Date   

Re: Freight Car Statistics

A. Premo <armprem2@...>
 

Precisely.This is exactly what I have been trying to raise as a point of discussion..Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Hendrickson
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Freight Car Statistics



On Jan 26, 2011, at 8:09 AM, A. Premo wrote:

> David,Going even further using this data one can come up with the %
> of each car type in relation to the total car fleet of a given
> period (year).After perusing the information tank cars represent a
> minuscule percentage of the total car fleet.Armand Premo

Yes but, once again, Armand, one has to think in terms of the region
being modeled. Tank cars were all over the place in the oil-
producing and oil consuming regions of the southwest and far west,
much less so where coal was the major industrial and heating fuel.
In addition, western railroads like the SP and Santa Fe had
substantial fleets of tank cars in mostly captive service hauling
locomotive fuel.

Richard Hendrickson








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Re: New GATC Tank Car from Sunshine at Timonium

pennsylvania1954
 

Richard--I have appreciated all of your past articles. You have my sincere thanks.

The niche mags are indeed gone, so how about something different: Model Railroad Hobbyist http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/. They are now monthly. As a happy reader, I am unaware of anything preventing its becoming the new "magazine home" of our favorite prototypes.

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

On Jan 26, 2011, at 7:06 AM, Tom Birkett wrote:

Is there prototype information available on this model also?
Tom, Bartlesville
Lots of information exists, Tom, otherwise we wouldn't have the
models. But hardly any of it has been published. I scanned numerous
photos for Frank Hodina's use in developing the masters, and I'm sure
others on this list also contributed. I could write an article on
the subject, but with the loss of the "niche" magazines, there's now
no place to publish it.

Richard Hendrickson



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Freight Car Statistics (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

And there were boatloads of tank cars around the major chemical producers and
petro-chemical user areas, such as portions of Ohio, Pennsylvania, Louisiana,
and such, and which also then differed from the more "common" oil-producer
fleets. With all the small gasoline distributors, and later LPG wheelers in
the mid-west and west, it would be hard to imagine a layout on which tank
cars were not in evidence.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Richard Hendrickson
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 11:50 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Freight Car Statistics



On Jan 26, 2011, at 8:09 AM, A. Premo wrote:

David,Going even further using this data one can come up with the % of
each car type in relation to the total car fleet of a given period
(year).After perusing the information tank cars represent a minuscule
percentage of the total car fleet.Armand Premo
Yes but, once again, Armand, one has to think in terms of the region being
modeled. Tank cars were all over the place in the oil- producing and oil
consuming regions of the southwest and far west, much less so where coal was
the major industrial and heating fuel.
In addition, western railroads like the SP and Santa Fe had substantial
fleets of tank cars in mostly captive service hauling locomotive fuel.

Richard Hendrickson

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: New GATC Tank Car from Sunshine at Timonium

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jan 26, 2011, at 7:06 AM, Tom Birkett wrote:

Is there prototype information available on this model also?
Tom, Bartlesville
Lots of information exists, Tom, otherwise we wouldn't have the
models. But hardly any of it has been published. I scanned numerous
photos for Frank Hodina's use in developing the masters, and I'm sure
others on this list also contributed. I could write an article on
the subject, but with the loss of the "niche" magazines, there's now
no place to publish it.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Freight Car Statistics

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jan 26, 2011, at 8:09 AM, A. Premo wrote:

David,Going even further using this data one can come up with the %
of each car type in relation to the total car fleet of a given
period (year).After perusing the information tank cars represent a
minuscule percentage of the total car fleet.Armand Premo
Yes but, once again, Armand, one has to think in terms of the region
being modeled. Tank cars were all over the place in the oil-
producing and oil consuming regions of the southwest and far west,
much less so where coal was the major industrial and heating fuel.
In addition, western railroads like the SP and Santa Fe had
substantial fleets of tank cars in mostly captive service hauling
locomotive fuel.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Forgotten Accurail Great Northern 2 Bay Canton Hopper

David
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "soolinehistory" <destorzek@...> wrote:
I always suspected that while the Virginian had cars built by the elusive Canton Car Co., they were just regular looking USRA clones, and thus didn't stand out in photos.
They were rebuilt with ordinary 7-post sides in (1943, off the top of my head).

