Date   

Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

Denny Anspach <danspach@...>
 

Shake/Take is an outstanding Clinic concept dreamed up by Greg Martin about four years ago for Prototype Rails, and then executed by Greg and his partner in the shadows, Jim Singer. The concept was an old fashioned one: kit bash an existing commercial freight car, core, or kit to represent an interesting and/or distinctive car not otherwise modeled or available. The cars done so far: A KCS USRA rebuild box car; A Kahns Meat Reefer; A PRR 50' welded boxcar; and this years car, a UP rebuild stock car. The core parts and special decals (if needed) are donated by very generous manufacturers and individuals. Greg selects the project, works it up, creates masters (if required) and then authors basic instructions. Jim researches what's available, and then rounds up special materials. It is left up to modeler to provide labor, imagination, skill, and basic raw materials, i.e. styrene, wire, etc.

The two of them cannot get enough kudos for their sheer generosity.

Although Mike kindly gives me some credit, my *only* function has been to blather on.

These projects place squarely on the front burner the considerable traditional skills and creative demands of scratch building coupled to the very core of those subscribing to the concept of Prototype modeling, i.e. modeling from photos of the real thing. It is totally fascinating to me to observe what different "takes" very different very skilled and imaginative modelers have as to just exactly what replicating the prototype demands, and then deciding how to replicate it with the materials available, or- to modify it, finesse it, or simply ignore it!

To better foster the collaborative nature of these projects, Schuyler Larabee and Jeff Aley initiated a Shake/Take Yahoo! Group that serves as a central clearing and meeting house for those working on these projects. Speaking personally, it has been immensely helpful as other participants turn up helpful photos, and plans to share. Most helpful of all are the observations of other modelers as they discuss their takes and modeling methods, and the compromises that they are willing or not willing to take. Always startling is a participant pointing out to the rest of us an essential prototype detail that has been front and center of every single photo, but has been utterly missed by any one or more of us (I completely tore out an entire meticulously fabricated "origami" underframe after one such shameful episode!).

I have not the slightest idea what Greg and Jim have cooked up for the 2010 edition. Right now, I am utterly immersed in completing this year's project.

Denny


Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Happy Thanksgiving

Dennis Williams
 

resinbuilders4u.com wishes everyone a Happy Thanksgiving. Dennis Williams Owner


Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

rockroll50401 <cepropst@...>
 

"the rivet counter in me shows up and I just have to make a couple of more changes"...Bruce Smith


Bruce I understand, but that's not what these kits are about. We are to build them as per the very high quality instructions. They offer techniques most have not have tried.

The KCS car is a prime example, most of the 10 or so models that showed up the next year used a different body. I built mine as the "Shake 'n' Take" crew intended. Brought it back to diplay, then gave it away : )))
We were operating on the guys layout I gave it to the other week and the car looks good!

But, I think the bottom line is "You can take a guy to the model, but you can't make him build it".
Clark Propst


Re: New ART Steel Reefer Run Is In

Schuyler Larrabee
 

I have two questions:

Why is the order of the two heralds reversed on the model from the prototype photo just above it?
Was the other side of the prototype similarly reversed?

Is the Rock Island boxcar an assembled model or a kit? It's not clear in the write-up.

SGL

I couldn't make out the reweigh date or the build date from the photos. Can someone offer up the
dates?
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , asychis@... wrote:

Hello everyone!

The Amarillo Railroad Museum and Missouri Pacific Historical Society are
pleased to announce that our newest run of ART steel ice reefers arrived
today. These are painted in the classic reefer yellow and boxcar red scheme
with Missouri Pacific and Wabash heralds and the ART shield. They are
numbered in the 33000 series which denotes 24000 series cars which had Equipco
mechanical fans added in the early 1950s. There are six numbers available,
all are RTR, no kits right now. Price is $32.95 each plus shipping. ARM and
MPHS members get a 10% discount. Texas residents must add 8.25% sales tax.

Order from our web site now: _www.amarillorailmusuem.com_
(http://www.amarillorailmusuem.com <http://www.amarillorailmusuem.com> ) .

Great Christmas gifts!
There are only 293 cars in this run.
They will soon be listed on e-Bay.

Thanks,

Jerry Michels










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Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

Schuyler Larrabee
 

"rockroll50401" <cepropst@netconx.net <mailto:cepropst%40netconx.net> > 11/26/09 8:55 AM >>>
These 'Shake/Take' models the guys come up with are really neat little
challenging projects, very satisfying, if you show the respect of
building them. I really feel bad when I see less than a third show up on
the display table the next year. Who can't build one model in a year?

