Date   

Re: express reefers loading/unloading

railwayman <stevelucas3@...>
 

Many local passenger trains lifted and set off express cars behind the coaches. It's easier to move the markers back and do up an air hose than to disconnect and re-connect steam pipe and air signal lines as well. Especially when wearing a passenger trainman's uniform and trying not to soil it.

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Tim O'Connor wrote:
For unloading, that makes sense. What about loading? I've seen
photos/videos of trains with many express reefers. Were they handled
by local passenger trains like the cream/butter business,or by
freights, and then later consolidated for long haul on mail/
passenger trains?
Good point. I'd guess it would depend on the local
circumstances, for example how easy a pickup by a passenger train
would be. Certainly no one is going to park a passenger while the
locomotive wanders off to an industrial siding somewhere. There's an
example cited in the PFE book of strawberries in express reefers, with
cars timed to complete loading and be picked up and taken straight to
the main line by the normal local freight, to meet a passenger train.
Other situations would require other solutions.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Steel Mill Railroads from Morning Side Books

Norman+Laraine Larkin <lono@...>
 

I spoke with Morning Sun Books today about the book. It is primarily a photo essay on the industry from the 1960s-1980s with emphasis on the 70s. The main subject is motive power, but there is a lot of background physical plant info and a lot of rolling stock pics. Unfortunately, it is more modern than the List's time frame. However, I would guess that the plant, mill rolling stock and some motive power photos relate back to the 50s.
Norm Larkin

----- Original Message -----
From: "Allen Cain" <allencain@...>
To: "Steam Era Freight Car Discussion Group" <STMFC@...>
Sent: Monday, December 28, 2009 11:56 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Steel Mill Railroads from Morning Side Books


Would anyone who has this recently published book comment on coverage of
steam era or transition era freight cars, operations and roads?



I am interested in it but only if it has a decent amount of material for the
period covered by this group and in particular the early 1950s.



Thanks,



Allen Cain






------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: Modifying Con-Cor USRA Box Car

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Jerry Glow wrote:
"NOT TRUE if you get the right ones. Bill Gould made the 5-5-5 ends for a DS car long before the SS car came around. The ends ARE different."

Good point; however, it would have helped out the original poster more if you had noted the specific part to avoid confusion.

BTW, the end for the USRA DS boxcar is Tichy #3001:
http://tinyurl.com/yhnekhe

To clarify, there are two options for Riley's project - Tichy #3001, or Westerfield #3822.


Ben Hom


Re: Modifying Con-Cor USRA Box Car

jerryglow2
 

NOT TRUE if you get the right ones. Bill Gould made the 5-5-5 ends for a DS car long before the SS car came around. The ends ARE different.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@...> wrote:

Jerry Glow responded:
"Good choice for the doors and I'd use their ends also. I'm familiar with the kit (might still have an unbuilt one) and scratch built one using the new Gould (at the time) ends following a Bob Hundman article in Mainline Modeler."

Be advised that the Tichy ends are from their USRA SS boxcar kit, which if used as is will be too narrow for the DS boxcar. You'll need to splice two ends together and rework the roof pitch to get the correct width.

A better alternative would be to use Westerfield #3822, which IS intended for the USRA DS boxcar:
http://www.westerfield.biz/detail_parts_80318.htm

Scroll down 3/4 of the way down the page for the part in question.


Ben Hom


Re: express reefers loading/unloading

Steve SANDIFER
 

From the Santa Fe Society website:

Express Special East, 8/29/52, Amarillo
Contributed by Richard Stephey
Engine 2900

REX 1581 ExpReef ExpReef 1200-1899 Broadway Ltd LCL Perishable Chicago
REX 6240 ExpReef ExpReef 6100-6599 Branchline Grapes New York SR 3 PC
REX 6733 ExpReef ExpReef 6600-6799 Grapes Chicago SR3 PC
REX 6583 ExpReef ExpReef 6100-6599 Branchline Grapes New York SR No salt
REX 1491 ExpReef 1200-1899 Broadway Ltd Grapes New York SR 3 PC
NCSTL 3905 Grapes Chicago SR No salt
REX 282 ExpReef ExpReef 275-474 Grapes Chicago SR No salt
ATSF 4034 ExpReef REA/ATSF ExpReef 4000-4049 Grapes Chicago SR No salt
REX 6173 ExpReef ExpReef 6100-6599 Branchline Grapes New York SR No salt
ATSF 275 Hwt ACF BagMailExp 257-319 Baggage
ATSF 397 Hwt PS BagMailExp 383-399 Baggage
ATSF 3706 Lwt PS/ATSF RPO-Bag 3700-3749 Baggage
ATSF 357 Bad Number Baggage
ATSF 1861 Hwt ATSF BagMailExp 1861-1884 Msgr Baggage DH KsCity
ATSF 1165 Hwt PS 58 seat chair Rider Chair Car Kansas City


