Date   

Re: LOOKING FOR PLATFORN FOR A KADEE 11,000 GALLON 105A TANK CAR

Pierre Oliver
 

YOu could modify this
http://www.yarmouthmodelworks.com/index.php/Products/YMW-370

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com
On 2022-01-17 1:30 p.m., Bill Keene via groups.io wrote:

I recently picked up a Kadee model of their 11,000 gallon 105A pressure tank car to model a car in the SHPX 1800-1941 number series, ACF Lot 3365, as a car leased to Phillips Petroleum Company. I chose the Kadee model based on the fact that it was the plainest paint scheme requiring on the revising the lettering to be accurate. Unfortunately, this model did not have the 6'-6" x 4'-7" platform. Hopefully someone on this list can offer suggestions of a source to obtain a platform. See attached photo. 

I have contacted Kadee and received a reply that they did not sell this part. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene 
Irvine, CA


Re: LOOKING FOR PLATFORN FOR A KADEE 11,000 GALLON 105A TANK CAR

Brian Carlson
 

Could any of the tangent platforms be kitbashed to work. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On Jan 17, 2022, at 1:30 PM, Bill Keene via groups.io <bill41@...> wrote:

I recently picked up a Kadee model of their 11,000 gallon 105A pressure tank car to model a car in the SHPX 1800-1941 number series, ACF Lot 3365, as a car leased to Phillips Petroleum Company. I chose the Kadee model based on the fact that it was the plainest paint scheme requiring on the revising the lettering to be accurate. Unfortunately, this model did not have the 6'-6" x 4'-7" platform. Hopefully someone on this list can offer suggestions of a source to obtain a platform. See attached photo. 

I have contacted Kadee and received a reply that they did not sell this part. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene 
Irvine, CA

--
Brian J. Carlson, P.E.
Cheektowaga NY


LOOKING FOR PLATFORN FOR A KADEE 11,000 GALLON 105A TANK CAR

Bill Keene
 

I recently picked up a Kadee model of their 11,000 gallon 105A pressure tank car to model a car in the SHPX 1800-1941 number series, ACF Lot 3365, as a car leased to Phillips Petroleum Company. I chose the Kadee model based on the fact that it was the plainest paint scheme requiring on the revising the lettering to be accurate. Unfortunately, this model did not have the 6'-6" x 4'-7" platform. Hopefully someone on this list can offer suggestions of a source to obtain a platform. See attached photo. 

I have contacted Kadee and received a reply that they did not sell this part. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene 
Irvine, CA


Re: SFRD Rr-39 Side View Photo Needed

Bob Chaparro
 

A few more photos. Notice that Tim O'Connor's photo, taken in 1957, shows the reefer still had the reverse-opening hatch covers. This was eight years after Santa Fe started using mechanical icing equipment on its icing platforms. And the car has swing doors. The Calisphere photo shows conventional hatch covers and a sliding plug door.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Re: Shell tankcar for my Quincy-model-RR

Tim O'Connor
 


Shell had cars of this size and class from more than one builder and era. I just mentioned
the Proto cars because that's a car that is both correct and readily available - even RTR.

Tim O'Connor


On 1/17/2022 11:14 AM, Steve and Barb Hile wrote:

Fred,

 

These cars appear to be 10,000 gallon cars built by Standard Tank Car Company as witnessed by the heavy combination bolster and tank saddle and the safety valves placed opposite one another on the centerline of the tank dome top.

 

There is a similar car at the Western Railway Museum.  See

 

SCCX 662 - Western Railway Museum (wrm.org)

 

They may well have been hauling refined petroleum products.

 

Southern Car and Foundry makes some 8000 gallon STCCo tank cars, so it might be possible to combine than underframe with a 10K Intermountain tank to produce a reasonable model of one of these cars.

 

It is reasonably likely that the Standard jobber would receive products in UTLX tank cars, like the future Rapido model.

