Well, actually Richard you are incorrect again. The Northern Pacific,
according to Mr. Warren McGee, a former NP employee and historian
of great respect, has written that the NP had three different coal districts.
The far eastern portion of the railroad was fueled in the steam era by lake
coal carried on return trips by ore carriers. The central part was fueled by
lignite coal from the NP's own mines. And the western portion was fueled
with coal that came from Washington state itself. It was NOT lignite, but
with all honesty, a bituminous of only fair quality when compared to it's
eastern counterparts.
The Northern Pacific burned Washington state bituminous coal well
through the 1940's and into the 50's. Oil fuel for steam locomotives out
of Tacoma, for example, was only to be found on some passenger, and
switching engines in the 1950's. Coal was still the common fuel on most
freight locomotive around Tacoma and Seattle almost to the end of steam.
There are some great articles to be found in the "Mainstreeter", the NPRHA
magazine, about NP steam era freights working out of Tacoma with coal
burning locomotive in the 1950's. And, for whoever is interested, photos
of the NP coal docks in western Washington state, painted in the railroads
distinctive two color scheme.

Happiness, Jerry Stewart

In a very ice covered Woodstock, Ill.

Denny Anspach wrote:

Well, today, I am chef, cook, and bottle washer with my capable son-in-law as assistant- a

Christmas present to Mama. I

made pecan and mincemeat pies yesterday (only Grade B dark maple syrup, and roasted pecans!).

While I relax at the

computer and contemplate decal applications on my STEAM ERA FREIGHT CARS, I absent myself every 30

minutes

to baste the roast . It will be removed from the oven when the core temp reaches 120º, and then

allowed to rest for

awhile until carved at the table.

First, I contributed my famous (not kidding!) scalloped potatoes to my cousin's dinner table last
night, two dishes worth, and none came home with us . . . 8^(

Today, I made our traditional Christmas Day dinner, Beef Bourguignonne, served very simply with rice
and a good green salad. Oh, and some fairly good wine, coffee and sweets.

Both recipes from the Joy of Cooking, but with variations based on ~40 years experience.

I am the cook every day, but haven't washed dishes for decades, a deal I consider as good as it
gets. It gets me out of the kitchen and dining room earlier so I can get to the steam era freight
cars . . .

SGL





E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (7.0.0.508)
Database version: 6.13990
http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/

You are correct. I've seen several of these AAR tank car lettering
diagrams from various years and the underframe is never represented. The
CBC caption says "For Explanatory Notes See Manual,...", there you will
find note 6.

Later,
Bill Kelly


Tony Thompson wrote:

Bill Kelly wrote:

The 1941 AAR Specifications for Tank Cars has a lettering diagram
in appendix C, this is the same drawing that appears in the Car
Builder'sCyclopedias. Note 6 to the diagram states "Car number and
initials to be stencilled on underframe center sills, or side
sills, and on both truck bolsters". No location on the center or side

sills is specified so it may be hard to find.

The drawing in the 1946 Cyc, page 373, does not show anything
about the center sill, Bill.

____________________________________________________________
Weight Loss Program
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The cuisine of our ancestors was definitely not for the weak of diet... most people couldn't afford the luxury of wasting anything. And suet was high in calories, necessary for those winter nights before centralized heating.

Bill Daniels

Tucson, AZ

Bill Daniels wrote:

It's rare to find meat in any mincemeat pie anymore... I've had several when a friend of mine was in the grass-fed beef business a couple of years ago. Karen would take orders for them several weeks before Thanksgiving. And I believe venison was the traditional meat. Nowadays, it's usually justraisins and apples... but it's still tasty.

