Date   

Re: Liquid chloride Tankcar help

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jun 8, 2010, at 1:47 AM, schmuck804_99 wrote:

Hello,
I am looking for information to model this tiny tankcar:
http://picasaweb.google.com/ErieChris333/
ProtoPhotos#5480125587635072754
I got DIAMOND ALKALI COMPANY Painesville, OH D.A.X.
The tank dia. looks small, I guess it to be around 63" from the photo.

Can you guys help, drawings would be a big plus!
That's a GATC Type ICC-105 high pressure 4,000 gal. high pressure
chlorine car of 30 tons nominal capacity. AFAIK there are no
drawings available for a GATC car. However, Diamond also owned AC&F
cars which were essentially identical except for their underframes,
so the AC&F general arrangement drawings in Kaminski's book, in '40s
editions of the Car Builders' Cyclopedias, and in Train Shed
Cyclopedia #12
will give you the dimensions you need. I will send you off-list a
couple of scans that will help.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Liquid chloride Tankcar help

Tim O'Connor
 

Note: In the Diamond Alkali equipment listing of the January 1953 ORER,
it states that ICC regulations prohibited the loading of any tank car with
more than 60,000 lbs of chlorine. Since chlorine weighs over 12 lbs/gallon
any size in excess of 5,000 gallons was unnecessary. Nevertheless the
equipment register shows various cars with 80,000 lbs as well as 60,000 lbs
capacity for chlorine. Several tank cars are specially noted as having
30,000 lbs capacity (Note A).

Tank cars could be smaller -- I have a photo of a 3,000 gallon car built
for tetraethyl lead (which weighs over 14 lbs/gallon).

Tim O'Connor

They're both small tank cars, so the dimensions are somewhat similar; in addition to the differences you mention and the tank mounts, the DAX car is pressurized and insulated so the tank has a jacket. In Kaminski's tank car book, p 227, are general arrangement drawings (with dimensions) of AC&F insulated Type 27 cars from 2600 to 10,000 gallons.

The HO scale Trix model mentioned in this thread is of a 6,000-gallon insulated car; Richard Hendrickson discusses prototypes in Railmodel Journal 9/04, pp 49-53. The cars shown were all built by AC&F, and all the pictures but one show 6,000-gallon cars, which to me look fatter than the DAX car. The exception is SPX 8010, a 4,000-gallon car, so I suspect that's what DAX 212(?) may be.

-- Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


Re: Liquid chloride Tankcar help

al_brown03
 

They're both small tank cars, so the dimensions are somewhat similar; in addition to the differences you mention and the tank mounts, the DAX car is pressurized and insulated so the tank has a jacket. In Kaminski's tank car book, p 227, are general arrangement drawings (with dimensions) of AC&F insulated Type 27 cars from 2600 to 10,000 gallons.

The HO scale Trix model mentioned in this thread is of a 6,000-gallon insulated car; Richard Hendrickson discusses prototypes in Railmodel Journal 9/04, pp 49-53. The cars shown were all built by AC&F, and all the pictures but one show 6,000-gallon cars, which to me look fatter than the DAX car. The exception is SPX 8010, a 4,000-gallon car, so I suspect that's what DAX 212(?) may be.

-- hth --

-- Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@..., "schmuck804_99" <CSchmuck@...> wrote:

Al,
Thank you. This info "sounds right" to me from my guess.

So this tank would be similar to the SHPX 4000gal car in the June 94 MR, but longer and a different dome?

Thanks for your help!
Chris

--- In STMFC@..., "al_brown03" <abrown@> wrote:

Well, the car has a pressure bonnet not a dome. The 1/53 ORER shows 81 tank cars, AAR type TPI, ICC classes 105A300 (66 cars) and 105A300W (15 cars), 30 and 40 tons, in eleven groups between DAX 200-299. All but four cars are said to be marked "Chlorine Gas Tank Car". I could convince myself this car's number is 212, one of three 40-ton cars in series 211-213. The capacity looks to be maybe 5000 gallons, which IIRC is a typical size for a steam-era chlorine tank; the tank mounts differ from those on the other tank car shown, and suggest to me this car may have been built by General American or Standard Tank. (See pictures in Ted Culotta's tank car book.)

