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Re: PFE Reefer With White Line Stripe (?)
Jack Mullen
I think it's snow accumulated on the angle that secures the lower end of the sheathing. That "stripe" does look quite uniform, but the snow on the roof also looks pretty even and undisturbed, so I'd guess there was a light snowfall after the car was spotted.
Jack Mullen
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PFE Reefer With White Line Stripe (?)
thecitrusbelt@...
An undated photo from the Barringer Library:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/12331543144/in/photostream/
Use the arrows in the lower right corner to enlarge the image.
The location is identified as White River Junction on the Central Vermont mainline. Siding and tracks to right are Boston & Maine.
Notice what appears to be a white line along the bottom edge of the car. Is this just an accumulation of snow or did any PFE reefers receive such a white line stripe?
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA
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Another Three-Compartment Tank Car
thecitrusbelt@...
From the Barringer Library:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/12329407623/in/photostream/
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA
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Re: Rapido boxcar
Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
On 6/17/2017 10:14 AM, Brian LaManna
brianlamanna@... [STMFC] wrote:
NP boxcar is currently slotted for a Spring '18 delivery. Thanks, for some reason I had never looked at the delivery schedule. Probably because I didn't find it easily. I'm guessing they had a lot of rework to do.
I remember the maker seemed to think they didn't need wire
grabs, thought they could do it in plastic. -- Jon Miller For me time stopped in 1941 Digitrax Chief/Zephyr systems, SPROG, JMRI User NMRA Life member #2623 Member SFRH&MS
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Re: Rapido boxcar
Brian LaManna
List,
According to Rapido's delivery schedule, the NP boxcar is currently slotted for a Spring '18 delivery. They're currently at the second sample phase.
From: STMFC@... on behalf of Jon Miller atsfus@... [STMFC]
Sent: June 16, 2017 8:43:36 PM To: STMFC@... Subject: Re: [STMFC] Rapido boxcar On 6/16/2017 1:56 PM,
SUVCWORR@... [STMFC] wrote:
will break the 4 packs Rapido site seems to indicate the cars come individually if ordered that way? -- Jon Miller For me time stopped in 1941 Digitrax Chief/Zephyr systems, SPROG, JMRI User NMRA Life member #2623 Member SFRH&MS
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Re: Shippers Guides For Sale
Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
Friends,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
The referenced WP "shippers' guide" (CIRCULAR 167-E) is actually an internal document rather than the usual industrial directory. It probably was regularly updated with mimeographed inserts. The alleged 1957 version (based on what is missing after the early 1957 abandonment of the Oakland line) is the only one I have encountered. That said, it is filled with tons of useful information. Mine was copied from an original in the CSRM library, and cost me some $60. The listed price of the reprint is well worthwhile. Yours Aye, Garth Groff
On 6/16/17 7:39 PM, Ted Schnepf
railsunl@... [STMFC] wrote:
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Re: Rapido boxcar
Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
On 6/16/2017 1:56 PM,
SUVCWORR@... [STMFC] wrote:
will break the 4 packs Rapido site seems to indicate
the cars come individually if ordered that way? -- Jon Miller For me time stopped in 1941 Digitrax Chief/Zephyr systems, SPROG, JMRI User NMRA Life member #2623 Member SFRH&MS
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Shippers Guides For Sale
Ted Schnepf
Hello Everyone,
My website has been upgraded to show all the recent Shippers Guides that are available. The page is here: http://railsunlimited.ribbonrail.com/Books/shippers.html Recent additions are Pennsylvania RR, New York Central RR (including Pittsburgh and Lake Erie), Reading RR, New Haven, Western Pacific, Denver Rio Grande, and Icing Stations. There are also directories from Chicago Switching District, RI (2 ea), UP, C&EI, MP, Milw (2 each), GN and CNW. All are on hand an ready to ship. These shippers guides are very useful for historical research and for preparing accurate waybills for a model railroad. All have a comb binding, allowing them to lay flat when in use. I will have all these shippers guides with me at the St Louis RPM coming up in 7 days. See you there. Ted Rails Unlimited Ted Schnepf railsunl@... 847-697-5353 126 Will Scarlet Elgin, Ill. 60120 http://RailsUnlimited.ribbonrail.com/ Model Railroad Sales and Service with a personal touch. Books new and used. HO and O scales. DCC supplies. O scale urethane cars. Photos and darkroom services. Checks, cash (0%) or credit (secure server at web site 5% added).