 

Steve Hile

-----Original Message-----
From: <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Jan 17, 2022 6:47 AM
To: <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Shell tankcar for my Quincy-model-RR

 

Hello all,
I'm modeling Quincy, CA in 1949.
Besides lumber being one of the main factors of existence of the QRR, I found 4 oil dealers located in Quincy: Associated, Union, Standard and Shell.
Looking for matching tank cars, I found these two prototype pictures of Shell cars.
SCCX667 was on WP track in 1949, the SCCX673 on GN track.
But I wonder; were these oil cars? Is there a model?
Thanks for your help.
regards, Fred Jansz

 

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Shell tankcar for my Quincy-model-RR

Bruce Hendrick
 

Are you modeling in HO Scale?

If so, the aforementioned Proto2000 Type 21 8000 gallon car was offered by Walthers in both a yellow Shell scheme and in black, similar to your images but with a Shell image above road numbers. Sold as a single car and as a 6-pack. The P2K Type 21 cars are high quality, well-detailed models but do some research if you are concerned with an exact match to Shell cars.

Apparently discontinued currently but likely will eventually show up in secondary markets. Currently one Shell car is listed on eBay but it is in kit form. These kits are not “shake the box” and require some time & patience.

Also, considered that UTLX and GATX cars were more common that oil company-owned cars so you may wish to research the cars actually used at the oil facilities you mentioned.

Bruce Hendrick
Brea, California


Re: Shell tankcar for my Quincy-model-RR

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Fred,

 

These cars appear to be 10,000 gallon cars built by Standard Tank Car Company as witnessed by the heavy combination bolster and tank saddle and the safety valves placed opposite one another on the centerline of the tank dome top.

 

There is a similar car at the Western Railway Museum.  See

 

SCCX 662 - Western Railway Museum (wrm.org)

 

They may well have been hauling refined petroleum products.

 

Southern Car and Foundry makes some 8000 gallon STCCo tank cars, so it might be possible to combine than underframe with a 10K Intermountain tank to produce a reasonable model of one of these cars.

 

It is reasonably likely that the Standard jobber would receive products in UTLX tank cars, like the future Rapido model.

 

Steve Hile

-----Original Message-----
From: <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Jan 17, 2022 6:47 AM
To: <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Shell tankcar for my Quincy-model-RR

 

Hello all,
I'm modeling Quincy, CA in 1949.
Besides lumber being one of the main factors of existence of the QRR, I found 4 oil dealers located in Quincy: Associated, Union, Standard and Shell.
Looking for matching tank cars, I found these two prototype pictures of Shell cars.
SCCX667 was on WP track in 1949, the SCCX673 on GN track.
But I wonder; were these oil cars? Is there a model?
Thanks for your help.
regards, Fred Jansz

 


Re: Strangest caboose I ever did see

dahminator68
 

Hello Dennis:  The Denver & Intermountain had two operations.  The coal mines in Leyden, Co were standard gauge so the coal gondolas could be interchanged with D&SL and other rr’s.  The rest of the D&IM was 42” gauge.  The one photo posted of a train with gondolas shows the dual gauge track under the train.
Caboose 902 is at CRRM in Golden.

On Sunday, January 16, 2022, 2:14 PM, Dennis Storzek <dennis@...> wrote:

On Sat, Jan 15, 2022 at 09:05 AM, Matt Mihalo wrote:
This was a combination of a homemade flatcar and the carbody of Denver Tramway Cable Car #271 in 1886 by 1886 by the Laclede Car Company of Saint Louis. Renumbered as DTC #40 in 1888.   Rebuilt in 1918 as Caboose 901.  Flatcar burned in 1950, carbody saved and restored, now on display at Forney Transp. Museum in Denver as Denver Tramway Cable Car #40.  All equipment in this picture is 42" gauge.
I didn't realize this operation wasn't standard gauge. The photo I originally came across only had the caboose and a very ordinary interurban style locomotive, so I assumed they did some interchange freight business. I knew shay had some standard gauge lines, just jumped to the wrong conclusion. I see from the train picture posted that the caboose has radial couplers and the coal gons may have them as well.