----------------------------------------------------------------
J. Stephen (Steve) Sandifer
mailto:steve.sandifer@...
Home: 12027 Mulholland Dr., Meadows Place, TX 77477, 281-568-9918
Office: Southwest Central Church of Christ, 4011 W. Bellfort, Houston, TX
77025, 713-667-9417
Personal: http://www.geocities.com/stevesandifer2000/index
Church: http://www.swcentral.org

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Thompson
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Tuesday, December 29, 2009 12:12 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] express reefers loading/unloading



Tim O'Connor wrote:
> For unloading, that makes sense. What about loading? I've seen
> photos/videos of trains with many express reefers. Were they handled
> by local passenger trains like the cream/butter business,or by
> freights, and then later consolidated for long haul on mail/
> passenger trains?

Good point. I'd guess it would depend on the local
circumstances, for example how easy a pickup by a passenger train
would be. Certainly no one is going to park a passenger while the
locomotive wanders off to an industrial siding somewhere. There's an
example cited in the PFE book of strawberries in express reefers, with
cars timed to complete loading and be picked up and taken straight to
the main line by the normal local freight, to meet a passenger train.
Other situations would require other solutions.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Modifying Con-Cor USRA Box Car

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Riley K (didn't sign full name) asked:
"I have a C&WC car I bought in 1967 and never built. The bug bit me again and I am back building HO models. I'm trying to update it with some current parts. Have decided to use Tichy "wooden doors" and am asking for your advice on replacing the metal ends which came with the kit. The brake work will be Tichy K brake parts.

Who makes parts which will be adequate for this model's ends? Any help is appreciated."


Jerry Glow responded:
"Good choice for the doors and I'd use their ends also. I'm familiar with the kit (might still have an unbuilt one) and scratch built one using the new Gould (at the time) ends following a Bob Hundman article in Mainline Modeler."

Be advised that the Tichy ends are from their USRA SS boxcar kit, which if used as is will be too narrow for the DS boxcar. You'll need to splice two ends together and rework the roof pitch to get the correct width.

A better alternative would be to use Westerfield #3822, which IS intended for the USRA DS boxcar:
http://www.westerfield.biz/detail_parts_80318.htm

Scroll down 3/4 of the way down the page for the part in question.


Ben Hom


Re: express reefers loading/unloading

np328
 

Back in May, I had uploaded a bit of paperwork I had found that might help with how some of these loads are consolidated. It is in the files section here listed as "Fruit and Vegetable Transit in PNW 1934.doc". I wish I could have found something in the 1950's timeframe however......

On the NPRHA site, I transcribed an instructional listing of the
manifesting of trains. I would think that each railroad had it's own instructions of how these loads were to be handled. The listing I had was a 1929 listing. Since then I have found more leading up to the mid 1950's (these seem to have been issued every three months on the NP) however the documents differ not too much from the 1929 posting other than a bit of tweaking.
Jim Dick -St.Paul

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

For unloading, that makes sense. What about loading? I've seen
photos/videos of trains with many express reefers. Were they
handled by local passenger trains like the cream/butter business,
or by freights, and then later consolidated for long haul on
mail/passenger trains?

Tim O'Connor


At 12/28/2009 10:04 PM Monday, you wrote:
Brian Carlson wrote:
To get away from coal for a moment. at larger terminals, Pittsburgh,
Buffalo, Cleveland, etc would express reefers of strawberries for
instance be unloaded at the station or REA terminal, or would they
be delivered a food/produce terminal in the city. Cities like
Buffalo and Cleveland had food terminals and I was wondering if
express reefers would be switched from a passenger train to these
locations?
From what I know about PFE, the produce terminals were always
used, not passenger depots. The role of REA is an interesting
question, as they controlled express reefers for most railroads, but I
think were still routed to produce terminals to serve the normal
buyers in those locations.

Tony Thompson


Re: express reefers loading/unloading

michael bishop <goldrod_1@...>
 

I have been told by some older Santa Fe men (and this was thirty years ago) that the East bound Grand Canyon would pick up two or three REA reefers in Fullerton, Ca during the Strawberry season for back east. I have seen photos of the Grand Canyon during the strawberry season with REA reefers, if they were picked up in Fullerton I do not know. I  have had fun doing this move over the years with my east bound Grand Canyon.
 
