Date   

Re: Morning Sun & the Historical Record

Steve Lucas <stevelucas3@...>
 

Clark--

Actually, they use colourised black-amd-white photos, too.

Their book "Great Lakes Trolleys" uses many of these.

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., cepropst@... wrote:

My only gripe with the color books is just that, they only use color photos, so anything that was shot in b/w is left out.
Clark Propst


Re: another SE road set

jerryglow2
 

My artwork is all vector so I can do it in any scale. I've done sets from N-scale to O including TT and S. One or two of the sets was originally done for an S-scale customer.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Bob McCarthy <thesupplycar@...> wrote:

Jerry,

     Do you produce these decals in S.

Bob McCarthy

--- On Wed, 11/24/10, jerryglow@... <jerryglow@...> wrote:

From: jerryglow@... <jerryglow@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: another SE road set
To: STMFC@...
Date: Wednesday, November 24, 2010, 8:29 PM







 









He did including modeling those tiedowns and I reference them with my ACL sets. I just got a note from a new customer who suggested this set as a variation. He's ordering one of each.



Jerry Glow



--- In STMFC@..., "lnbill" <fgexbill@> wrote:

I am very pleased to see these Jerry. Somewhere, I think in the online SAL/ACL Modeling magazine, John Golden has done an article on modeling the ACL series the Georgia cars copied, including the pesky tie-down device along each side of the gon.
Bill Welch
--- In STMFC@..., Gerald Glow <jerryglow@> wrote:
Along with the ACL 50' DD autobox I recently announced, I just added one
for a 41' gondola for Georgia Railroad (Accurail car). See sample at:
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/samples/GA_gondola.jpg
--
*Jerry Glow
The Villages FL
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/decals/*
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: UP Freight Car Photos

Scott
 

Very neat Don. I would be interested in the history of the end door boxcar 161404. Why where the doors removed and the post looking things put in?

Thanks,
Scott

--- In STMFC@..., "donstrack" <donstrack@...> wrote:

A couple months ago I decided to scan and share the UP company photos I have collected over the past 35 years. John Bromley at the UP museum has given his permission, as long as they are credited to the Union Pacific Historical Collection. These are all scanned as high resolution black and white photos.

http://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/UP-Freight-Cars/

Don Strack
http://utahrails.net/


Specialized Ore Cars and the Value of Captions

Don Strack
 

In a previous message thread, Schuyler Larrabee wrote:

Captions have to tell you something more than what you can already see in the picture. "Here we see an SD-45 in full roar as it crosses the Delaware River on the Mill Rift bridge." Gee, even that caption has facts in it that MIGHT not be evident to a casual reader, but any ERIE/EL fan will know all that already. But captions that include year, month, date if possible, direction of the photo, locomotive or other equipment ID, location, reason you should look at the photo, etc., etc. are all reasons to buy a book. <<
Although not freight car related, I'm in the middle of a project to caption over 200 photos of "Bingham Canyon Railroads", each with no less than 50 words and no more than 70 words. It is proving to be a real test of my knowledge of the subject, and my ability to write about it.

Would anyone care to comment on the features of these heavy duty ore cars, such as truck design, air brakes, etc.

http://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Utah-Copper-Ore-Cars/

Don Strack


Re: Morning Sun & the Historical Record

Clark Propst
 

My only gripe with the color books is just that, they only use color photos, so anything that was shot in b/w is left out.
Clark Propst


UP Freight Car Photos

Don Strack
 

A couple months ago I decided to scan and share the UP company photos I have collected over the past 35 years. John Bromley at the UP museum has given his permission, as long as they are credited to the Union Pacific Historical Collection. These are all scanned as high resolution black and white photos.

http://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/UP-Freight-Cars/

Don Strack
http://utahrails.net/


Re: Morning Sun & the Historical Record

Frank Pearsall
 

Good morning all:

Two observations here:

First, good caption writing is an art form unto itself. Caption writing can be the step-child to good writing and photographs.

The question in my mind is why does Mr. Yanosey at Morning Sun Books have this attitude towards proper historical fact recording? What, if anything can we all do to help him and other publishers do the right thing?

Frank Pearsall
Brevard, N.C.

On Nov 26, 2010, at 1:08 AM, <tmolsen@...> <tmolsen@...> wrote:

List,

A number of lister's have praised the Morning Sun books because of the photos within. I agree that for the most part, the photos are excellent, but the fact remains that inaccurate captions pervert the history that the books are supposed to represent.

It is a lot of hubris for us to say that "We" don't care as "We" know where the photos were taken and what the subjects are. The point here is not whether "WE" know what is on the printed page, but what of those who follow us and what of the younger group of people who are just now new to this business of prototype railroading and have never seen the subjects that are within the covers of these books before?

