Date   

Prototype Rails 2011 report

Aley, Jeff A
 

Note: I am the Clinic Chairman for Prototype Rails, so my report is therefore biased.

Prototype Rails 2011 is now behind us, and I had a great time, as usual. Attendance was 251, which is approximately the same as last year. We had most of the "usual suspects", as well as some new faces.

Clinic Summary:
Overall, things went very smoothly. We had a slate of fine clinics, and I received a lot of positive feedback on Jack Burgess' clinic on using Photoshop. We had several clinics by manufacturers, including Intermountain, Pacific Western Rail Systems, and Rapido. There was a nice series of passenger car clinics as well as a bunch of freight car clinics. Clinics on modeling techniques were popular (as always). Scott Mason brought a small compressor and demonstrated airbrushing techniques in his clinic, and we used a video cam + projector to magnify Jon Cagle's hands as he showed how to build a resin tank car kit. The award for "most anachronistic use of technology" had to go to Bernard Kempinski. He did his clinic using an Apple iPad - but his clinic was on Civil War Railroads! Shake-N-Take, as usual, was a highlight for the freight car folks. Perhaps we'll have a Passenger Shake-N-Take in the near future.

Ballroom and Displays:
There were a lot of fine models on display, including from the ultra-detailed and prototypical, a modeler's very first kit w/ updated details, and my personal favorite: a nicely weathered Gould tank car lettered for Switzer Tank Lines. Also notable were some beautifully weathered O-scale freight cars. Most of the usual vendors were there, and I spent some $$ buying books from Speedwitch Media. Notably absent were Branchline Trains, Broadway Limited (I think they left early), and Walthers. Of course, the ballroom was THE place to be to see the new Rapido reefer, and to catch up with your modeling buddies.

The Weather:
The weather was MUCH better than last year, and 68 degrees is plenty warm enough to go out for a stroll on the beach. On Monday, it got up to about 78.

The Food:
I'll confess that I did not eat at the hotel at all. We had oranges from Harvey's to snack on, and went out to eat at: Florida Seafood [the regular hangout of the modelers from Chicago], Sonny's BBQ (the brisket sandwich is decent), Slow-N-Low BBQ (the brisket sandwich is terrible), Roberto's Little Havana (aka "The Cuban Place" - highly recommended), Coconuts on the Beach (great grilled fish), and The Lobster Shanty (great broiled rock shrimp - better than Florida Seafood, but you'll pay for it).

The People:
The REAL reason to go to a Prototype Modeling meet is the people. Everyone is interested in (surprise!) prototype modeling, and everyone is willing to share their ideas, techniques, research, etc. And of course you get to see your friends, some of whom you may only know from a Yahoo!Group somewhere.

Details of what Jeff saw:
As usual, events began on Thursday with Op Sessions and registration. The Thursday dinner was not well-attended, and in fact, I went to Florida Seafood with some of the "Chicago [and Indiana] Mafia" instead. It is my conclusion that most of the folks who show up on Thursday now have "favorite" restaurants, and that an organized dinner is no longer necessary.

We started clinics on Thursday night (see the schedule at http://prototyperails.com ). I attended Mike Brock's railfan videos that he shot of N&W 1218 and N&W 611, with a little bit of UP 3985 and UP 844 thrown in. It was all well-shot, and we got to hear every whistle blast, and saw every S-curve in Appalachia! After that, I presented selected slides from the Rock Island Technical Society's "Don Ball, Jr Collection". These were well-narrated by RI guru Steve Hile. Steve hadn't seen the slides until about two hours before the presentation, but was able to make insightful comments anyways!

On Friday, I enjoyed Tony Thompson's presentation on Prototype Waybills and how they can be adapted for our model railroads. I think I asked more questions than anybody else in the room. I also saw Steve Hile's clinic on Rock Island stock cars, and learned that Rocket Express will be producing some of them as resin kits. I am among the many disappointed folks who will not be able to buy the Westerfield kits (see Al's message on STMFC). I attended Jim Singer's "Prototype Oddities 3", which focused mostly on strange passenger train consists in the midwest. There was a particular focus on the "camp trains" (which took kids to camp in the summer). After a quick dinner, I attended Doug Harding's clinic on Meat Trains and Operations, a subject that is of great interest to me.

