Date   

Re: Freight cars owned are not employed in Interstate Commerce

railsnw1 <railsnw@...>
 

I think that meens direct connection on BC Electric Lines only. I have seen photos of these cars and most had "BCE" and the number only, no other data that would be required.

Richard Wilkens

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "cdnrailmarine" <cdnrailmarine@...> wrote:



The BC Electric Railway entry in the ORER of October 1926 has the notation "Freight cars owned are not employed in Interstate Commerce" however, under the listing of freight and passenger equipment:

"Freight equipment only in switching service with direct connections."

For anyone wishing to move those old soldiers off line in freight service here is a precedent.

The BC Electric in this listing indicated 419 freight cars in service, 184 Plain Box, 12 Stock, 23 gondolas, 178 flats etc.

Ross McLeod Calgary


ADMIN: Yahoogroups Problem

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Yahoogroups has indicated that they have a problem associated with changes to membership status. The effect of this problem is that changes to Email settings [ "Email/No Email" ] that have been initiated since July 17 will not take place for possibly another week. So, during the next week, if you are planning to be offline and wish to stop receiving Emails [ changing the Email setting to "No Email" ], the change will not take effect. If you changed your Email setting prior to July 17 and have since then changed it again, the last change will not occur for possibly another week. New members may not receive messages via Email during the next week.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Freight cars owned are not employed in Interstate Commerce

cdnrailmarine <cdnrailmarine@...>
 

The BC Electric Railway entry in the ORER of October 1926 has the notation "Freight cars owned are not employed in Interstate Commerce" however, under the listing of freight and passenger equipment:

"Freight equipment only in switching service with direct connections."

For anyone wishing to move those old soldiers off line in freight service here is a precedent.

The BC Electric in this listing indicated 419 freight cars in service, 184 Plain Box, 12 Stock, 23 gondolas, 178 flats etc.

Ross McLeod Calgary


Re: RI upgraded boxcar

frograbbit602
 

Rob,

Thank you for the info. on the RI series 133000 to 133499 Class B-2 cars.

Lester Breuer


Re: ICC 104A300 question

Jeff Coleman
 

just to add that the 105's were built in 100, 300, 400, 500 and 600 psi with no bottom outlets, top loading and unloading only.
Jeff Coleman

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Tim;

I wondered about that, too, but the 104's seemed to be an expedient design,
rather than permanent, and has a different commodity list from what was
allowable in a 103 (riveted or welded 2% dome with safety valves or vents).

I have never seen any evidence of a high-pressure 104, and that, in fact,
goes against what the car was designed for. Therefore, you won't see 104's
with high-pressure psi figures after the basic designation; therefore, no ICC
104A300's.

The ICC 105's are a wholly different case; ICC 105A300 meaning a pressurized
tank capable of containment to 300 psi internal pressure. The 105's were
also insulated, but that is about as far is it goes. The 105 had the valve
casing on top; no "dome".

Elden Gatwood



-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim
O'Connor
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 5:04 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [STMFC] ICC 104A300 question




No one has ever explained to me why a 104 couldn't just as well be called an
insulated 103. They made 103's with big domes and safety valves, didn't they?
Now someone is asking about a 104 built for 300psi? Doesn't that make it a
105??

Sunshine had a Warren 104 kit -- a car built to carry "natural"
gasoline.

Tim O'Connor

At 7/24/2009 01:59 PM Friday, you wrote:
Dave;

No, that is not exactly correct. The 104 is more like an insulated 103
made for specific commodities like ethyl ether, casinghead gas and
refine veg oils, and has a 2% dome with safety valves on its (usually
very large) insulated dome, while the 105 had insulation, but had a top
unloading valve casing with no bottom outlets, for pressurized
commodities, if I remember right. AHM used to make a late (1955+?)
model of an ICC 105A300, that I have a couple of, but I have never seen a
model of a 104.

Elden Gatwood


Re: ICC 104A300 question

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Tim;

I wondered about that, too, but the 104's seemed to be an expedient design,
rather than permanent, and has a different commodity list from what was
allowable in a 103 (riveted or welded 2% dome with safety valves or vents).

I have never seen any evidence of a high-pressure 104, and that, in fact,
goes against what the car was designed for. Therefore, you won't see 104's
with high-pressure psi figures after the basic designation; therefore, no ICC
104A300's.

The ICC 105's are a wholly different case; ICC 105A300 meaning a pressurized
tank capable of containment to 300 psi internal pressure. The 105's were
also insulated, but that is about as far is it goes. The 105 had the valve
casing on top; no "dome".