The Canton Car Co. is even harder to find info on that Siems-Stembel of St. Paul. At least that company eventually became part of Standard Car Co, and thence Pullman-Standard.
John Corns' second W&LE book has a few pages on Canton. Started out in a W&LE shop in 1927, was folded up into the SSC side of P-S by 1934 and closed down in 1937.

David Thompson


Re: Freight Car Statistics

A. Premo <armprem2@...>
 

David,Going even further using this data one can come up with the % of each car type in relation to the total car fleet of a given period (year).After perusing the information tank cars represent a minuscule percentage of the total car fleet.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Evans
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 10:45 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Freight Car Statistics



--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Aley, Jeff A" <Jeff.A.Aley@...> wrote:
>
> Very interesting! Does anybody have easy access to the same data (in Railway Age) for, say '52 or '53? The '47 data is a bit too close to The War for my use. If someone can send me a scan, I'll be happy to do the typing.
>
> It is interesting to note that, for the '47 data, 59% of the box cars were built between 1917 and 1931. To me, that implies that most of that 59% are wood-sheathed.
>
> Regards,
>
> -Jeff
>
Jeff,

Several years ago I did an analysis of the '43 ORER (granted a little early for your use) for all X cars (I combined XM, XA, and others - newbie mistake). In '43 the ORER indicated wood or steal sheathed for nearly all roads. I came up with 56% wood sheathed, 44% steel for the North American fleet. Note that CP and CN were nearly 12% of that fleet, and they were a little over 90% wood sheathed. If you remove PRR, NYC, and B&O from the NA count (the three biggest eastern roads, which had transitioned heavily to steel sheathed cars) and CP and CN (because people believe those cars did not wonder south that often), the remaining roads were 63% wood sheathed and 37% steel - almost 2:1 wood sheathed.

Of the top 20 X car fleets in NA, only PRR, NYC, and B&O show a majority steel sheathed fleet (and each by a large margin - combined the three roads were over 85% steel sheathed). SP and IC were about a 50-50 split. Most of the other top 20 road's wood cars outnumbered their steel cars by 2 to 1, so it wasn't just the smaller, perhaps more resource constrained roads that lacked steel X cars.

It is also important to note that North American sub-40' cars (mostly 36' cars) outnumbered 50 footers by over 2:1, and taking even CP and CN out of the mix, US 36' cars still outnumbered 50' cars (70k vs. 45k). Southern had more 36' cars (~13,650) than all but the largest 21 railroad's X-car fleets (C&O was number 22, with ~12,700 X cars of all lengths and types). You can never have enough Southern 36' XM cars if you model through WWII. For reasons that escape me, that remains a resin only option.

Dave Evans






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Re: Freight Car Statistics

devansprr
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Aley, Jeff A" <Jeff.A.Aley@...> wrote:

Very interesting! Does anybody have easy access to the same data (in Railway Age) for, say '52 or '53? The '47 data is a bit too close to The War for my use. If someone can send me a scan, I'll be happy to do the typing.

It is interesting to note that, for the '47 data, 59% of the box cars were built between 1917 and 1931. To me, that implies that most of that 59% are wood-sheathed.

Regards,

-Jeff
Jeff,

Several years ago I did an analysis of the '43 ORER (granted a little early for your use) for all X cars (I combined XM, XA, and others - newbie mistake). In '43 the ORER indicated wood or steal sheathed for nearly all roads. I came up with 56% wood sheathed, 44% steel for the North American fleet. Note that CP and CN were nearly 12% of that fleet, and they were a little over 90% wood sheathed. If you remove PRR, NYC, and B&O from the NA count (the three biggest eastern roads, which had transitioned heavily to steel sheathed cars) and CP and CN (because people believe those cars did not wonder south that often), the remaining roads were 63% wood sheathed and 37% steel - almost 2:1 wood sheathed.

