Date   

BC RPM @Trains 2010 Announcement

hockenheim68
 

BC RPM

British Columbia's Own Prototype Modeling Event

We are proud to announce that the third annual British Columbia Railroad Prototype Modeler's meet will again be held in association with TRAINS 2010. The
RPM meet will take place during Saturday, November 13th from 10AM-4PM at the
Cameron Centre in Burnaby, BC as part of a weekend of model railroading
activities. Clinics will be held on both the 13th and 14th covering a wide
variety of subjects.

All scales and all roads are welcome. If you've been working on something, be it
a structure, diorama, freight car or locomotive, in-progress or finished, bring
it out and participate in a friendly and informative afternoon.

Besides the RPM meet and Clinic line-up, TRAINS 2010 has a lot to offer
enthusiasts. The exhibition runs from the evening of Friday, November 12th
through Sunday, November 14th and features operating sessions, a public show,
model contest, escorted layout tour, Sunday evening banquet. The local prototype
tour has yet to be announced but such tours generally fall on the Monday after
the main show.

Images from Last year's RPM event can be accessed at:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/32922165@N06/sets/72157622812956308/


Here are some of the clinics to be presented in 2010:

Mike Barone – The CPR's Nelson, BC Diesel shop


Tim Horton - The BCR Dawson Creek Subdivision in N Scale Revisited

At Trains 2005 Tim presented his plans for an N Scale layout depicting the BCR's
Dawson Creek Subdivision. Five years later this clinic will look at layout
design for prototypical operation in a small space, and some of the construction
techniques used to date, including proprietary shelving brackets, sectional
benchwork, wiring for DCC, LED layout lighting, hand laid Code 40 track, helix
construction and more. Tim's layout was featured in Model Railroad Planning
2009.


Greg Kennelly – Pacific Great Eastern Railway steam locomotives


Don Mitchell – Small Space Big Operation

The design and operation of a relatively small (140 sq. ft.) HO layout is
covered in detail. The Southern Mountain Railroad concept, track plan, and
operation keeps a 5 person crew busy with trains that include up to 3
locomotives, 16 40ft cars, and a caboose. Pluses and minuses of the factors in
play are discussed for consideration in planning of other small layouts. Don is
the author of Kalmbach's "Walkaround Model Railroad Track Plans."


Wendy Magnall and Edi Erwin - Mass producing model conifers


Phil Mason - B.C.'s forest industry and rail related delivery systems


Jack Hamilton - The NMRA Achievement Program Assessment - Getting Qualified

The primary purpose of this clinic is to fully acquaint participants with
reasonable experience as modelers, with the process and procedure for completing
AP assessments. This clinic will cover the general philosophy of AP, the
individual requirements for AP merit awards and AP certificates, and the tools
available to make assessments more objective. Attendees will get about an hour
of classroom exposure followed by a few hours of actual "hands on" assessment
experience. Those who complete the program presented and demonstrate the
attitude and ability requisite of an AP Assessor will be recommend for such
designation to their respective Division Superintendent.



Registration for BC RPM /Trains 2010 is $20 CDN
Does not include banquet, layout or prototype tours. Operating sessions are free
but first come first serve. Operating session attendees must pre-register.
Saturday night escorted layout tours TBA. Cost $25 CDN.

Sunday night Banquet: guest speaker TBA Cost $30 CDN.
Proto tour TBA

TRAINS 2010 is located at:
Cameron Centre (across from Lougheed Mall)
9523 Cameron Street
Burnaby, BC, Canada

Cameron Centre is under thirty minutes from downtown Vancouver using Skytrain.to
Lougheed station.

For more information regarding Trains 2010 and online registration see
www.bctrains.org

If you are planning on attending the RPM meet feel free to drop a line at
ahutchinson.mudbay@...


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

Tom, according to Clark's post in 2003, the M&StL cars had green
lettering EXCEPT for the capacity and dimensional data, which was
black. So you need Martin's decals (green) and Champ's (black) (or
someone else's black decals).

The Alton cars had red lettering. I have a color shot of a GM&O
repaint and the lettering is dark, probably black.

All of these aluminum box cars NKP, RI, ALTON(GM&O), M&StL(CNW) had
14 panels.

