Date   

Re: Cattle resting

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Thanks, Doug, exactly what the other list and I wanted to know.



SGL



Schuyler, it is my understanding that once unloaded, the cars would be
cleaned. Livestock was not normally loaded back into the same car. Unless
you were only unloading one car, or made sure you emptied each car into a
separate pen, you had no way of knowing if the same animals were put back
into the same car. Cleaning was required, as was fresh bedding, each time a
car was unloaded, to remove manure and any disease pathogens. A railroad
that allowed animals to become exposed to disease while in the railroads
care risked losing all livestock traffic.

These were not railroad rules, but dictated by government agencies
responsible for safe handling of livestock and safe food for human
consumption.

Doug Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org








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Re: Tank Car Color Guide (UNCLASSIFIED)

Benjamin Hom
 

Elden Gatwood wrote:
"Morning Sun's PRR color guides went from speculative and lacking
class specifics in vol 1 to much better accuracy and details in vols
2 & 3."

That's because you went from David Sweetland to Ian Fischer as authors. In terms of attention to detail, that's like going from Mario Mendoza to Ted Williams.

"I only wish I could help them with vol 4."

There's a Volume 4? If Ian's working on it, I'll be happy with it.


Ben Hom


Re: Tank Car Color Guide

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Galleys? PROOFS? Camera copy? Surely you jest.



These are all completely digital productions, and I have never heard of
Antemeridan Sol reprinting ANY book. Doesn't happen.

SGL



Tony, you and Ed Hawkins are certainly the best people on here to speak to
this . . . Publisher's attitudes aside, I've always heard that it was
expensive to change a book like this once the galleys or proofs or camera
copy (or whatever the correct term is) are created. With a limited print
run (as I'm sure these have), perhaps it is just uneconomical to correct
them for a subsequent edition that might never come?

(There is always the "Do it right the first time" aspect, but we're talking
about a horse that has already left the barn here . . .)

KL

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Thompson

Tom Olsen wrote:
If you sent the corrections for the Morning Sun Books to the
authors, perhaps you may see corrections in an errata page, but if
they went to the Publisher at Morning Sun, don't hold your breath to
ever see a correction.
What a shame that these books depicts a portion of the photographic
history of the PRR incorrectly captioned (locations were totally
wrong) and will go uncorrected. This is not the first time this
book publisher has printed incorrect captions and refused to correct
them. Sorry to say, the next generation will take these books with
their failings as gospel as there will be no one to correct the
historic record.
The publisher of these books has had this attitude from the
very beginning and has never deviated from it. Not only that, he
doesn't want "too much history" in captions from authors, the main
reason I declined to do more than the first books I had agreed to do.
And wished I'd only agreed to do a single book.








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Re: Books with pictures in Color from an East Coast publisher

geodyssey <riverob@...>
 

HA! I am, at this moment, on page 112 "The Alco RS1s of Many Colors". The book is sitting beside me as I read this digest. I've been pouring over it for a week. So add one more person to the list of readers. I'm enjoying it- an interesting RR. I'm primarily an SP modeler, but something compelled me to buy the book a month ago. Perhaps the fact that I spent a few weeks RVing in beautiful M&StL country a couple of months ago?

Concerning STMFCs, what more can anyone tell me about the 10 aluminum 40' box cars received from Mt. Vernon Car in 1945, some of which were converted to dedicated gas-electric trailers?

Rob Simpson

--- In STMFC@..., "Gene" <bierglaeser@...> wrote:

As an afterthought to my previous post, I'm not really sure inaccurate captions are a big problem.

The M&StL in Color book has three different series of photos the captions for which tell a story. In my humble opinion the captions are worth reading.

In the 14 years since that book came out I have only encountered one person who ever read it - my aunt. She read it from cover to cover. No one else, including my own model railroader son, has ever admitted to reading a single word. Maybe captions are unnecessary for the great unwashed masses.

Gene Green


Re: Books with pictures in Color from an East Coast publisher

Tim O'Connor
 

Gene,

I may not have read EVERY caption, but I always read the captions
of the photos that catch my eye. And I like many of the photos in that
book! And since you wrote them, I believe them all implicitly. :-)

Tim O'Connor

At 11/24/2010 10:52 AM Wednesday, you wrote:
As an afterthought to my previous post, I'm not really sure inaccurate captions are a big problem.

The M&StL in Color book has three different series of photos the captions for which tell a story. In my humble opinion the captions are worth reading.