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim
O'Connor
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 5:04 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [STMFC] ICC 104A300 question




No one has ever explained to me why a 104 couldn't just as well be called an
insulated 103. They made 103's with big domes and safety valves, didn't they?
Now someone is asking about a 104 built for 300psi? Doesn't that make it a
105??

Sunshine had a Warren 104 kit -- a car built to carry "natural"
gasoline.

Tim O'Connor

At 7/24/2009 01:59 PM Friday, you wrote:
Dave;

No, that is not exactly correct. The 104 is more like an insulated 103
made for specific commodities like ethyl ether, casinghead gas and
refine veg oils, and has a 2% dome with safety valves on its (usually
very large) insulated dome, while the 105 had insulation, but had a top
unloading valve casing with no bottom outlets, for pressurized
commodities, if I remember right. AHM used to make a late (1955+?)
model of an ICC 105A300, that I have a couple of, but I have never seen a
model of a 104.

Elden Gatwood


Precooler Photos

Bob Chaparro <thecitrusbelt@...>
 

The attached Yahoo book link below is to the Yearbook of the United States Department of Agriculture, by United States. Dept. of Agriculture, published in 1910. The book shows a number of precooler photos from several of locations in California. The photos appear on Page 440 and beyond. Enter 440 in the box where Page 1 appears to navigate to the precooler material.

Bob Chaparro
Moderator
Citrus Industry Modeling Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/citrusmodeling/

===========================

http://tinyurl.com/n9vfnw

or

http://books.google.com/books?id=2nQUAAAAYAAJ&printsec=titlepage&source=gbs_v2_summary_r&cad=0


Re: SP B-50-19

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Brian Carlson wrote:
Thanks Tony, I wasn't sure if you had dates for the renumbering. I'll have to keep this in mind for future SP cars.
For most cars, I have the day and location. For some cars, in cases where apparently it was discovered that they had already been renumbered but documentation was lost, it only gives the year. And some are simply not noted at all, though the car can be proven to have been renumbered. Not sure why the latter case, but "clerkmanship" was clearly waning in the SP offices as the computer age neared. I could cite numerous examples from the 1950s, both from both documents I have, and from ones I've examined at CSRM.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: SP B-50-19

Brian Carlson <brian@...>
 

Thanks Tony, I wasn't sure if you had dates for the renumbering. I'll have
to keep this in mind for future SP cars.

Brian J. Carlson, P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Anthony Thompson
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2009 7:48 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] SP B-50-19

Brian Carlson wrote:
I have a red caboose 1937 AAR car lettered for SP B-50-19 class. The
car number 38296 . . .
Also, the wood roofwalks gradually replaced with steel ones
according to the book. Anyone (Tony) know if they all would have
been replaced by august of 57, or even if this specific car was
replaced.
As I feared, Brian, the running boards are not logged in the car
ledger, so I don't know. But your 8-57 date gets you right under the
wire. The car was renumbered in the six-digit system the following
month.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Overland models Help

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Southern compared to what? CN? Yep! B&A? Yep! Pere Marquette? Yep! Northern Pacific? Yep!

But to be serious, no, they'll be painted ERIE. They are, you see, UM-20s, the experimental test
bed the ERIE hosted for GE for several years. They were later taken back by GE, rebuilt* with
2000HP engines, and sold to UP.

*Original equipment was 1200 HP in one AB set, 1600 HP in the other.

SGL


Hey Schuyler G.

What road are you finishing those F-units in? Certainly a southern road, right?

John

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , "Schuyler Larrabee"
<schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:

I think I've had this car for about ten years and still haven't finished it. My record is an
Overland ACL caboose that I
bought in 1992 that I just finished last month. That only took 17 years.

John

John Golden
Bloomington, IN
John, why rush it? I'm nearing completion of an Overland ABBA set (which pulled steam era
freight
cars) which I bought in 1989. Much of the delay, I have to admit, has been convincing myself the
more complex but more accurate methods were worth it.

SGL




E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.1.441)
Database version: 6.12900
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Re: SP B-50-19

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Brian Carlson wrote:
I have a red caboose 1937 AAR car lettered for SP B-50-19 class. The car number 38296 . . .
Also, the wood roofwalks gradually replaced with steel ones according to the book. Anyone (Tony) know if they all would have been replaced by august of 57, or even if this specific car was replaced.
As I feared, Brian, the running boards are not logged in the car ledger, so I don't know. But your 8-57 date gets you right under the wire. The car was renumbered in the six-digit system the following month.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: B&O LCL circle "T"

Brian Carlson <brian@...>
 

Thanks Jim. Answers what I wanted to know.