Tim O'Connor

The discussion of RI aluminum cars reminds me that the M&StL also had 10 aluminum box cars. The photos of the cars I have seen are from their later years when at least one or two were converted as mail storage/express cars and coupled behind the M&StL RDC-3 with its small passenger compartment.

I am curious about the lettering on the cars in their earlier years.

1. I have an old set of CHAMP decals in green lettering, supposedly intended for these cars. Is that prototypically correct? It's not hard to believe since the GM&O also had a few aluminum box cars with red lettering, didn't they?

2. I recall,possibly incorrectly, that the RI aluminum cars had six riveted panels, not five. Was that also true for the M&StL cars?

Tom


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

Did they pack the wrong doors in the kit? This has happened to me
with two Sunshine kits (so far). If so they may be able to send you
the proper doors.

Tim O'Connor

With all the back and forth about lettering color, am I the only one that has a problem with the Sunshine doors being wrong? It stopped me dead in my tracks from finishing the kit. I would have used the black decals, assuming for one could correct me, but the wrong doors are in every photo.

Paul Lyons


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Paul Lyons
 

With all the back and forth about lettering color, am I the only one that has a problem with the Sunshine doors being wrong? It stopped me dead in my tracks from finishing the kit. I would have used the black decals, assuming for one could correct me, but the wrong doors are in every photo.

Paul Lyons

-----Original Message-----
From: Ed Hawkins <hawk0621@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Mon, Jul 5, 2010 1:28 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars





On Jul 5, 2010, at 3:06 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:

And in six plus years I take it no one has located a color photo
of the cars in question?
Tim,
There's a color photo of 20064 on page 33 of the Rock Island Color
Guide Morning Sun book. The car has a lot of grime on it, and the photo
was taken sometime during the mid to late 1960s based on other subjects
in the view. In any event, the lettering looks black to me FWIW. Of
course, it could always be a repainted car since it was at least 20
years old when the photo was taken.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tom Baker wrote:
2. I recall,possibly incorrectly, that the RI aluminum cars had six riveted panels, not five.
Yep, you're incorrect in part. They did not have five, all right; they had seven.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Thomas Baker
 

The discussion of RI aluminum cars reminds me that the M&StL also had 10 aluminum box cars. The photos of the cars I have seen are from their later years when at least one or two were converted as mail storage/express cars and coupled behind the M&StL RDC-3 with its small passenger compartment.

I am curious about the lettering on the cars in their earlier years.

1. I have an old set of CHAMP decals in green lettering, supposedly intended for these cars. Is that prototypically correct? It's not hard to believe since the GM&O also had a few aluminum box cars with red lettering, didn't they?

2. I recall,possibly incorrectly, that the RI aluminum cars had six riveted panels, not five. Was that also true for the M&StL cars?

Tom

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... on behalf of Aley, Jeff A
Sent: Mon 7/5/2010 1:50 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Rock Island aluminum box cars

Tony,

No worries: Head-End cars are ON TOPIC for STMFC.

Regards,

-Jeff


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Anthony Thompson
Sent: Sunday, July 04, 2010 1:43 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Rock Island aluminum box cars



Though strictly speaking, these were passenger express cars,
AAR class BX, they LOOKED like freight cars <g> and I'm sure someone
on this list knows about them. I have a partly-built Sunshine kit for
these, but no photos, and don't know what kind of trucks they had.
Number series RI 20060-20069. `Anyone?

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...<mailto:thompson%40signaturepress.com>
Publishers of books on railroad history



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Wabash auto boxcars tractor loading stencil

cef39us <cfrench@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., "octoraro1948" <octoraro1@...> wrote:

A 1948 ORER lists a number of Wabash auto boxcars in the series 45000 - 45399 assigned for tractor loading and noted as marked "DK". Where on the cars would this stencil have been placed? Would this have been accompanied with "Return When Empty to ___" lettering?


Lou,

A 12" "DK" was placed four inches above the OMO in AUTOMOBILE,
and "RETURN TO DETROIT WHEN EMPTY" in 2" letters on the left door.
The bottom of this lettering was 3'-0" from the bottom of the
door.