In the 14 years since that book came out I have only encountered one person who ever read it - my aunt. She read it from cover to cover. No one else, including my own model railroader son, has ever admitted to reading a single word. Maybe captions are unnecessary for the great unwashed masses.

Gene Green


Re: Tank Car Color Guide

Tim O'Connor
 

Gene

Believe it or not the best method of getting corrections in
print is something like Wikipedia -- if there was a Wiki page
for each Morning Sun color guide, then people can publish the
corrections -- and the corrections themselves can be corrected!
That's the beauty of the Wiki -- all edits are saved and you
can view any "edition" of the page you want to see. Of course
in this hobby with so many self-appointed 'experts' we might
see some 'Wiki warfare' but it ain't anonymous so everyone can
see who the culprits are, and decide who to believe.

Tim O'Connor

-------------------------

Not trying to "top" anyone's story . . .

After the M&StL in Color book was published a reader sent a list of corrections. Most of his corrections were actually wrong but, nonetheless, he expected that Yanosey would re-publish the book with his corrections.

With the C&NW Official Color Photography book another self-appointed expert sent an even longer list of corrections with same re-publish expectation. In his defense, some of his corrections were indeed correct and some few not correct.

Still, business realities dictate otherwise. Unfortunately! I would be happy to admit my errors and correct them in print if possible.

Gene Green


Re: UP S-40-6

SUVCWORR@...
 

UP Historical Society

http://www.uphs.org/store/category/?c=7

Rich Orr

-----Original Message-----
From: WILLIAM PARDIE <PARDIEW001@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Wed, Nov 24, 2010 1:46 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: UP S-40-6




Now that we are all excited about this car where do we get on from?



Bill Pardie

On Nov 24, 2010, at 8:33 AM, mike brock wrote:



Regarding the UP S-40-6, without any doubt, Richard Hendrickson'a
article in
Vol 23 #4 is the source for information on the cars and, perhaps more
importantly, how to build them. Richard does not...uh...tell us how
to find
the time to build them.
I will mention that there is a tiny discrepancy regarding the
reconstruction
of these cars at Denver. The rather obscure book Union Pacific Frt
Cars of
the 1950s by Greg Davis includes 4 photos of the reconstruction
process
including one of a finished car with a reweigh date of DR-4-51.
Incidentally, there is another article on UP stock cars in general
in Vol 23
# 2 by Dick Harley which includes a photo of a rebuilt car with a
reweigh
date of DR-10-53 so the reconstruction process probably lasted
several yrs.
That article includes a photo of an S-40-6 not rebuilt in May 1963.
Beat up
a bit...paint deteriating somewhat...it appears to have a reweigh
date of
4?.
Mike Brock
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Re: Books with pictures in Color from an East Coast publisher

Douglas Harding
 

Gene I too have read your book. And Joe a copy of Mileposts on the Prairie
should be in your inbox by now. It is now available online via Google Books.

Doug Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org


Re: Tank Car Color Guide

Charlie Vlk
 

Tony-
I just looked, and it doesn't have an index to the Tank Car Color Guide Vol 1...... go figure!!!
Charlie Vlk

Gee, Charlie, there's Ed Kaminski's book on AC&F tank cars, and
IT has an index . . .

Tony Thompson


Livestock Traffic Patterns was [Re: Cattle resting]

rwitt_2000
 


Schuyler Larrabee asked:
When stock cars were brought to a pen where the livestock was to be
rested and watered and fed, would the particular cars which the
stock was brought to the location be retained to be reloaded with
the same cattle?
Tony Thompson replied: Last time we discussed this, it was pointed
out that if the
arriving cars were foreign road cars, they would be unloaded and sent
homeward, and home road cars used for onward movement.
Tony,

Does your reply imply that stock cars from railroads primarily west of
the Mississippi River would be less likely to appear in trains of
railroads east of the Mississippi?

Was livestock arriving in say St. Louis typically forwarded eastward?

Did eastern railroads use stock cars from western railroads to meet any
seasonal needs?

If previously discussed can someone provide references in the archives.

Thanks,

Bob Witt


Re: another SE road set

jerryglow2
 

He did including modeling those tiedowns and I reference them with my ACL sets. I just got a note from a new customer who suggested this set as a variation. He's ordering one of each.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., "lnbill" <fgexbill@...> wrote:

I am very pleased to see these Jerry. Somewhere, I think in the online SAL/ACL Modeling magazine, John Golden has done an article on modeling the ACL series the Georgia cars copied, including the pesky tie-down device along each side of the gon.

