Date   

Re: Proto 50' Automobile boxcar Lehigh Valley

Tim O'Connor
 

The main changes are the side sill, and replacement of the
running board.

http://www.anthraciterailroads.org/lvrrmodeler/freightmodels.htm

Tim O'Connor

Just received one of these kits and wondering how correct they are.
Car number 8505.

Mark Morgan
Mark, as always with the P2K kits, the prototypes were well
researched before the models were produced. I'll send you a
prototype photo off-list.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Fruit Growers reefer

rwitt_2000
 

The neat photo with "atmosphere". It almost appears that no two reefers
have the same height. If one is modeling this period this what ones
model trains need to look like.

Bob Witt

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

April 1938, somewhere on the Southern Rwy
http://www.gstatic.com/hostedimg/c18a77a6460df795_large

Tim O'


Re: Proto 50' Automobile boxcar Lehigh Valley

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Aug 25, 2010, at 7:26 PM, Mark M wrote:

Just received one of these kits and wondering how correct they are.
Car number 8505.

Mark Morgan
Mark, as always with the P2K kits, the prototypes were well
researched before the models were produced. I'll send you a
prototype photo off-list.

Richard Hendrickson


Proto 50' Automobile boxcar Lehigh Valley

Mark
 

Just received one of these kits and wondering how correct they are. Car number 8505.

Mark Morgan


Re: Pictures of Tools

Mark
 

Brian you and Dennis were so nice to share the photos. Really interesting and wish something similar was available for me!

Mark Morgan

--- On Wed, 8/25/10, brianleppert@... <brianleppert@...> wrote:

From: brianleppert@... <brianleppert@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Pictures of Tools
To: STMFC@...
Date: Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 12:29 PM







 









I've posted some photos in a folder called "Tahoe Model Works" of some tooling for making plastic parts. Listed below are descriptions:



photo 1: These are a pair of Cavity Inserts for one of Tahoe Model Works' HO freight car trucks. Each block measures .500" x .750" x 1.250" and is made of H-13 tool steel. These are bolted to each side slide in the truck mold.



photo 2: Complete truck mold mounted in the injection machine, shown in closed position. Mold measures 8" x 8" x 7".



photo 3: Mold in opened position. Stationary side is on the right. This is a two slide mold and the wedges for backing up the slides and pecker pins for pulling the slides away from the core can be seen on this side. In the center of the stationary side is a small tapered hole in which the melted plastic is injected into the mold.



photos 5 & 6: Opened mold showing the ejector side. The two slides have been pulled away from the core, allowing the molded part to clear the side frame cavities and be pushed off the core by the ejector pins. Photo 6 is a close-up of the molded part still hanging on the ejector pins, with the truck itself at the top of the runner and the brake shoe detail at the bottom.



Most of the truck molds at Model Die Casting where similar to this mold, only they made a pair of trucks per shot. Acurail's truck mold, I suspect, makes two pair of trucks per shot. The TMW mold makes only one truck at a time, plus the separate brake shoe detail, so these are at least two or four times more expensive to mold than other's.



Photo 7: Here's an N scale PS1 50' box car body next to two pieces of blue wax. Its always wise to test cut any CNC program first in wax, so that any mistakes can be corrected. These two wax blocks were first machined to the same shape and dimensions as the final steel inserts for the four slide mold that creates this box car, then all the detail was cut in.



Photo 8: Very, VERY basic mold. Made out of brass, this mold made driver centers for Sn3 Mason Bogie. Worked OK in a small bench-top injection machine for a small production run.



Brian Leppert

Tahoe Model Works

Carson City, NV


Re: My Work Bench

kenneth broomfield
 

I have got to say that this has been one of the most interesting reads for me
yet. It is very nice to see what everyone is working on and has given me a
thought about what to do next, when I get mine clear. I do not remember who
started this thread but what a good question.