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Re: Rapido boxcar
SUVCWORR@...
Still scheduled for 2017 delivery. Pre-production samples have been received http://rapidotrains.com/ho-np-boxcar/ The order deadline is still TBA. I am still accepting reservations and will break the 4 packs if I have sufficient reservations to make that feasible. Rich Orr
-----Original Message----- From: Jon Miller atsfus@... [STMFC] To: STMFC Sent: Fri, Jun 16, 2017 11:21 am Subject: [STMFC] Rapido boxcar Any word on the current
progress on the boxcar? -- Jon Miller For me time stopped in 1941 Digitrax Chief/Zephyr systems, SPROG, JMRI User NMRA Life member #2623 Member SFRH&MS
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Re: Hazmat Placards
Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
Hi everyone,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
The document referenced can be found at https://archive.org/details/regulationsfortr00unit Placards are shown on pages 76-79 Claus Schlund
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Parker spottab@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> To: <STMFC@...> Sent: Friday, June 16, 2017 7:15 AM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Hazmat Placards Rich: I have the same ICC publication as you. It includes a diagram of the early (earliest) INFLAMMABLE placard: that word in red, the rest in black, and on a diamond that is 10.75" on a side. It also include the ACID diamond, but for some reason that was only 8.5" on a side. For some reason, the ARA (MCB) started requiring the placard holders somewhat earlier. The 1920 Specifications for Tank Cars included rule 18-A, but only for Class III and IV cars. It specified "suitable boards for attaching placards prescribed by the Interstate Commerce Commission...of sufficient size to permit placards to be applied with the opposite points of the diamond in vertical and horizontal positions..." . So the boards could be either square or in the diamond orientation, as long as they could accommodate the placards. This reg predates the ICC rule by two or three years; perhaps the ARA knew it was in the pipeline. I can find no mention of these placards in the earlier MCB Specifications (1917, 1918). Note that the metal-frame holders that allowed the standard placards to be dropped into place (rather than tacked) were mandated on newly built cars, and on those receiving general repairs, with an effective date of Oct 14, 1932. This is according to the 1938 Code of Federal Regulations. Dave ParkerRiverside, CA On Friday, June 16, 2017 3:53 AM, "'Richard W. Chapin' rwc27q@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote: I have a copy of “Transportation of Explosives and Other Dangerous Articles by Freight including Specifications for Shipping Containers”, issued 12/11/1922, effective 1/1/1923. Required by a 3/4/1921 amendment to the Transportation Act of 1920. This is a ICC publication of regulations [actually labelled as “Freight Tariff No.1”. Article 700 is “Labels” and shows required placards [classic diamonds]; red for inflammable liquids & gases, yellow for inflammable solids, white for acids & corrosives, white with red letters for poison gases and green for non-inflammable gases. These required on packaging. Article 900 is required “Placarding of Cars”, but this has illustrations for explosives, poison gas, inflammable liquids and acids only. The last two are diamonds like the packaging, while the first two are rectangles. So, 1/1/1923 is an official date for placards. I note colors noted above are currently used [e.g., yellow flammable solid] So, did the diamond come for the law requiring these regs? Or perhaps from a prior Bureau of Explosives document? I have found articles that say railroads required labels for Dangerous Goods in 1910, but have yet to find any specifics on that. 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FS: HO Rahoe Model Works Arch Bar trucks w/ high detail wheels
Andy Carlson