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@..., Gerald Glow <jerryglow@> wrote:

Along with the ACL 50' DD autobox I recently announced, I just added one
for a 41' gondola for Georgia Railroad (Accurail car). See sample at:
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/samples/GA_gondola.jpg

--
*Jerry Glow
The Villages FL
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/decals/*



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Tie Downs on ACL and Georgia gons

Bill Welch
 

I found the message John Golden sent me after I sent him a message asking for clarification on fabricating the tie downs using brass wire and some Evergreen styrene. The article in the ACL/SAL online modeling magazine was not clear on this point. (this issue is no longer on-line but available as part of a multi-issue DVD.

"The Coast Line K-17 gon--yes, that was a fun project. I certainly hope I didn't write that I used "V-groove siding" as I actually used clapboard. I don't recall which Evergreen product I used, but it was probably 080 spacing or greater. The website is here: http://www.evergreenscalemodels.com/Sheets.htm#Clapboard%20Siding
I simply put the wire between two pieces of clapboard, offset them, and hammered the sheets down, making the undulations in the wire. It'll take a few tries to get it like you want, but it's so easy my mom could do it."

Bill Welch


Re: another SE road set

Bill Welch
 

I am very pleased to see these Jerry. Somewhere, I think in the online SAL/ACL Modeling magazine, John Golden has done an article on modeling the ACL series the Georgia cars copied, including the pesky tie-down device along each side of the gon.

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@..., Gerald Glow <jerryglow@...> wrote:

Along with the ACL 50' DD autobox I recently announced, I just added one
for a 41' gondola for Georgia Railroad (Accurail car). See sample at:
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/samples/GA_gondola.jpg

--
*Jerry Glow
The Villages FL
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/decals/*



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Tank Car Color Guide

Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

GUYZ,

            I have this book and use it as a picture / painting guide to tank
cars. 
It sells as a pictorial, not a history of tank cars. If one is a serious builder
of tank cars; then they already have the Steam Freight Car rafference Manual
vol#2--tank cars by Ted C. The color guide does make a nice companion
piece to Ted's work.

Fred Freitas
Bennington,VT




________________________________
From: Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Wed, November 24, 2010 2:14:08 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Tank Car Color Guide

 
Charlie Vlk wrote:
My main concern with the book (and anothers) is the lack of an
index. Also, the coverage seems to be largely cars late in the
game. I think there is room for books with more coverage of cars
that perhaps won't have Color photos available..... maybe we'll get
one or two to complement these that do so and have more accurate
captions and an index of at least the car numbers, if not
catagorized by type and builder....
Gee, Charlie, there's Ed Kaminski's book on AC&F tank cars, and
IT has an index . . .

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Tank Car Color Guide

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Charlie Vlk wrote:
My main concern with the book (and anothers) is the lack of an index. Also, the coverage seems to be largely cars late in the game. I think there is room for books with more coverage of cars that perhaps won't have Color photos available..... maybe we'll get one or two to complement these that do so and have more accurate captions and an index of at least the car numbers, if not catagorized by type and builder....
Gee, Charlie, there's Ed Kaminski's book on AC&F tank cars, and IT has an index . . .

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Tank Car Color Guide (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: FOUO

Morning Sun's PRR color guides went from speculative and lacking class
specifics in vol 1 to much better accuracy and details in vols 2 & 3. I only
wish I could help them with vol 4

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Anthony Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2010 12:23 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Tank Car Color Guide



Kurt Laughlin wrote:
Tony, you and Ed Hawkins are certainly the best people on here to
speak to this . . . Publisher's attitudes aside, I've always heard
that it was expensive to change a book like this once the galleys or
proofs or camera copy (or whatever the correct term is) are created.
With a limited print run (as I'm sure these have), perhaps it is just
uneconomical to correct them for a subsequent edition that might never
come?
Not nowadays. The computer files created by the layout person are used to
make the printing plates directly, and the "plates" are so thin they can't be
re-used. There is no more "camera ready" material and no camera in the
process; and there are no longer page negatives used to make the plates. A
device which is essentially a laser printer "writes" the pages directly on
the emulsion of the plates, which are then developed.
Many of Morning Sun's books are only printed one time, so obviously there is
no question of corrections. But in a second or subsequent print run, it would
in fact be very easy to correct the computer file. That Yanosey will not do
so may mean that he doesn't care (a viable possibility) but it could also
mean that he has a specific contract with his printer about doing so.
The Sweetland book on the SP by Morning Sun is filled with "howler" mistakes,
wildly wrong locations and wrong trains or eras or historical sidebars. I
tell people to look at the photo with their thumb over the caption. Gene
Green's comments hopefully do not mean that this has spread as the preferred
mode for ALL Moaning Sun products. <g>