Michael Bishop

--- On Mon, 12/28/09, Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:


From: Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] express reefers loading/unloading
To: STMFC@...
Date: Monday, December 28, 2009, 10:12 PM


 



Tim O'Connor wrote:
For unloading, that makes sense. What about loading? I've seen
photos/videos of trains with many express reefers. Were they handled
by local passenger trains like the cream/butter business,or by
freights, and then later consolidated for long haul on mail/
passenger trains?
Good point. I'd guess it would depend on the local
circumstances, for example how easy a pickup by a passenger train
would be. Certainly no one is going to park a passenger while the
locomotive wanders off to an industrial siding somewhere. There's an
example cited in the PFE book of strawberries in express reefers, with
cars timed to complete loading and be picked up and taken straight to
the main line by the normal local freight, to meet a passenger train.
Other situations would require other solutions.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress. com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturep ress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history











[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: express reefers loading/unloading

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
For unloading, that makes sense. What about loading? I've seen photos/videos of trains with many express reefers. Were they handled by local passenger trains like the cream/butter business,or by freights, and then later consolidated for long haul on mail/ passenger trains?
Good point. I'd guess it would depend on the local circumstances, for example how easy a pickup by a passenger train would be. Certainly no one is going to park a passenger while the locomotive wanders off to an industrial siding somewhere. There's an example cited in the PFE book of strawberries in express reefers, with cars timed to complete loading and be picked up and taken straight to the main line by the normal local freight, to meet a passenger train. Other situations would require other solutions.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: express reefers loading/unloading

Tim O'Connor
 

For unloading, that makes sense. What about loading? I've seen
photos/videos of trains with many express reefers. Were they
handled by local passenger trains like the cream/butter business,
or by freights, and then later consolidated for long haul on
mail/passenger trains?

Tim O'Connor

At 12/28/2009 10:04 PM Monday, you wrote:
Brian Carlson wrote:
To get away from coal for a moment. at larger terminals, Pittsburgh,
Buffalo, Cleveland, etc would express reefers of strawberries for
instance be unloaded at the station or REA terminal, or would they
be delivered a food/produce terminal in the city. Cities like
Buffalo and Cleveland had food terminals and I was wondering if
express reefers would be switched from a passenger train to these
locations?
From what I know about PFE, the produce terminals were always
used, not passenger depots. The role of REA is an interesting
question, as they controlled express reefers for most railroads, but I
think were still routed to produce terminals to serve the normal
buyers in those locations.

Tony Thompson


ADMIN: Coal in the Northwest Terminated

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Well...we've certainly spent enough time worrying about coal in the state of Washington.
However, while the subject of coal anywhere is a legitimate subject, referencing other members in a negative manner is not legitimate on the STMFC. Remember a major theme of the STMFC. If you want to make a point...make it. If someone disagrees, they have the right to state it. Neither, however, has the right to criticize another member on the STMFC regarding the right or wrong of their position. The data presented will decide the validity of the arguments put forth and other members will be so persuaded.

So...let's let the thread on coal in the Northwest...whichever one...lie for awhile. Time to move on.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: B&O Wagon Tob Boxcars

Brian Carlson
 

Gary: You want to get Railway Prototype Cyclopedia no.9. It had a 25 page
article on the B&O wagon top cars. They are available here
http://rpcycpub.com/



Brian J. Carlson, P.E.

Cheektowaga NY



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of gary
rodriguez
Sent: Monday, December 28, 2009 11:36 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] B&O Wagon Tob Boxcars





Can anyone provide me with information pertaining to the various designs
that the B&O had for the wagon top boxcars. I am researching this to
construct a model of a car that is sitting on the outskirts of my town.
Also does anyone know if any of these were saved in museums?

TIA,

Gary R.
SA, TX.


Steel Mill Railroads from Morning Side Books

Allen Cain <allencain@...>
 

Would anyone who has this recently published book comment on coverage of
steam era or transition era freight cars, operations and roads?



I am interested in it but only if it has a decent amount of material for the
period covered by this group and in particular the early 1950s.



Thanks,



Allen Cain


B&O Wagon Tob Boxcars

gary rodriguez
 

Can anyone provide me with information pertaining to the various designs that the B&O had for the wagon top boxcars.  I am researching this to construct a model of a car that is sitting on the outskirts of my town.  Also does anyone know if any of these were saved in museums?

TIA,

Gary R.
SA, TX.


Re: Modifying Con-Cor USRA Box Car

jerryglow2
 

Good choice for the doors and I'd use their ends also. I'm familiar with the kit (might still have an unbuilt one) and scratch built one using the new Gould (at the time) ends following a Bob Hundman article in Mainline Modeler.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., "Riley K" <riley050748@...> wrote:

I have a C&WC car I bought in 1967 and never built. The bug bit me again and I am back building HO models. I'm trying to update it with some current parts. Have decided to use Tichy "wooden doors" and am asking for your advice on replacing the metal ends which came with the kit. The brake work will be Tichy K brake parts.