-- hth --

-- Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


--- In STMFC@..., "Garth G. Groff" <ggg9y@> wrote:

Chris and friends,

Can't help with the tank car (neat, though!), but note the NP boxcar to
the right. Can't have a freight train without an NP box in the first ten
cars.

Kind regards,


Garth Groff

schmuck804_99 wrote:
Hello,
I am looking for information to model this tiny tankcar:
http://picasaweb.google.com/ErieChris333/ProtoPhotos#5480125587635072754
I got DIAMOND ALKALI COMPANY Painesville, OH D.A.X.
The tank dia. looks small, I guess it to be around 63" from the photo.

Can you guys help, drawings would be a big plus!

Thanks
Chris


Re: Liquid chloride Tankcar help

Bryan Busséy
 

Chris,

If an HO model already exists at a reasonable cost, that along with
prototype photos might be a viable alternative to scale drawings since
you are scratchbuilding the N scale tank in any event.

bb

On 6/8/2010 2:41 PM, schmuck804_99 wrote:

Eldon,
I model in N scale this car will be a kitbash with a new tank for me...

Chris

--- In STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>,
"Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Had you already passed on the Trix car? It is about 6k, like that
one, and
is also an insulated car with valve casing instead of dome.
Admittedly, some
work to bring up to standard.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>] On
Behalf Of Garth
G. Groff
Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2010 6:56 AM
To: STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Liquid chloride Tankcar help



Chris and friends,

Can't help with the tank car (neat, though!), but note the NP boxcar
to the
right. Can't have a freight train without an NP box in the first ten
cars.

Kind regards,

Garth Groff

schmuck804_99 wrote:
Hello,
I am looking for information to model this tiny tankcar:
http://picasaweb.google.com/ErieChris333/ProtoPhotos#54801255876350727
54 I got DIAMOND ALKALI COMPANY Painesville, OH D.A.X.
The tank dia. looks small, I guess it to be around 63" from the photo.

Can you guys help, drawings would be a big plus!

Thanks
Chris


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

Steve Lucas <stevelucas3@...>
 

I can vouch for the use of Bare-Metal foil. I used it to represent patch plates on a Westerfield Canada Southern car. Even under a layer of Scalecoat, the thickness of the foil is obvious as a "welded" patch".

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., Brian Carlson <prrk41361@...> wrote:

Champ Decal film does work as does, Bare metal foil, (never tried that on a painted car), also I plan to try an Archer fine weld bead to see if it will suggest a patch panel.

Brian Carlson
--- On Tue, 6/8/10, Barrybennetttoo@... <Barrybennetttoo@...> wrote:


From: Barrybennetttoo@... <Barrybennetttoo@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 2:35 PM


 



Yes, I know that is the work I have to do.

My patch panel plans are to use thick (ie Champ or left over Walthers)
decal sheet, which should produce enough of an edge to the panels without the
add-on crudity of thin plastic sheet, which isn't thin enough at any grade I
can get.

I suppose another alternative would be thin plastic sticky tape, but my gut
feeling is that the decal film will be infinitely easier.

Cheers

Barry Bennett

In a message dated 08/06/2010 18:01:58 GMT Standard Time,
prrk41361@... writes:

Barry: As discussed recently on the list you'll have to reroof your
westerfield cars and add patch panels for your era. Additing Patch panels to
painted cars is not that difficult. I've done it to the RC X29's before the
newest runs.
brian carlson

--- On Tue, 6/8/10, barryb2again <_Barrybennetttoo@..._
(mailto:Barrybennetttoo@...) > wrote:

From: barryb2again <_Barrybennetttoo@..._
(mailto:Barrybennetttoo@...) >
Subject: [STMFC] Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars
To: _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...)
Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 12:02 PM

I read, and filed, Richard's piece before I mailed and ...

" By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

As I model 1957 then 'most cars had them' applies.

It seems to me a little odd to offer late 50's paint schemes on pristine
un-patched bodies. Because of the extra work I'll pass on them and build
up my Westerfields instead.

