Date   

Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Jerry Beach
 

This shows a couple boxcars with galvanized roofs.   I cropped this from a Jack Delano photo taken at the CMStP&P yard in Bensenville, IL ca 1943.  I hope this helps. 


BL Santa Fe Fe-28 1) is it accurate and 2) are there decals available?

Charlie Duckworth
 

Decided to build an ATSF Branchline 50’ Fe-28 that’s in yhe ‘to do’ shelf. The lightweight is shown an ‘new 1951’. While the lettering is nice it’s not very opaque and if there’s a decal set available I’ll repaint and decal it.  I tried accessing the RMJ article  that’s online covering these models but getting an error message.  

Is the BL 50’ DD boxcar accurate for the Fe-28 class?
If it is does anyone make a decal set for the Fe-28 in our era?  Thanks 


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Tim O'Connor
 


!!! :-D



On 9/11/2022 7:54 AM, Charlie Duckworth via groups.io wrote:

When I was painting one of my Eagle Merchandise boxcars I was referencing the MP’s painting diagram. The 1951 notes indicated that the roof was to be unpainted and the seam caps were to be painted Eagle gray. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Charlie Duckworth
 

When I was painting one of my Eagle Merchandise boxcars I was referencing the MP’s painting diagram. The 1951 notes indicated that the roof was to be unpainted and the seam caps were to be painted Eagle gray. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sat, Sep 10, 2022 at 05:25 PM, Philip Dove wrote:
Why did the Railroads bother trying to paint roofs that wouldn't take paint? If l had worked for Hutchins l would have made the saving on paint and labour a selling point. 
The problem was, at least with Murphy panel roofs, the seam caps had exposed rivets that would rust, since the head formed after installation would not be galvanized. This is what led to some roads specifying either paint or car cement over the seam caps only, but paint over the whole roof was likely just as fast to apply, and stuck to the areas that lacked galvanizing. At least the new cars looked spiffy until they got dirty, then the paint started blowing off, but not very visible from the ground.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Philip Dove
 

Galvanizers Don, t expect you to paint their coating. The galvanising is sufficient. When l sold paints in the UK in the late70s and early 80s. Getting paint to stick on new galvanising was. Problematic some companies made galvanising primer. My company sold their own products and 1 major brand. We recommended using zinc chromate primer a mildly etching primer, natural colour yellow. Then our oil based Gloss enamel, but we said that the best thing to do was, wait till the galvanised surface changed from Bright silver to matt grey to have much chance of success, Even the technical data sheets suggested waiting before trying to get paint to stick on galvanised metal rather than go straight into using galvanising etch primers. An alternative was to use acid washes but this trashed the galvanised coating. My Dad ignored my advice and slapped a couple of coats of green oil based paint on a still silver galvanised door. A year later less than one percent had blistered. Underneath it was still bright silver.
Why did the Railroads bother trying to paint roofs that wouldn't take paint? If l had worked for Hutchins l would have made the saving on paint and labour a selling point. 


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Tony Thompson
 

Nelson Moyer wrote:

I see your point, but these are much newer cars, and are those roofs really galvanized? I would think metallography would improve from early galvanized roofs to a more recent time. I’m thinking of the old galvanized wash tubs I’ve seen, and the one I have. I don’t dates for the FRISCO cars, or the photo date, so no way to tell how old these roofs are.

Nelson, you are of course right that metallurgy has progressed over the decades, but galvanized still means zinc coated. What’s improved is paint formulations to “stick” to galvanized. Sometimes inferior paint, or inferior practice of painting, led to one set of roofs showing far more paint failure than another set of the same vintage. I think age isn’t a complete guided to paint failure.