Chet French
Dixon, IL


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
And is there any model that resembles the S-4 truck in HO scale?
It's a little hard to tell in the RP CYC photo, but the trucks look to me like pedestal trucks.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Ed Hawkins wrote:
There's a color photo of 20064 on page 33 of the Rock Island Color Guide Morning Sun book. The car has a lot of grime on it, and the photo was taken sometime during the mid to late 1960s based on other subjects in the view. In any event, the lettering looks black to me FWIW.
Ed, how about the original B&W print used for RPCYC? It may be more dependable than the version printed, as far as detecting gray vs. black lettering.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Ed Hawkins
 

On Jul 5, 2010, at 3:06 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:

And in six plus years I take it no one has located a color photo
of the cars in question?
Tim,
There's a color photo of 20064 on page 33 of the Rock Island Color
Guide Morning Sun book. The car has a lot of grime on it, and the photo
was taken sometime during the mid to late 1960s based on other subjects
in the view. In any event, the lettering looks black to me FWIW. Of
course, it could always be a repainted car since it was at least 20
years old when the photo was taken.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

I knew I'd heard this debate before!

Sure enough Denny, you posted a nearly identical message on
October 6, 2003 (almost seven years ago).

And in six plus years I take it no one has located a color photo
of the cars in question?

Clark Propst had an excellent reply back then, explaining that the
M&StL cars had both green and black lettering, and none of the decal
sets (Sunshine/Champ) is 100% correct for M&StL but if you use them
both you can get it right.

Tim O'Connor

P.S. The LIFE magazine photo of RI #20060 shows that the 2nd panel
from the left, on the right side of the car, is EMBOSSED with the
Reynolds Aluminum logo! Try to do that with decals!

P.P.S. The LIFE photo also shows marker light brackets on the end.
Does the Sunshine model include those?

P.P.P.S. Speaking of brake hose brackets, does anyone make a bracket
that includes a brake hose and signal hose (over-under) as mounted
on these express service box cars?

At 7/5/2010 02:52 PM Monday, you wrote:
These handsome cars bring up once again a mystery about the lettering
coloring: Sunshine includes very nice all-black decals. However,
Gordon Varney produced a very nice model of this car in 8/1946 (B-37)
#20069, and the printed Bristol board sides showed both the ROCK
ISLAND logo as solid *red* , and ROCKETS in *red*, not black. When
Varney produced the same model in its all-metal version c. 1950 (B-60)
#20069 , he continued the same red/black lettering pattern. Overall,
the combination of silver, red, and black made for a very handsome
combination!

Now, Gordon Varney was known to be pretty accurate on his sides, if
only because he used his own photographs as a direct, and sometimes
exact guide to printing.

Now, I have examined as close as possible the photo of the first of
these cars #20060 in V6 of the RPC, but because of of the
orthochromatic film used, I am simply unable to discern whether or not
the lettering was monochrome black, or was indeed a mixture of black
and red. The logo is outline-only, may be either black or red, most
probably the former.

So, perhaps these cars had several different lettering color schemes
as delivered, OR, the red scheme was replaced later.

As to the truck discussion, note that apparently #20064-9 had roller
bearings!

I too have one of the Sunshine kits awaiting it fate. My present
inclination is to finish it with Alcad, the difficulty being as to how
to neatly paint beforehand -or after- the black ladders and
appliances; and then somehow copy the decal set in red so that I can
create the red logo and lettering. Advice for the effort in the
latter regard invited!

Denny


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Tim O'Connor
 

FWIW the old Champ decal set HB-9 is entirely black lettering.

Were these RI aluminum cars ever repainted Pullman green? All
of the other 200xx series (AAR and PS-1) box cars were green as
far as I know.

Tim O'Connor

At 7/5/2010 02:52 PM Monday, you wrote:
These handsome cars bring up once again a mystery about the lettering
coloring: Sunshine includes very nice all-black decals. However,
Gordon Varney produced a very nice model of this car in 8/1946 (B-37)
#20069, and the printed Bristol board sides showed both the ROCK
ISLAND logo as solid *red* , and ROCKETS in *red*, not black. When
Varney produced the same model in its all-metal version c. 1950 (B-60)
#20069 , he continued the same red/black lettering pattern. Overall,
the combination of silver, red, and black made for a very handsome
combination!

