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Re: 1925 photos around Omaha and unpainted roofs
gary laakso
The CB&Q and the FW&D stock cars shown in picture 20 don't look painted to me. There appear to be many knots showing in the wood. Plus in pix 14, there is a Pittsburgh and West Virginia coal gondola. I guess its going over Sherman Hill!
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gary laakso south of Mike Brock vasa0vasa@earthlink.net
----- Original Message -----
From: proto48er To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com Sent: 12/10/2008 6:23:09 PM Subject: [STMFC] 1925 photos around Omaha Guys - Here are som nice photos from around Omaha in the 1924 to 1925 era. The link was posted on the Railway Bull Shippers Yahoo group. I never knew that the Old Dutch Cleanser reefers really had a prototype! <http://www.railroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26579> A.T. Kott
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Re: Car Types for Team Tracks
gary laakso
I certainly agree with you and my 20 years in the ESPEE Law Dept confirm that the marketing folks like to list everything and then some as potential customers. I will not discuss how accurate their marketing plan car counts were compared to reality or what flooding the system with too much traffic did to train operations.
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That said, the book reflects patterns of heavy Team Track usage for a much wider variety of products then I thought. I may have read too many ESPEE team track reports! For instance in the GN book, in a large number of towns, coffins are listed as a team track commodity (though one industry received "coffin plywood" [no, there was no footnote on whether it was treated or not]) and there are a fair number of soda companies and potato chip receivers listed. Maybe they were team track customers. gary laakso south of Mike Brock vasa0vasa@earthlink.net
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From: Aley, Jeff A To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com Sent: 12/10/2008 7:43:28 PM Subject: RE: [STMFC] Car Types for Team Tracks Gary, It is useful to consider why the "Industrial Guide" was published (and given away). I believe the intent was for "Business to Business" transactions. In other words, if I had something to ship, I could look and see what potential new customers were available ("coincidentally" served by the GN). Or, if I want to buy something, I can similarly look for suppliers (again, that would ship by the GN). Some local freight agents would apparently list every single industry they could find, and if they weren't rail-served, they'd list them as "Team Track". My point is that a listing in the book doesn't necessarily mean that such a shipment (from a team track) ever really happened. Regards, -Jeff ________________________________ From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gary laakso Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 9:54 AM To: STMFC Subject: [STMFC] Car Types for Team Tracks I have been going through the January 1, 1961 Great Northern Railway Industrial Guide for points served by it and other railroads. The scope of team track usage amazes me since it covers from coffins to Edsels to Hamms beer to paving machinery and on and on. Here are the uses that i am not sure what type of freight car would be used (no, i am not listing pipe, threaded or not): 1- boats; flatcars? 2- fish; refrigerator cars? 3- elevators (as in Otis) boxcars? 4- steel products (its not more specific) gondolas? 5- soft drinks (i assume vending machines) boxcars? 6- vitamins; refrigerator cars? 7- pilings; flat cars or gondolas? 8- candy/tobacco; refrigerators? 9- potato chips (its listed at multiple locations) refrigerators? 10- ferns , as in plants ? no idea 11- fireworks? no clue and for Mike Brock.. 12- jailhouse supplies? brig cars? gary laakso south of Mike Brock vasa0vasa@earthlink.net<mailto:vasa0vasa%40earthlink.net>
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Re: Car Types for Team Tracks
Aley, Jeff A
Gary,
It is useful to consider why the "Industrial Guide" was published (and given away). I believe the intent was for "Business to Business" transactions. In other words, if I had something to ship, I could look and see what potential new customers were available ("coincidentally" served by the GN). Or, if I want to buy something, I can similarly look for suppliers (again, that would ship by the GN). Some local freight agents would apparently list every single industry they could find, and if they weren't rail-served, they'd list them as "Team Track". My point is that a listing in the book doesn't necessarily mean that such a shipment (from a team track) ever really happened. Regards, -Jeff ________________________________ From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gary laakso Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 9:54 AM To: STMFC Subject: [STMFC] Car Types for Team Tracks I have been going through the January 1, 1961 Great Northern Railway Industrial Guide for points served by it and other railroads. The scope of team track usage amazes me since it covers from coffins to Edsels to Hamms beer to paving machinery and on and on. Here are the uses that i am not sure what type of freight car would be used (no, i am not listing pipe, threaded or not): 1- boats; flatcars? 