Barry Bennett

--- In _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) , "Steve
Hoxie" <stevehprr@> wrote:

Hi Barry--I had to go back and read Richard Hendrickson's piece again.
I found that he didn't write "all", which, like "never," is a dangerous
word to use in prototype modeling! I have taken the liberty of quoting
from his piece here:

"By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

My plan is some with and some without patch panels for my 1953 date.

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL

--- In _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) ,
"barryb2again" Barrybennetttoo@ wrote:

Having reviewed tha earlier posts and then read the BLI blurb I note
that BLI have said that they will not be producing models with repair
patches.

Taking Richard Hendrickson's manuscript comments that the cars
suffered the same body rot problems as the X29 cars and that all of them
received patch panel repairs then the BLI cars are not much use as
produced for anyone that models the 1950's.

So it looks like buy undecs, add patch panels and then paint and
decal. Or maybe I will just build my store of Westerfield kits instead.

Barry Bennett
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

On 6/8/2010 11:35 AM, Barrybennetttoo@... wrote:
Yes, I know that is the work I have to do.

My patch panel plans are to use thick (ie Champ or left over Walthers)
decal sheet, which should produce enough of an edge to the panels without the
add-on crudity of thin plastic sheet, which isn't thin enough at any grade I
can get.

Adding that coating for old decal paper, with one or more applications, might be a way to thicken up the decal sheet! :-)

--
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax--Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

Brian Carlson
 

Champ Decal film does work as does, Bare metal foil, (never tried that on a painted car), also I plan to try an Archer fine weld bead to see if it will suggest a patch panel.

Brian Carlson

--- On Tue, 6/8/10, Barrybennetttoo@... <Barrybennetttoo@...> wrote:


From: Barrybennetttoo@... <Barrybennetttoo@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 2:35 PM


 



Yes, I know that is the work I have to do.

My patch panel plans are to use thick (ie Champ or left over Walthers)
decal sheet, which should produce enough of an edge to the panels without the
add-on crudity of thin plastic sheet, which isn't thin enough at any grade I
can get.

I suppose another alternative would be thin plastic sticky tape, but my gut
feeling is that the decal film will be infinitely easier.

Cheers

Barry Bennett

In a message dated 08/06/2010 18:01:58 GMT Standard Time,
prrk41361@... writes:

Barry: As discussed recently on the list you'll have to reroof your
westerfield cars and add patch panels for your era. Additing Patch panels to
painted cars is not that difficult. I've done it to the RC X29's before the
newest runs.
brian carlson

--- On Tue, 6/8/10, barryb2again <_Barrybennetttoo@...
(mailto:Barrybennetttoo@...) > wrote:

From: barryb2again <_Barrybennetttoo@...
(mailto:Barrybennetttoo@...) >
Subject: [STMFC] Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars
To: _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...)
Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 12:02 PM

I read, and filed, Richard's piece before I mailed and ...

" By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

As I model 1957 then 'most cars had them' applies.

It seems to me a little odd to offer late 50's paint schemes on pristine
un-patched bodies. Because of the extra work I'll pass on them and build
up my Westerfields instead.

Barry Bennett

--- In _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) , "Steve
Hoxie" <stevehprr@...> wrote:

Hi Barry--I had to go back and read Richard Hendrickson's piece again.
I found that he didn't write "all", which, like "never," is a dangerous
word to use in prototype modeling! I have taken the liberty of quoting
from his piece here:

"By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

My plan is some with and some without patch panels for my 1953 date.

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL

--- In _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) ,
"barryb2again" Barrybennetttoo@ wrote:

Having reviewed tha earlier posts and then read the BLI blurb I note
that BLI have said that they will not be producing models with repair
patches.

Taking Richard Hendrickson's manuscript comments that the cars
suffered the same body rot problems as the X29 cars and that all of them
received patch panel repairs then the BLI cars are not much use as
produced for anyone that models the 1950's.

So it looks like buy undecs, add patch panels and then paint and
decal. Or maybe I will just build my store of Westerfield kits instead.