An ingredient of MAJOR proportions in the old-fashioned mincemeat pie was SUET. Lots of it. Makes that winter dessert stick to your ribs. <g>

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history

Andy,

Being from So Cal and now living in the Pac Nor West the folks up here do
make the distinction specifically. They include Idaho, Washington, Oregon
and a bit of the coastal areas of Nor Cal as the PNW as well as British
Columbia, further north is simply the Yukon. Just a notation from someone who
moved here and listening to those that have always lived here. I also love
the freight car past that is found here... Salem, Or loaded all kinds of
freight cars during the steam to diesel era (mandatory freight car
requirement)>


Andy Carlson writes:




And Richard, since it seems to be popular sport to go after you, don't you
think that as an English Instructor the phrase "PACIFIC Northwest" is
unnecessarily wordy when "Northwest" will suffice?
-Andy Carlson

________________________________
John Riddell wrote:

Richard,

you wrote

The Pacific Northwest consists of Oregon, Washington, and British

Columbia. Period.

British Columbia is in the Pacific SOUTHwest. The Yukon is in the
NORTHwest.

You seem to be afflicted with the kind of geographical confusion that is
endemic among those who live
south of the 49th parallel. :-)

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It's rare to find meat in any mincemeat pie anymore... I've had several when a friend of mine was in the grass-fed beef business a couple of years ago. Karen would take orders for them several weeks before Thanksgiving. And I believe venison was the traditional meat. Nowadays, it's usually justraisins and apples... but it's still tasty.

Bill Daniels

Tucson, AZ

Maybe I should arrange to have some of our local (Hatch, NM is just down the Interstate from here) chilies shipped out... via a 40' PFE ice reefer (to keep this on subject).

And we are in the Mountain time zone, just an hour ahead of the Bay Area...

Bill Daniels

Tucson, AZ

Bill Daniels wrote:

And it was perfect... with enough left over for roast beef sandwiches for days to come. We can get some locally roasted green Anaheim chillies to go with the sandwiches.

Boy, is my keyboard getting drenched . . . us Pacific Time Zone folks haven't eaten yet . . . boy, do those chilies sound great.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history

Denny, if you're fussy about how your pecan pies are made, what kind of meat
do you use in your mince(d) meat pie? The best I ever had was made with
venison. Nowadays most mincemeat pies seem to be minced apple & raisin pies.

Jim H.

On Fri, Dec 25, 2009 at 4:11 PM, Bill Daniels <billinsf@yahoo.com> wrote:

Denny,

Ours came out when it hit 125... half an hour later it was ready to slice
and serve.
And it was perfect... with enough left over for roast beef sandwiches for
days to come. We can get some locally roasted green Anaheim chillies to go
with the sandwiches.

Bill Daniels

Tucson, AZ

--- On Fri, 12/25/09, Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com<thompson%40signaturepress.com>>
wrote:

From: Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com<thompson%40signaturepress.com>

Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Tank Car lettering conventions
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com <STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Date: Friday, December 25, 2009, 4:17 PM




Denny Anspach wrote:

While I relax at the computer and contemplate decal applications on

my STEAM ERA FREIGHT CARS, I absent myself every 30 minutes to baste

the roast . It will be removed from the oven when the core temp

reaches 120º, and then allowed to rest for awhile until carved at

the table.

Aw, cut it out, Denny! You're making my mouth water all over my

keyboard!

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA

2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress. com

(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturep ress.com


Publishers of books on railroad history

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Denny,

You did better than I did... the only meal I had on a Southern Pacific Train (101) was courtesy of the automat. Yeccchhh!

Fortunately, the train had five PA's on the point as we went over Donner that morning, which made up for that unforgettable (no matter how hard I've tried) meal.

Bill Daniels

Tucson, AZ

Denny,

Ours came out when it hit 125... half an hour later it was ready to slice and serve.
And it was perfect... with enough left over for roast beef sandwiches for days to come. We can get some locally roasted green Anaheim chillies to go with the sandwiches.

Bill Daniels

Tucson, AZ

Wow Denny sounds good. My father likes it simple and asked if pizza would be okay. My wife made fudge, pistacio puddy, cold vegetable pizza, cheese ball and marshmallow crunches. I made pepperoni pizza and bacon, pepperoni pizza.

Mark Morgan in Ohio with rain.

Bill Kelly wrote:

The 1941 AAR Specifications for Tank Cars has a lettering diagram in appendix C, this is the same drawing that appears in the Car Builder'sCyclopedias. Note 6 to the diagram states "Car number and initials to be stencilled on underframe center sills, or side sills, and on both truck bolsters". No location on the center or side sills is specified so it may be hard to find.