We spend a lot of time on this list searching for correct information concerning the freight cars we want to model and document, in addition to information of the territories that they operated over. SO, from where I sit, we have a responsibility to point out and document the mistakes that are printed in these and other books for the sake of the younger generation that follows us to pick up from where we leave off! Many of our people are dying off, so if we are not around to show them the way, then at least we can make sure that the history (that's what these books are!) books are correct in what is printed!

This is why people like Richard Hendrickson, Tony Thompson, Bill Welch and many more take so much care in documenting the subjects in the books that they write.

Regards,

Tom Olsen
7 Boundary Road, West Branch
Newark, Delaware, 19711-7479
(302) 738-4292
tmolsen@...





------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Morning Sun & the Historical Record

tmolsen@...
 

List,

A number of Lister's have praised the Morning Sun books because of the photos within. I agree that for the most part, the photos are excellent, but the fact remains that inaccurate captions pervert the history that the books are supposed to represent.

It is a lot of hubris for us to say that "We" don't care as "We" know where the photos were taken and what the subjects are. The point here is not whether "WE" know what is on the printed page, but what of those who follow us and what of the younger group of people who are just now new to this business of prototype railroading and have never seen the subjects that are within the covers of these books before?

We spend a lot of time on this list searching for correct information concerning the freight cars we want to model and document, in addition to information of the territories that they operated over. SO, from where I sit, we have a responsibility to point out and document the mistakes that are printed in these and other books for the sake of the younger generation that follows us to pick up from where we leave off! Many of our people are dying off, so if we are not around to show them the way, then at least we can make sure that the history (that's what these books are!) books are correct in what is printed!

This is why people like Richard Hendrickson, Tony Thompson, Bill Welch and many more take so much care in documenting the subjects in the books that they write.

Regards,

Tom Olsen
7 Boundary Road, West Branch
Newark, Delaware, 19711-7479
(302) 738-4292
tmolsen@...


(No subject)

tmolsen@...
 


Re: Cattle resting

tmolsen@...
 

List,

In the Spring, stock moved on the PRR from the west to Enola. If the stock needed to be fed and watered (in accordance to Federal Law) they could be unloaded at the east end of Enola Yard where there were stock pens for this reason just west of Day Tower on the north side of the yard. An extra crew was called to move the stock train east to Pomeroy on the Main Line east of Parkesburg, Pa.

On arrival at Pomeroy, Pa., the operator operated the electric locks to allow the freight crew to shove the train onto the siding there. The crew then would clear the main, run around the train and take it south on the Newark & Pomeroy Branch to Doe Run where the stock was unloaded at the Farm that the King Ranch owned.

The purpose of this move was to bring the stock east to the King Ranch establishment to allow them to graze and fatten up through the summer. In the late summer or early fall, the cattle were loaded up and trucked to the slaughter houses in Philadelphia and New York. Cross Brothers had a slaughter house and meat packing packing plant on the eastbound side of the Philadelphia-New York Main Line at Front Street, East of North Philadelphia station. Other stock movements destined for Cross Brothers came from the west on symbol freight trains to be set off at 44th Street Yard, where local freight crews would take complete the movement to Cross Brothers. The empty cars would be returned after unloading to 44th Street by the local crews working out of Margie Yard or 44th Street.

I was an extra PRR block operator posting at Thorndale and at Parkesburg block stations in 1966 when several of these movements took place. One of the trains was a 65 car stock train. After the train was unloaded, the emptys were moved from Doe Run to Thorndale Yard where the cars were returned west on a westbound symbol freight to be returned to their home road empty.

Tom Olsen
7 Boundary Road, West Branch
Newark, Delaware, 19711-7479
(302) 738-4292
tmolsen@...


Re: Books with pictures in Color from an East Coast publisher

Clark Propst
 

Gene Green wrote:
"The cars were natural aluminum with some lettering in black and the rest in green. Problem is I can't remember which was
black and which was green. Maybe Clark Propst can help here."

The initials, number, road name, and slogan were green. All the small lettering and steel parts were black.
CLark Propst


Re: Books with pictures in Color from an East Coast publisher

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., "geodyssey" <riverob@...> wrote:
<snip>
Concerning STMFCs, what more can anyone tell me about the 10 aluminum 40' box cars received from Mt. Vernon Car in 1945, some of which were converted to dedicated gas-electric trailers?

Rob Simpson
Rob and any others who might be interested,
Here's all I know about the M&StL's 10 aluminum box cars including just a tad of speculation.