Tony Thompson




Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Nelson Moyer
 

I see your point, but these are much newer cars, and are those roofs really galvanized? I would think metallography would improve from early galvanized roofs to a more recent time. I’m thinking of the old galvanized wash tubs I’ve seen, and the one I have. I don’t dates for the FRISCO cars, or the photo date, so no way to tell how old these roofs are.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charlie Duckworth via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2022 1:46 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

 

[Edited Message Follows]

Nelson
Here’s the two photo I used as reference so I didn’t over do the flaking.  The lighter, galvanized areas seem the have the same color but I agree it would seem some areas would age but I don’t see it on these images.  
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Charlie Duckworth
 
Edited

Nelson
Here’s the two photo I used as reference so I didn’t over do the flaking.  The lighter, galvanized areas seem the have the same color but I agree it would seem some areas would age but I don’t see it on these images.  
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Western Maryland hoppers-a Question

David
 

I think both cases converge on a middle color, i.e weathered rust. There may also be some variations depending on the base colors, and the number and type of paint layers.

David Thompson


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Nelson Moyer
 

Charlie, as I’ve said, I really like your approach to weathering. I’m trying to work up the nerve to start weathering my fleet, but starting on some plastic cars to work out techniques. Roof paint failure is perhaps the most difficult part to get right, largely because there are few color photos to work from for the Hutchins and early Murphy roofs. Galvanized steel is difficult to model well. I’d like to know more about where and how paint fails on individual cars. With the early galvanized roofs, does it chip and flake or peel off in patches and sheets? B&W photos I’ve seen show most of the panels bare metal, but I can’t tell if that’s paint failure of just an unpainted roof with painted seam caps. It seems like paint fade would occur over time, so that some sections would look like unoxidized metal, while others would be darker from oxidation.

 

Your basic galvanizing method is good, but there’s a uniformity as all the patches of paint failure are the same color, implying they all happened at once. The ‘grayness’ of the patches is quite light, perhaps a function of lighting for photography, but it seems to me that it should be a little darker and perhaps a little more metallic, and there should be some variation between patches, maybe smaller  ones lighter than the larger patches.

 

All this is speculation as I try to figure out how I should proceed, and I’m relying heavily upon paint fade pioneers like you and other who have been experimenting with galvanized steel effects. I’d like to see a robust discussion of techniques, supported by photos, with the goal of enhancing the realism of weathered galvanized freight car roofs.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charlie Duckworth via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2022 6:54 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

 

Been exchanging emails with Ed Hawkins on the early use of galvanized roofs and the Hutchins DryLading steel roof and one called the Universal Type Hutchins roof used 1/16” steel galvanized panels.  Paint doesn’t adhere to galvanized steel so here’s my paint failure on the L&A Sunshine kit using water based oils.  I like to use these paints as they dry slowly allowing me to lightly dry brush over them - something you can’t easily do with enamels or acrylics.  

Mopac was a large owner of the Howe Truss design and Ive probably built 5-6 of Martin’s kits since he first released them.  I’m pleased with the weathered boards on the sides and just used the technique on an NOT&M boxcar I’m building.  

 

--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

O Fenton Wells
 

Thanks Charlie, Water based oils, I'll take a look.  Haven't tried them. I have regular artist oils and wanted to buy some non-smelling turpentine.  I'll look for waterbased oils
Thanks
Fenton

On Sat, Sep 10, 2022 at 8:30 AM Charlie Duckworth via groups.io <Worth51=duck.com@groups.io> wrote:
Fenton
The water based oils dry a little faster than the traditional oils do but will still take a few days.  After they dry I airbrush a light coat of Dullcote to seal them.  The NOT&M car has all the paint worn off and with the oils it easy to vary the colors on each panel. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Paul Doggett
 

Charlie 

Another great looking car 

Paul Doggett


On 10 Sep 2022, at 13:31, Charlie Duckworth via groups.io <Worth51@...> wrote:



[Edited Message Follows]

Fenton
The water based oils dry a little faster than the traditional oils do but will still take a few days.  After they dry I airbrush a light coat of Dullcote to seal them.  The NOT&M car I’m currently working on has all the paint worn off and with the oils it easy to vary the colors on each panel. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Charlie Duckworth
 