The drawing in the 1946 Cyc, page 373, does not show anything about the center sill, Bill.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history

The 1941 AAR Specifications for Tank Cars has a lettering diagram in
appendix C, this is the same drawing that appears in the Car Builder's
Cyclopedias. Note 6 to the diagram states "Car number and initials to be
stencilled on underframe center sills, or side sills, and on both truck
bolsters". No location on the center or side sills is specified so it may
be hard to find.

I too have trouble with that small white lettering in decal sets.
Sometimes, depending on the paper, coloring the back of the sheet with a
black Sharpie helps to make them easier to see.

Merry Christmas
Bill Kelly


Denny Anspach wrote:

Friends, would you kindly refer me to a ready source for learning
standard tank car lettering conventions? I have studied many tank
photos, some of them very nice high resolution, and either my eyes
or the pixelated nature of the photos have prevented me from actually
reading much of the lettering, or enough to determine patterns.

From what I am able to determine, it seemed common- required?- that
both reporting marks and car number be repeated on the sides of the
center sill, presumably so that if tank and frame were separated,
the source of each could still be identified. Capacity and weight the

same? What about other data?

Sometimes the decals provide the clues, but in instances presently
at hand, no such clues are available (in one instance, the fine white

lettering cannot be read against the light blue background decal
paper!) .

Any suggestions, help would be much appreciated.

(There is nothing so very relaxing on a Christmas Day afternoon as a

little dose of Prototype Freight car modeling, made especially
pleasant by the smells of a prime rib roast in the oven
downstairs).


Denny


Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento







------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

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Denny Anspach wrote:

While I relax at the computer and contemplate decal applications on
my STEAM ERA FREIGHT CARS, I absent myself every 30 minutes to baste
the roast . It will be removed from the oven when the core temp
reaches 120º, and then allowed to rest for awhile until carved at
the table.

Aw, cut it out, Denny! You're making my mouth water all over my
keyboard!

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Denny Anspach wrote:

From what I am able to determine, it seemed common- required?- that
both reporting marks and car number be repeated on the sides of the
center sill, presumably so that if tank and frame were separated,
the source of each could still be identified. Capacity and weight
the same? What about other data?

As far as I know, Denny, this practice was at the discretion
of the owner of the car (I've never seen an MCB or ARA/AAR lettering
drawing with tank car center sill lettering). There are certainly a
few photos out there of reasonably fresh tank car paint jobs and NO
such lettering on center sills, but my impression is that a large
majority of owners DID put initials and number on the center sill (and
almost always, repack data are there too). But size and location of
the lettering varied widely. This is especially evident in the many
AC&F builder photos we have. So as with so many things, you need a
prototype photo to letter your model correctly. Some owners did letter
additional items on the center sill, as I gather you've noticed also.

(There is nothing so very relaxing on a Christmas Day afternoon as a
little dose of Prototype Freight car modeling, made especially
pleasant by the smells of a prime rib roast in the oven downstairs).

Quite true, though I lean to the situation where that roast is
cooking at the house you'll visit later today for dinner, and thus
someone ELSE will be doing the heroic mountain of dishes afterward.
<g> At our house, the dishwasher is invariably ME.

Oh, yes. However, I have a children and grandchildren with whom I barter hospitality for such homely tasks.

Well, today, I am chef, cook, and bottle washer with my capable son-in-law as assistant- a Christmas present to Mama. I made pecan and mincemeat pies yesterday (only Grade B dark maple syrup, and roasted pecans!). While I relax at the computer and contemplate decal applications on my STEAM ERA FREIGHT CARS, I absent myself every 30 minutes to baste the roast . It will be removed from the oven when the core temp reaches 120º, and then allowed to rest for awhile until carved at the table.

Some of the very finest most tasty Prime Rib I can ever recall (more than once) was prepared by Southern Pacific Railroad chefs.

Denny

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history

My carelessness had me replying to what I thought was a PM. Please accept my apologies, and let me take some more of your bandwidth to wish everyone well.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA

Hello Paul,
Add $2.00. I figure that by all rights, this should be Brian's best selling truck.