Saturday I saw Doug Harding's other clinic, "Meat Packing Plants and How to Model One". I followed that with Sperandeo's clinic on modeling signals. It should come as no surprise that his emphasis was on signals as used by the AT&SF. After dinner I went to Tony Thompson's other clinic "Transition-Era Tank Car Modeling", followed by Richard Hendrickson's "The North American Freight Car Fleet in the 1950's". Both were very interesting and dovetailed nicely with the books I purchased from Speedwitch Media (the tank car book and the two box car books).

End of Report.

Regards,

-Jeff


Re: Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?

pullmanboss <tcmadden@...>
 

Rich, the RAILWAY AGE article has two photos of the cars, both of which also appear in the 1937 CBC. There's no mention of color in the article. I can send you copies of the two pages if you want, but they're from a bound volume here at the Colo. RR Museum so some of the text at the very left margin of the first page is dark & distorted where it dives into the binding. Let me know (off list at tcmadden at Q dot com) if you'd like the copies.

Tom Madden

--- In STMFC@..., "Richard Yoder" <oscale48@...> wrote:

Gentleman.
I know this is an old subject but -
Does anyone know what color the Liquid Carbonic cars were?
Further.
In the Car builders Cyclopedia from 1937, pg 194, figure 165, there is
reference to a description of the cars in Railway Age August 10, 1935 page
179.
Does anyone have that issue of Railway age?

Sincerely,
Rich Yoder
7 Edgedale Court
Wyomissing PA 19610-1913
Call between 6:00 PM and 10:00 PM EST
610-678-2834
www.richyodermodels.com






-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Frederick Freitas
Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2010 5:23 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?

GUYZ,
 
You are thinking of the Mathison Dry Ice car offered by Laconia in the late
50's.
 
Fred Freitas

--- On Sat, 9/18/10, John Stokes <ggstokes@...> wrote:


From: John Stokes <ggstokes@...>
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?
To: stmfc@...
Date: Saturday, September 18, 2010, 3:49 PM



A guess would be Liquid Carbonic, and the second builder's photo on the page
clearly shows a build date of 1935. I think LC was shipped in cylinders, but
someone else may have more accurate information.

I seem to recall that Ambroid or someone of that era in HO offered a kit for
a similar car.

John Stokes
Bellevue, WA




To: STMFC@...
From: repairman87@...
Date: Sat, 18 Sep 2010 19:25:28 +0000
Subject: [STMFC] Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?


 


I was surfing the net and stumbled across this site with this picture.

http://www.billspennsyphotos.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=82586961

Anybody know what its purpose was or what it hauled or time frame it use
used?

Thanks,
Scott




                         





------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links









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Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: IM/RC SP S40-5 stock car

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Bill McCoy wrote:
A new IM release announcement shows a S40-5 stock car lettered for
T&NO, TNO 15503-15767 with a reweigh date of EP 2-57.
Is this accurate?
Yes. Those are transferred Pacific Lines cars, and the reweigh
date is representative of the time period.

Tony Thompson



Almost enough info, Tony. When did they transfer happen?


SGL





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Re: 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Denis Blake wrote:
"The 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet is scheduled to take place March
25-26. This meet is hosted by Bob Harpe and is held at the Port Wentworth,
GA
Community Center. There are several options for lodging in the area.

More information can be found here. http://www.savannahrpm.com/

We look forward to see you all there."



Ben Hom complained:

This conflicts with the this year's Greensburg PA meet!
http://www.hansmanns..org/rpm_east/2011.htm
<http://www.hansmanns.org/rpm_east/2011.htm>



What, exactly, is your point, Ben? It's not like the population of
Prototype Modelers these days is so limited that there won't be enough folks
at the two meets. For many people, the distances involved plus the housing
expenses keep people from participating.

It's OK, Ben, it's OK.

SGL





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Re: 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet

seaboard_1966
 

Ben

I hate it when that happens. I changed the date of my meet a couple of times because I found out it conflicted with different things. One was Easter and then the other was Mothers Day. One of my dates also conflicted with a NMRA function in NE Ohio. With the amount of meets that are happening now it is just about impossible to come up with a date that is not in conflict with something or another. We all need to have places to display our freight car models...