Barry Bennett
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: DL&W wood auto boxcars

Ken O'Brien
 

Gentlemen,

Thanks for all the info, so far. I did find my copy of the Magor book and copies of the Mainline Modeler drawings of the 40T USRA box.
I also found an article in the January 2010 RMC on kitbashing a NYC USRA-design door and a half boxcar by J.M. Johnson.

Ken O'Brien

--- In STMFC@..., "brianleppert@..." <brianleppert@...> wrote:

I have an original Magor drawing of the underframe arrangement for the DL&W 12800-12999 cars. It is almost an exact copy of the USRA 40-ton box car underframe.

Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV

--- In STMFC@..., "Ken" <kobrien1600@> wrote:

I'm looking for info and pictures about the wood door and a half auto boxcars of the DL&W in series 12000 to 12999...
Ken O'Brien


Re: Liquid chloride Tankcar help

schmuck804_99 <CSchmuck@...>
 

Eldon,
I model in N scale this car will be a kitbash with a new tank for me...

Chris

--- In STMFC@..., "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Had you already passed on the Trix car? It is about 6k, like that one, and
is also an insulated car with valve casing instead of dome. Admittedly, some
work to bring up to standard.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Garth
G. Groff
Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2010 6:56 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Liquid chloride Tankcar help



Chris and friends,

Can't help with the tank car (neat, though!), but note the NP boxcar to the
right. Can't have a freight train without an NP box in the first ten cars.

Kind regards,

Garth Groff

schmuck804_99 wrote:
Hello,
I am looking for information to model this tiny tankcar:
http://picasaweb.google.com/ErieChris333/ProtoPhotos#54801255876350727
54 I got DIAMOND ALKALI COMPANY Painesville, OH D.A.X.
The tank dia. looks small, I guess it to be around 63" from the photo.

Can you guys help, drawings would be a big plus!

Thanks
Chris


Re: Liquid chloride Tankcar help

schmuck804_99 <CSchmuck@...>
 

Chuck,

Thank you for the link. I live right where the Fairport branch of the B&O started. I used to be the Painesville & Youngstown RR and at one time was 3' gauge.

Chris

--- In STMFC@..., RUTLANDRS@... wrote:

Chris,
Can't help with the drawings, but Dad worked there for over 20 years.
You might want to check the Fairport, Painesville and Eastern site,
_www.rsworld.com~nix66/fpemain.html_
(http://www.rsworld.com~nix66/fpemain.html) +it has a lot of info on the Diamond.
Chuck Hladik
Rutland Railroad
Virginia Division


In a message dated 6/8/2010 4:51:35 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
CSchmuck@... writes:




Hello,
I am looking for information to model this tiny tankcar:
_http://picasaweb.google.com/ErieChris333/ProtoPhotos#5480125587635072754_
(http://picasaweb.google.com/ErieChris333/ProtoPhotos#5480125587635072754)
I got DIAMOND ALKALI COMPANY Painesville, OH D.A.X.
The tank dia. looks small, I guess it to be around 63" from the photo.

Can you guys help, drawings would be a big plus!

Thanks
Chris







Re: Liquid chloride Tankcar help

schmuck804_99 <CSchmuck@...>
 

Al,
Thank you. This info "sounds right" to me from my guess.

So this tank would be similar to the SHPX 4000gal car in the June 94 MR, but longer and a different dome?

Thanks for your help!
Chris

--- In STMFC@..., "al_brown03" <abrown@...> wrote:

Well, the car has a pressure bonnet not a dome. The 1/53 ORER shows 81 tank cars, AAR type TPI, ICC classes 105A300 (66 cars) and 105A300W (15 cars), 30 and 40 tons, in eleven groups between DAX 200-299. All but four cars are said to be marked "Chlorine Gas Tank Car". I could convince myself this car's number is 212, one of three 40-ton cars in series 211-213. The capacity looks to be maybe 5000 gallons, which IIRC is a typical size for a steam-era chlorine tank; the tank mounts differ from those on the other tank car shown, and suggest to me this car may have been built by General American or Standard Tank. (See pictures in Ted Culotta's tank car book.)

-- hth --

-- Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


--- In STMFC@..., "Garth G. Groff" <ggg9y@> wrote:

Chris and friends,

Can't help with the tank car (neat, though!), but note the NP boxcar to
the right. Can't have a freight train without an NP box in the first ten
cars.