Kenny Broomfield


ADMIN: Jerry Albin's msg

Aley, Jeff A
 

Folks,

Jerry's msg is SPAM, and appears to be going out to his entire inbox. It is very unlikely that he is the Spammer; it is more likely that his computer has been hijacked.

His account will be Moderated until the problem is found.

Regards,

-Jeff Aley
Deputy Moderator, STMFC.


Re: Pictures of Tools

soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., "brianleppert@..." <brianleppert@...> wrote:


Photo 8: Very, VERY basic mold. Made out of brass, this mold made driver centers for Sn3 Mason Bogie. Worked OK in a small bench-top injection machine for a small production run.

Brian Leppert
This brass mold:

<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/photos/album/99799505/pic/115748359/view?picmode=large&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&dir=asc>

Is very reminiscent of some of the early Grandt Line molds Dave Grandt showed me. As far as I know, Cliff Grandt had no specific moldmaking background; he was a precision instrument maker by trade. Back in the days before CNC, Cliff was building large scale patterns of the cavities he wanted, and cutting reduced size cavities with micro-sized cutters in a pantograph. Some of these simple molds didn't even have an ejection system (as Brian's example doesn't) the parts were picked out by prying on the sprue with a penknife. The presses to shoot this sort of mold consist of a vise to clamp the mold shut, and a foot operated plunger to inject the plastic. Some of this style mold are still in production.

Cliff's genius was reducing the cost of his tooling to a point where short production runs of products with limited production volume were affordable, and in doing so made the entire concept of narrow gauge modeling possible.

Dennis


Re: Pictures of Tools

Bill Welch
 

Dear Dennis & Brian:

Than you so much for the time you have taken to take the picture and write the explanations of what we are looking at. I for one have a great appreciation now for the challenges you face in trying to make all of us happy in our modeling.

Bill Welch


Re: Pictures of Tools

proto48er
 

Thank you Brian and Dennis for the wonderful photos and information on plastic injection molding! Truly amazing technology that we all take for granted!

A.T. Kott


Re: Tank Cars

Aley, Jeff A
 

Mark,

Actually, you DID upload the photos, but they had not been approved by a moderator. Yahoo!Groups has a bug in which:
1) You receive a mysterious error msg when uploading photos.
2) You are not informed that the photos will not show up until a Moderator approves them.
3) The moderators are never notified that there are new photos that they need to review / approve.

Yahoo!Groups is allegedly working on fixing this.

Regards,

-Jeff Aley
Deputy Moderator, STMFC.


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Mark M
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 12:03 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Tank Cars



Bellville Ohio has a gravel pit that has closed. The asphalt plant is close to State Route 97 East.
I stopped today and took some photos of four tanks which appear to be tank cars.
Tried to post the photos and that did not work.

Mark Morgan


Tank Cars

Mark
 

Bellville Ohio has a gravel pit that has closed. The asphalt plant is close to State Route 97 East.
I stopped today and took some photos of four tanks which appear to be tank cars.
Tried to post the photos and that did not work.

Mark Morgan


Re: Pictures of Tools

Andy Sperandeo <asperandeo@...>
 

Thank you very much, Brian,

That's interesting stuff. I've been able to visit a few injection-molding shops, and I always find the ingenuity of the toolmakers impressive.

So long,

Andy


Re: Pictures of Tools

soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., "Aley, Jeff A" <Jeff.A.Aley@...> wrote:

Dennis,

Thanks for these great photos! The hopper mold is 12" x 14" x 9", according to your caption. That's a big hunk of steel for such a small car! How much does a mold like that weigh??

Regards,

-Jeff
More than the capacity of out shipping scale, that's for sure :-)

If it were solid steel, it calculates out to 428 pounds, but the ejector box is hollow, so someplace around 350 - 375.

You'll note the hooks from some chain fall hoists peeking into the photos, which is how these are moved around and hung in the presses.