Hello- I have 6 pairs of Tahoe Model Works old-time 5' 0" wheelbase Arch Bar trucks (Later archbar trucks had 5'6" w.b.). Good from late 19th century until outlawed sometime mid-century, though many continued in use for MoW work cars. Tahoe # 011 I also have 8 pairs of the TMW 40-ton Arch Bars with the later 5'6" wheelbase. Tahoe # 003 Both of these arch bars are sold equipped with Intermountain's new semi-scale "high-detail" wheels which feature correct for non-ribbed back side wheel profile and code 88 wheel width.These wheels look very nice with such a fine truck such as this. Offered for $8/pair, plus shipping of $3.25 and up. I have many of the other trucks from TMW, also equipped with the high-detail wheel sets. Ask for info off-list (Please) at I accept checks and money orders. With a small fee I also accept PayPal. thanks, -Andy Carlson Ojai CA
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Re: Amoco Tank
Dean Kinzley
Thanks Dave
On Thursday, June 15, 2017 3:57 PM, "Dave Parker spottab@... [STMFC]" wrote: Dean: Tim is correct; it is an AC&F Type 21, 10,000 gallons. These are still available in Walthers Proto line, ready to run. I have not seen the schemes on the the cars in Ted's book, nor decals for them, but that doesn't mean they don't exist somewhere. Depending on what era you model, you might consider one of the Amoco predecessors. Amoco (aka American) became the east coast brand name for Standard Oil of Indiana. Rights to those marketing areas were acquired when Standard bought Pan American Petroleum (in 1929), which in turn held controlling interests in Mexican Petroleum (MPLX) and the American Oil Company (Baltimore). There is a nice American Gas version of the car, and it happens to be on sale at Walthers today: I own this car, but am still not 100% clear on what years the scheme would be appropriate for. Walthers also has a black Pan Am version, but the same question applies. I suspect (hope?) the answers may lie in the late Richard Hendrickson's photo collection, which I still have not had an opportunity to peruse. PS: As as been discussed here several times, the Tichy kit is based on the ~1918 USRA design that was never built. It's a nice-looking car that does not model anything (accurately). Hope this helps. Dave Parker Riverside, CA On Thursday, June 15, 2017 12:11 PM, "Dean Kinzley dean.kinzley@... [STMFC]" wrote: Sorry, I meant to. P. 22
On Thursday, June 15, 2017 1:34 PM, "Dave Parker spottab@... [STMFC]" wrote: Dean: Can you provide the page number for the car in question so we don't have to flip through the whole book? Thanks, Dave Parker Riverside, CA On Thursday, June 15, 2017 9:19 AM, "Dean Kinzley dean.kinzley@... [STMFC]" wrote: I am a bit of a novice so the following are likely novice questions: In the Speedwitch Freight Cars Ref Manuel, V 2, there is a photo of an Amoco tank AMOX 1799 which looks like it could be represented by Tichy tank kit #4020 and, if it could, is there a source for the decals? Thanks. Dean
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Re: Hazmat Placards
Tony Thompson
Rich Chapin wrote:
I wrote a blog post about all this back in 2012. My basis was a fine and authoritative article by John Ryczkowski, in Mainline Modeler (Volume 14, January 1993, pages 68–73), and I showed all the early and subsequent placards. Here is a link to that post: Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@... Publishers of books on railroad history
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ADMIN: RE: Mainline Modeler - Hundman Publishing
Guys, The thread regarding Hundman Publishing’s position on copyright…and the C&O Historical Society’s as well…with only a remote association with steam era frt cars, is now terminated. It is out of scope and has already been discussed at length on the STMFC.
Mike Brock STMFC Owner
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Rapido boxcar
Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
Any word on the current
progress on the boxcar? -- Jon Miller For me time stopped in 1941 Digitrax Chief/Zephyr systems, SPROG, JMRI User NMRA Life member #2623 Member SFRH&MS
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Re: Lowered Car End Reporting Marks
S. Busch
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Bob,
Looking through my C&O material, it appears this was common practice
for C&O cars with that type of Murphy end.