Kind regards,


Garth Groff

schmuck804_99 wrote:
Hello,
I am looking for information to model this tiny tankcar:
http://picasaweb.google.com/ErieChris333/ProtoPhotos#5480125587635072754
I got DIAMOND ALKALI COMPANY Painesville, OH D.A.X.
The tank dia. looks small, I guess it to be around 63" from the photo.

Can you guys help, drawings would be a big plus!

Thanks
Chris


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

Brian Carlson
 

Barry: As discussed recently on the list you'll have to reroof your westerfield cars and add patch panels for your era. Additing Patch panels to painted cars is not that difficult. I've done it to the RC X29's before the newest runs.
brian carlson

--- On Tue, 6/8/10, barryb2again <Barrybennetttoo@...> wrote:


From: barryb2again <Barrybennetttoo@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 12:02 PM


 




I read, and filed, Richard's piece before I mailed and ...

" By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

As I model 1957 then 'most cars had them' applies.

It seems to me a little odd to offer late 50's paint schemes on pristine
un-patched bodies. Because of the extra work I'll pass on them and build
up my Westerfields instead.

Barry Bennett

--- In STMFC@..., "Steve Hoxie" <stevehprr@...> wrote:

Hi Barry--I had to go back and read Richard Hendrickson's piece again.
I found that he didn't write "all", which, like "never," is a dangerous
word to use in prototype modeling! I have taken the liberty of quoting
from his piece here:

"By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

My plan is some with and some without patch panels for my 1953 date.

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL

--- In STMFC@..., "barryb2again" Barrybennetttoo@ wrote:

Having reviewed tha earlier posts and then read the BLI blurb I note
that BLI have said that they will not be producing models with repair
patches.

Taking Richard Hendrickson's manuscript comments that the cars
suffered the same body rot problems as the X29 cars and that all of them
received patch panel repairs then the BLI cars are not much use as
produced for anyone that models the 1950's.

So it looks like buy undecs, add patch panels and then paint and
decal. Or maybe I will just build my store of Westerfield kits instead.

Barry Bennett
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

jerryglow2
 

The first offer of a free undec car might induce me to do the set. <g>. I already have 2 or 3 Westerfield models and IIRC the decals were fine. I think I had to add a Champ road name to do my Peorida Eastern one but think Al has that one now. BUT act quickly as he is closing down next year.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

Bob

Yes, but I am reluctant to impose too much on Mr. Glow. He
is a hobbyist like most of us and the decals are not so much
a business as a small sideline that distracts him from his
own modeling. :-) I don't have the software or knowledge to
do my own artwork for decals -- and if I did, I'd probably
get bogged down in it too, since there's an infinite supply
of ideas in that direction. NYC in general is highly neglected
for late 50's to the late 60's when it comes to decals.

Tim O'Connor


An alternative would be to supply Mr. Glow with a nice broadside photo or twelve, and ask him if he would be interested in generating the artwork. A set that includes the later 50s style of NYC lettering would be useful to many modelers, especially as a larger portion of the hobby moves to a post STMFC era for their modeling.

Sincerely,
Bob Heninger
Iowa City, IA

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@> wrote:

Thanks Tom, but I should have been more specific -- I meant
decals for the mid to late 1950's. After a search through my
catalogs and decals I've found nothing appropriate to model
this car or cars like it:

http://www.broadway-limited.com/images/NYC%20105065%20%28resized%20for%20web%29.jpg

CDS and Mark Vaughan did sets for this style of repaint but
only for postwar AAR (CDS) and prewar AAR (MV) -- so the data
are in the correct style but are not for the much smaller
spec 486 cars. And of course Ted is not interested in the
later 50's (although he did a nice set for SP repaints).

So it's factory paint for me! (Not my preference.)

Tim O'Connor


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

Bob

Yes, but I am reluctant to impose too much on Mr. Glow. He
is a hobbyist like most of us and the decals are not so much
a business as a small sideline that distracts him from his
own modeling. :-) I don't have the software or knowledge to
do my own artwork for decals -- and if I did, I'd probably
get bogged down in it too, since there's an infinite supply
of ideas in that direction. NYC in general is highly neglected
for late 50's to the late 60's when it comes to decals.

