Date   

Re: ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

Paul Hillman
 

Thanks Andy & all, for the links & info.

I guess I had found a photo on the SF-HS site of the 1300 series, under Links-Waycars-Caboose Photos by Don Ross, of #1430 in Chicago, ILL July 1969. I didn't know that it was of the 1300-series.

Looks like the Santa Fe had at least 131 cabooses of the 1300-series. What was the complete series numbers?

Paul Hillman

----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Sperandeo<mailto:asperandeo@mrmag.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com<mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 8:54 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses


Hello Paul,

The only changes were to the lettering. The ampersand was omitted beginning in 1938 (A.T.S.F.) and the periods were omitted (ATSF) beginning in 1943. The windows, three on one side and four on the other, stayed the same. There are photos of a caboose of this series on the Santa Fe society Web site at http://users.snowcrest.net/photobob/sfr42.html.<http://users.snowcrest.net/photobob/sfr42.html.>

Happy Thanksgiving,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
Model Railroader magazine
asperandeo@mrmag.com<mailto:asperandeo%40mrmag.com>
262-796-8776, ext. 461
FAX 262-796-1142


Re: Philadelphia Quartz Type 21 tank car

Allen Cain <allencain@...>
 

Curiosity is getting the best of me this fine Thanksgiving morning.

I have always assumed that these cars would have serviced glass making
industries but I am curious as to what other industries these might have
serviced in the early 1950s.

Allen Cain


Re: Pipe loads on the cheap

SUVCWORR@...
 

Dean:

For larger diameter pipe (24 - 36") I have used 1/4" or 3/8" copper tubing.
Cut it to length then use a vertical boring machine or a drill press to thin
the walls to a depth of 1/4 inch or so. This give a visually thin wall but
maintains the overall integrity of the pipe. Paint to match the color of the
company manufacturing the pipe -- US steel black, J&L steel tuscan, Armco
steel dk blue, anything from American Bridge was orange although that was
mostly structural steel for bridges. Not sure the correct color for Bethlehem
steel pipe. Also adds some weight to the gon. Brass or aluminum tubing would
work just as well.

Rich Orr

In a message dated 11/27/2008 11:02:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
1payne1@windstream.net writes:

I've got two pending resin orders, but I've noticed that I've got a
lot of empty gons. The W&LE served the South Lorain pipe works, so
I've decided to model a bunch of pipe loads. I can't afford to buy
commercial loads for all these without having to reduce my resin
order, so...
Are there any especially good sources for "pipe"? I've got a bunch of
coffee stirrers, of course, but I don't know if there is something
better. (Mine are a scale 35' 8" or so, 10" approx. OD) I seem to
remember seeing something about someone who found a source of
especially nice stirrers, but don't remember the source.
The pipe load from Life-Like (on sale at Walthers) looks too
thick-walled for my tastes (and a little too "plastic-ey").

Dean Payne


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Re: ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

atsfsd26 <davenorth@...>
 

Hi Paul,
Here is a link to some pics of 1426 taken in 1955.
http://users.snowcrest.net/photobob/sfr42.html
cheers
Dave




Walthers is selling their ATSF 1300-series wood cabooses in 2
types,
either as the 1938 to 1943 version, or 1943 to Retirement version.

Their pictures for the 1938 to 1943 version, show the "right-side"
(offset cupola to the left) with 3 side-windows, & the ATSF
lettering
with periods.

Their pictures for the 1943 to Retirement version, show the "left-
side" (offset cupola to the right) with 4 side-windows, & the ATSF
lettering without periods.

I couldn't find prototype pictures or drawings of the 1300's on the
ATSF historical site or elsewhere.

What were the 1943 changes? Just the lettering or the addition of a
4th window? The lettering style looks the same for both versions,
just the periods missing after 1943.

Also, always, the main question,...is this an "accurate" physical
model?