Andy Carlson
111 S Encinal Ave
Ojai CA 93023

805 646 3334

I will mailing after the first. Thanks,
-Andy




________________________________
From: "cobrapsl@aol.com" <cobrapsl@aol.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, December 25, 2009 12:52:25 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Tahoe Model Works latest HO 50T truck



Hi Andy,

I got the "flyer" and my answer from Brian as to the truck prototype. Looks like it was a big replacement truck under SP B-50-15 and 16 boxcars. Since this was a big Sunshine seller, not to mention CIL, there is a real need for these things. Please give a dozen sets, w/o wheels to start. Total with shipping?

Merry Christmas!
Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: Andy Carlson <midcentury@sbcgloba l.net>
To: Steam Era <stmfc@yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Wed, Dec 23, 2009 8:35 pm
Subject: [STMFC] Tahoe Model Works latest HO 50T truck

I am pleased to be able to offer the latest Tahoe Model Works HO 50 Ton truck. This is arguably the most used of his entire line in the prototype world. This is his 9th offering to date.

I am sure that Brian will make his notice to this list shortly, though I will summarize the users:

1920s to the late 1930s
ATSF B&O CB&Q CNCP CV CoG C&NW C&EI ERIE DL&W GTWIC MP NP RI SL-SF SP T&NO T&P UP and WP. Also PFESFRD

Brian informs me that these trucks were used extensively as replacements for earlier- defect prone trucks such as the PFE's T-section.

Prices from me are $5.25/pair with either code 88 or fat wheels.
Sideframes less wheelsets w/ brake beams are $3.00/pair

I still have a good selection of trucks 001-008 with and w/o wheelsets.

Shipping is based on actual charges. I do accept PayPal, and I still welcome personal checks.As before, I can be contacted off-list (please) at <midcentury@sbcgloba l.net>
Thanks,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA
805 646 3334

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Dec 25, 2009, at 1:16 PM, Denny Anspach wrote:

Friends, would you kindly refer me to a ready source for learning
standard tank car lettering conventions? I have studied many tank
photos, some of them very nice high resolution, and either my eyes or
the pixelated nature of the photos have prevented me from actually
reading much of the lettering, or enough to determine patterns.

From what I am able to determine, it seemed common- required?- that
both reporting marks and car number be repeated on the sides of the
center sill, presumably so that if tank and frame were separated, the
source of each could still be identified. Capacity and weight the
same? What about other data?

Sometimes the decals provide the clues, but in instances presently at
hand, no such clues are available (in one instance, the fine white
lettering cannot be read against the light blue background decal
paper!) .

Any suggestions, help would be much appreciated.

As a general guide, which (among other things) explains the required
tank test data, one can hardly do better than the AAR Standard
Lettering and Marking Diagrams, which were published in every issue
of the Car Builders' Cyclopedias. Interestingly, These do not show
reporting marks and numbers on the center sill as a requirement,
though - as Tony Thompson has pointed out - most tank car owners, and
all of the major tank car leasing companies, did so. Nominal
capacity, light weight, and weigh station symbol and date were
generally just below the reporting marks and numbers on the tank, but
the exact arrangement varied (e.g., GATC tended to put them all on
the same line). Note, too, that tank cars, unlike other freight
cars, did not have to be periodically reweighed, as shippers were
charged on the basis of gallonage, not weight. Consequently, they
were reweighed only when repairs or modifications significantly
affected their light weight (e.g., the application of AB brake
equipment in place of K brakes). They often carried their NEW light
weight and weighing date for many years after they were built. As an
extreme case, I have a photo of a UTL Van Dyke car taken in the early
'50s which still bore the stenciling "NEW 4-12." though its trucks
(but not its KD brake equipment) had been changed. It should also be
pointed out that tank test data was simpler on cars (e.g., ICC -203s
in wine or corn oil service) that were not used for what the ICC
defined as "regulatory commodities" which would burn, explode,
corrode, etc. For more specific info, let me know off-list what
you're working on and I will consult my photo files.

Richard Hendrickson