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
<mailto:thompson%40signaturepress.com>
Publishers of books on railroad history





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: FOUO


Re: UP S-40-6

Jim Hayes
 

UPHS.ORG

Jim Hayes
Portland Oregon
www.sunshinekits.com


On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 10:46 AM, WILLIAM PARDIE
<PARDIEW001@...>wrote:




Now that we are all excited about this car where do we get on from?

Bill Pardie

On Nov 24, 2010, at 8:33 AM, mike brock wrote:

Regarding the UP S-40-6, without any doubt, Richard Hendrickson'a
article in
Vol 23 #4 is the source for information on the cars and, perhaps more
importantly, how to build them. Richard does not...uh...tell us how
to find
the time to build them.

I will mention that there is a tiny discrepancy regarding the
reconstruction
of these cars at Denver. The rather obscure book Union Pacific Frt
Cars of
the 1950s by Greg Davis includes 4 photos of the reconstruction
process
including one of a finished car with a reweigh date of DR-4-51.
Incidentally, there is another article on UP stock cars in general
in Vol 23
# 2 by Dick Harley which includes a photo of a rebuilt car with a
reweigh
date of DR-10-53 so the reconstruction process probably lasted
several yrs.
That article includes a photo of an S-40-6 not rebuilt in May 1963.
Beat up
a bit...paint deteriating somewhat...it appears to have a reweigh
date of
4?.

Mike Brock



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: UP S-40-6

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

Now that we are all excited about this car where do we get on from?

Bill Pardie

On Nov 24, 2010, at 8:33 AM, mike brock wrote:

Regarding the UP S-40-6, without any doubt, Richard Hendrickson'a article in
Vol 23 #4 is the source for information on the cars and, perhaps more
importantly, how to build them. Richard does not...uh...tell us how to find
the time to build them.

I will mention that there is a tiny discrepancy regarding the reconstruction
of these cars at Denver. The rather obscure book Union Pacific Frt Cars of
the 1950s by Greg Davis includes 4 photos of the reconstruction process
including one of a finished car with a reweigh date of DR-4-51.
Incidentally, there is another article on UP stock cars in general in Vol 23
# 2 by Dick Harley which includes a photo of a rebuilt car with a reweigh
date of DR-10-53 so the reconstruction process probably lasted several yrs.
That article includes a photo of an S-40-6 not rebuilt in May 1963. Beat up
a bit...paint deteriating somewhat...it appears to have a reweigh date of
4?.

Mike Brock



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: Tank Car Color Guide

Charlie Vlk
 

I still like the book for the pictures.... I don't really trust captions on photos in the vast majority of books but generally the pictures themselves don't lie.... but with Photoshop one never knows......

My main concern with the book (and anothers) is the lack of an index. Also, the coverage seems to be largely cars late in the game. I think there is room for books with more coverage of cars that perhaps won't have Color photos available..... maybe we'll get one or two to complement these that do so and have more accurate captions and an index of at least the car numbers, if not catagorized by type and builder....

Charlie Vlk


Re: UP S-40-6

mike brock <brockm@...>
 

Regarding the UP S-40-6, without any doubt, Richard Hendrickson'a article in Vol 23 #4 is the source for information on the cars and, perhaps more importantly, how to build them. Richard does not...uh...tell us how to find the time to build them.

I will mention that there is a tiny discrepancy regarding the reconstruction of these cars at Denver. The rather obscure book Union Pacific Frt Cars of the 1950s by Greg Davis includes 4 photos of the reconstruction process including one of a finished car with a reweigh date of DR-4-51. Incidentally, there is another article on UP stock cars in general in Vol 23 # 2 by Dick Harley which includes a photo of a rebuilt car with a reweigh date of DR-10-53 so the reconstruction process probably lasted several yrs. That article includes a photo of an S-40-6 not rebuilt in May 1963. Beat up a bit...paint deteriating somewhat...it appears to have a reweigh date of 4?.

Mike Brock

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