Walthers part #'s, 932-27582 & 932-27583

Paul Hillman


Re: Philadelphia Quartz Type 21 tank car

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Nov 26, 2008, at 7:44 PM, Brian J Carlson wrote:

This past weekend I picked up a P2K Type 21 decorated for Philadelphia
Quartz in a black tank with yellow lettering. The car number was 506.
Knowing that P2k was very good about only putting accurate schemes
on cars I
am sure the P&L is correct. I am trying to determine what trucks we
applied
to these cars. A photo of POX 806 built in 1928 is on page 113 of
Kaminski's ACF Tank car book, but I believe this to be a later Type
27 based
on the build date. The series doesn't appear in Ed Hawkins roster
in RPC
though. Given the way tank car leases changed, that is not surprising.

Any help on the trucks would be appreciated.











PQX 805-858 and 512-518 were essentially identical; both series were
8K gal. Type 21s. (Type 21s continued to be produced, at least as
late as 1929, after the Type 27 was introduced). Both series came
from the builders with 40 ton ARA trucks with spring planks (i.e.,
Accurail). Philadelphia Quartz owned, not leased, their cars, so
their fleet remained unchanged over the years except when they
purchased new cars.

Richard Hendrickson


Philadelphia Quartz Type 21 tank car

Brian J Carlson <brian@...>
 

This past weekend I picked up a P2K Type 21 decorated for Philadelphia
Quartz in a black tank with yellow lettering. The car number was 506.
Knowing that P2k was very good about only putting accurate schemes on cars I
am sure the P&L is correct. I am trying to determine what trucks we applied
to these cars. A photo of POX 806 built in 1928 is on page 113 of
Kaminski's ACF Tank car book, but I believe this to be a later Type 27 based
on the build date. The series doesn't appear in Ed Hawkins roster in RPC
though. Given the way tank car leases changed, that is not surprising.

Any help on the trucks would be appreciated.

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Re: Norfolk Southern color

mcindoefalls
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, LOUIS WHITELEY <octoraro1@...> wrote:

http://images.google.com/hosted/life/l?q=freight+car+source:life&imgurl=4617f3a9036aa1cd
popped up among the Life photos.

A great photo from a weathering standpoint, too! How about those toe
scuffs up the ladder, as well as the faded lettering?

Walt Lankenau


Re: Norfolk Southern color

LOUIS WHITELEY <octoraro1@...>
 

http://images.google.com/hosted/life/l?q=freight+car+source:life&imgurl=4617f3a9036aa1cd  popped up among the Life photos.  This is a terrific resource.

--- On Sat, 10/4/08, Louis C. Whiteley <octoraro1@verizon.net> wrote:

From: Louis C. Whiteley <octoraro1@verizon.net>
Subject: [STMFC] Norfolk Southern color
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, October 4, 2008, 10:21 AM






Can anyone suggest appropriate colors for the Norfolk Southern XM-3
(25500-series, Magor, 1942) and XM-5 (27000-series, P-S, 1947) boxcars
as delivered? I appreciate any leads -- formula, color photo source,
or "similar to . . ."?

Thank you.

Lou Whiteley
Lawrenceville, NJ


Re: PRR Gon info request

Roger Hinman <rhinman@...>
 

And there are examples of libraries that separated the two and had
them bound independently. I've had a couple of instances where I've
request a certain year's volume and all I got was six months
of bound advertisements. (and most months were identical)

Roger Hinman

On Nov 25, 2008, at 8:29 PM, Anthony Thompson wrote:

Rich Burg wrote:
When libraries received their bound copies of Railway Age all the
advertisement pages (which were split between the front and back of
each magazine) were removed. This allowed the whole six months of
issues to fit in one book, albeit a book bigger than the size of a
Car
Builder's Cyc. The loss of these ads also from a historical
standpoint
was unfortunate since often the ads told you more than the articles.
Bound volumes of Railway Age also contained (usually, I've seen
bound
volumes without it) a master index for the whole year, with listings
that indicated the "volume" and page, such as JJ 1242, or JD 802 for
example.
It was up to the individual library whether or not to remove those
ad pages. I have seen some volumes of RA which DID have the ads.
Happily, I've never encountered one without an index--an extremely
helpful feature in a journal like this one--but I have seen one
instance of a bound volume in which the copies were all front to back,
in other words the newest magazine was in the front, and the oldest at
the back. Makes page-finding a little challenging.
The pages with the letters, as in your examples, are from the
annual convention issues.