Who makes parts which will be adequate for this model's ends? Any help is appreciated.


Re: Airbrush Help

leakinmywaders
 

Richard: I have a very basic, first-generation Aztek that I've painted with for about ten years. I'm fine with it-- it does what I need it too, and with easy cleanup and minimum fuss. I very seldom get clogs with acrylic paints if I use a metal mesh filter in the intake tube, and keep the nozzle wet with a shot of Windex any time I set the bush down for a few minutes. But I do keep a second acrylic nozzle on hand for those occasions when clogs happen. In the event of persistent clogs, I have always been able to unclog the nozzles with a simple overnight solvent soak.

I can't recall getting a clog more than once or twice with slower-drying laquer-based paints like Scalecoat. I'm still painting those with the original nozzle. Best,

Chris Frissell
Polson, MT

--- In STMFC@..., Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

Thanks to Greg Martin, Jack Burgess, Kurt Laughlin, Rich Orr, and Tim
O'Connor for their feedback on the Aztec airbrush, all of it very
useful. I haven't made a decision yet, but I really appreciate the
help.

Richard Hendrickson



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Coal in the Pacific Northwest

leakinmywaders
 

Richard:

I too was content to let this pass, but since you took one more kick at this: My post was not incorrect (nor so car as I can tell were most of the others on list). Though irrelevant to the original question, it was certainly relevant to a sweeping statement you made about commercial mining of coal in Oregon. Though doubtless insignificant to Mr. Peabody, in the context of time and place, the coal mined at Coos Bay was important economically and socially to those who participated in that industry and those who followed them--and in fact it spawned small industrial railroads, which rails lasted into the era of this list. It was not my intent to nitpick, but only to ensure one small historical fact was not forgotten in the rush to generalize.

Any implication that my post contradicted the main thrust of your original message was a long stretch meant to be tongue in cheek. I thought I made that fairly plain, but if not, let it be plain now. Best,

Chris Frissell
Self-Appointed, MT

--- In STMFC@..., Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

I said I would have no more to say on this subject, but I can't
resist responding to Dave's very useful post.
....
So what does this tell us? I got a lot of grief, some of it off-
list, about my post on this subject which started the whole
discussion, but it appears to me that Dave's evidence entirely
confirms my original statements (except for my ignorance about the
NP's use of coal, which I've already admitted). Doesn't that make a
lot of the responses to my post by self-appointed experts on Pacific
Northwest coal seem either wrong or irrelevant?

Richard Hendrickson



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Coal in the Pacific Northwest -- some FACTS

Dave Nelson
 

Actually everything I wrote was correct. I just forgot to include the
phrase "per miner" after the word coal. It's a bit more than half the US
average, so not only are these small mines, they're low productivity mines
as well.

Anyway, the other fact I omitted to mention that fully half of Washington's
coal came from a single mine and whatever it was named it was located in
Kittitas county. Google maps tells me Kittitas county is near Stampede
Pass, on the east side of the Cascades. Unlike most of Washington's mines
it operated for most workdays of the year.

Dave Nelson

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Tim
O'Connor

Dave, you've got to watch those decimal points...

Tim O'Connor

The average DAILY producion of coal in Washington state was 3.89 tons.


Re: express reefers loading/unloading

Brian Carlson
 

Thanks tony: It's one of those questions that popped up while researching
the Niagara Frontier (Buffalo) NY) Food terminal.



Brian J. Carlson, P.E.

Cheektowaga NY



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Anthony Thompson
Sent: Monday, December 28, 2009 10:04 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] express reefers loading/unloading



From what I know about PFE, the produce terminals were always
used, not passenger depots. The role of REA is an interesting
question, as they controlled express reefers for most railroads, but I
think were still routed to produce terminals to serve the normal
buyers in those locations.


Re: Slide scanner

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Excuse the intrusion on the list, but please copy me on replies off list, too. Thanks.

SGL

I have a lot of slides and negatives of steam freight cars that I want to scan. My Epson
Perfection 2400 does a nice job,
but is slow. Since the moderator probably won't let this thread continue for long, please contact
me off list with
suggestions for an upgrade. If you have experience with an Epson Perfection V500, please let me
hear from you.
______________
J. Stephen (Steve) Sandifer
mailto:steve.sandifer@... <mailto:steve.sandifer%40sbcglobal.net>
Home: 12027 Mulholland Drive, Meadows Place, TX 77477, 281-568-9918
Office: Southwest Central Church of Christ, 4011 W. Bellfort, Houston, TX 77025, 713-667-9417




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