drailroad%26search%5Ftype%3Dbasic%26sort%5Fby%3Ddate
Image ID: 59415

Apparently the box was converted, or originally built, to carry coal in bulk, with top loading hatches and side unloading doors. Very interesting arrangement. Would make an interesting model, something to do with those surplus wooden box cars.

John Stokes
bellevue, WA



To: STMFC@yahoogroups.comFrom: riverob@gmail.comDate: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 22:55:23 +0000Subject: [STMFC] Re: Freight Car Images From The Wisconsin Historical Society’s Website




It looks like the WCC car has roof hatches.Rob Simpson--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Chaparro" <thecitrusbelt@...> wrote:<sni>> Transferring bodies of a standard gauge box car (of the Wisconsin > Coal Co.) to the narrow gauge trucks of the Fond du Lac, Amboy & > Peoria Railway at Iron Mountain, Wisconsin., c 1900> > http://wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullimage.asp?id=24529<;snip>

It looks like the WCC car has roof hatches.

Rob Simpson

The Wisconsin Historical Society's website
(http://wisconsinhistory.org/) has several railroad subject images.
Below are links to some of these images. Enjoy.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA
===================
A 1912 image of a Frisco Box car. It appears that the upper door
guide has seen a lot of service.

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullimage.asp?id=9724

New York Central box car image taken in 1917:

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullimage.asp?id=35439

Unloading fiber at an International Harvester twine mill, c 1948.
Freight car appears to be a Santa Fe box car with map logo.

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullimage.asp?id=59424

Same activity and location, different box car.:

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullimage.asp?id=59422

Transferring bodies of a standard gauge box car (of the Wisconsin
Coal Co.) to the narrow gauge trucks of the Fond du Lac, Amboy &
Peoria Railway at Iron Mountain, Wisconsin., c 1900

http://wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullimage.asp?id=24529

1911 image of rail cars carrying two 150 horse-power boilers for use
in the temporary power plant at the dam construction site at Prairie
du Sac. The cars also carry sections of smoke stack.

http://wisconsinhistory.org/whi/fullimage.asp?id=49515

Sunshine sells "4 General American Duryea underframe parts/details for
modification of plastic & resin 40' boxcar kits" which might be useful.

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon

Folks,

What and when was the first offset-sides construction coal car? I've
the VGN 50000 120-ton gon blt June 1917 by Pressed Stl Car Co and VGN
G4 Class blt in Nov 1920. Earlier N&W 90-ton gons were flush-sides
cars. C&O 100000-10999 91-ton gons were not blt until Feb 1922
(Pressed Stl and Standard Stl car co's).

Did the Pressed Steel Car Company have a patent on this design?

Enterprise has a patent that is similar but for a hopper car
construction in awarded in 1925.

Al Kresse

Ted Culotta's Speedwitch makes a Red Caboose M-26 to M-26d/e
conversion fkit and one bundled with a boxcar kit.

The troubles are:

(1) patent research by Bob Witt and myself show that the Duryea
underframe product evolved over time, and B&O always bought the
latest version.

(2) versions for hoppers and boxcars differ a lot.


--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, SUVCWORR@... wrote:

Does anyone make a Duryea underframe conversion kit? Or is the

best thing

to fake it by extending the coupler pockets?

Rich Orr

In a message dated 10/21/2008 3:21:36 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
jmischke@... writes:


Prototype B&O W-7's had Duryea underframes, so the Accurail triple
bay offset side hopper is not quite right.

I did not help with that one. Nor the 1956 Athearn quad hopper.





--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Ed Hawkins <hawk0621@> wrote:

On Oct 15, 2008, at 12:57 PM, jim_mischke wrote:

After watching obscure ATSF and Missouri Pacific versions of

popular

car types come out because of some consultant's favorite

railroad,

it's
feels good to win one.

Jim Mischke
B&OHS Model Committee

Jim,
Uhh, what I don't quite understand is why there wasn't a similar

vague

reference to the obscure Accurail triple offset-side AAR 70-ton

hopper

car that was ONLY correct (albeit poorly rendered Z-sections on

the

ends) for 1,000 B&O W-7 cars produced in 1947. I've often

wondered

how

that "rare" car happened to be selected when there were other

superior

choices. Surely the decision wasn't made by some self-interested

B&O

modeler. At any rate, I'm glad you have learned the process of

how

to

get self-interest models produced. Among other good choices,

could

the

B&O version of the AAR 50-ton hopper car (a car that was built

in

huge

numbers) be far away? <g>
Regards,
Ed Hawkins

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links







**************New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your

destination.

Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out
(http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000002)


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks Jim.

Rich Orr

The VGN 50000 was not an offset side car. It was an outside rib battleship
gon.

According to Martin Karig in "Coal Cars the First Three Hundred Years" The
first offset cars were built for the C&O in 1921 (pg 261) #100000 - 100999.
The first patent for the design was issued to John A. Pilcher (# 1,433,096)
on Oct 24, 1922. The next patent was issued to Enterprise (#1,537,051) May
1925. Wine received a patent for a different offset design in 1929
(#1,698,866). A fourth patent was issued to William F. Kiesel, Jr. Mechanical Engineer
for the PRR in 1931 (#1,834,952) and was used in the PRR class H27. (See pg
74 of Karig) See also Karig pg 298-329 for photos. The Wine design was
licensed to the ARA and was adopted as the 1928 standard practice design.

Rich Or

Jim,

Thanks for the info. But I think you may have inadvertently compounded my
problem. I am attempting to convert a few cabooses.

Rich Orr

Ben,
Thanks for those two very useful references. I'll print out both and
put them with my NYC material.
Gene Green

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@...> wrote:

Gene Green wrote:
"It seems easier to find model matches for the PRR cars. The NYC

and

subsidiaries appear to present more of a challenge. That is why I
asked all the questions."

I think the biggest reason behind the under-representation of NYC
boxcars on a typical layout (aside from SPFs with a tenuous grip on
reality) is a lack of understanding of the NYC boxcar fleet brought
on by the Byzantine lot number system. For example, almost

everyone

on this list knows what a PRR Class X29 boxcar is, but how many of
you know off the top of your head what a NYC Lot 414-B boxcar looks
like? (Answer at bottom of page.)

For more online on understanding the NYC boxcar fleet, see:

Jeff English's handout from the 2000 Hunt Valley PM Meet on the
subject:
http://www.steamfreightcars.com/prototype/frtcars/nycsboxmain.html

Terry Link's breakdown of NYC freight car lots, including links to
equipment diagrams and photos:
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-MODELS-FREIGHT.htm


Ben Hom

Answer: The most under-represented car on steam era layouts, Lot

414-

B is a 1000-car lot of NYC's 8 ft 7 in IH USRA-design steel boxcars,
NYC 180000-180999 (original), renumbered to NYC 101000-101999. If
you take all of the different IH of these cars as a group, the
numbers are on the same order as the PRR X29 fleet.