Oh, and just to keep the name straight, it's William Kiesel, not
Walter.
True. I'd missed the wrong name inserted by Ben Hom in an earlier
post.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history



Re: Norfolk Southern color

Charles Hladik
 

Lou,
I'm forwarding this to the NMRA Division near Raleigh, N.C. They just
had a run made of an original NS boxcar.
Chuck Hladik

In a message dated 11/26/2008 9:45:04 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
octoraro1@verizon.net writes:




_http://images.http://imaghttp://imagehttp://imagehttp://imaghttp&imgurl=imgur
l=<WBR>4617_
(http://images.google.com/hosted/life/l?q=freight+car+source:life&imgurl=4617f3a9036aa1cd) popped up among the Life photos. This is a
terrific resource.

--- On Sat, 10/4/08, Louis C. Whiteley <_octoraro1@verizon.oct_
(mailto:octoraro1@verizon.net) > wrote:

From: Louis C. Whiteley <_octoraro1@verizon.oct_
(mailto:octoraro1@verizon.net) >
Subject: [STMFC] Norfolk Southern color
To: _STMFC@yahoogroups.STM_ (mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com)
Date: Saturday, October 4, 2008, 10:21 AM

Can anyone suggest appropriate colors for the Norfolk Southern XM-3
(25500-series, Magor, 1942) and XM-5 (27000-series, P-S, 1947) boxcars
as delivered? I appreciate any leads -- formula, color photo source,
or "similar to . . ."?

Thank you.

Lou Whiteley
Lawrenceville, NJ

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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AOL.com.
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web site update

Peter Ness
 

I've completed a rather large update to my web site.

The freight car page is completely revised including a new format to
be friendlier to both New Haven modelers and modelers of other
railroads interested in adding appropriate foreign cars to their
rosters.

I've added a couple of additional heavyweight cars to coach and head
end pages as well as a couple of new links.

I've added a new page to which I uploaded my 2008 NHRHTA Clinic on
modeling NH 33000-33499 series Post-war AAR 10'IH 40' Steel Boxcars.
Sunshine Models produced a kit for this car many years ago which has
been discontinued. I show how to build the Improved Dreadnaught Ends
two ways - one based on Branchline parts and the other using
Intermountain ends back-dated with Archer rivet decals.

Happy Thanksgiving!

Enjoy,
Peter
http://www.freewebs.com/newhavenrailroad1959/


Re: Life magazine/Google photos

Greg Martin
 

Actually the term for the siding was V-Joint T&G or Butt-Joint T&G. Often was the case where the boards were either single boards as seen on PFE (early)?cars or V&CV-T&G? which was was V-Joint with a Center Vee in the same board.? These were standard patterns by most all the grading agencies. The double patterned boards were just a labor savings over singe pattern boards.?On horizontal sheathing the boards were applied with the Tounge pointing up to decrease the chance of water collecting in the Groove. Peronally I like the appearance of the PFE application (early cars) as the weathering of the single boards is visually more interesting. There is a good shot of one here..

http://images.google.com/hosted/life/l?imgurl=dfc3277ac546bd17&q=freight+car+source:life&usg=__TL-KvjRlkNJnJFBYq_w_wTGIqZA=&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dfreight%2Bcar%2Bsource:life%26start%3D100%26ndsp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN

A great example and as you scroll through look at the other wood reefers to see the difference.