For example, here are two cars from another group having this type of
end:
Regards --
Steve Busch
Duncan,SC
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Re: Hazmat Placards
Dave Parker
Rich: I have the same ICC publication as you. It includes a diagram of the early (earliest) INFLAMMABLE placard: that word in red, the rest in black, and on a diamond that is 10.75" on a side. It also include the ACID diamond, but for some reason that was only 8.5" on a side. For some reason, the ARA (MCB) started requiring the placard holders somewhat earlier. The 1920 Specifications for Tank Cars included rule 18-A, but only for Class III and IV cars. It specified "suitable boards for attaching placards prescribed by the Interstate Commerce Commission...of sufficient size to permit placards to be applied with the opposite points of the diamond in vertical and horizontal positions..." . So the boards could be either square or in the diamond orientation, as long as they could accommodate the placards. This reg predates the ICC rule by two or three years; perhaps the ARA knew it was in the pipeline. I can find no mention of these placards in the earlier MCB Specifications (1917, 1918). Note that the metal-frame holders that allowed the standard placards to be dropped into place (rather than tacked) were mandated on newly built cars, and on those receiving general repairs, with an effective date of Oct 14, 1932. This is according to the 1938 Code of Federal Regulations. Dave Parker Riverside, CA
On Friday, June 16, 2017 3:53 AM, "'Richard W. Chapin' rwc27q@... [STMFC]" wrote: I have a copy of “Transportation of Explosives and Other Dangerous Articles by Freight including Specifications for Shipping Containers”, issued 12/11/1922, effective 1/1/1923. Required by a 3/4/1921 amendment to the Transportation Act of 1920. This is a ICC publication of regulations [actually labelled as “Freight Tariff No.1”. Article 700 is “Labels” and shows required placards [classic diamonds]; red for inflammable liquids & gases, yellow for inflammable solids, white for acids & corrosives, white with red letters for poison gases and green for non-inflammable gases. These required on packaging. Article 900 is required “Placarding of Cars”, but this has illustrations for explosives, poison gas, inflammable liquids and acids only. The last two are diamonds like the packaging, while the first two are rectangles. So, 1/1/1923 is an official date for placards. I note colors noted above are currently used [e.g., yellow flammable solid] So, did the diamond come for the law requiring these regs? Or perhaps from a prior Bureau of Explosives document? I have found articles that say railroads required labels for Dangerous Goods in 1910, but have yet to find any specifics on that. Rich Chapin 27 Quincy Rd Basking Ridge, NJ 07920-2222
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Re: Mainline Modeler - Hundman Publishing - who really owns the copyright?
SUVCWORR@...
This can all be boiled down to Did you sell the copyright or only sell the limited use of copyrighted material? The answer depends on the agreement you signed. Let's move this to photographs something I an involved with everyday. I am a partner is a photographic studio. When we shoot a wedding our standard contract gives the bride and groom limited rights -- they may publish the photos on social media without transfering any right to anyone viewing the photos, they may have prints made by us or somewhere else for their personal use and use of their family, they may not sell those prints to anyone nor may they edit, alter or otherwise change our work without purchasing the copyright. We have never had anyone actually purchase the copyright as we charge $2500 per photograph for the edited file. Beyond these limited uses we retain the copyright. We also include a release in the contract that we can use any and all photographs for advertising, promoting our business, displaying on our website or any other use. So what did you sign? You own the copyright the moment the article is written. Did you sign an agreement selling all rights? Did you only agree to let them publish it? Are you bound by a time limit from publishing the material elsewhere or bound forever? Did you agree to let them edit the article? Do you have any rights with regard to the editing in the agreement? Does you agreement allow the publisher to further publish the material in compendium or book of reprinted articles? You need to read the agreement and if you do not agree to its terms say so before you sign it. The one thing you do not own is the layout. Even if you own the article and all the photographs, drawings, charts etc the publisher owns the layout. It is their artistic employees and editors who design they layout. This will prevent you from simply copying the article and reprinting it even if you are the author. Rich Orr
-----Original Message-----