Dennis


Re: Pictures of Tools

brianleppert@att.net
 

I've posted some photos in a folder called "Tahoe Model Works" of some tooling for making plastic parts. Listed below are descriptions:

photo 1: These are a pair of Cavity Inserts for one of Tahoe Model Works' HO freight car trucks. Each block measures .500" x .750" x 1.250" and is made of H-13 tool steel. These are bolted to each side slide in the truck mold.

photo 2: Complete truck mold mounted in the injection machine, shown in closed position. Mold measures 8" x 8" x 7".

photo 3: Mold in opened position. Stationary side is on the right. This is a two slide mold and the wedges for backing up the slides and pecker pins for pulling the slides away from the core can be seen on this side. In the center of the stationary side is a small tapered hole in which the melted plastic is injected into the mold.

photos 5 & 6: Opened mold showing the ejector side. The two slides have been pulled away from the core, allowing the molded part to clear the side frame cavities and be pushed off the core by the ejector pins. Photo 6 is a close-up of the molded part still hanging on the ejector pins, with the truck itself at the top of the runner and the brake shoe detail at the bottom.

Most of the truck molds at Model Die Casting where similar to this mold, only they made a pair of trucks per shot. Acurail's truck mold, I suspect, makes two pair of trucks per shot. The TMW mold makes only one truck at a time, plus the separate brake shoe detail, so these are at least two or four times more expensive to mold than other's.

Photo 7: Here's an N scale PS1 50' box car body next to two pieces of blue wax. Its always wise to test cut any CNC program first in wax, so that any mistakes can be corrected. These two wax blocks were first machined to the same shape and dimensions as the final steel inserts for the four slide mold that creates this box car, then all the detail was cut in.

Photo 8: Very, VERY basic mold. Made out of brass, this mold made driver centers for Sn3 Mason Bogie. Worked OK in a small bench-top injection machine for a small production run.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV


Re: Pictures of Tools

Aley, Jeff A
 

Dennis,

Thanks for these great photos! The hopper mold is 12" x 14" x 9", according to your caption. That's a big hunk of steel for such a small car! How much does a mold like that weigh??

Regards,

-Jeff


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of soolinehistory
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 8:36 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Pictures of Tools



List,

As promised, I've posted some pix of Accurail's injection molds. Molds are hard to photograph in the press; the press usually doesn't open enough to really see the mold cavity, so I dragged a couple open on the mold maintenance bench for a better view. View the pix at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/photos/album/1341047430/pic/list

The "Open 'n Close" mold isn't very exciting; this is the style used to make what modelers call a "flat" kit and also detail sprues for other kits. In the trade this is refereed to as an open n' close tool because that's all it does; no side pulls, lifters, or unscrewing mechanisms, it simply closes, makes a part, and opens again. I've included a photo mainly to illustrate the Master Unit Die Co. system of interchangeable tooling inserts that fit a common frame; this explains why some of our tools don't have a complete ejector box. The photo of the two slide mold open on the bench illustrates this pretty well, with the spring loaded ejector plate showing behind the "B" half. the "A" (stationary) half is turned so one can see the features of both and how they interact. Surface mounting the "locks / wedges" with dowel pins is the quick and dirty way of doing it; sufficient for the relatively low molding forces involved in filling those little sill steps.

The larger mold on the bench makes the body for the USRA hopper family. It's usually pretty hard to see the core and slide faces since the slides closely surround the core, so I've removed one slide and placed it on the bench. The "cavity" (stationary) side actually makes the bottom of the car, with the blocks that core out behind the ladders projecting outward. Note how the cavity is pocketed deeply into the mold base, so that the wedges that lock the slides in place when the mold closes have a lot of steel behind them for support. Long pipes carry cooling water into the side actions to remove heat; there are other water circuits into the core and cavity that are not as obvious.