Greg Martin

-----Original Message-----
From: cj riley <cjriley42@yahoo.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 9:30 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Life magazine/Google photos








--- On Tue, 11/25/08, Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com> wrot

Most T&G siding had a modest V-groove at each edge, so there

SHOULD be a groove on such sheathing. OTOH, most single-sheathed cars

did not use such siding; but in at least some cases, the sheathing DID

include a T&G connection between the (horizontal) boards, despite no

V-groove at the surface.

To be more precise (isn't that the group's goal) the siding boards had a chamfer on the edges ( a 45 degree bevel) that created the appearance of a v groove when 2 boards were butted. It is common to chamfer edges on boards so theat they don't splinter as badly as a 90 degree corner wood.But Tony is right that t&g siding can be chamfered or unchamfered.
CJ Riley


Re: Bronx photo

ed_mines
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, " Westerfield" <westerfield@...> wrote:
NYC is a big place with lots of drinkers. :) - Al Westerfield

Al I think you misunderstood my comment. I'll bet even winos prefer
their cheap wine without kerosene in it. Maybe the government too.

Cleaning 8000 gallon tanks is a big job.

Did wineries make any other products that weren't consumed? Like paint
remover?

Back in the day when I knocked down a few I decided to do some work on
a N&W Quality Craft caboose I was building after a night of drinking. I
didn't notice that one of the spacer blocks is behind the small window.

Ed


Re: ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

The steel cars were the primary waycars during my era, and rumor has it that a major manufacturer is coming out with those soon, a substantial upgrade to Athearn.<
Intermountain has plans to do the back-dated version of this car that was originally produced by Centiala. They had drawings but not samples at the National in SoCa. Supected date is '09 but then we know how dates are!


Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

Steve SANDIFER
 

If you can find them (out of print), the best resources are the Priest book and the Ellington book on Santa Fe Waycars. Ebay and bookfinder.com are two good resources. Their use depends on the era you model. I model 1951-53, so they were on branch line and MOW by that time. The steel cars were the primary waycars during my era, and rumor has it that a major manufacturer is coming out with those soon, a substantial upgrade to Athearn.

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Hillman
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 7:20 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses


Thanks Steve,

Good info. Would like to see some prototype photos. Still looking.

Paul Hillman

----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sandifer<mailto:steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com<mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2008 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

The only difference is the lettering.
It is an accurate model.
http://atsfrr.net/Reviews/HO/Freight/WalCab/Index.htm<http://atsfrr.net/Reviews/HO/Freight/WalCab/Index.htm>
______________
J. Stephen (Steve) Sandifer
mailto:steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net<mailto:steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net>
Home: 12027 Mulholland Drive, Meadows Place, TX 77477, 281-568-9918
Office: Southwest Central Church of Christ, 4011 W. Bellfort, Houston, TX 77025, 713-667-9417

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul & Bernice Hillman
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com<mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2008 7:57 PM
Subject: [STMFC] ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

Walthers is selling their ATSF 1300-series wood cabooses in 2 types,
either as the 1938 to 1943 version, or 1943 to Retirement version.

Their pictures for the 1938 to 1943 version, show the "right-side"
(offset cupola to the left) with 3 side-windows, & the ATSF lettering
with periods.

Their pictures for the 1943 to Retirement version, show the "left-
side" (offset cupola to the right) with 4 side-windows, & the ATSF
lettering without periods.

I couldn't find prototype pictures or drawings of the 1300's on the
ATSF historical site or elsewhere.

What were the 1943 changes? Just the lettering or the addition of a
4th window? The lettering style looks the same for both versions,
just the periods missing after 1943.

Also, always, the main question,...is this an "accurate" physical
model?

Walthers part #'s, 932-27582 & 932-27583

Paul Hillman


Re: ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

Andy Sperandeo <asperandeo@...>
 

Hello Paul,

The only changes were to the lettering. The ampersand was omitted beginning in 1938 (A.T.S.F.) and the periods were omitted (ATSF) beginning in 1943. The windows, three on one side and four on the other, stayed the same. There are photos of a caboose of this series on the Santa Fe society Web site at http://users.snowcrest.net/photobob/sfr42.html.