Brian J. Carlson, P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Re: B&O LCL circle "T"

jim_mischke <jmischke@...>
 

Use of circle T
----------------

The circle T meant the B&O boxcar was fit for LCL service. Clean and mechanically sound. It could fit through the Parkersburg subdivision tunnels, hence could go anywhere on the B&O.

Timesaver LCL service was so dubbed in 1950, so the circle T does not predate that.

There were far more B&O boxcars so marked with a circle T than actually in Timesaver LCL service. Empty boxcars were pooled and tapped for whatever the daily traffic warrented. One would have to see the waybill, or divine from photo context, whether a given boxcar was actually in LCL service on that occasion.




Boxcars classes with circle T
------------------------------

There is no list. This circle T status tended to affect all cars within a class.

Often, boxcars of certain classes were all marked with the circle T. After 1950. Examples: M-53/53a wagontops, M-56, M-62, M-66, M-67.

None marked of other classess. I have never seen an M-15k or M-15p subclass wagontop with a circle T. Old? Inferior? For most of the 1950's, 50' boxcars were forbidden on the Parkersburg sub, so none of those got a circle T until that was rectified.

Other boxcars got a circle T over time. M-59 40' double door boxcars predated the Timesaver name, and were originally for autos and auto parts with special equipment. Only when they were released for general service in the late 1950's, and Parkersburg tunnels roofs were daylighted, did any M-59 get the circle T.

By snafu, the 500 M-55c boxcars had a lateral running board that would not clear the Parkersburg sub tunnels. (Or did only after the first trip.) After two years, in 1947 the first 100 to be fitted with conforming lateral running boards. These cars were painted aluminum over blue as rolling billboards for Sentinel Service, the special paint job also showed they would fit the Parkersburg sub tunnels. The other 400 were shopped as otherwise needed, all 400 were forbidden on the Parkersburg sub until all were modified. Then in 1954, the worst Parkersburg tunnels were daylighted and all could go, modified or not. This story shows that who gets a circle T can get a little complicated and overtaken by events.


Work from photos. Large groups and whole classes were designated with a circle T.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Carlson" <brian@...> wrote:

Did the 'T' in a circle on B&O M-26 and M-27 class boxcars mean the cars
were in assigned LCL service or that they could be used in that service? Is
there a listing of car numbers with the circle t designation? My era is
1957 if this matters.

Brian J. Carlson, P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


Re: SP B50-24 express box conversions

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Mark Pierce wrote:
Add steam line and emergency signal details (Branchline). Replace wood running board with metal (Kadee). Replace doors with modified Youngstowns (I've been waiting over six months for Andy Carlson to get some for me).
Proper rivet detail on car sides (good luck).
The ACR rivets are now dead easy--there is an Archer rivet set exactly for that purpose. And they're black.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: RI upgraded boxcar ends

Rob Adams
 

I should have added that the Bettendorf cars were delivered with Westinghouse KC brakes and Ajax power hand brake. They are noted to have Barber Lateral Motion trucks.

The AC&F cars apparently had Klasing hand brakes upon delivery, the diagram I have indicates that at least some were "renewed" with Universal W-2000.

Regards, Rob Adams



Rob Adams wrote:


Lester;

The 1927-built B-2 type cars in Rock Island series 13300-133999 were
built with an early 3/4 Dreadnaught end, Murphy Radial roof and top hung
Camel steel doors. Cars 133000-133499 were built by Bettendorf and cars
133500-133999 were built by AC&F's St. Louis plant.

Because of the dimensional differences in inside height, they would not
have accommodated a 3/3/3 end.

Regards,

Rob Adams
Wellman, IA

frograbbit602 wrote:


Does anyone know what type ends the upgraded design of RI, Class B-2,
single-sheathed boxcars, built 1923 to 1927, like the photo of RI
133349 in Steam Era Freight Cars Reference Manual by Ted Culotta, p.
15, had? RI auto box cars built in 1927 had early dreadnaught 3/3/3
steel ends. A photo of auto box RI 160249 with 3/3/3 steel ends is in
the 1928 Car Builders Cyc. on p. 135. Did any of the Class B-2 cars
get these ends?