Clark, if you wait until Nov 1 to start, like I did, then the pressure's
on! Then, in the midst of making progress, the rivet counter in me
shows up and I just have to make a couple of more changes... My S-40-10
will be there, although in what shape I have no idea! I do have an
additional 2 reefers based on the Kahn's project of several years ago
that will I'll bring as well - part of the group of cars that DID get
built this year <G>.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL

Geez, Bruce, why did you start so early? ;^)

SGL





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Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

Schuyler Larrabee
 

As you well know, Clark, a deep dark secret until you're in Cocoa . . .

Happy Thanksgiving.

SGL

What's this year's car?
Clark Propst




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Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

Bruce Smith
 

"rockroll50401" <cepropst@netconx.net> 11/26/09 8:55 AM >>>
These 'Shake/Take' models the guys come up with are really neat little
challenging projects, very satisfying, if you show the respect of
building them. I really feel bad when I see less rhan a third show up on
the display table the next year. Who can't build one model in a year?

Clark, if you wait until Nov 1 to start, like I did, then the pressure's
on! Then, in the midst of making progress, the rivet counter in me
shows up and I just have to make a couple of more changes... My S-40-10
will be there, although in what shape I have no idea! I do have an
additional 2 reefers based on the Kahn's project of several years ago
that will I'll bring as well - part of the group of cars that DID get
built this year <G>.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

rockroll50401 <cepropst@...>
 

These 'Shake/Take' models the guys come up with are really neat little challenging projects, very satisfying, if you show the respect of building them. I really feel bad when I see less rhan a third show up on the display table the next year. Who can't build one model in a year?

Giving thanks for that crew that keeps cranking out the quality projects.

Clark Propst


Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

rockroll50401 <cepropst@...>
 

What's this years car?
Clark Propst


Re: Stan's long stock car

rockroll50401 <cepropst@...>
 

Thanks, someone emailed the article to me.
Clark Propst

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Donald Ford <ford.donald77@...> wrote:

Clark
There is a article in MR January 1998 pp. 94-97 about building a NKP 50 foot car that might help you.
Don Ford
Kanab ut


________________________________
From: Clark Propst <cepropst@...>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, November 24, 2009 8:54:48 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Stan's long stock car

 
I picked up one of Stan Rydarowicz's new 50' Mathers stock cars at Naperville. I'm about finished with assembly.

The kit is basically a P2K stock car with styrene and resin parts for the doors and center extension of the frame.

All parts needed for assembly are included. The instructions made me laugh because they are written just like Stan talks. He did not included several of the assembly steps, so like most small maker kits, you're on your own. He does provide some poor photocopies of the constructed model. I was impressed by the thought Stan put into this model.

This is a time consuming kit. Heck, the P2K kit is time consuming alone. There is no good photo of a completed model or prototype. The decals included do have a drawing of the cars. A friend supplied photos of the prototype which were quite helpful.

Next time I talk to Stan I'll recommend he amends his instructions to make each step clearer to the builder.

The kit is priced at $35. These cars were built in the early 60s, but are so cool I had to have one!

Stan sells an extensive line of resin supplemented kits including several modified reefers.
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa











R-40-2 Re: MTH PFE Reefers

pwkrueger <kruegerp@...>
 

I was able to get a picture of the MTH R-40-2 last weekend.

Here it is if anyone is curious....
http://s257.photobucket.com/albums/hh230/pwkrueger/WGH%20Seattle%202009/?action=view¤t=PB210392.jpg

Were all of these cars rebuilt into something else before WW2?

Thanks,
Paul
Seattle, WA

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Walters" <eddie_walters@...> wrote:

I just realised, I didn't make it clear I was referring to MTH's HO
line. Not that it seems to be that much different to their O gauge line
in accuracy!

Ed
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Walters" <eddie_walters@> wrote:

I hate to mention toy trains on this list, but perhaps it's worth
getting the record straight on it!

What's the expert opinion on the new MTH PFE reefers shown in their
catalog, along with their articulated UP 4-12-2 and "Operating Action
Cars"... clearly their copy writers have at least skimmed through the
esteemed Mr Thompson's tome on the subject, as they've quoted a
paragraph from it, but is the model actually any good? I have my
doubts, but perhaps eventully MTH will get SOMETHING right and they
would be worth picking up.


Re: New ART Steel Reefer Run Is In

pierreoliver2003 <pierre.oliver@...>
 

I couldn't make out the reweigh date or the build date from the photos. Can someone offer up the dates?
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, asychis@... wrote:

Hello everyone!

The Amarillo Railroad Museum and Missouri Pacific Historical Society are
pleased to announce that our newest run of ART steel ice reefers arrived
today. These are painted in the classic reefer yellow and boxcar red scheme
with Missouri Pacific and Wabash heralds and the ART shield. They are
numbered in the 33000 series which denotes 24000 series cars which had Equipco
mechanical fans added in the early 1950s. There are six numbers available,
all are RTR, no kits right now. Price is $32.95 each plus shipping. ARM and
MPHS members get a 10% discount. Texas residents must add 8.25% sales tax.