Tim O'Connor

An alternative would be to supply Mr. Glow with a nice broadside photo or twelve, and ask him if he would be interested in generating the artwork. A set that includes the later 50s style of NYC lettering would be useful to many modelers, especially as a larger portion of the hobby moves to a post STMFC era for their modeling.

Sincerely,
Bob Heninger
Iowa City, IA

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

Thanks Tom, but I should have been more specific -- I meant
decals for the mid to late 1950's. After a search through my
catalogs and decals I've found nothing appropriate to model
this car or cars like it:

http://www.broadway-limited.com/images/NYC%20105065%20%28resized%20for%20web%29.jpg

CDS and Mark Vaughan did sets for this style of repaint but
only for postwar AAR (CDS) and prewar AAR (MV) -- so the data
are in the correct style but are not for the much smaller
spec 486 cars. And of course Ted is not interested in the
later 50's (although he did a nice set for SP repaints).

So it's factory paint for me! (Not my preference.)

Tim O'Connor


Re: so that's how they did it!

Tim O'Connor
 

No one has commented on the freight car -- it matches the Proto 2000
50' double door car except for the Viking Roof. :-)

Tim

A loaded Nickel Plate 50' auto box car -- notice the cars do
not have their wheels mounted!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250644589551

Tim O'Connor


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

barryb2again <Barrybennetttoo@...>
 

I read, and filed, Richard's piece before I mailed and ...

" By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

As I model 1957 then 'most cars had them' applies.

It seems to me a little odd to offer late 50's paint schemes on pristine
un-patched bodies. Because of the extra work I'll pass on them and build
up my Westerfields instead.

Barry Bennett

--- In STMFC@..., "Steve Hoxie" <stevehprr@...> wrote:

Hi Barry--I had to go back and read Richard Hendrickson's piece again.
I found that he didn't write "all", which, like "never," is a dangerous
word to use in prototype modeling! I have taken the liberty of quoting
from his piece here:

"By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

My plan is some with and some without patch panels for my 1953 date.

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL

--- In STMFC@..., "barryb2again" Barrybennetttoo@ wrote:

Having reviewed tha earlier posts and then read the BLI blurb I note
that BLI have said that they will not be producing models with repair
patches.

Taking Richard Hendrickson's manuscript comments that the cars
suffered the same body rot problems as the X29 cars and that all of them
received patch panel repairs then the BLI cars are not much use as
produced for anyone that models the 1950's.

So it looks like buy undecs, add patch panels and then paint and
decal. Or maybe I will just build my store of Westerfield kits instead.

Barry Bennett


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

Ray Breyer
 

Steve Hoxie wrote:
I had to go back and read
Richard Hendrickson's piece again.  I found that he
didn't write "all", which, like "never," is a dangerous word
to use in prototype modeling! I have taken the liberty of
quoting from his piece here:
"By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to
the lower sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and
these patch panels became increasingly common until, in the
late 1950s, most cars had them."
My plan is some with and some without patch panels for my
1953 date.
Hi Steve,

I just checked my NYCS digitized database. Of the 25 postwar photos I have of these cars, only three show up without patch panels. All are in older schemes, including one (107127) in 1947 with a black herald background. The latest repack date on any of the cars is 2-54 (car 107054). Moving the date back to 1940 gives me six additional photos, two of which don't show patch panels.

So based on this unscientific study, I'd only go with about 1/8 of your NYC cars without patches!

Regards,
Ray Breyer
Elgin, IL


Re: so that's how they did it!

Dave Nelson
 

FWIW, I recall reading a negative complaint about the seller... buyer was
P-O'd that what he received was a copy-neg of a .jpg image. I dunno if it
was or wasn't(I'm not even sure how one might make a neg from a .jpg) but I
do recall the complaint.

Dave Nelson

-----Original Message-----

A loaded Nickel Plate 50' auto box car -- notice the cars do
not have their wheels mounted!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250644589551

Tim O'Connor



------------------------------------


Re: so that's how they did it!

barryb2again <Barrybennetttoo@...>
 

From the published photos I have they are 1957 Pontiac 'Chieftain Safari' station wagon bodies.