From: martiny@... [STMFC] To: STMFC Sent: Thu, Jun 15, 2017 10:33 pm Subject: Re: [STMFC] Mainline Modeler - Hundman Publishing - who really owns the copyright? I have been reading this thread with interest but the answer still seems murky. But then that could be because the law is flexible. So let me ask a question and hopefully there is a clear answer. Let us say that I wrote an article for a current publication (which I have and am waiting for it to be published). Do I retain the copyright or does that vary between magazines? If I retain the copyright then in theory I could submit the article to another magazine right now for publication. That, to me, seems unethical and probably would cause me to not have any future articles to be considered. Not a very good idea. If I retain the copyright then it would appear that after a reasonable amount of time, I could update the article and publish it again. But I am more interested in the next question. Which copyright supersedes article ownership? Is it the magazine you first published in or the company that the magazine reassigned all articles to? The second company could be more strict on articles they own and not allow the author access to anything he wrote. Perhaps even publish the article again without asking permission or possibly not reimbursing the original author. This has possibly been settled a courtroom already. Marty San Diego, CA ---- "Al Kresse water.kresse@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote: > Do not assume anything. Ask a general question to C&O HS folks to get Bob's Hundman's intent. C&O HS rates ease of sharing railroad knowledge as their top priority. I would GUESS not-for-profits just need to ask. > > > I don't have first hand knowledge of the agreement. > > > Al > > > On June 15, 2017 at 2:20 PM "rxensen@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > That is an interesting change as Bob and I spoke several years ago about C&NW articles and at the time he gave the society verbal permission to use any C&NW article needed for the CNWHS Modeler. > > > > Per your statement we now have to ask the C&O society? > > Ron Christensen > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ Posted by: <martiny@...> ------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ Yahoo Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: STMFC-digest@... STMFC-fullfeatured@... <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: STMFC-unsubscribe@... <*> Your use of Yahoo Groups is subject to: https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/
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Re: Mainline Modeler - Hundman Publishing - who really owns the copyr...
Greg Martin
Marty,
I would have to ask why you would do it to your own work, unless there was
a new procedure or vehicle to accomplish it.
I do believe that the shelf life of any subject is two years and at time
the subject should be revised, but perhaps by your mentor not you. I think Tony
would agree and his blog has done than more than once and one subject that comes
to mind is the SHAKE_N_TAKE® Kansas City Southern car, a simple project with a
"new" path to completion and I enjoyed the outcome.
As I have said gain the respect and you will win the reader, violate it and
you will be forever criticized.
Copy is a great form of flattery, and welcomed when borrowing a
technique when you mention it roots, improving it brings a smile to the creator.
Greg Martin
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through
it. Norman Maclean
In a message dated 6/16/2017 1:27:19 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
STMFC@... writes:
Greg and Tony, I absolutely agree with your comments concerning the ethics of sending the same article to more than one periodical at the same time. The editors have to trust the authors will not do that and violating that trust will have consequences. I can see publishing the same article in another periodical several years later (the original might no longer exist, for example), HOWEVER I would include a cover letter explaining that this article was previously published in xyz magazine in June 2001 and would include a copy of the original article with my submission. The new article should not be a word for word copy of the original but would include new content. There would also have to be a reason for submitting it again. Perhaps there has been an advance in products thus providing a better way to accomplish what the original article covered.
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Re: Tank Car CIL 805
william darnaby
Both of these cars were indeed in company service. I saw and photographed these cars a lot during my Purdue years as they were always around the Shops. It was my understanding that they were in relatively captive service between Whiting, Indiana (Standard Oil) and Shops for specialty oils for locomotive and car maintenance. Hence, the small compartments. Bill Darnaby
From: "Andy Carlson midcentury@... [STMFC]" To: "STMFC@..." <STMFC@...> Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2017 4:27 PM Subject: [STMFC] Tank Car CIL 805 This car (or a sister) is a subject for one of the 1950s color slides often referred to as "the Gerstley Collection". It is, of course, a frameless Van Dyke tank car which the Monon acquired for company service. I had a brief discussion with Richard Hendrickson about this car and he noted that this was one of very few Van Dykes with AB brake conversions. Look at all of the brackets visible in the underside. -Andy Carlson Ojai CA From: "thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC]" To: STMFC@... Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2017 1:58 PM Subject: [STMFC] Tank Car CIL 805 Another backward print from the Barringer Library: This is CIL 805, a three-compartment tank car. I seem to
recall the presence of the two smaller domes indicates this car originally was
a single-compartment car that was subsequently modified. Any comments on this car? Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA
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