Of the top 20 X car fleets in NA, only PRR, NYC, and B&O show a majority steel sheathed fleet (and each by a large margin - combined the three roads were over 85% steel sheathed). SP and IC were about a 50-50 split. Most of the other top 20 road's wood cars outnumbered their steel cars by 2 to 1, so it wasn't just the smaller, perhaps more resource constrained roads that lacked steel X cars.

It is also important to note that North American sub-40' cars (mostly 36' cars) outnumbered 50 footers by over 2:1, and taking even CP and CN out of the mix, US 36' cars still outnumbered 50' cars (70k vs. 45k). Southern had more 36' cars (~13,650) than all but the largest 21 railroad's X-car fleets (C&O was number 22, with ~12,700 X cars of all lengths and types). You can never have enough Southern 36' XM cars if you model through WWII. For reasons that escape me, that remains a resin only option.

Dave Evans


Re: New GATC Tank Car from Sunshine at Timonium

Thomas Birkett
 

Is there prototype information available on this model also?
Tom, Bartlesville

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Steve Hoxie
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 9:03 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] New GATC Tank Car from Sunshine at Timonium




List--In msg #96716 Tom Madden provided a link to a great photo of this
new model to be released at Timonium next weekend. Thanks, Tom.

Can anyone close to Sunshine provide any info about which stock numbers
go with which roadname/lessor? I have a friend who will undertake the
mission of getting me a couple, but it would be very helpful to give him
all the info I can.

Thanks!

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL


New GATC Tank Car from Sunshine at Timonium

pennsylvania1954
 

List--In msg #96716 Tom Madden provided a link to a great photo of this new model to be released at Timonium next weekend. Thanks, Tom.

Can anyone close to Sunshine provide any info about which stock numbers go with which roadname/lessor? I have a friend who will undertake the mission of getting me a couple, but it would be very helpful to give him all the info I can.

Thanks!

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL


Re: information related to meat shipping

Clark Propst
 

Anyone see the "Dirty Jobs" show where they were at a tanning factory?

Clark Propst

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Schuyler Larrabee" <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:

http://lists.railfan.net/listthumb.cgi?erielack-01-25-11

The last three thumbnails on this page are about tanning leather. This
tannery was served by the ERIE.

SGL





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information related to meat shipping

Schuyler Larrabee
 

http://lists.railfan.net/listthumb.cgi?erielack-01-25-11

The last three thumbnails on this page are about tanning leather. This
tannery was served by the ERIE.

SGL





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Campville NY - Foreclosure is not new - 1885

Schuyler Larrabee
 

http://lists.railfan.net/erielackphoto.cgi?erielack-01-25-11/Campville-Alb_E
ve_Jnl_5-25-1885.jpg

This list discusses the movement of beef from time to time, and this
clipping from 1885 indicates the "collateral damage" that the transition
from beef on the hoof to processed beef in reefers had on properties along
the railroad.

SGL





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Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car

Brian Paul Ehni <behni@...>
 

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Souse! See it and pass on it every time I go by the
lunchmeat counter at the local grocer. It may be a Southern thingŠ

--
Thanks!

Brian Paul Ehni



From: <SUVCWORR@aol.com>
Reply-To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 22:50:16 -0500
To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car



The Armour plant that was in Pittsburgh used every part of every hog
either on site or shipped off-site for processing. You really don't want
to know what goes into some luncheon meats. Same was true for beef, lamb,
veal.

Rich Orr


Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car

SUVCWORR@...
 

The Armour plant that was in Pittsburgh used every part of every hog either on site or shipped off-site for processing. You really don't want to know what goes into some luncheon meats. Same was true for beef, lamb, veal.

