Date   

Re: Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

Tim O'Connor
 

Tony

yes, sadly. we could REALLY use a resin kit for these !! Pierre are you listening?


On 1/23/2022 5:33 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:
Tim O'Connor wrote:

Oriental imported a brass model of the A-50-10 (with end doors).

But with the wrong end.

Tony Thompson


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Indianapolis RPM Rooms

 

My father designed and supervised the construction of the Age of Steam Roundhouse building and will be doing his presentation on the topic at Indy. The master plan part has a lot of overlap with layout design - but bigger.  There are many Steam era freight cars currently under roof in the building. The talk is on the NMRA schedule, but both schedules are open to both groups. 

I’m looking forward to making some acquaintances with some of the names here. 

Matt Goodman
Columbus, Ohio, US. 

On Jan 20, 2022, at 9:04 PM, Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

And more of the Indy Jct RPM details. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On Jan 20, 2022, at 7:56 PM, Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst@...> wrote:

All's I could find was the NMRA part of the meet. I was told the RPM meet was from about noon Thursday till about noon Saturday...I think?
Clark


Re: Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

Doug Rhodes
 

The ship in the photo is indeed HMS Implacable. After putting her planes and aircrew ashore in Australia, she transported troops for repatriation, many of them formerly held in Japanese POW camps. She arrived in Vancouver  October 11, 1945 with about 2100 repats on board. A great crowd came down to the wharves to greet the ship and seek any available info about their loved ones. Local media reported the crowd numbered 50,000 of whom about 400 were injured in the crush. The repats embarked on CPR and CNR trains for travel from Vancouver to Nova Scotia, where they boarded troop ships for the return to Britain.

 

HMS Implacable, though of very recent construction and very state of the art for its day, met an early end. Britain’s troubles, financial and other, saw it withdrawn from active service by the early 1950s and scrapped by 1955.

 

Rob is correct that Vancouver is not a naval base or port, though it does see naval ships from time to time. The visit of HMS Implacable was a very big deal and received wide media coverage at the time.

 

Doug Rhodes

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Robert kirkham
Sent: January 23, 2022 1:09 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

 

Thanks Tim - I didn’t pick up on the steel sides.  Makes it an even more do-able model.

 

The photo is of a series on the archives site showing the carrier in port at the end of the war.  (The other photos omit the SP car). Not certain what HMS Implacable's purpose was (Vancouver not really a naval port), although I do understand carriers were among the ships used to bring home POWs and other personnel.

 

Rob  

 

On Jan 23, 2022, at 12:53 PM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

 


Neat picture. SP A-50-10 or A-50-11 all steel single sheathed automobile box cars built in 1930.

Oriental imported a brass model of the A-50-10 (with end doors).

Tim O'Connor


On 1/23/2022 3:10 PM, Robert kirkham wrote:

I am hoping those of you who know the Souther Pacific auto-boxcar fleet can help with some information on the 50’ car shown under the underpass in this photo (October 1945).  Would like to know some information to assist in building a model - for starters, likely number series so I can look it up in the ORER, etc.  If there is an outline drawing with basic dimensions available for the car shown in this photo, would appreciate that too! A larger image can be had at: 433e1ede-68cf-43ef-9b9c-0eca526d6c01-CVA586-5634.jpg

Thanks in advance for any assistance,

 

Rob

Attachments:

 


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts <Oriental SP A-50-10.jpg>

 


Re: Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

Tony Thompson
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:

Oriental imported a brass model of the A-50-10 (with end doors).

But with the wrong end.

Tony Thompson



Re: Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

_._,_._,_

Good eye Tim:

Here is one more.

Bill Pardie


SP A-50-9 series 68980-69229 (was: Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar)

Robert kirkham
 

Remembered where my copy of the SP Freight cars v. 3 auto boxcar and flat car book was.  I found the key spotting feature is the length of the under-door stiffened below the side sills.  So that makes this a photo of the A-50-9 cars, a lot of 250 cars of series 68980-69229 built in Sept- Nov 1928. 

I’m wondering if there are detailed photos of the cars anywhere?  Especially curious to know details of the underframe and whether the drawings for the A-50-10s, shown p.76, would be materially different on the earlier cars?  