Edited

Fenton
The water based oils dry a little faster than the traditional oils do but will still take a few days.  After they dry I airbrush a light coat of Dullcote to seal them.  The NOT&M car I’m currently working on has all the paint worn off and with the oils it easy to vary the colors on each panel. 
--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Re: Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

O Fenton Wells
 

The roof looks good, I haven't tired oils but should as the results you have are quite nice
Fenton

On Sat, Sep 10, 2022 at 7:54 AM Charlie Duckworth via groups.io <Worth51=duck.com@groups.io> wrote:

Been exchanging emails with Ed Hawkins on the early use of galvanized roofs and the Hutchins DryLading steel roof and one called the Universal Type Hutchins roof used 1/16” steel galvanized panels.  Paint doesn’t adhere to galvanized steel so here’s my paint failure on the L&A Sunshine kit using water based oils.  I like to use these paints as they dry slowly allowing me to lightly dry brush over them - something you can’t easily do with enamels or acrylics.  

Mopac was a large owner of the Howe Truss design and Ive probably built 5-6 of Martin’s kits since he first released them.  I’m pleased with the weathered boards on the sides and just used the technique on an NOT&M boxcar I’m building.  

 

--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Sunshine Models Louisiana & Arkansas Howe Truss Boxcar

Charlie Duckworth
 

Been exchanging emails with Ed Hawkins on the early use of galvanized roofs and the Hutchins DryLading steel roof and one called the Universal Type Hutchins roof used 1/16” steel galvanized panels.  Paint doesn’t adhere to galvanized steel so here’s my paint failure on the L&A Sunshine kit using water based oils.  I like to use these paints as they dry slowly allowing me to lightly dry brush over them - something you can’t easily do with enamels or acrylics.  

Mopac was a large owner of the Howe Truss design and Ive probably built 5-6 of Martin’s kits since he first released them.  I’m pleased with the weathered boards on the sides and just used the technique on an NOT&M boxcar I’m building.  

 

--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


WESTERFIELD MODELS Newsletter, Vol 11, No 3, SEPT, 2022

dahminator68
 

Hello Steam Era Modeler:
 
We are pleased to announce that Westerfield Models is releasing an older Kit Series that has been out of production for a while and some new detail parts.

The #11000 Series Kit:  GKa/GKb 46 FT Battleship Gondola for N&W is now available again. 
The Kit body has been rebuilt with One-Piece body including frame.  The first high capacity gondola, N&W built 750 GKa cars numbered 100000-100749 in 1914 for use at its new Lamberts Point rotary dumper. The cars were successful and in 1916 and additional 1,000 cars of class GKb numbered 100750-101749 were built.  Pilcher Trucks available from Labelle Models.  Decal Set Available.
Recommended Trucks: Pilcher 6 Wheel Trucks - Available only from Labelle Models #HO-528 (Labellemodels.com)
 
Our Kit cover all variations and lettering styles for the life of these cars.                                        
Operating Era:   1914 - 1930
      
AVAILABLE NOW.  Listed in Our Secure Model Store under "GONDOLAS".

KIT NUMBER:
11001      GKa/GKb 46 Ft Battleship Gondola, N&W                         $46

Now also available are our new Detail Parts:

Our newest HO release is Etched Metal Ladders for Pennsylvania RR X23 SS Boxcars and R7 Refrigerator Cars.  These etched brass parts will allow the modeler to accurately replicate the metal ladders on these PRR cars.  The ladders are available in a five rung version and a six rung version that modern FGEX and NX R7 reefers used.  The assembly of the ladders is very simple, requiring the bending of the ladder side stiles, placing in the included assembly tool and securing the rungs with ACC.  Detailed instructions with photos are included.

All of our PRR X23 Boxcars and R7 Refrigerator cars now come with these etched metal ladders. In addition, we offer  separately, three sets of the Etched Metal ladders in our Detail Parts section of our Website Secure Model Store.  Please see listings below.