Rich Orr

-----Original Message-----
From: tyesac@aol.com
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2011 7:54 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car




Wouldn't they also be producing sacks of dried bone meal as well, or is that

only a beef by-product?



Tom Casey





Clark,



Don't forget the hides. You need to ship those off for processing into leather.

Even hog hides. Also the hair was used in a number of produces ranging from

brushes to fly tying material.



Rich Orr



-----Original Message-----

From: cepropst@q.com

To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2011 12:10 pm

Subject: [STMFC] Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car



Thanks Tom, the plant I model also shipped lard, grease and hog water.



It's my understanding that Armour leased their cars from GATC.



Clark Propst

















-----Original Message-----

From: SUVCWORR <SUVCWORR@aol.com>

To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>

Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2011 4:51 pm

Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car









Clark,



Don't forget the hides. You need to ship those off for processing into leather.

Even hog hides. Also the hair was used in a number of produces ranging from

brushes to fly tying material.



Rich Orr



-----Original Message-----

From: cepropst@q.com

To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2011 12:10 pm

Subject: [STMFC] Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car



Thanks Tom, the plant I model also shipped lard, grease and hog water.



It's my understanding that Armour leased their cars from GATC.



Clark Propst



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Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car

SUVCWORR@...
 

I had no intention of implying that the hides were shipped in tank cars. Clark was listing the by-products of the hog packing plant and did not include hides and hair. Yes, those hides were shipped in very old useless for any other service boxcars.

Rich Orr

-----Original Message-----
From: Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2011 7:32 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Sunshine's new GATC tank car


RIch Orr wrote:
Don't forget the hides. You need to ship those off for processing
into leather. Even hog hides. Also the hair was used in a number
of produces ranging from brushes to fly tying material.


Clark Propst replied:

Yes, Rich, but that stuff went out in box cars.


Aw, c'mon, Clark. Why not ship hides in tank cars? And hair

would sure go IN all right. Reminds of the Larry Jackman story about

sending the tank car to Memphis, pretending it was a load of lumber.



Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA

2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com

(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com

Publishers of books on railroad history







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Hicks

David
 

Found this while I was looking for C&IM gons; one of the more obscure carbuilders.

http://www.midcontinent.org/rollingstock/builders/hicks_loco_freight.htm

David Thompson


Re: C&IM 7000 series Gons

David
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Jason Greene <jason.p.greene@...> wrote:

I am looking for pictures of these gons that were built in the 20s through the 40s as best I can tell.
350 cars 7000-7349 from Pullman in 8/27, 100 cars 7350-7449 from Pullman-Standard in 8/37, and 400 cars 7450-7849 from P-S in 5-9/48.

There were two photos of the first order in the 1931 CBC, reprinted in Train Shed Cyclopedia #46.

David Thompson


Re: C&IM 7000 series Gons

al_brown03
 

A builder's photo of C&IM 7199 appears in TS CYC 5 (from '40 CBC) p 225 (stencilled NEW 8-27) and TS CYC 46 (from '31 CBC) p 233, and a builder's photo of C&IM 7410 appears in TS CYC 70 (from '43 CBC) p 215 (NEW 8-37). At least six cars in series 7000-7999 are shown in Wallin, Stringham, and Szwajkart's C&IM book (pp 110, 154, 176, 207, 216).

-- hth --

-- Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Jason Greene <jason.p.greene@...> wrote:

Steam era freight car discussion group. The time period covered will be from 1900-1960.I am looking for pictures of these gons that were built in the 20s through the 40s as best I can tell. I am interested in these because it appears that Sloss-Sheffield Steel & Iron in Birmingham, AL bought some of these.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


C&IM 7000 series Gons

Jason Greene
 

Steam era freight car discussion group. The time period covered will be from 1900-1960.I am looking for pictures of these gons that were built in the 20s through the 40s as best I can tell. I am interested in these because it appears that Sloss-Sheffield Steel & Iron in Birmingham, AL bought some of these.

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