2- fish; refrigerator cars? 3- elevators (as in Otis) boxcars? 4- steel products (its not more specific) gondolas? 5- soft drinks (i assume vending machines) boxcars? 6- vitamins; refrigerator cars? 7- pilings; flat cars or gondolas? 8- candy/tobacco; refrigerators? 9- potato chips (its listed at multiple locations) refrigerators? 10- ferns , as in plants ? no idea 11- fireworks? no clue and for Mike Brock.. 12- jailhouse supplies? brig cars? gary laakso south of Mike Brock vasa0vasa@earthlink.net<mailto:vasa0vasa%40earthlink.net>
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Re: 1925 photos around Omaha
Charles Morrill
There are some great yard trackwork photos in that series. I was particularly fascinated by the three way point switch. What a fun project to build in 1/48 scale.
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Charlie
----- Original Message -----
From: "proto48er" <atkott@swbell.net> To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 5:22 PM Subject: [STMFC] 1925 photos around Omaha Guys -
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Re: 1925 photos around Omaha
Richard Hendrickson
On Dec 10, 2008, at 3:22 PM, proto48er wrote:
Guys - Interesting photos, A. T. Thanks for the reference. But you obviously haven't seen the recent book on Billboard Refrigerator Cars by Ed Kaminski and myself, in which several Cudahy cars with Old Dutch Cleanser advertising are shown. The book points out that most, if not all, cars with ODC advertising on one side had some other type of Cudahy advertising on the other side, and also that ODC advertising came in different forms; not al the cars that had it were alike. Richard Hendrickson
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Re: Unpainted wood.
Denny Anspach <danspach@...>
ERRATA:
Ideal dry rot conditions are present when there is 30-35% wood moisture content, versus the diametrically contrary assertion that I posted in error. Denny Denny S. Anspach MD Sacramento
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Re: Reciprocal switching
Andy Laurent
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry" <jrs060@...> wrote:
Andy, you are indeed correct that the reciprocal switchingagreements were very common in the steam era, and that most of the arrangementsactual involved accounting and paper work more than anything else.it's misleading to look at the tariff agreements your quoiting above as applicableduring the time period this group is interested in. In Chicago the ruling tariffthat was the law within the switching district was IFA (Illinois FreightAssociation) #22, the Chicago Switching Tariff. And just briefly, the carrier that delivered thecar to industries closed to reciprocal switching within the district got a portion ofthe line haul rate, not the uniform switching charges, on any car movement even if theydid not participate in the actual line haul routing.Happiness, Jerry Stewart Jerry, sorry for any confusion. I was not trying to imply that the modern tariffs would apply to steam era operations. I was just pointing folks in a direction where they could learn how 'reciprocal switching' was defined and learn some basic terminology by observing how it is practiced today. If someone has a copy of IFA#22, I would love to see it. Regards, Andy Laurent
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Re: 1925 photos around Omaha
Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
A.T. Kott wrote:
Here are som nice photos from around Omaha in the 1924 to 1925 era. The link was posted on the Railway Bull Shippers Yahoo group. I never knew that the Old Dutch Cleanser reefers really had a prototype!Obviously you don't have the new Billboard Reefer book, or you'd know all about it--and also that the Old Dutch advert was only on one side of the car. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com Publishers of books on railroad history
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Re: GREEN BAY & WESTERN
Andy Laurent
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Andy Sperandeo <asperandeo@...> wrote:
Covers the Ahnapee & Western, Green Bay & Western, Kewaunee GreenBay & Western, and Fox River Valley Railroads as part of its on going preservation mission. Contact InformationThis is the correct contact info for the GBWHS. The website is www.gbwhs.org I am a charter member of the Society. I have been in touch with our webmaster and we will rectify the communication problem. We have recently released a custom decorated Accurail 40' refrigerator car custom decorated to match the A&W 3000-3004 series ex-MDT cars that the railroad acquired in 1948. The lettering is individual to each road number representing the prototypes down to the repack stencils. The cars sell for $24.95 each or both for $44.95. Decals are available at no cost for the other 3 road numbers. See http://www.greenbayroute.com/latestnews.htm#117 and http://www.trains.com/mrr/default.aspx?c=a&;id=2748 for images of the car. Contact me with any questions regarding this project or any GB&W questions that you have. Regards, Andy Laurent GBWHS Model Project Manager
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1925 photos around Omaha
proto48er
Guys -
Here are som nice photos from around Omaha in the 1924 to 1925 era. The link was posted on the Railway Bull Shippers Yahoo group. I never knew that the Old Dutch Cleanser reefers really had a prototype! <http://www.railroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26579> A.T. Kott
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Re: Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update
Richard Hendrickson
On Dec 10, 2008, at 1:19 PM, Aley, Jeff A wrote:
Shall I start up the "My Weather is Nicer than Your Weather" Yahoo! Jeff, do you have the keys to moderate jail, and would it accomplish anything if you rattled them loudly within earshot of the list owner? Richard Hendrickson
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1953 CBC on ebay
Tom Lawler
Hi all,
I just listed a 1953 CBC on ebay. It is a 3 day auction. Item number is: 230313668299 or you can try the link below. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&;ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&ite m=230313668299> &ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=230313668299 Tom Lawler E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.0.386) Database version: 5.11310 http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/
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Re: Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update
Larry Jackman <Ljack70117@...>
I am moving back to the Seattle area. Will be back there by Jan 1, 2009. Seattle 36 inches of rain per year. Miami gets 65 inches and hurricanes. Mississippi gets 75 inches. I do not know what they expect here this year but they are advertising snow blowers on Miami and Palm Beach TV stations.
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Thank you Larry Jackman ljack70117@comcast.net
On Dec 10, 2008, at 4:05 PM, Mike Brock wrote:
Richard Hendrickson writes:
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Re: Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update
CJ Riley
--- On Wed, 12/10/08, Aley, Jeff A <Jeff.A.Aley@intel.com> wrote:
From: Aley, Jeff A <Jeff.A.Aley@intel.com> Subject: RE: [STMFC] Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update To: "STMFC@yahoogroups.com" <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 1:19 PM Shall I start up the "My Weather is Nicer than Your Weather" Yahoo!Group? [Hint: THIS Yahoo!Group is about Steam-Era Freight Cars.] Since the moderator has the keys and is responsible for feeding the denizens, can he be assigned residence?CJ Riley
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Re: Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update
CJ Riley
"What's with this gratuitous sneer at weather in the Northwest??? "
I don't know what you mean, Mike. I have lived here long enough that I haven't worn a raincoat in several years. I did put my down vest on last night as a left for a meeting, thinking it might be a cool night. I didn't need it as it got down to only 45. Seemed almost balmy compared to many nights in Pittsburgh. CJ RileyBainbridge Island WA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: Unpainted wood.
Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Aley, Jeff A wrote:
I have been led to believe that many box car interiors and possibly floors were of white oak. A woodworker once asked me if I knew where any boxcars were being scrapped (i.e. in the Antelope / Roseville area), as they were often a source of good-quality recycled oak.True for many railroads. SP often specified Douglas fir or yellow pine, since both could be obtained from on-line mills, and are also durable woods. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com Publishers of books on railroad history
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Re: Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update
Aley, Jeff A
Shall I start up the "My Weather is Nicer than Your Weather" Yahoo!Group? [Hint: THIS Yahoo!Group is about Steam-Era Freight Cars.]