Now, Gordon Varney was known to be pretty accurate on his sides, if
only because he used his own photographs as a direct, and sometimes
exact guide to printing.

Now, I have examined as close as possible the photo of the first of
these cars #20060 in V6 of the RPC, but because of of the
orthochromatic film used, I am simply unable to discern whether or not
the lettering was monochrome black, or was indeed a mixture of black
and red. The logo is outline-only, may be either black or red, most
probably the former.

So, perhaps these cars had several different lettering color schemes
as delivered, OR, the red scheme was replaced later.

As to the truck discussion, note that apparently #20064-9 had roller
bearings!

I too have one of the Sunshine kits awaiting it fate. My present
inclination is to finish it with Alcad, the difficulty being as to how
to neatly paint beforehand -or after- the black ladders and
appliances; and then somehow copy the decal set in red so that I can
create the red logo and lettering. Advice for the effort in the
latter regard invited!

Denny


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Jack Burgess <jack@...>
 

Denny wrote:
<I too have one of the Sunshine kits awaiting it fate. My present
<inclination is to finish it with Alcad, the difficulty being as to how
<to neatly paint beforehand -or after- the black ladders and
<appliances; and then somehow copy the decal set in red so that I can
<create the red logo and lettering. Advice for the effort in the
<latter regard invited!

The decals that are black and need to be red (if everyone agrees) can be
scanned at around 600 dpi (as a color file) and the resulting image opened
in Photoshop Elements (or Photoshop). Click on the color Swatches and select
a red color but clicking on it. That color will show up at the bottom of the
Tool Box. Click on that color at the bottom of the tool box. That will open
up a dialogue box which will let you fine-tune color.

Once you are satisfied with the color, use the Paint Bucket Tool and "pour"
the color into the black areas of the scan. Print onto decal paper and you
are done.


Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Denny Anspach wrote:
These handsome cars bring up once again a mystery about the lettering coloring . . . Now, I have examined as close as possible the photo of the first of these cars #20060 in V6 of the RPC, but because of of the orthochromatic film used, I am simply unable to discern whether or not the lettering was monochrome black, or was indeed a mixture of black and red. The logo is outline-only, may be either black or red, most probably the former.
I disagree, Denny. Careful examination of the lettering DOES show some of it a distinct gray, and other a distinct black. It's my observation that the "Route of the Rockets" slogan is gray, and so is the emblem. Presumably these are the red parts.
Modeling, however, is a problem in the absence of appropriate red decals.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Denny Anspach <danspach@...>
 

These handsome cars bring up once again a mystery about the lettering coloring: Sunshine includes very nice all-black decals. However, Gordon Varney produced a very nice model of this car in 8/1946 (B-37) #20069, and the printed Bristol board sides showed both the ROCK ISLAND logo as solid *red* , and ROCKETS in *red*, not black. When Varney produced the same model in its all-metal version c. 1950 (B-60) #20069 , he continued the same red/black lettering pattern. Overall, the combination of silver, red, and black made for a very handsome combination!

Now, Gordon Varney was known to be pretty accurate on his sides, if only because he used his own photographs as a direct, and sometimes exact guide to printing.

Now, I have examined as close as possible the photo of the first of these cars #20060 in V6 of the RPC, but because of of the orthochromatic film used, I am simply unable to discern whether or not the lettering was monochrome black, or was indeed a mixture of black and red. The logo is outline-only, may be either black or red, most probably the former.

So, perhaps these cars had several different lettering color schemes as delivered, OR, the red scheme was replaced later.

As to the truck discussion, note that apparently #20064-9 had roller bearings!

I too have one of the Sunshine kits awaiting it fate. My present inclination is to finish it with Alcad, the difficulty being as to how to neatly paint beforehand -or after- the black ladders and appliances; and then somehow copy the decal set in red so that I can create the red logo and lettering. Advice for the effort in the latter regard invited!

Denny



Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Re: Hoboes

Dennis Storzek
 

--- In STMFC@..., Jim Betz <jimbetz@...> wrote:

Schuyler,

Thanks for the link. Great stuff on that site.

So ... does any one know when the practice of closing and/or
locking the doors on empties became more or less "common".

****

Background ...