Also, I wasn’t sure how to interpret the notes on the dimples used to mount the grab irons without intruding into the interior car space (drawing also p.77).  Were those used on the A-50-10 and A-50-11 cars only, or also on the A-50-9s?

Rob
    

On Jan 23, 2022, at 1:09 PM, Robert kirkham <rdkirkham@...> wrote:

Thanks Tim - I didn’t pick up on the steel sides.  Makes it an even more do-able model.

The photo is of a series on the archives site showing the carrier in port at the end of the war.  (The other photos omit the SP car). Not certain what HMS Implacable's purpose was (Vancouver not really a naval port), although I do understand carriers were among the ships used to bring home POWs and other personnel.

Rob  

On Jan 23, 2022, at 12:53 PM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Neat picture. SP A-50-10 or A-50-11 all steel single sheathed automobile box cars built in 1930.

Oriental imported a brass model of the A-50-10 (with end doors).

Tim O'Connor


On 1/23/2022 3:10 PM, Robert kirkham wrote:
I am hoping those of you who know the Souther Pacific auto-boxcar fleet can help with some information on the 50’ car shown under the underpass in this photo (October 1945).  Would like to know some information to assist in building a model - for starters, likely number series so I can look it up in the ORER, etc.  If there is an outline drawing with basic dimensions available for the car shown in this photo, would appreciate that too! A larger image can be had at: 433e1ede-68cf-43ef-9b9c-0eca526d6c01-CVA586-5634.jpg
Thanks in advance for any assistance,

Rob

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts <Oriental SP A-50-10.jpg>



Re: Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

Robert kirkham
 

Thanks Tim - I didn’t pick up on the steel sides.  Makes it an even more do-able model.

The photo is of a series on the archives site showing the carrier in port at the end of the war.  (The other photos omit the SP car). Not certain what HMS Implacable's purpose was (Vancouver not really a naval port), although I do understand carriers were among the ships used to bring home POWs and other personnel.

Rob  

On Jan 23, 2022, at 12:53 PM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Neat picture. SP A-50-10 or A-50-11 all steel single sheathed automobile box cars built in 1930.

Oriental imported a brass model of the A-50-10 (with end doors).

Tim O'Connor


On 1/23/2022 3:10 PM, Robert kirkham wrote:
I am hoping those of you who know the Souther Pacific auto-boxcar fleet can help with some information on the 50’ car shown under the underpass in this photo (October 1945).  Would like to know some information to assist in building a model - for starters, likely number series so I can look it up in the ORER, etc.  If there is an outline drawing with basic dimensions available for the car shown in this photo, would appreciate that too! A larger image can be had at: 433e1ede-68cf-43ef-9b9c-0eca526d6c01-CVA586-5634.jpg
Thanks in advance for any assistance,

Rob

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts <Oriental SP A-50-10.jpg>


Re: Photo: UP Gondola 63960 In Discharge Mode (1922)

Clarence Zink
 

Corey -

Ah-ha, I must have "fat fingered" the search in eBay.  Thanks for the correct link.

CRZ


Re: Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

Tim O'Connor
 


Neat picture. SP A-50-10 or A-50-11 all steel single sheathed automobile box cars built in 1930.

Oriental imported a brass model of the A-50-10 (with end doors).

Tim O'Connor


On 1/23/2022 3:10 PM, Robert kirkham wrote:
I am hoping those of you who know the Souther Pacific auto-boxcar fleet can help with some information on the 50’ car shown under the underpass in this photo (October 1945).  Would like to know some information to assist in building a model - for starters, likely number series so I can look it up in the ORER, etc.  If there is an outline drawing with basic dimensions available for the car shown in this photo, would appreciate that too! A larger image can be had at: 433e1ede-68cf-43ef-9b9c-0eca526d6c01-CVA586-5634.jpg
Thanks in advance for any assistance,

Rob

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Help ID on SP DD 50' single sheathed boxcar

Robert kirkham
 

I am hoping those of you who know the Souther Pacific auto-boxcar fleet can help with some information on the 50’ car shown under the underpass in this photo (October 1945).  Would like to know some information to assist in building a model - for starters, likely number series so I can look it up in the ORER, etc.  If there is an outline drawing with basic dimensions available for the car shown in this photo, would appreciate that too! A larger image can be had at: 433e1ede-68cf-43ef-9b9c-0eca526d6c01-CVA586-5634.jpg
Thanks in advance for any assistance,

Rob


Re: Iron Modeler competition?