Dennis Storzek


Re: SFRD Rr-39 Side View Photo Needed

Nelson Moyer
 

Thanks, Tim, Overhead views are always appreciated for any freight car.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Monday, January 17, 2022 7:05 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] SFRD Rr-39 Side View Photo Needed

 


here's a 1957 overhead view for ya

On 1/16/2022 1:50 PM, Nelson Moyer wrote:

Thanks, Charlie. Those two photo answer both parts of the question, and they are very good photos to add to the collection. It’s really helpful to get these two relatively high resolution photos. All my SFRD photos are lower resolution, and it’s hard to see details and read small lettering.

 

Nelson Moyer

 


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

 


Re: Fort Dodge Des Moines and Southern

ron christensen
 

Here is AFE information  Ron Christensen

AFE # Date Work Done Equipment Quantity Start Number End Number Purchased From Former Number Notes
2154 1/9/57 Purchase Box Car 40' composite, 40 ton 12 10030 10041 B&M 7xxxx See note 7 for car number detail Purchased from Boston & Maine
2184 7/1/57 Purchase Box Car composite 40 ton 40' 6" inside 33 10042 10074 B&M 7xxxx See note 11 for car number detail Purchased from Boston & Maine
2195 11/4/57 Purchase Box Car 40'6" composite 40 ton 33 10045 10074 B&M 71xxx See note 1 for car number detail Purchased from B&M
2203 2/11/58 Purchase Box Car 40'6" Composite 28 10075 10102 B&M   This AFE canceled cars sold to Wellsville, Addison & Galeston
2243 2/25/59 Purchase Box Car 40'6" Composite  25 10075 10099 B&M 71xxx&72xxx 40 ton cap. Boston & Maine #'s 71417,71826,72015,72074,72388,72402,72409
2243 2/25/59 Purchase Box Car 40'6" Composite 25 10075 10099 B&M 71xxx&72xxx 40 ton cap. Boston & Maine #'s 72503,72551,72691,72737,72842,72943
2134 9/4/56 Purchase  Box Car 30 ton 40 ft single sheathed 30 10000 10029 B&M   See note 4 for car number detail Purchased from B&M


Re: TA&G 7006

Tim O'Connor
 

On 1/16/2022 8:53 AM, mopacfirst wrote:
I concur on the Santa Fe Bx-40.  See page 163 of the Santa Fe Railway Rolling Stock Reference Series, Volume. 4.

Ron Merrick

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Shell tankcar for my Quincy-model-RR

Tim O'Connor
 


Some of the SCCX cars were ACF Type 21's, and in fact Proto 2000 sold cars decorated correctly for the Shell tank cars.

I've attached Gene Deimling's Proto:48 kitbash from a Lionel model.



On 1/17/2022 7:47 AM, Fred Jansz wrote:
Hello all,
I'm modeling Quincy, CA in 1949.
Besides lumber being one of the main factors of existence of the QRR, I found 4 oil dealers located in Quincy: Associated, Union, Standard and Shell.
Looking for matching tank cars, I found these two prototype pictures of Shell cars.
SCCX667 was on WP track in 1949, the SCCX673 on GN track.
But I wonder; were these oil cars? Is there a model?
Thanks for your help.
regards, Fred Jansz

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: SFRD Rr-39 Side View Photo Needed

Tim O'Connor
 


here's a 1957 overhead view for ya

On 1/16/2022 1:50 PM, Nelson Moyer wrote:

Thanks, Charlie. Those two photo answer both parts of the question, and they are very good photos to add to the collection. It’s really helpful to get these two relatively high resolution photos. All my SFRD photos are lower resolution, and it’s hard to see details and read small lettering.

