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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
C J Wyatt
Thanks Dave, I forgot about the potatoes. I believe Idaho had an early fallMost GN & NP potato loads originated in the Red River valley -- western Minnesota and eastern North Dakota. I think potatoes and apples could be stored for several months following the harvest. << The Idaho harvest was the first one I found data on. I realized that NP likely sourced more potatoes from other areas. I did not know about the Red River Valley, but after Tim's post I found a website on RRV potatoes. Most of their harvest occurs in September, and they are able to store potatoes up to ten months. I would guess in the past, they might not be able to store potatoes as long. However from Clark's post, their capabilities would be approaching at least a half year back then. Thanks everyone for your responses. I guess NP must have kept its fleet busy enough that they did not need reciprocal agreements with other refrigerator car operators to meet seasonal demands. Jack Wyatt
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Tim O'Connor <timoconnor@...>
Does Al sell the X25 ladders separately?
At 01:33 AM 7/7/2002, you wrote: Tom -I just finished one of these kits and for the most part the quality is Tim O'Connor <timoconnor@...> Sterling, Massachusetts
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Tim O'Connor <timoconnor@...>
Thanks Dave, I forgot about the potatoes. I believe Idaho had an early fallMost GN & NP potato loads originated in the Red River valley -- western Minnesota and eastern North Dakota. I think potatoes and apples could be stored for several months following the harvest. Tim O'Connor <timoconnor@...> Sterling, Massachusetts
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Re: Branchline 40' AAR boxcar Review
Tim O'Connor <timoconnor@...>
Dave Nelson wrote
The instructions recommend doing the underframe first...Ah, that was your first mistake! ;o) I almost never look at instructions anymore for plastic box cars. Assembly of such cars is pretty obvious if you've built 50 or more of them. Anyway, one thing I do is desprue everything, examine all of the parts, test fit the major stuff, and throw out any poorly rendered or incorrect parts. Test fitting immediately reveals the problems with the ends. I insert a small 3-sided file and turn it once or twice in each hole. Voila, perfect fit. The underframe did not lie quite flat -- it seemed to have a slight bow. Length problem. So I turned the file again in the bolster holes creating a little slop in the fit -- Voila once more. For smaller holes, I have a full set of reamers. For larger holes I usually use files rather than drills, unless the hole is visible on the completed model. I agree that Branchline's plastic formula is somewhat soft and crumbly. I pointed this out to Bill a couple of years ago after assembling my first 50 foot car. The small parts as a result do require extra care in handling. I'm doing a couple of Southern Railway 40 foot cars now. The kit has all the right parts except the running board, which needs to be Morton, and the handbrake, which was Universal. I will install Accumate scale draft gear, as is my wont these days. Before fixing the gear in place, I assemble them and use a tacky glue to affix them to the body so I can test fit the coupler height. If necessary, I can then shim or file as needed before "permanent" attachment (i.e. drilling holes in the case of the Accumates as the draft gear are made from a slippery plastic and do not glue.) Tim O'Connor <timoconnor@...> Sterling, Massachusetts
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Greg Martin
Jeeze I almost forgot the cheese... The world famous Tillamook Cheese... 3^)
Greg Martin Pac Nor Westerner
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Greg Martin
Jack,
Ah yes let's not forget that beer... Olympia "It's the Water and a Lot More..." My first beer at the ripe age of ahhh, well ahhh... Just remember it the Water! Then if you consider the other fruits that are harvested in Eastern Washington, Pears, Peaches, and the sort and of course their harvest is slightly later than other more Southern States. And let's not forget those short seasoned WALLA WALLA Sweet Onions...mmmm. just da best Ma! Greg Martin Pac Nor Westerner
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Bert Decker
Clark,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Returning empty beer bottles would not be so unusual in an era of 2 cent and nickel deposits for soda bottles - many is the sherbet I bought with those returns. Bert
----- Original Message -----
From: Clark Propst <cepropst@...> To: <STMFC@...> Sent: Sunday, July 07, 2002 9:09 AM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer Jack,beer is from the Twin Cities and wouldn't have traveled to the southeast. Ofinterest here in that the distributor would collect empty bottles and return themin the car they unloaded.to beenask about the NP reefer operations. Since the subject of the kits has question.brought up, I guess this is as good of a time as ever to ask my Burlington thatRefrigerator Express, were affiliated with Fruit Growers Express, so refrigeratorthe combined fleets could meet the seasonal needs across the larger would becars. Everyone knows about Washington State apples, which I believe makeharvested in late summer and early fall. What would be some of the other modelingits reefers available to other railroads in the off-seasons? showsituation, would there be much of a chance that one of these cars would http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/up in the Southeast, say March/April 1947?