O Fenton Wells
 

Excellent, a great fantasy build  Love the Tall Corn Route
Fenton

On Sun, Jan 23, 2022 at 10:03 AM Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst=q.com@groups.io> wrote:
Here's my fantasyland "Iron Modeler" concept car...Years in the making...Well maybe about as long as some guys take to build a resin kit, if they ever do?  ;  ))
Clark



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: Iron Modeler competition?

Clark Propst
 

Here's my fantasyland "Iron Modeler" concept car...Years in the making...Well maybe about as long as some guys take to build a resin kit, if they ever do?  ;  ))
Clark


Re: Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

Nelson Moyer
 

Tony Thompson wrote a blog entry on structural steel loads, and you can find it at:

modeling the SP: Search results for structural steel

The MS Open Car Loads books have several photos of steel loads.


Re: Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

mopacfirst
 

You might also be seeing an unpainted load of fabricated steel on the way to the galvanizer.  Fabricated steel in our era might have been primed with red lead for shipment. and was less likely to be finish painted before arrival at destination.

Ron Merrick


Re: Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

Brian Rochon
 

Bob,

 

While I don’t know if the practice dates back to the timeframe that you model, the US Navy has been using pre-construction primer on steel plate since at least 1980.

 

https://www.nsrp.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Deliverable-2009-346-Retention_Preconstruction_Primer_Final_Report-BAE_SE_Shipyards.pdf

 

Brian Rochon

Silver Spring, MD

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2022 7:41 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

 

Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

I’ve seen models of structural steel loads that were painted, usually what appeared to be flat black but sometimes other colors.

Did various steel mills paint the structural steel products or were they usually left unpainted when shipped?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

_._,_._,_


Re: [EXT] [RealSTMFC] Rapido X31a

Robert kirkham
 

Thanks for confirming that Bruce.   

Rob
Slowly tackling the reality we’re all PRR modellers . . . 

On Jan 22, 2022, at 1:38 PM, Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:

Rob,
In general, cars during WWI were "rode hard and put up wet" meaning that they only got the minimum work needed to keep them on the road. Given that the X31 fleet was 10 years old at the end of the war, the cars probably looked pretty well weathered. However, they probably also looked different from each other. Some would have faded paint, others heavier soot, still others, rust. One or two cars might be in pretty new paint from a repaint.

Regards,
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Robert kirkham <rdkirkham@...>
Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2022 1:25 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [EXT] Re: [RealSTMFC] Rapido X31a
 
CAUTION: Email Originated Outside of Auburn.
I have a broader question on weathering the Rapido cars: So far I have precious few photos of these cars from the immediate end of WWII when I model.  I’m trying to get some sense of what the cars might have looked like at that point.  I have a bunch of guesses about things that might factor into how the fleet looked, but not sure how material any of them are to this group of PRR cars.

We generalize about various factors such as quality of paint products used prior to WWII, the effects of acid rain in the east, of coal and smoke; about paint peeling off galvanized roofs, and weathering and wear and tear.   But how were the cars used in WWII?  How did that affect their appearance after the war?  Did PRR maintain them during the war?  Or only gear up that form of maintenance sometime in 1946 or 47 . . . ? 

I’m thinking 
a) aged worn paint, within a range from pretty good to almost unrecognizable.  
b) some with peeling paint on the roof (was it small spotty paint failure, or large failures?)
c) lettering still pretty good & legible?

I’m thinking for my modelling period they may be in rougher shape than within a couple of years post war, when repaints might have caught up?

But all of this is just speculation, not PRR-informed insight.  

So, is there something more informative to go from when weathering the Rapido cars?