Regards, -Jeff Aley [Soon to be Ex- ] Deputy Moderator, STMFC P.S. Those of you who ARE interested in Steam-Era Freight Cars are encouraged to attend the various Prototype Modeling meets around the country, especially Prototype Rails in Cocoa Beach, FL. See http://www.prototyperails.com<http://www.prototyperails.com/> for details. ________________________________ From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mike Brock Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 1:06 PM To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [STMFC] Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update Richard Hendrickson writes: "What's with this gratuitous sneer at weather in the Northwest???" Sneer? Hardly. A guy living in western Oregon visited here a few yrs ago arrived at night and, awaking the next morning, was seen to wander outside, look up and, evidently stunned, aclaimed...The Sun!!! We couldn't figure out what the problem was until he mentioned later that he had not seen it in several yrs. "Today in Ashland it's clear, sunny, and dry (i.e., no Florida-style high humidity)," Well, of course, in the summer the humidity does seem a bit high...but not now. "...the wind is calm, and the temp is around 52." Geeez. Isn't that below freezing? "Ideal weather for outdoor activities." I can't play golf in an overcoat...or do much else. I don't even go seek out steam era frt cars at the local shops. "I just got back from an hour of flying aerobatic practice in the Citabria. What's not to like?" Well...I CAN see the advantage of not having to worry about cooling one's beer. Other than that...?? Think I'll take a dip in the pool...before lunch outside. Richard Hendrickson
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Re: Unpainted wood.
Aley, Jeff A
Denny,
I have been led to believe that many box car interiors and possibly floors were of white oak. A woodworker once asked me if I knew where any boxcars were being scrapped (i.e. in the Antelope / Roseville area), as they were often a source of good-quality recycled oak. Regards, -Jeff P.S. How do you recommend I treat the dog-eared cedar fence boards that are so common in the Sacramento area? ________________________________ From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Denny Anspach Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 10:36 AM To: STMFC List Subject: [STMFC] Unpainted wood. I have a feeling that most freight car decking was old growth Douglas fir, and flat car decking either of the same, or white oak- both woods that wear well, and are also relatively pretty dry rot resistant unless poorly installed. Denny Denny S. Anspach MD Sacramento
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Re: Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update
Mike Brock <brockm@...>
Richard Hendrickson writes:
"What's with this gratuitous sneer at weather in the Northwest???" Sneer? Hardly. A guy living in western Oregon visited here a few yrs ago arrived at night and, awaking the next morning, was seen to wander outside, look up and, evidently stunned, aclaimed...The Sun!!! We couldn't figure out what the problem was until he mentioned later that he had not seen it in several yrs. "Today in Ashland it's clear, sunny, and dry (i.e., no Florida-style high humidity)," Well, of course, in the summer the humidity does seem a bit high...but not now. "...the wind is calm, and the temp is around 52." Geeez. Isn't that below freezing? "Ideal weather for outdoor activities." I can't play golf in an overcoat...or do much else. I don't even go seek out steam era frt cars at the local shops. "I just got back from an hour of flying aerobatic practice in the Citabria. What's not to like?" Well...I CAN see the advantage of not having to worry about cooling one's beer. Other than that...?? Think I'll take a dip in the pool...before lunch outside. Richard Hendrickson
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Re: Prototype Rails/Cocoa Beach 2009 update
Mike Brock <brockm@...>
Greg Martin says:
" Those freight cars heading out to Hinke might have a small snow pack on the roofs. Were getting our first Nor-wester this weekend with perhaps a little snow on the valley floor... Richard are your headed up to Mt. Ashland for some skiing?" Skiing? On a mountain.?..whatever that is. Is their some kind of lake up there...heated by volcanic activity? Odd... Mike Brock
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