Happy Thanksgiving,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
Model Railroader magazine
asperandeo@mrmag.com
262-796-8776, ext. 461
FAX 262-796-1142


Re: AT&SF BX-3 Paint Suggestion? Circa 1942

Andy Sperandeo <asperandeo@...>
 

Hi Jason,

I use Polly Scale Light Freight Car Red for Santa Fe Mineral Brown, with Grimy Black for the black roof. Wood running boards were Mineral Brown. When the Santa Fe repainted freight cars it repainted the trucks Mineral Brown, so that's the color of your Bx-3's trucks by 1942.

Good luck with your model,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
Model Railroader magazine
asperandeo@mrmag.com
262-796-8776, ext. 461
FAX 262-796-1142


Re: ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

Paul Hillman
 

Thanks Steve,

Good info. Would like to see some prototype photos. Still looking.

Paul Hillman

----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sandifer<mailto:steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com<mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2008 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses


The only difference is the lettering.
It is an accurate model.
http://atsfrr.net/Reviews/HO/Freight/WalCab/Index.htm<http://atsfrr.net/Reviews/HO/Freight/WalCab/Index.htm>
______________
J. Stephen (Steve) Sandifer
mailto:steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net<mailto:steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net>
Home: 12027 Mulholland Drive, Meadows Place, TX 77477, 281-568-9918
Office: Southwest Central Church of Christ, 4011 W. Bellfort, Houston, TX 77025, 713-667-9417

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul & Bernice Hillman
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com<mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2008 7:57 PM
Subject: [STMFC] ATSF 1300-Series Wood Cabooses

Walthers is selling their ATSF 1300-series wood cabooses in 2 types,
either as the 1938 to 1943 version, or 1943 to Retirement version.

Their pictures for the 1938 to 1943 version, show the "right-side"
(offset cupola to the left) with 3 side-windows, & the ATSF lettering
with periods.

Their pictures for the 1943 to Retirement version, show the "left-
side" (offset cupola to the right) with 4 side-windows, & the ATSF
lettering without periods.

I couldn't find prototype pictures or drawings of the 1300's on the
ATSF historical site or elsewhere.

What were the 1943 changes? Just the lettering or the addition of a
4th window? The lettering style looks the same for both versions,
just the periods missing after 1943.

Also, always, the main question,...is this an "accurate" physical
model?

Walthers part #'s, 932-27582 & 932-27583

Paul Hillman


Re: Life magazine/Google photos

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

cj riley wrote:
To be more precise (isn't that the group's goal) the siding boards had a chamfer on the edges ( a 45 degree bevel) that created the appearance of a v groove when 2 boards were butted. It is common to chamfer edges on boards so theat they don't splinter as badly as a 90 degree corner wood.But Tony is right that t&g siding can be chamfered or unchamfered.
[thump of palm hitting forehead] Yes, of course, the board EDGES can't have a "V-groove" as I stated--each board has to have a chamfered edge, as CJ says, to make a V when they are put together. Duh. <g>

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Life magazine/Google photos

CJ Riley
 

--- On Tue, 11/25/08, Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com> wrot

Most T&G siding had a modest V-groove at each edge, so there

SHOULD be a groove on such sheathing. OTOH, most single-sheathed cars

did not use such siding; but in at least some cases, the sheathing DID

include a T&G connection between the (horizontal) boards, despite no

V-groove at the surface.

To be more precise (isn't that the group's goal) the siding boards had a chamfer on the edges ( a 45 degree bevel) that created the appearance of a v groove when 2 boards were butted. It is common to chamfer edges on boards so theat they don't splinter as badly as a 90 degree corner wood.But Tony is right that t&g siding can be chamfered or unchamfered.
CJ Riley

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