AVAILABLE NOW.  Listed in Our Secure Model Store under "DETAIL PARTS".

Detail Part #10075:    PRR X23 Five Rung Etched Metal Ladder Set, Includes 4 Sets Ladders, Rungs, Tool & Instructions, for Kits #10001-10059, #10061-10062 (Requires 2 Sets), #11601-11653, 11663-11664.                                         $10 
                     
Detail Part #11675:    PRR R7 Five and Six Rung Etched Metal Ladder Set, Includes 2 Sets 5 Rung and 2 Sets 6 Rung Ladders, Rungs, Tool & Instructions, for Kits #11661, FGEX-11662, NX.                                                                             $12

Detail Part #11690:    PRR R7 Six Rung Etched Metal Ladder Set, Includes 2 Sets Ladders, Rungs, Tool & Instructions, for Kits #11661-11662 or any FGEX wood sided Reefer in the 1940-50's era                                                                 $8

All of our items available directly from:
WESTERFIELD MODELS LLC, 1964 LACEY COURT, GARDNERVILLE, NV 89410
EMAIL:       westerfieldmodels @gmail.com
PHONE :     303-658-9343
 
When ordering, please indicate your payment method in the Order Comment Section.
Please note:  Shipping is not included in the item prices.

All of our Kits are available at our secure website: westerfieldmodels.com




Westerfield Kits include new HO scale unpainted urethane castings, and are complete with quality details, detailed instruction/history sheets
and proprietary decals covering all versions of the prototype car.   Trucks and couplers are not included but are available - See below.

We are almost out of the older brown Kit boxes but have found that there are 74 extra box tops.
These are available for $.75 each.
Send us an email if interested - we can add some to any order.  Ships flat.

Our Newsletter is sent through our gmail account.  If you would like us to add or remove your email, simply email us at westerfieldmodels@... and we will be glad to make any changes for you.
Questions or Suggestions?  Feel free to email us at:  westerfieldmodels@....
 
Thank you,
Andrew Dahm
Westerfield Models, LLC
westerfieldmodels.com
westerfieldmodels@...
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Re: C&EI Box Cars

Tim O'Connor
 


oops sorry I meant that to only go to Lee...

On 9/9/2022 12:38 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:


A few photos from the collection :-)

On 9/7/2022 5:27 PM, Lee Gautreaux wrote:
I have been working with some folks at the C&EI Railroad Historical Society to document their freight car fleet.  I have been working on their 30' and 40' box cars and have made significant progress.  I am still missing some renumbering and builder/build date info on some groups of cars.  If anyone can provide any assistance with this effort to fill in some gaps, I would appreciate it.

     http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/other_cars/cei_cars/cei_type/box/cei_box.htm

Lee A. Gautreaux - the RailGoat
http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/

--
Tim O'Connor


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: C&EI Box Cars

Tim O'Connor
 


A few photos from the collection :-)

On 9/7/2022 5:27 PM, Lee Gautreaux wrote:

I have been working with some folks at the C&EI Railroad Historical Society to document their freight car fleet.  I have been working on their 30' and 40' box cars and have made significant progress.  I am still missing some renumbering and builder/build date info on some groups of cars.  If anyone can provide any assistance with this effort to fill in some gaps, I would appreciate it.

     http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/other_cars/cei_cars/cei_type/box/cei_box.htm

Lee A. Gautreaux - the RailGoat
http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Help identifying depressed center flat car

Alex Schneider
 

Thanks for the identification and the suggestions. Clearly the model prioritized fidelity to prototype over running qualities. If I leave the coupler box on I may impose restrictions on tight curves.

Alex Schneider

On Thu, Sep 8, 2022 at 10:13 PM, Hugh Guillaume via groups.io
<mguill1224@...> wrote:
Red Ball.  I would file away the pot metal to make room for a Kadee box.