Order from our web site now: _www.amarillorailmusuem.com_
(http://www.amarillorailmusuem.com) .

Great Christmas gifts!
There are only 293 cars in this run.
They will soon be listed on e-Bay.

Thanks,

Jerry Michels


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

Greg Martin
 

Gize,

I am always humbled by Denny and his heart felt appreciation of the
project(s) but he forgets to remind you that he to presents a detail analogy of
how to adapt the ACCURAIL Scale couple to each project.

Then John Greedy has taken the time to do a one page write up of historical
interest regarding he project.

For this years as well as last years project Richard Hendrickson (who does
know the exact project) has provided much of the inspiration as well as
technical support. And trust me he has planted the seeds for next years as
well which I am equally excited about.

So far we can thank 5th Avenue Cars Shops (Jim Singer), ACCURAIL ~twice~
(Bob Walker and Dennis Storzek) and Branchline (Bill Schneider at the time)
for their generous contributions of the kits, KADEE (Sam Clark) for roof
walks on the past kits, and last years offering from Southern Car &Foundry
for the resin cast ends (now the center sill as well), Eric Cote for his
generous effort in creating the magnificent artwork for the decals and Jim
Singer again who has generously absorbed the cost of the decals. It's about a
lot of folks you never even know. This years involves new contributors.

With regards to the concept, Clark is correct, the idea has always been one
of creating from the parts provided. This has drifted a bit but it is good
to see the variation on the theme. I looked back to see how many varied on
the KCS project and it was not that many in reality, two were moved to
Branchline kits, one had removed and replaced the ends, but only 17 of the 36
showed up. No word on whether these folks had trouble or what.

Many thanks to Schuyler who is the moderator of the SHAKE N TAKE group and
to follow along you didn't have to be present, just a wish to learn. Thanks
to Richard Hendrickson for his extensive photo library he has contributed
and Dick Berry who has a work in progress spread sheet on the actual cars.
Some members have multiple cars in progress of the S-40-10. And I believe
that Schuyler wants to include past and future projects or at least at one
time.

In keeping with tradition the SHAKE N TAKE for next year will be announced
this weekend and again the spots this year will be limited to only 30
kits, and 50 handouts. The pre registration will allow for 20 spots to go via
emails to me ONLY OFFLINE, first come first serve. The other 10 spots will
be reserved for WALK IN folks at Cocoa Beach first come first serve. You are
always welcome to sit in and if need be I will send out extra handouts of
the kit after the event in limited cases if you were there and didn't get
one. I will post updates to this list as to which spots are filled.

This years will be a good one and very limited. A good study in freight car
evolution, thank you Richard.

In keeping with a very early request from Denny, the project doesn't
duplicate a prior project, i.e., not another wood reefer, 40-foot boxcar,
50-foot boxcar, or stock car. So the concept is fresh and inviting. I will say I
would think that many will see this project and want one.

Oh yes please remember to bring all your past S-N-T projects as Jeff calls
it.

See you there!

Greg Martin



Denny writes:




Shake/Take is an outstanding Clinic concept dreamed up by Greg Martin about
four years ago for Prototype Rails, and then executed by Greg and his
partner in the shadows, Jim Singer. The concept was an old fashioned one: kit
bash an existing commercial freight car, core, or kit to represent an
interesting and/or distinctive car not otherwise modeled or available. The cars
done so far: A KCS USRA rebuild box car; A Kahns Meat Reefer; A PRR 50'
welded boxcar; and this years car, a UP rebuild stock car. The core parts and
special decals (if needed) are donated by very generous manufacturers and
individuals.
Greg selects the project, works it up, creates masters (if required) and
then authors basic instructions. Jim researches what's available, and then
rounds up special materials. It is left up to
modeler to provide labor, imagination, skill, and basic raw materials,
i.e. styrene, wire, etc.

The two of them cannot get enough kudos for their sheer generosity.

Although Mike kindly gives me some credit, my *only* function has been to
blather on.

These projects place squarely on the front burner the considerable
traditional skills and creative demands of scratch building coupled to the very
core of those subscribing to the concept of Prototype
modeling, i.e. modeling from photos of the real thing. It is totally
fascinating to me to observe what different "takes" very different very skilled
and imaginative modelers have as to just exactly what
replicating the prototype demands, and then deciding how to replicate it
with the materials available, or- to modify it, finesse it, or simply ignore
it!