Reynolds aluminum box and refrigerator cars of 1945 and 1946 were designed by Robert B. Borucki. Borucki worked as mechanical draftsman, car draftsman and lead draftsman for Milwaukee Road 1926 to 1936, engineer of passenger car design for Union Pacific 1936 to 1943. He joined Reynolds in 1943.

The M&StL's 10 aluminum box cars were designed by Reynolds Aluminum and built by Mount Vernon Car Manufacturing Company in 1945. These were the first M&StL box cars to have a 10'-6" inside height.

The Alton, and Rock Island each also took 10 aluminum box cars with similar features. An article in the March 10, 1945, issue of Railway Age magazine described
the design and construction of these cars and included a thorough list of materials and equipment used.

Design variations between the three groups of cars making the M&StL cars the lightest at 37,000 pounds. This saved as much as 11,000 pounds when compared to conventional all-steel cars.

The M&StL numbered their cars 1000 to 1018, even numbers only. These cars had, among other parts, Camel doors, NY AB-1012 air brakes, Miner A-22-XB
draft gear, National Malleable couplers, Apex aluminum runboards, Barber S-2 trucks with 33" one-wear steel wheels from Carnegie-Illinois, Superior 566 handbrakes, and even Apex R 4 A defect card holders. The Dreadnaught ends had a 3/3/4 pattern.

The first of these cars was delivered to the M&StL February 28, 1945 after it and one for each of the other two railroads had been on public display at La Salle Street Station in Chicago the day before. The cars were natural aluminum with some lettering in black and the rest in green. One of these cars appears briefly in an amateur 8mm movie film. Problem is I can't remember which was black and which was green. Maybe Clark Propst can help here.

In August 1953 all 10 M&StL aluminum box cars were painted "Devins green," actually Du Pont #89-8127 Vorhauer Green Dulux Enamel.

Car number 1012 survived in revenue freight service the longest. Cars number 1014, 1018 and 1000 had their steel flooring removed in February 1957 which is probably when they became baggage cars 405, 406 and 407 respectively for use behind the M&StL's two RDC-4s.

Their date of conversion is not certain because two may have been converted in 1957 but 8 were still in freight service in January 1958. By April 1958 another one was gone from the Register. These converted cars received red stenciling which included shaded striping to simulated fluted sides.

Six of these aluminum box cars were equipped with Evans 19-belt DF loaders, repainted and renumbered 2350 to 2360, even numbers only. Cars 2356, 2358 and 2360 went to "Plymouth" for installation of DF Loaders on June 17, 1959. The six cars with DF Loaders were repainted bright red with white "Mikan" stenciling.

One of the cars - I don't know which one - was "cornered" and needed a new end. Knowing what would eventually happen, Bill Landmesser went ahead and installed a new steel end because no aluminum ends were available.

Reynolds aluminum box and refrigerator cars of 1945 and 1946 were designed by Robert B. Borucki. Borucki worked as mechanical draftsman, car draftsman and lead draftsman for Milwaukee Road 1926 to 1936, engineer of passenger car design for Union Pacific 1936 to 1943. He joined Reynolds in 1943.

Gene Green


Re: Books with pictures in Color from an East Coast publisher

kmelvin1663 <melvinphotos@...>
 

As the author or co-author of a number of Morning Sun books, I have to say that the publisher never cautioned me about "too much history" and the textual portion of each book will rise or fall with the author. I too have read Gene's M&StL book and have a LOT of Morning Sun books. The better writers get "invited back", those not so good are not. An index or bibliography doesn't usually make it into the book. I provided a sheet with a bibliography for my Maine Central-Volume 3 that we passed out with copies we sold. Feedback to the publisher is taken into consideration. A second edition is out of the question commercially but subsequent volumes can carry corrections. Some Morning Sun authors, such as Jerry Pinkepank (GTW books) have maintained a website as a forum for corrections. Having said all this, the photos alone are worth the price of admission!
George Melvin

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

Gene,

I may not have read EVERY caption, but I always read the captions
of the photos that catch my eye. And I like many of the photos in that
book! And since you wrote them, I believe them all implicitly. :-)

Tim O'Connor


At 11/24/2010 10:52 AM Wednesday, you wrote:
As an afterthought to my previous post, I'm not really sure inaccurate captions are a big problem.

The M&StL in Color book has three different series of photos the captions for which tell a story. In my humble opinion the captions are worth reading.

In the 14 years since that book came out I have only encountered one person who ever read it - my aunt. She read it from cover to cover. No one else, including my own model railroader son, has ever admitted to reading a single word. Maybe captions are unnecessary for the great unwashed masses.

Gene Green


Re: Cattle resting

Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

Evan,

There was quite a discussion on the PRR list about this movement.
You might find some useful info there.