Denis Blake
N Hamlet Shops, OH





2011 Central Ohio Prototype Modelers Meet, May 19-21

http://www.facebook.com/pages/manage/#!/pages/Central-Ohio-Prototype-Modelers-Meet/326645470797

-----Original Message-----
From: Benjamin Hom
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2011 12:57 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet

Denis Blake wrote:
"The 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet is scheduled to take place March
25-26. This meet is hosted by Bob Harpe and is held at the Port Wentworth, GA
Community Center. There are several options for lodging in the area.

More information can be found here. http://www.savannahrpm.com/

We look forward to see you all there."


This conflicts with the this year's Greensburg PA meet!
http://www.hansmanns.org/rpm_east/2011.htm


Ben Hom


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links









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Re: IM/RC SP S40-5 stock car

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bill McCoy wrote:
A new IM release announcement shows a S40-5 stock car lettered for T&NO, TNO 15503-15767 with a reweigh date of EP 2-57.
Is this accurate?
Yes. Those are transferred Pacific Lines cars, and the reweigh date is representative of the time period.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet

Benjamin Hom
 

Denis Blake wrote:
"The 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet is scheduled to take place March
25-26. This meet is hosted by Bob Harpe and is held at the Port Wentworth, GA
Community Center. There are several options for lodging in the area.

More information can be found here. http://www.savannahrpm.com/

We look forward to see you all there."


This conflicts with the this year's Greensburg PA meet!
http://www.hansmanns.org/rpm_east/2011.htm


Ben Hom


2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet

seaboard_1966
 

The 2011 Savannah Prototype Modelers Meet is scheduled to take place March 25-26. This meet is hosted by Bob Harpe and is held at the Port Wentworth, GA Community Center. There are several options for lodging in the area.

More information can be found here. http://www.savannahrpm.com/

We look forward to see you all there.

Denis Blake


2011 Central Ohio Prototype Modelers Meet, May 19-21

http://www.facebook.com/pages/manage/#!/pages/Central-Ohio-Prototype-Modelers-Meet/326645470797


What operating time frame does the new Rapido Reefer cover ...

dakkinder
 

Just curious i don't know much about this car .
Doug kinder


IM/RC SP S40-5 stock car

Bill McCoy
 

A new IM release announcement shows a S40-5 stock car lettered for T&NO, TNO 15503-15767 with a reweigh date of EP 2-57.

Is this accurate?

Bill McCoy
Jax, FL


Re: Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?

Tim O'Connor
 

The LCIX cars look a lot like (identical to?) cars built for
Mathieson for dry ice (MAWX/SHPX).

But Liquid Carbonic also had reefers (RB). I have color scans
of DICX 208, 320, 340, 374, 379, 381 and all of them are painted
white with oxide red ends and roof, and black underbodies. It
would be nice to have a model of these interesting looking cars
in HO -- they seemed to have existed in larger numbers than most
of the other dry ice cars for which we already have models.

Tim O'Connor

Rich,
I don't have handy access to the 8-10-35 Railway Age issue but could
look at it during my next visit to the Museum of Transportation.

If you are referring to the cars built by AC&F in 1934-1935, namely
LCIX 1000-1005 (6-34, lot 1338) and LCIX 1006-1010 ((5-35, lot 1409),
the AC&F bill of materials state:

Lot 1338: Aluminum - sides, ends, roof, and running board. Black -
underframe, trucks. Green - stencils. Red - Lettering and shield.

Lot 1409: Aluminum - entire car (sides, ends, roof, running board).
Black - underframe, trucks, stencils. Green and Vermillion - stencils.

Copies of the pages containing the painting/lettering information can
be purchased from the St. Louis Mercantile Library. Hope this helps.
Ed Hawkins


Re: Rapido Reefer and Sergent Couplers

Jeff <jeff@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...> wrote:

Larry Wolohon wrote:
"I thought that I heard that Sargent couplers will couple with scale Kadee
couplers such as #58, etc, which are what I have been using."

Whomever told you this is incorrect.  They are are NOT compatible with Kadee
couplers, scale or otherwise: 
http://www.sergentengineering.com/FAQCompatibility.htm 
I agree they're incompatible - they'll couple, sorta, but may swing over to one side (don't remember which offhand) and cause derailments when going around the opposite curve.

--
Jeff Shultz
http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com


Re: Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?