To better foster the collaborative nature of these projects, Schuyler
Larabee and Jeff Aley initiated a Shake/Take Yahoo! Group that serves as a
central clearing and meeting house for those working on these projects.
Speaking personally, it has been immensely helpful as other participants turn up
helpful photos, and plans to share. Most helpful of all are the observations
of other modelers as they discuss their takes and modeling methods, and
the compromises that they are willing or not willing to take. Always
startling is a participant pointing out to the rest of us an essential prototype
detail that has been front and center of every single photo, but has been
utterly missed by any one or more of us (I completely tore out an entire
meticulously fabricated "origami" underframe after one such shameful episode!).

I have not the slightest idea what Greg and Jim have cooked up for the
2010 edition. Right now, I am utterly immersed in completing this year's
project.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Re: Prototype Rails 2010: Shake/Take alert.

Greg Martin
 

Ned,

No reason for you to stumble and get hung up use this list to get the
answers you are looking for and to move forward...

Build it and we shall come... 3^)


Greg

In a message dated 11/26/2009 9:28:55 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
nedspam@comcast.net writes:




Clark Propst wrote:
Who can't build one model in a year?

Actually to me it happens regularly. I work on a model until I get stuck
and don't know how to proceed. Sometimes it is a part I need, sometimes
unclear instructions or often simply figuring out how to hold, fasten, shape,
create or install a particular part.

Once the project has stalled another shiny new object comes into view and
becomes the next project.

My current goal is to actually complete some past projects. I have 6
freight cars I plan to have finished by Cocoa Beach.

Here's my list and you can all hold me accountable
2 PSC Van Dyke tank cars
1 Speedwitch Pressed steel tank
2 Sunshine WM DD box
1 Tichy War Emergency Gon

Ned Carey

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: New ART Steel Reefer Run Is In

Kenneth Montero
 

Ed,

Thank you for the information. I'm glad I bought two kits of the prior run of kits and have not yet assembled both of them.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Hawkins" <hawk0621@sbcglobal.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 1:35:22 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: New ART Steel Reefer Run Is In







On Nov 25, 2009, at 11:26 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:

Jerry is there any external difference for the Equipco fans?
The photo on your web site just shows a car that says "fans"
http://www.amarillorailmuseum.com/cgi-bin/image/templates/
ART33320webmod.jpg

Do you ever expect a kit to be available? I don't care about the
price I just prefer to build my own...
Tim,
The ART 33000-series cars with Equipco air circulating fans had a
control device tucked up under the car and essentially out of view. The
previous 32000-series cars with Preco air circulating fans had a
control device that was visible on the left side of the car next to the
left bolster.

The newest run of ART cars are available only as assembled models. The
previous run of ART kits could be lettered for either 32000 or 33000
series cars since car numbers were left off and decals were provided.
However, these kits are sold out.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


ART Steel Reefer Reweigh and Build dates

asychis@...
 

Pierre,

The reweigh stencil is K.V. 4-55 (Kingsville), build date is 10-41.

Jerry Michels


Re: New ART Steel Reefer Fans

asychis@...
 

Hi Tim,

No there are no external differences both the Preco (32000 series) and
Equipco (33000 series) fans are not seen from the outside. That being said,
some cars had a stencil or a flat metal plate where a fan pulley would be
located above the truck. According to Ed Hawkins this might have been to
alert employees that the cars had fans. On our website is a reprint of the
excellent article on these cars by Ed Hawkins from the MPHS Eagle. With
photos of the stencils and plates.

Kits will come, don't know when exactly.

Jerry


Re: New ART Steel Reefer Run Is In

asychis@...
 

Regarding kits, yes in the near future. The old kits that came with the
32000 series cars are exactly the same. Just the number is different. On
the decal sheet that came with the kits there are a few 33000-series numbers.

Jerry


ART Reefer Correction

asychis@...
 

Sometimes I just get too excited! The web site, spelled correctly is:

_www.amarillorailmuseum.com_ (http://www.amarillorailmuseum.com)

Sorry for the misspelling! I've checked it out and it all seems to work
now.

Jerry Michels


Re: New ART Steel Reefer Run Is In

Ed Hawkins
 

On Nov 25, 2009, at 11:26 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:

Jerry is there any external difference for the Equipco fans?
The photo on your web site just shows a car that says "fans"
http://www.amarillorailmuseum.com/cgi-bin/image/templates/
ART33320webmod.jpg

Do you ever expect a kit to be available? I don't care about the
price I just prefer to build my own...
Tim,
The ART 33000-series cars with Equipco air circulating fans had a
control device tucked up under the car and essentially out of view. The
previous 32000-series cars with Preco air circulating fans had a
control device that was visible on the left side of the car next to the
left bolster.

The newest run of ART cars are available only as assembled models. The
previous run of ART kits could be lettered for either 32000 or 33000
series cars since car numbers were left off and decals were provided.
However, these kits are sold out.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins

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