Fred Freitas




________________________________
From: RDG2124 <RDG2124@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Thu, November 25, 2010 2:48:57 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Cattle resting

 
The King Ranch was referred to by another Reading devotee and that rail
shipments ran into the 60's. I never looked into it, regretfully. Years later
ran into an article, in a Sunday newspaper insert, about the King Ranch. The
article made a point of their sending cattle to Bucks county, Pennsylvania for
fattening on lush pasture land before being processed for distribution to
eastern restaurants. The article did mention that the cattle had previously been
sent by rail before the trucks took over.


Evan Leisey
Bennett, CO

-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Smith <smithbf@...>
To: STMFC <STMFC@...>
Sent: Thu, Nov 25, 2010 9:15 am
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Cattle resting

Evan,

I believe this movement was a "normal" thing, and represented an attempt
by the famed King Ranch to avoid the losses normally associated with
shipping cattle. Exactly as you say, younger cattle were shipped to SE
PA and then "finished" on pastures there, before making a much shorter
trip to slaughter than cattle "finished" out west.

Lots of photos of foreign stock cars on the PRR as well.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Happy Thanksgiving

Dennis Williams
 

We want to wish you and your family a Happy Thanksgiving.

From all of us at Resin Builders 4 U.

Dennis
www.resinbuilders4u.com


Happy Thanksgiving

Dennis Williams
 

We want to wish you and your family a Happy Thanksgiving.

From all of us at Resin Builders 4 U.

Dennis
www.resinbuilders4u.com


Re: Cattle resting

RDG2124 <RDG2124@...>
 

The King Ranch was referred to by another Reading devotee and that rail shipments ran into the 60's. I never looked into it, regretfully. Years later ran into an article, in a Sunday newspaper insert, about the King Ranch. The article made a point of their sending cattle to Bucks county, Pennsylvania for fattening on lush pasture land before being processed for distribution to eastern restaurants. The article did mention that the cattle had previously been sent by rail before the trucks took over.


Evan Leisey
Bennett, CO

-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Smith <smithbf@...>
To: STMFC <STMFC@...>
Sent: Thu, Nov 25, 2010 9:15 am
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Cattle resting




Evan,

I believe this movement was a "normal" thing, and represented an attempt
by the famed King Ranch to avoid the losses normally associated with
shipping cattle. Exactly as you say, younger cattle were shipped to SE
PA and then "finished" on pastures there, before making a much shorter
trip to slaughter than cattle "finished" out west.

Lots of photos of foreign stock cars on the PRR as well.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


Re: Time to take a swing at scratch building.

Jack Burgess <jack@...>
 

I'd be happy to answer questions off-list Scott...


Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com
jack@...


Time to take a swing at scratch building.

Scott
 

Well, since I have completed a few resin models I feel I am completely qualified to be a scratch builder! (That is sarcasm folks)

What I had in mind was a CB&Q Bomber Box. I know Sunshine makes one, but with a six month wait I thought I would give it a shot.

For reference material I have The Burlington Bullentin #15 and Railway Prototype Cyclopedia 12.

For the end doors I am going to modify a Sylvan Models Dreadnaught end door. Not sure for the B end yet.

So, I was looking for some onlist/offlist help that I can ask all the beginners questions too. I have a lot of them i.e. tools, methods etc.

Any help would be great!

Thanks,
Scott


Re: UP S-40-6

Dick Harley
 

Thanks for the explanation Mike. You are quite correct about the photos showing the rebuilding in Denver in the Spring of 1951. As you might suspect, there are even more company photos than the ones Davies published. I don't have any firm knowledge of when the rebuildings occurred, but I suspect there are UP Denver shop records at the Colorado Railroad Museum that could tell much more of that story. Frank Peacock provided me with copies of pages from "Virginia's Book", but they do not list rebuildings.

UP had apparently been considering a rebuilding of those cars for some time. I have a copy of a drawing issued in June 1946 for rebuilding the S-40-6 cars with steel ends (and the vertical slat doors). Obviously that program was not instituted. I also have a copy of the drawing issued September 1947 for the steel letter boards that were applied to the S-40-1 to S-40-6 classes.

Regarding the reweigh dates, remember that the AAR rules applied to cars in interchange service. I claim little knowledge about this, but apparently a lot of UP stock cars were not interchanged. Frank Peacock took many photos in September 1966 of S-40-6 cars that still had reweigh dates from the early to mid 1950s. I have yet to see a photo of a UP S-40-6 with the LT. WT. and/or reweigh date repainted.

Happy Thanksgiving to All,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach, CA

98841 - 98860 of 193619