Dennis


Re: Pictures of Tools

Mark
 

Dennis, thank you for sharing these photos. Amazing the size and what you make for the consumer.
We are currently down at work for maintenance, AK Steel/Mansfield(OH). Some of the equipment would surprise others like your molds.

Mark Morgan

--- On Wed, 8/25/10, soolinehistory <destorzek@...> wrote:

From: soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Pictures of Tools
To: STMFC@...
Date: Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 11:36 AM







 









List,



As promised, I've posted some pix of Accurail's injection molds. Molds are hard to photograph in the press; the press usually doesn't open enough to really see the mold cavity, so I dragged a couple open on the mold maintenance bench for a better view. View the pix at:



http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/photos/album/1341047430/pic/list



The "Open 'n Close" mold isn't very exciting; this is the style used to make what modelers call a "flat" kit and also detail sprues for other kits. In the trade this is refereed to as an open n' close tool because that's all it does; no side pulls, lifters, or unscrewing mechanisms, it simply closes, makes a part, and opens again. I've included a photo mainly to illustrate the Master Unit Die Co. system of interchangeable tooling inserts that fit a common frame; this explains why some of our tools don't have a complete ejector box. The photo of the two slide mold open on the bench illustrates this pretty well, with the spring loaded ejector plate showing behind the "B" half. the "A" (stationary) half is turned so one can see the features of both and how they interact. Surface mounting the "locks / wedges" with dowel pins is the quick and dirty way of doing it; sufficient for the relatively low molding forces involved in filling those little sill steps.



The larger mold on the bench makes the body for the USRA hopper family. It's usually pretty hard to see the core and slide faces since the slides closely surround the core, so I've removed one slide and placed it on the bench. The "cavity" (stationary) side actually makes the bottom of the car, with the blocks that core out behind the ladders projecting outward. Note how the cavity is pocketed deeply into the mold base, so that the wedges that lock the slides in place when the mold closes have a lot of steel behind them for support. Long pipes carry cooling water into the side actions to remove heat; there are other water circuits into the core and cavity that are not as obvious.



Dennis

























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Pictures of Tools

soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

List,

As promised, I've posted some pix of Accurail's injection molds. Molds are hard to photograph in the press; the press usually doesn't open enough to really see the mold cavity, so I dragged a couple open on the mold maintenance bench for a better view. View the pix at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/photos/album/1341047430/pic/list

The "Open 'n Close" mold isn't very exciting; this is the style used to make what modelers call a "flat" kit and also detail sprues for other kits. In the trade this is refereed to as an open n' close tool because that's all it does; no side pulls, lifters, or unscrewing mechanisms, it simply closes, makes a part, and opens again. I've included a photo mainly to illustrate the Master Unit Die Co. system of interchangeable tooling inserts that fit a common frame; this explains why some of our tools don't have a complete ejector box. The photo of the two slide mold open on the bench illustrates this pretty well, with the spring loaded ejector plate showing behind the "B" half. the "A" (stationary) half is turned so one can see the features of both and how they interact. Surface mounting the "locks / wedges" with dowel pins is the quick and dirty way of doing it; sufficient for the relatively low molding forces involved in filling those little sill steps.

The larger mold on the bench makes the body for the USRA hopper family. It's usually pretty hard to see the core and slide faces since the slides closely surround the core, so I've removed one slide and placed it on the bench. The "cavity" (stationary) side actually makes the bottom of the car, with the blocks that core out behind the ladders projecting outward. Note how the cavity is pocketed deeply into the mold base, so that the wedges that lock the slides in place when the mold closes have a lot of steel behind them for support. Long pipes carry cooling water into the side actions to remove heat; there are other water circuits into the core and cavity that are not as obvious.


Dennis


Re: What's on your work bench?

Denny Anspach <danspach@...>
 

What is totally interesting in the many parts of this thread is to once again be made aware of the intensely catholic interests that make up this intelligent group, the nature of which IMHO also form the basic strength of the wider hobby. No one is in lockstep!