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Re: PRR Merchandise Service Boxcars
Greg Martin
Ben Hom (b.hom@...) writes:
<< We do need to find a better DSMS boxcar shot though - the one of PRR 24168 with the pigeon colony on top of it doesn't make it look like the car utilization campaign was too successful! ;-) Ben Hom >> Your absolutely correct! Perhaps it was a border town where not much English was spoken or maybe the locals just can't read plain English... 3^) Greg Martin
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Clark Propst <cepropst@...>
Jack,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
These cars are from the M&StL Fairfax MN agents records. I assume this beer is from the Twin Cities and wouldn't have traveled to the southeast. Of interest here in that the distributor would collect empty bottles and return them in the car they unloaded. Clark PS the date is either 47 or 48 NP 90168 BEER RS 91000-91249 NP 90168 EMPTIES RS 91000-91249 NP 90454 BEER RS 91000-91249 NP 90454 EMPTIES RS 91000-91249 NP 92154 BEER RS 92038-92941 NP 92732 BEER RS 92038-92941 NP 92732 EMPTIES RS 92038-92941 Jack Wyatt wrote:
Ever since the NP reefer kits by Norwest came out, I've been intending to
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Clark Propst <cepropst@...>
Jack,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Here are some actual cars from the M&StL setout list from your era. the cars with spuds were on bridge route trains heading east. These all appear to be wooden cars. Clark NP 90015 90000-90799 RS Stl Unde 8/2/50 empty refrg. NP 90575 90000-90799 RS Stl Unde 7/23/50 beer NP 92574 92000-92950 RS Stl Unde 2/9/50 spuds NP 92787 92000-92950 RS Stl Unde 2/7/50 spuds NP 94784 94400-94920 RS Stl Unde 2/15/50 spuds Jack Wyatt wrote:
Ever since the NP reefer kits by Norwest came out, I've been intending to
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Re: Early 50' Cars
centga@...
John, this bring up another question that I have. How do you find out what
style corner post the Central's 37' AAR cars had? Most of what I heard says that they were of the "W" style, can anyone confirm this? I'm interested in the door and a half's and the single door cars. TIA, Todd Horton
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PSC Co. Bldrs. Photos
CBarkan@...
Todd,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Several of us have asked this question over the years. I am not aware of a coherent, identifiable collection from PSC. However, some individual photos have turned up. Byron Rose may know the status best, as might Al Westerfield, on this list. Chris
In a message dated 7/7/02 8:05:20 PM, centga@... writes:
On another subject,
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Re: More Central of GA Box Car Questions
Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton <aidrian.bridgeman-sutton@...>
~From: John Golden [mailto:golden1014@...]
~Did Central of GA have any USRA single sheathed box ~cars? AS Richard has pointed out, they didn't. They did however have some clones of the USRA gondolas and USRA hoppers built in the twenties. The gons were rebuilt at some time as low sided gons with steel replacing wood and saw MoW service until the NS era. There's very little info available on pre-war CofG boxcars, though perhaps the CGHS book of stencilling diagrams might have more info. They did have a series of ventilators which were drawn and photographed for the '31 CBC which saw service until after WW2. I suspect from a couple of fuzzy long distance photos that at least some of these might have had the ventilator doors removed at some time. I haven't yet checked the drawings against the Westerfield ACL ventilator cars, but these CofG cars might be a feasible kitbash from this kit. Aidrian --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.373 / Virus Database: 208 - Release Date: 01/07/2002
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Re: More Central of GA Box Car Questions
centga@...
In a message dated 7/7/02 4:10:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
aidrian.bridgeman-sutton@... writes: Aidrian, the CGRHS now has a 1931 freight car book available the has information available for cars built as early as 1903. On another subject, any know if the builders photo's for Pressed Steel Car Company exist? The Central had some open hoppers from them. Todd Horton
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Richard Hendrickson
Jack Wyatt ask, about NP reefer traffic:
Everyone knows about Washington State apples, which I believe would beThe territory NP served generated a lot of other tree fruit as well, which matured at various seasons. And NP handled a lot of potatoes as well. Also fish, though once cars were in fish service they couldn't be used for anything else. In short, NP reefer traffic was reasonably substantial year around, though it probably went pretty slack in midwinter. Remember that many apples went into cold storage and were shipped at other times than the harvest season. Besides being interested in the general knowledge, for my specific modelingOthers have commented on the fact that NP cars turned up just about everywhere. If you want to model an NP reefer in the southeast in early spring of 1947, I don't think anyone can argue that it was implausible. Richard H. Hendrickson Ashland, Oregon 97520
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
thompson@...