Lester Breuer


Re: RI upgraded boxcar ends

Rob Adams
 

Lester;

The 1927-built B-2 type cars in Rock Island series 13300-133999 were built with an early 3/4 Dreadnaught end, Murphy Radial roof and top hung Camel steel doors. Cars 133000-133499 were built by Bettendorf and cars 133500-133999 were built by AC&F's St. Louis plant.

Because of the dimensional differences in inside height, they would not have accommodated a 3/3/3 end.

Regards,

Rob Adams
Wellman, IA



frograbbit602 wrote:


Does anyone know what type ends the upgraded design of RI, Class B-2, single-sheathed boxcars, built 1923 to 1927, like the photo of RI 133349 in Steam Era Freight Cars Reference Manual by Ted Culotta, p. 15, had? RI auto box cars built in 1927 had early dreadnaught 3/3/3 steel ends. A photo of auto box RI 160249 with 3/3/3 steel ends is in the 1928 Car Builders Cyc. on p. 135. Did any of the Class B-2 cars get these ends?

Lester Breuer


RI upgraded boxcar ends

frograbbit602
 

Does anyone know what type ends the upgraded design of RI, Class B-2, single-sheathed boxcars, built 1923 to 1927, like the photo of RI 133349 in Steam Era Freight Cars Reference Manual by Ted Culotta, p. 15, had? RI auto box cars built in 1927 had early dreadnaught 3/3/3 steel ends. A photo of auto box RI 160249 with 3/3/3 steel ends is in the 1928 Car Builders Cyc. on p. 135. Did any of the Class B-2 cars get these ends?

Lester Breuer


Re: SP B-50-19

Gene Green <bierglaeser@...>
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Carlson" <brian@...> wrote:
<snip>
Does anyone know what style of [Universal] handbrake was used and what HO part would replicate it.


Brian,

You said 1937 but does that mean you are using the 1937 AAR 10'-0" IH box car as a jumping off point or was the prototype built in 1937. I assume the latter. Please correct me if I am wrong.

My list of Universal hand brakes introduced and/or sold before 1937 is pretty short. Unless you have better information I think we can rule out all horizontal hand brakes. That leaves:
[year introduced and model number]

1935 - XL1825
1932 - 1534

For a photo, such as it is, of the 1534 and its hand wheel see page 368 of Ry Mechancial Engineer for September 1932 or page 1039, Railway Age, June 18, 1932. Same article in both so you only need to find one of the two references.

I have an application drawing of the 1534 as well as a "Xerox" of some photos.

For the XL 1825 I have only an application drawing. [An application drawing shows a simple outline of the front and side of the hand brake as it would be seen when applied to a car. Not too informative but better than nothing. The hand wheel is always merely a circle.]

There were a couple of apparently experimental hand brakes that could be possible candidates but not too likely.

That is the best I can do for 1937 and earlier Universal hand brakes.

If I assumed the wrong date built, please set me straight.

Gene Green


Re: SP B50-24 express box conversions

Tim O'Connor
 

Or... sell the RC kit on Ebay, and apply the proceeds towards
a Sunshine BE-50-24.

Tim O'Connor

At 7/26/2009 02:12 AM Sunday, you wrote:
Add steam line and emergency signal details (Branchline).

Replace wood running board with metal (Kadee).

Replace doors with modified Youngstowns (I've been waiting over six months for Andy Carlson to get some for me).

Proper rivet detail on car sides (good luck).

Mark Pierce

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bill McCoy" <wpmccoy@...> wrote:

I have one of the Red Caboose AAR'37 boxcar kits painted for the SP box express conversions (SP 5703). What does it need to make a credible SP B50-24. Doors roofs etc shouldn't be a big problem since the pullman Green may not be too hard to match considering the filthy exteriors of these cars. I will just have to live with the 4-5 ends. The picture of SP 5712 on P.21 of RP CYC 8 appears to have 4-5 ends.

Thanks,

Bill McCoy
Jax, FL


Re: KCS Rebuilt Box Car March RMC

Joseph
 

Jesse,
I have the info and will scan and email this afternoon.
Joe Binish

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jesse" <jessefameree@yahoo.com>
To: <stmfc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 9:34 PM
Subject: [STMFC] KCS Rebuilt Box Car March RMC


Gents,

Saw the April 2009 article of this series on Rebuilding a KCS car using parts from various other kits but seek the March Issue to read the first part of the article on how to build up the Accurail underframe. If you have a spare copy or know where one can be found I would be much appreciative ( RMC is SOLD OUT of that month only :( )

I look forward to your reply offline to jessefameree@yahoo.com

Thanks much

Jesse Fameree
Green Bay, Wisconsin



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