Rob 

      

On Jan 22, 2022, at 11:02 AM, Mike Clements via groups.io <mbclements@...> wrote:

For me, I’m fine with exaggerating this feature to make it visible. The main idea is to give a lip for the oil wash to settle on. I went back and used a pointed q tip with horizontal strokes on the patch as opposed to vertical on the rest of the car. It helped build up grime on the lip and set it off much better. This also makes the rivets on the patch fade away- which is good because there appear to be less of them on the patches.

From what I can tell these got repaired on an as-needed basis. I model 1965 though, so any car that lived that long probably had something done to it. I’m sure one of the PRR die hards can give a better answer. 

Mike Clements
Wakefield, MA
nyc65.wordpress.com




Re: Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

Tim O'Connor
 


Raw structural steel is almost never painted (stuff like I beams or H beams etc) but fabricated steel loads
could be painted or unpainted - I have photos of both. Depends what it is for and whether it is a 'final' product
item or is an intermediate item used to make something else.

Attached is a shot of unpainted fabricated steel.


On 1/22/2022 7:41 PM, Bob Chaparro via groups.io wrote:

Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

I’ve seen models of structural steel loads that were painted, usually what appeared to be flat black but sometimes other colors.

Did various steel mills paint the structural steel products or were they usually left unpainted when shipped?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

Hudson Leighton
 

In my experience the "raw" steel from the steel mill is unpainted, the finished product from the Steel Fabricator will
have been sandblasted and at least primed, sometimes it gets a finish coat.

-Hudson


Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

Bob Chaparro
 

Structural Steel Loads – Colors?

I’ve seen models of structural steel loads that were painted, usually what appeared to be flat black but sometimes other colors.

Did various steel mills paint the structural steel products or were they usually left unpainted when shipped?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Re: [EXT] Re: [RealSTMFC] Rapido X31a

Bruce Smith
 

Rob,
In general, cars during WWI were "rode hard and put up wet" meaning that they only got the minimum work needed to keep them on the road. Given that the X31 fleet was 10 years old at the end of the war, the cars probably looked pretty well weathered. However, they probably also looked different from each other. Some would have faded paint, others heavier soot, still others, rust. One or two cars might be in pretty new paint from a repaint.

Regards,
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Robert kirkham <rdkirkham@...>
Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2022 1:25 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [EXT] Re: [RealSTMFC] Rapido X31a
 
CAUTION: Email Originated Outside of Auburn.
I have a broader question on weathering the Rapido cars: So far I have precious few photos of these cars from the immediate end of WWII when I model.  I’m trying to get some sense of what the cars might have looked like at that point.  I have a bunch of guesses about things that might factor into how the fleet looked, but not sure how material any of them are to this group of PRR cars.

We generalize about various factors such as quality of paint products used prior to WWII, the effects of acid rain in the east, of coal and smoke; about paint peeling off galvanized roofs, and weathering and wear and tear.   But how were the cars used in WWII?  How did that affect their appearance after the war?  Did PRR maintain them during the war?  Or only gear up that form of maintenance sometime in 1946 or 47 . . . ? 

I’m thinking 
a) aged worn paint, within a range from pretty good to almost unrecognizable.  
b) some with peeling paint on the roof (was it small spotty paint failure, or large failures?)
c) lettering still pretty good & legible?

I’m thinking for my modelling period they may be in rougher shape than within a couple of years post war, when repaints might have caught up?

But all of this is just speculation, not PRR-informed insight.  

So, is there something more informative to go from when weathering the Rapido cars?

Rob 

      

On Jan 22, 2022, at 11:02 AM, Mike Clements via groups.io <mbclements@...> wrote:

For me, I’m fine with exaggerating this feature to make it visible. The main idea is to give a lip for the oil wash to settle on. I went back and used a pointed q tip with horizontal strokes on the patch as opposed to vertical on the rest of the car. It helped build up grime on the lip and set it off much better. This also makes the rivets on the patch fade away- which is good because there appear to be less of them on the patches.

From what I can tell these got repaired on an as-needed basis. I model 1965 though, so any car that lived that long probably had something done to it. I’m sure one of the PRR die hards can give a better answer. 

Mike Clements
Wakefield, MA
nyc65.wordpress.com


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