 

Nelson Moyer



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Shell tankcar for my Quincy-model-RR

Fred Jansz
 

Hello all,
I'm modeling Quincy, CA in 1949.
Besides lumber being one of the main factors of existence of the QRR, I found 4 oil dealers located in Quincy: Associated, Union, Standard and Shell.
Looking for matching tank cars, I found these two prototype pictures of Shell cars.
SCCX667 was on WP track in 1949, the SCCX673 on GN track.
But I wonder; were these oil cars? Is there a model?
Thanks for your help.
regards, Fred Jansz


Re: West India Fruit Company Boxcars

Michael Palmieri
 

WIF began service between Port Everglades and Havana in 1946, then moved to West Palm Beach in 1947.  Operation began with the former Grand Trunk Western ferry GRAND HAVEN, then it acquired former FEC HENRY M. FLAGLER (USN KEOKUK) and JOSEPH R. PARROTT (USN SHAWMUT) from the U.S. Government in 1947.

 

WIF’s first new vessel, the NEW GRAND HAVEN, was completed in May 1951, then it acquired the SEATRAIN NEW ORLEANS in 1954, renamed it SEA LEVEL, and began operating it between New Orleans and Havana, replacing former Sea-Train service.  In March 1956 WIF began operating an automobile ferry between Key West and Havana using the CITY OF HAVANA, a former LSD which had been used by the Royal Navy under the Lend-Lease program during WWII.

 

 

The last addition was the oddly-named CITY OF NEW ORLEANS, oddly-named because it was a stern loader and could not operate out of New Orleans!  It was delivered in August 1959, shortly after Fidel Castro came into power, and it made less than 100 trips to Cuba.  After normal service ended, WIF was able to repatriate about 900 of the 1,000 American freight cars on the island before all service ended and the company went out of business.  WIF’s reporting marks were deleted from the Official Railway Equipment Register in April 1961.

Mike Palmieri - Fort Worth, Texas


Re: West India Fruit Company Boxcars

Robert G P
 

That is correct Dennis, also the green paint appeared in the late 50's. 


On Sun, Jan 16, 2022 at 5:03 PM Dennis Storzek <dennis@...> wrote:
On Sun, Jan 16, 2022 at 12:10 PM, Michael Palmieri wrote:
Just to add to what others have posted, in 1954 WIF acquired the SEATRAIN NEW ORLEANS, renamed it SEA LEVEL, and began operating it between the Seatrain terminal along the Mississippi River and the Missouri Pacific just south of New Orleans and Havana. 
That may explain why and when the ship outline used in the herald changed. See message 189651 for examples. What I think was the earlier herald has a ship with a vertical prow and a longer superstructure, the later ship was much more streamlined. All the wood reefers I've seen photos had the more streamlined ship.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Strangest caboose I ever did see

Dennis Storzek <dennis@...>
 

On Sat, Jan 15, 2022 at 09:05 AM, Matt Mihalo wrote:
This was a combination of a homemade flatcar and the carbody of Denver Tramway Cable Car #271 in 1886 by 1886 by the Laclede Car Company of Saint Louis. Renumbered as DTC #40 in 1888.   Rebuilt in 1918 as Caboose 901.  Flatcar burned in 1950, carbody saved and restored, now on display at Forney Transp. Museum in Denver as Denver Tramway Cable Car #40.  All equipment in this picture is 42" gauge.
I didn't realize this operation wasn't standard gauge. The photo I originally came across only had the caboose and a very ordinary interurban style locomotive, so I assumed they did some interchange freight business. I knew shay had some standard gauge lines, just jumped to the wrong conclusion. I see from the train picture posted that the caboose has radial couplers and the coal gons may have them as well.

Dennis Storzek


Re: West India Fruit Company Boxcars

Dennis Storzek <dennis@...>
 

On Sun, Jan 16, 2022 at 12:10 PM, Michael Palmieri wrote:
Just to add to what others have posted, in 1954 WIF acquired the SEATRAIN NEW ORLEANS, renamed it SEA LEVEL, and began operating it between the Seatrain terminal along the Mississippi River and the Missouri Pacific just south of New Orleans and Havana. 
That may explain why and when the ship outline used in the herald changed. See message 189651 for examples. What I think was the earlier herald has a ship with a vertical prow and a longer superstructure, the later ship was much more streamlined. All the wood reefers I've seen photos had the more streamlined ship.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Bobber 4-wheel cabooses