Ed Hawkins
 

On Jan 11, 2011, at 9:33 PM, Richard Yoder wrote:

Gentleman.
I know this is an old subject but -
Does anyone know what color the Liquid Carbonic cars were?
Further.
In the Car builders Cyclopedia from 1937, pg 194, figure 165, there is
reference to a description of the cars in Railway Age August 10, 1935
page
179.
Does anyone have that issue of Railway age?
Sincerely,
Rich Yoder
Rich,
I don't have handy access to the 8-10-35 Railway Age issue but could
look at it during my next visit to the Museum of Transportation.

If you are referring to the cars built by AC&F in 1934-1935, namely
LCIX 1000-1005 (6-34, lot 1338) and LCIX 1006-1010 ((5-35, lot 1409),
the AC&F bill of materials state:

Lot 1338: Aluminum - sides, ends, roof, and running board. Black -
underframe, trucks. Green - stencils. Red - Lettering and shield.

Lot 1409: Aluminum - entire car (sides, ends, roof, running board).
Black - underframe, trucks, stencils. Green and Vermillion - stencils.

Copies of the pages containing the painting/lettering information can
be purchased from the St. Louis Mercantile Library. Hope this helps.
Ed Hawkins


Re: Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?

Rich Yoder
 

Gentleman.
I know this is an old subject but -
Does anyone know what color the Liquid Carbonic cars were?
Further.
In the Car builders Cyclopedia from 1937, pg 194, figure 165, there is
reference to a description of the cars in Railway Age August 10, 1935 page
179.
Does anyone have that issue of Railway age?

Sincerely,
Rich Yoder
7 Edgedale Court
Wyomissing PA 19610-1913
Call between 6:00 PM and 10:00 PM EST
610-678-2834
www.richyodermodels.com

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Frederick Freitas
Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2010 5:23 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?

GUYZ,
 
You are thinking of the Mathison Dry Ice car offered by Laconia in the late
50's.
 
Fred Freitas

--- On Sat, 9/18/10, John Stokes <ggstokes@...> wrote:


From: John Stokes <ggstokes@...>
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?
To: stmfc@...
Date: Saturday, September 18, 2010, 3:49 PM



A guess would be Liquid Carbonic, and the second builder's photo on the page
clearly shows a build date of 1935. I think LC was shipped in cylinders, but
someone else may have more accurate information.

I seem to recall that Ambroid or someone of that era in HO offered a kit for
a similar car.

John Stokes
Bellevue, WA




To: STMFC@...
From: repairman87@...
Date: Sat, 18 Sep 2010 19:25:28 +0000
Subject: [STMFC] Interesting car anybody have some back ground on it?


 


I was surfing the net and stumbled across this site with this picture.

http://www.billspennsyphotos.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=82586961

Anybody know what its purpose was or what it hauled or time frame it use
used?

Thanks,
Scott




                         





------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Rapido freight car at Cocoa Beach

Bill Schneider
 

Aw shucks...

Thanks Doug.

To clarify one point though, my buddy Huang (the guy with my photo on his dart board for those that sat in on my clinic!) DOES understand our desire for fidelity and was already on top of most of the corrections before I contacted him. As far as “boxcar red” goes.... perhaps you forget that in... my past life... I used six shades of that “color” (“colour” for my friends north of the border...). I have yet to break that bit of information on our factory......

Bill Schneider
Rapido Trains



From: Douglas Harding
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 10:07 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Rapido freight car at Cocoa Beach




It still amazes me how many have commented on this new freight car, without
reading/understanding the comments that this is an early test shot and that
much work still needs to be done before a final production model is
produced.

I want to commend Bill and Jason for going to the extra effort to have an
early test shot available for examination. Bill took our ribbing and our
comments very seriously and patiently explained that he had already be in
touch with the factory and improvements were already in process. It seems
the Chinese do not understand our desire for fidelity to prototype. That
must come from doing to many molds for the Tyco and AHM of the world. And
let us not even discuss their understanding of Boxcar Red.

Knowing Bill's previous work, I suspect we will be pleasantly pleased with
this GATX reefer hits the hobby shops sometime this summer.

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org


Re: Rapido freight car at Cocoa Beach

Douglas Harding
 

It still amazes me how many have commented on this new freight car, without
reading/understanding the comments that this is an early test shot and that
much work still needs to be done before a final production model is
produced.