For instance - it is relatively easy to find a pic of a steam
era freight train with several open doors ... but it seems to
me that as you get closer to the end of the STMFC era you see
fewer and fewer of them.
I would suspect it has a lot to do with the advent of plug doors. Plug doors MUST be closed to be withing the clearance diagram; I remember seeing more than a few alongside loading docks where the switch crew pulled a string that didn't have the doors closed, and one in the middle of Kedzie Blvd. where it caught on the bridge steel above... Since open plug doors were dangerous, I'm sure the railroads made closing the doors a bigger issue, and as it trickled down to the dock hands, there was little distinction made as to the type of door; just close the darned doors.

Back in the days before plug doors, the matter got little attention. You'll notice that one of the cars pictured in the Hobo presentation still has the torn paper from sealing a car of flour flapping in the breeze. Both bulk flour and grain used grain doors to contain the load. the standard procedure at terminal elevators was to strip the grain doors from empties and pile them with one end sticking out of the car door. As the string of empties was pulled, labors pulled the grain doors from the car as they went by and piled them. The cars went to the outbound track with the car doors still open.


I don't really know what went on before the 30's. I do
know that some people were riding the rails at that time.
And that it was not unheard of. I just don't know how common
it was. Most of the stories you hear are from the depression
or later.
Back in earlier days, such as the depression that resulted from the Panic of 1893, "riding the rods" was common, A couple boards, or a grain door, was placed across the truss rods, and that made a place for a man to lay under the car. It was sheltered from the rain, there was no danger of being locked in the car, and easy egress if danger threatened. Of course this practice stopped when cars ceased to be built with truss rods.


Dennis


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Aley, Jeff A
 

Tony,

No worries: Head-End cars are ON TOPIC for STMFC.

Regards,

-Jeff


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Anthony Thompson
Sent: Sunday, July 04, 2010 1:43 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Rock Island aluminum box cars



Though strictly speaking, these were passenger express cars,
AAR class BX, they LOOKED like freight cars <g> and I'm sure someone
on this list knows about them. I have a partly-built Sunshine kit for
these, but no photos, and don't know what kind of trucks they had.
Number series RI 20060-20069. `Anyone?

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...<mailto:thompson%40signaturepress.com>
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Hoboes

Jim Betz
 

Schuyler,

Thanks for the link. Great stuff on that site.

So ... does any one know when the practice of closing and/or
locking the doors on empties became more or less "common".

****

Background ...

For instance - it is relatively easy to find a pic of a steam
era freight train with several open doors ... but it seems to
me that as you get closer to the end of the STMFC era you see
fewer and fewer of them.

Personally, I've always thought of the whole hobo thing as
having "3 distinct eras" ...

The thirties when relatively large numbers of people were
'hopping a freight' to move around the country - but who
weren't "hoboes" so much as just people who had to get out
of where ever they were in order to make a living/stay alive.
They quite possibly called themselves hoboes ... but as soon
as they got a job they usually changed to a more 'normal'
life style. Not necessarily all of them but certainly most.

The time after the war when the hobo way of life became a
something that was a sort of 'choice of life style'.

Finally - when the RRs started preventing 'riders' on
freight cars ... and "the hoboes became the homeless". I
just don't know when this happened. Yes, I have talked to
guys from much later times who 'rode the rails' ... all of
them did this when they were younger (in their 20's) and as
something to do to have "an adventure" instead of a life
style. And never out of "necessity". And they said they
never got lucky enough to get inside a box car ... they
would ride in an open gondola or in the platform on the end
of a covered hopper.

I don't really know what went on before the 30's. I do
know that some people were riding the rails at that time.
And that it was not unheard of. I just don't know how common
it was. Most of the stories you hear are from the depression
or later.
- Jim


Wabash auto boxcars tractor loading stencil

octoraro1948 <octoraro1@...>
 

A 1948 ORER lists a number of Wabash auto boxcars in the series 45000 - 45399 assigned for tractor loading and noted as marked "DK". Where on the cars would this stencil have been placed? Would this have been accompanied with "Return When Empty to ___" lettering?

Lou Whiteley
Lawrenceville, NJ


Re: Rock Island aluminum box cars

Clark Propst
 

There's a nice color photo in the RI Morning Sun equipment book.

Clark Propst

102241 - 102260 of 193520