Barry Bennett

--- In STMFC@..., "ken_olson54022" <kwolson@...> wrote:


Great shot! Does anyone recognize the body style?
My best guess is '57 Pontiac.
It looks as if the chrome strips that cover the paint breaks may not be applied yet.

Ken Olson


Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars

Barrybennetttoo@...
 

I've got one of them to do as well, in fact I have about 40 or so resin
kits to build.

Barry Bennett

In a message dated 08/06/2010 19:03:39 GMT Standard Time,
stevelucas3@... writes:




I can vouch for the use of Bare-Metal foil. I used it to represent patch
plates on a Westerfield Canada Southern car. Even under a layer of Scalecoat,
the thickness of the foil is obvious as a "welded" patch".

Steve Lucas.

--- In _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) , Brian
Carlson <prrk41361@...> wrote:

Champ Decal film does work as does, Bare metal foil, (never tried that
on a painted car), also I plan to try an Archer fine weld bead to see if it
will suggest a patch panel.

Brian Carlson
--- On Tue, 6/8/10, Barrybennetttoo@... <Barrybennetttoo@...> wrote:


From: Barrybennetttoo@... <Barrybennetttoo@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars
To: _STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...)
Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 2:35 PM


Â



Yes, I know that is the work I have to do.

My patch panel plans are to use thick (ie Champ or left over Walthers)
decal sheet, which should produce enough of an edge to the panels
without the
add-on crudity of thin plastic sheet, which isn't thin enough at any
grade I
can get.

I suppose another alternative would be thin plastic sticky tape, but my
gut
feeling is that the decal film will be infinitely easier.

Cheers

Barry Bennett

In a message dated 08/06/2010 18:01:58 GMT Standard Time,
prrk41361@... writes:

Barry: As discussed recently on the list you'll have to reroof your
westerfield cars and add patch panels for your era. Additing Patch
panels to
painted cars is not that difficult. I've done it to the RC X29's before
the
newest runs.
brian carlson

--- On Tue, 6/8/10, barryb2again <_Barrybennetttoo@..._
(mailto:Barrybennetttoo@...) > wrote:

From: barryb2again <_Barrybennetttoo@..._
(mailto:Barrybennetttoo@...) >
Subject: [STMFC] Re: BLI NYC all-steel box cars
To: __STMFC@... (mailto:_STMFC@...) _
(mailto:_STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) )
Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 12:02 PM

I read, and filed, Richard's piece before I mailed and ...

" By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

As I model 1957 then 'most cars had them' applies.

It seems to me a little odd to offer late 50's paint schemes on pristine
un-patched bodies. Because of the extra work I'll pass on them and build
up my Westerfields instead.

Barry Bennett

--- In __STMFC@... (mailto:_STMFC@...) _
(mailto:_STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) ) , "Steve
Hoxie" <stevehprr@> wrote:

Hi Barry--I had to go back and read Richard Hendrickson's piece again.
I found that he didn't write "all", which, like "never," is a dangerous
word to use in prototype modeling! I have taken the liberty of quoting
from his piece here:

"By the 1940s it was becoming necessary to apply patches to the lower
sections of the side sheathing on some cars, and these patch panels
became increasingly common until, in the late 1950s, most cars had
them."

My plan is some with and some without patch panels for my 1953 date.
>
Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL
> --- In __STMFC@... (mailto:_STMFC@...) _
(mailto:_STMFC@... (mailto:STMFC@...) ) ,
"barryb2again" Barrybennetttoo@ wrote:

Having reviewed tha earlier posts and then read the BLI blurb I note
that BLI have said that they will not be producing models with repair
patches.

Taking Richard Hendrickson's manuscript comments that the cars
suffered the same body rot problems as the X29 cars and that all of them
received patch panel repairs then the BLI cars are not much use as
produced for anyone that models the 1950's.

So it looks like buy undecs, add patch panels and then paint and
decal. Or maybe I will just build my store of Westerfield kits instead.

Barry Bennett
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