Bruce Smith
 

Obviously, many of you missed my PRR N4 cabin car clinic at Prototype Rails, Cocoa Beach. I spent about the 1st 1/3 of the hour addressing the "bobber problem". This is well spelled out, with respect to the "caboose laws" that were promulgated in the PRRT&HS' new cabin car book (or should I say, cabin car BIBLE!) The short of it is that many railroads including the PRR were building new bobbers into the first decade of the 20th century. Around 1910, the first "caboose law" was proposed in New York State, which, among other features, required 4 wheel trucks. These laws were typically formulated by the states in alliance with the "botherhoods" and the laws were defined as worker safety and comfort, thus allowing states to make rules governing inter-state commerce. Much negotiating then occurred as the PRR had built hundreds of new bobbers, with steel underframes, in class ND. Eventually, the states, botherhoods and railroads came to a consensus about the laws and they started to go into effect circa 1915. Often the laws differed somewhat from state to state but there were some general commonalities, such as steel underframes, 4 wheel trucks in mainline service, specific minimum bunk length etc... In general, the laws did not outright ban bobbers, but they were typically confined to local and yard service. 

On the PRR, the ND cabin car served into at least the late 1950s and some may have even made into the 1960s. 

Interestingly, the PRR took different approaches to the cabin car issue on Lines East vs Lines West. On lines east, they focused on building new steel cabin cars, the N5. There were a few experiments, such as the 13 NDA cabins, where trucks were fitted to ND bobbers, and the singleton N4, where an ND was lengthened and give trucks. On Lines West, their bobbers were predominantly older wood underframe cars. Lines West jacked up the bodies, rolled steel underframes under them, and lengthened the bodies, generating over 1000 N6A and N6B class cabin cars, with the N6B remaining the single most numerous cabin car on the PRR in the 1956 cabin car census!

The PRR ND is available in resin in HO from F&C and on the secondary market in the for of wood and cast metal craftman kits from GoorCraft.

As noted previously, several calss ND bobbers were preserved and you can even ride in one on the Strasburg Railroad.

Regards,
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Eric Hansmann <eric@...>
Sent: Sunday, January 16, 2022 10:28 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io <main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Subject: [EXT] Re: [RealSTMFC] Bobber 4-wheel cabooses
 
CAUTION: Email Originated Outside of Auburn.

I don’t have a definitive answer. I model 1926 and will need a few of these 4-wheel cabooses for the industrial branch I plan to model.

Some states banned the use of 4-wheel cabooses in the Teens. I think many survived in yard, industrial, and short branch line service. The B&OCT certainly used them late, as did the Cumberland and Pennsylvania (not a class one). 

I suspect many were sold or scrapped in the 1930s as traffic slowed. Many lines already had larger 8-wheel cabooses by the 1930s, so older equipment would be deemed as excess.

Interestingly, the Western Maryland Railway didn’t add any 8-wheel cabooses until the mid-1930s, so their 4-wheel cabooses would have been used extensively to that point.

It boils down to the location, years, and service to determine longevity for these classic cars.


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

> On Jan 16, 2022, at 10:03 AM, Robert G P <bobgp5109@...> wrote:
>
> And how long did these typically last in service? Ive always wondered if any lasted into the late transition era on a class 1 carrier.
>
> Great topic!
>
> -Bob







Re: Bobber 4-wheel cabooses

wrlyders
 

I have been swamped by so much lovely information on Bobber Cabooses. I will need some time to sort thru it all.

 

I thank you all so very much.

 

Bill L

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Sunday, January 16, 2022 3:17 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Bobber 4-wheel cabooses

 

More images of Ed’s 4-wheel caboose are in this blog post. Plus extra detail on the B&O prototypes. 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN


On Jan 16, 2022, at 2:03 PM, steve_wintner via groups.io <steve_wintner@...> wrote:

Nice models Ed!

5141 - 5160 of 194765