Thanks Dave, I forgot about the potatoes. I believe Idaho had an early fallYou will find that the UP carried as many carloads of potatoes as did the GN, as they served the part of southern Idaho where the bulk of them are grown. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 http://www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroads and on Western history
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Re: 1942 ORER
thompson@...
Tim Gilbert writes:
Thanks for the info. I have long suspected that the standardization ofActually, as someone else pointed out, it was a 17-column format, and B&M was the same as everyone else in the 1912 ORER I have. (One of the columns added later was for the MCB/ARA/AAR car classification.) I'm not sure why the Safety Act of 1911 would have necessitated more columns of information in the ORER. Can you enlighten me? Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 http://www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroads and on Western history
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
C J Wyatt
Washington state originated over 86% of the rail shipped apples in 1950.A couple of years later in 1956 (this is data I have here by the PC, the1950 data is filed someplace else in the house, but I expect the traffic typesand ratios to remain the same), the GN originating 3 times the number ofcarloads than the NP did (it was GN ~12000 carloadings vs. NP ~ 4000). For the NPsmall pototoes in comparison to, well, potatoes, of which the NP moved >11000over 25000 carloads of potatoes. Whether they moved the potatoes in reefers ornot is something I can't tell. Lading weight for both apples and potatoes wasa touch more than 20 tons/car.Thanks Dave, I forgot about the potatoes. I believe Idaho had an early fall harvest, but there may have been some capability to store the potatoes. That is interesting about the bananas. I'm guessing that each part of the hinterland would have been supplied through a particular port, so the NP probably got the business for the Pacific Northwest. I'm assuming that the bananas are a year round crop. Does anyone know if I'm wrong on that? If they are a year round crop, that would keep a portion of the NP reefers tied up with the banana trade. Jack Wyatt
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
Dave & Libby Nelson <muskoka@...>
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
-----Original Message----- Great Northern, through Western Fruit Express, and CB&Q, through BurlingtonWashington state originated over 86% of the rail shipped apples in 1950. A couple of years later in 1956 (this is data I have here by the PC, the 1950 data is filed someplace else in the house, but I expect the traffic types and ratios to remain the same), the GN originating 3 times the number of carloads than the NP did (it was GN ~12000 carloadings vs. NP ~ 4000). For the NP (1956 data again) what's interesting is they moved >5500 carloadings of bannanas, most of which they originated. At any rate, these numbers are small pototoes in comparison to, well, potatoes, of which the NP moved >11000 carloads, most originated. Over on the GN, no bannanas to speak of but over 25000 carloads of potatoes. Whether they moved the potatoes in reefers or not is something I can't tell. Lading weight for both apples and potatoes was a touch more than 20 tons/car. Both roads moved ~2000 carloads of misc. veggies and a lot less of any one other thing. For both the GN and NP there's no specific data I have that indicates where on their route they picked up the spuds but on a state-by-state basis of rail shipped spuds, the numbers for 1950 were MN: 280k tons, ND: 258k tons, and WA: 159k tons (I assume Idaho doesn't count given the route used). Dave Nelson
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Re: Norwest Kits & Castings NP reefer
C J Wyatt
Ever since the NP reefer kits by Norwest came out, I've been intending to
ask about the NP reefer operations. Since the subject of the kits has been brought up, I guess this is as good of a time as ever to ask my question. Great Northern, through Western Fruit Express, and CB&Q, through Burlington Refrigerator Express, were affiliated with Fruit Growers Express, so that the combined fleets could meet the seasonal needs across the larger territories served. Yet another Hill line, the NP, ran its own refrigerator cars. Everyone knows about Washington State apples, which I believe would be harvested in late summer and early fall. What would be some of the other crops and their seasons that would be handled by NP refeers? Did the NP make its reefers available to other railroads in the off-seasons? Besides being interested in the general knowledge, for my specific modeling situation, would there be much of a chance that one of these cars would show up in the Southeast, say March/April 1947? Thanks for any thoughts on this. Jack Wyatt
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