I want to commend Bill and Jason for going to the extra effort to have an
early test shot available for examination. Bill took our ribbing and our
comments very seriously and patiently explained that he had already be in
touch with the factory and improvements were already in process. It seems
the Chinese do not understand our desire for fidelity to prototype. That
must come from doing to many molds for the Tyco and AHM of the world. And
let us not even discuss their understanding of Boxcar Red.



Knowing Bill's previous work, I suspect we will be pleasantly pleased with
this GATX reefer hits the hobby shops sometime this summer.



Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org


Re: New Rapido reefer--the roof?

spsalso
 

Bill,

Thanks for resolving this. I'm looking forward to this car!


Ed

Edward Sutorik


Re: Rapido freight car at Cocoa Beach

Bill Schneider
 

So, now that I’m (somewhat) recovered from the meet and I have a moment to breath again, let me answer some of the comments regarding the test shots of our new meat reefer seen at Cocoa.
First, by way of history, this car has been designed for several months, but because of backlogs in our production schedule tooling did not actually start until late October. At my request our factory engineers and staff pushed hard to get me test shots in time for Prototype Rails. They did. Just. The samples arrived only a few days before I left. They were hurriedly thrown together and quickly painted in order to get them to me in time.
As I discussed at Cocoa, the tooling as shown is incomplete. Several items remain to be done, and several need reworking. Before leaving for Cocoa Beach I sent a multi-page corrections document to the factory addressing many of the issues discussed here. These include: Roof design and texture, side and end sheathing issues, oversize grab holes, step thickness and many more items not discussed here (yet..!). To his credit, when he received my comments our factory designer replied “have noticed, am fixing” to many of them.
Those who saw the car in person and discussed it with me were aware of the pending corrections and all agreed that it was a good start. Of course, those who were not there and did not have the... benefit (?!) of listening to my comments might have under the impression that this was the completed car and would rightly have come to a somewhat different conclusion! Such is the danger of showing early samples to the public.
Also, trying to head this one off... These same samples will be shown at the Springfield, Mass. show because there is no way for the factory to complete the updates in time. So, if you see a post in early February complaining that we have not yet improved the car please exercise your “Delete” key wisely... ;>)
Thanks,

Bill Schneider
Rapido Trains

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Possible prototypes for Sunshine's Warren & Columbian 8,000 gallon tankcars

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jan 11, 2011, at 2:04 PM, doswift wrote:

As a modeler who models late 1979, I'm always on the lookout for
steam era kits that will fit into my era. So I got pretty excited
when I picked up a couple of Sunshine kits for the Warren/Columbian
8,000 gal tankcars at a show in Pittsburgh last November.

http://sunshinekits.com/sunimages/sun36b.pdf

I recently came across these cars that appear to be near matches
for the Sunshine kits, but as I'm not an expert on steam era
tankcars, I could use some confirmation that these are indeed
insulated tankcars that match the kits.

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/acfx/acfx4839akg.jpg

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2012552

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1250098
ACFX 4839 appears to be very close to the Warren and Columbian cars
modeled by Sunshine. The AESX cars have later all-welded underframes
and different vents etc. on the domes, as they were used for the
shipment of corn oil.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: New Rapido reefer--the roof?

Bill Schneider
 

Hi Ed,

If you have the RP Cyc #14, open to page 78 (the lead page in the article). You will see that the roof does indeed have boards, not metal. Further, Ed and Pat sent me the original scan of the photo on page 83 and it is very clearly a board roof. In fact, even in the book if you look back about half way down the right hand side of the roof you can see one board joint not quite even. The roof looks to be made of T&G with very tight joints, then covered with a fairly solid coat of car cement and/or paint. In talking with Ed Hawkins early on in the development of this project he admitted that the caption and text were in error regarding the roof.

Regarding the model, the roof is clearly..... overstated. I’ll cover that in my next e-mail.... ;>)

Bill Schneider
Rapido Trains

From: spsalso
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 5:57 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] New Rapido reefer--the roof?


I'm still interested in reconciling what looks like t&g planking on the roof of the model with the statements (supported by a roof shot) in RPC #14 that the roof surface was relatively smooth sheet metal. Which one's right?

Ed

Edward Sutorik





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