My summer workbench projects are fresh anew each year, all projects drawn from my own stash of "the Great Unbuilt", solely because of personal attractiveness, or the challenge of building. Because I am separated for several months from the distractions of my layout, and the resources of my library, my home workbench, my paint booth, and my supply cupboards, my focus is narrowed to and by the chosen kits, tools and parts on hand. It is in this environment that, in fact, most of my freight cars actually begin life! Before leaving Sacramento home, all the kits are vetted for needed extra parts, trucks, couplers, etc. , and in most instances already will have had the wheels changed out, and the trucks and couplers (Accumate Proto-default, with some Kadee #152s) at least temporarily mounted to the underframes.

Aside from the pleasant distractions of delightful grandchildren, a gorgeous environment, and the lure of boating on the lake in front me, the most insidious continuing and unchanging distraction to real productivity in my kit building is the siren song posed by the many interesting posts appearing daily on my trusty Apple Laptop [Heh, heh, heh....!].

Projects on the bench, or waiting in the wings:

Gould tank car (finished!)

Westerfield Milw 36' drop bottom stock car (well underway)

Rail Shop PRR H-70 covered hopper. (challenging kit for a very interesting car, but also a kit that I have yet to fully understand, Has anyone yet attempted one?).

Westerfield Milw 40' double sheathed boxcars (2). (Al's newest production of a once-ubiquitous prototype never before modeled in HO).

NKP Shops Milw 70' baggage cars. (2. The prototype showed up all over the US, and on the MIlwaukee was commonly routinely hauled in freight trains when no 1st class trains were otherwise available. These kits offer an opportunity to first upgrade and then use up some of my stash of Central Valley trucks).

Sunshine 50' NYC express car. (ubiquitous car. Ditto opportunity to use up yet more CV trucks!).

I should be back at the bench right now to again ramp up production, but first, I have to finish this post.....

Denny


Denny S. Anspach, MD
Okoboji, Iowa


Re: What's on your work bench?

tbarney2004
 

mopacfirst wrote:
On my downstairs workbench (which my wife hates, since it's the kitchen table): two 42' RC flatcars converted to 13 stake, for MP, and one 45' spliced from two RC flatcars, also MP, which have the decking finished by the Tichy method but are not painted. Also, an F&C CGW PS-0 minus a couple of small details, but I received the decals last week. And, a Life-Like / Sunshine Wabash 50' auto car. Just off is another Life-Like with MDC fishbelly underframe, MP also, and an IC Centralia box from IM parts, riveted sides from the 37 modified XM and P-S ends and roof, and Accurail 5-panel Superior door. Plus two Sunshine flatcars with the decking not attached to the rest of the car. The Bx-11 is awaiting something else getting finished to make room for it.

On the upstairs workbench: five Branchline cars awaiting corner grabs and cut levers (the pin vises are downstairs). One day soon I'll repair the lamp up there so I can see all that stuff.

Ron Merrick


--- In STMFC@..., "Charlie D modeling the Mopac http://mopac51.tripod" <trduck@...> wrote:

Wondering what's on your work bench and would you recommend it to another modeler?

I understand where you're coming from Ron, currently, my "workbench" is the coffee table in the living room. On it are: 2 Gould/Tichy 120T wreck cranes, 2 Bowser F30s, 2 F&C FM flats, an Athearn 250T crane (all for PRR Pro), a Walthers American Loco diesel crane (currently not running, as one of the wires was caught in a gear and ripped loose), a few Branchline Pullmans of various flavors, Bowser B6 and K4s locos, just about a dozen Jordan vehicle kits (none started), a Jordan steam shovel and crawler crane. Structure-wise, a Tichy water tower, plus under the table in storage totes 6 stalls worth of Walther's modern roundhouse, a double kit of the now retired Walthers backshop with overhead crane, machine shop kit, etc...

Tim Barney

104461 - 104480 of 197075