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Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted
Tony Thompson
Tim O'Connor wrote:
Yes though they were hindered by their seriously unusual truck-coupler-underframe design, not the least bit easy to fix. This one has far less warts, IMO. And I'm already looking at mods toward insulated ICC 103 and 104 cars of this size. Tony Thompson |
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Re: What is this car?
tyesac@...
These were "dual service" stock & coke loading. Which is why they also have Caswell operating drop doors in the floor.
Tom Casey
-----Original Message----- From: Al Kresse water.kresse@... [STMFC] To: STMFC Sent: Tue, Mar 7, 2017 1:53 pm Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: What is this car? Solid top areas had pull-down feed bins I believe?
Al Kresse
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Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted
Tony
Granted, it is a size of tank car that is highly desirable! But didn't TRIX previously try to render this car, and they ran into a lot of flak here for their mistakes too? That was Strike ONE. Now, Strike TWO. It's time for somebody to hit a HOME RUN, I think. I'm patient. I'm pretty sure that David Lehlbach (Tangent) is planning to do some more good work building on that beautiful tank car tooling he's already done. I can wait. There's plenty of stuff in the queue. Tim O'Connor Tim O'Connor wrote: If you mean on the jacket, those are bolts, not rivets. Handrails, last time I checked, can be replaced (along with the heavy ladder). The walkway is pretty lame, there I agree. And full agreement with the comparison to Tangent models. It's kind of like the BLI releases of the NYC steel boxcars. Yeah, well short of great models, but we needed the cars. These BLI tank cars are very badly needed 6000-gallon insulated cars. Reminds me in a way of what we always used to say about Walthers (some still do): good news is that the model has been produced, bad news is that Walthers did it. Tony Thompson |
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Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted
Tony Thompson
Tim O'Connor wrote:
If you mean on the jacket, those are bolts, not rivets. Handrails, last time I checked, can be replaced (along with the heavy ladder). The walkway is pretty lame, there I agree. And full agreement with the comparison to Tangent models. It's kind of like the BLI releases of the NYC steel boxcars. Yeah, well short of great models, but we needed the cars. These BLI tank cars are very badly needed 6000-gallon insulated cars. Reminds me in a way of what we always used to say about Walthers (some still do): good news is that the model has been produced, bad news is that Walthers did it. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@... Publishers of books on railroad history |
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Re: automobile cars
Atlantic Coast Line also had this practice. Tim O' Many of the earlier Santa Fe Fe-class cars were lettered Furniture and Automobile on the car side. |
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Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted
> If it is any help in your decision, I know one of our STMFC members was > assisting them with this project, a tank car guy (not I). Ed Hawkins has made no secret of his assistance. Ed will help any manufacturer who asks for good prototype information - In this case, Broadway wanted information on paint and lettering, as Ed has already posted here. And evidently BLI tried to use the information effectively. But a funky model with giant rivets, fat handrails, a 4" thick solid walkway. I'm sorry, but park this blob next to a TANGENT tank car and you will not be happy with the comparison. My days of buying "toy" trains are long past. Tim O'Connor |
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Re: Pennsy X29
mark_landgraf
No rivets are sold by their shank size. The head is usually almost twice the shank size. The drawing called out a 5/8 inch rivet. I had hoped to avoid this by calling out the hole size. Scaling the rivet head vs. the rung diameter of 3/4, the rivet head is larger than the rung. Mark
I think you mean the rivet heads are 3/4" in diameter, a 3/4" rivet isn't going into a 5/8" hole, at least not without a LOT of force. Todd Horton From: "Mark Landgraf mark_landgraf@... [STMFC]" To: "'Robert J. Amsler, Jr.' mpfan1@... [STMFC]" ; STMFC@... Sent: Tuesday, March 7, 2017 1:50 PM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Pennsy X29 Bob According to a PRR plan sheet for ladders, the X29 has The vertical Styles are 1-3/4 by 1-3/4 by 3/16 Outside to outside the ladder width is 20 The rungs have the rivet holes 18-1/4 apart The rungs are 3/4 inch in diameter The rivets fit into a 5/8 hole The vertical spacing, rung to rung is 15-3/4 Hope this helps Mark
Good morning: I am hope someone on the list may know this information. I looking for the width of the ladders on Pennsy X29 box cars so I can get the correct ladder from Pierre. I looked at the all steel book from Speedwitch and the drawings show the distance between the rungs but not the stiles. Thanks, Bob Amsler Saint Louis, Missouri |
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Re: What is this car?
Al Kresse <water.kresse@...>
Solid top areas had pull-down feed bins I believe? Al Kresse
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Re: What is this car?
Al Kresse <water.kresse@...>
C&O had them also . . . . Mr Garstang, later Master Mechanic for C&O helped in their design. Al Kresse
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Re: What is this car?
Ray Breyer
>>...But I've never seen a stock car that has those boards on the top of the sides/ends (on any RR).... >>...But the top of the sides (and ends) are something I've never seen anywhere on any RR's stock car.... >>Jim B. Hi Jim, Really? That's a little surprising, because at one time they were de rigueur on almost every stock car built. Just in my own photo collection, I have images of cars from the following roads with this type of large lettering board: A&NM, ATSF, BCE, C&A, C>, C&S, C&NW, CA&CRW, CB&Q, CCC&StL, CGW, CMO, CP, CRI&P, CC&O, CWV&S, D&RG, DL&W, GN, Hicks, IC, I-GN, KCMO, LPTC, LS&MS, LV, M&NA, M&O, Mather, Milwaukee, MKT, MP, NdeM, NP, NKP, NYC&HR, PM, PRR, RGS, Rutland, SLSF, Soo, SSW, W&LE, Wabash, WC, WM. Cyril Durrenberger wrote an article for Model Railroading magazine in the early '00's on matching the old Roundhouse (and AHM) shorty stock car to the prototype, and showcased a couple of dozen of these cars. True, this type of stock car wasn't much built after 1910, but the type survived into WWII. Regards, Ray Breyer Elgin, IL |
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Re: Pennsy X29
Todd Horton
My mistake, I saw rungs and that translated into rivets somehow. I apologize for the error. Todd Horton From: "Mark Landgraf mark_landgraf@... [STMFC]" To: "'Robert J. Amsler, Jr.' mpfan1@... [STMFC]" ; STMFC@... Sent: Tuesday, March 7, 2017 1:50 PM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Pennsy X29 Bob According to a PRR plan sheet for ladders, the X29 has The vertical Styles are 1-3/4 by 1-3/4 by 3/16 Outside to outside the ladder width is 20 The rungs have the rivet holes 18-1/4 apart The rungs are 3/4 inch in diameter The rivets fit into a 5/8 hole The vertical spacing, rung to rung is 15-3/4 Hope this helps Mark
Good morning: I am hope someone on the list may know this information. I looking for the width of the ladders on Pennsy X29 box cars so I can get the correct ladder from Pierre. I looked at the all steel book from Speedwitch and the drawings show the distance between the rungs but not the stiles. Thanks, Bob Amsler Saint Louis, Missouri |
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Re: What is this car?
Steve SANDIFER
It is a standard old ATSF stock car. The SK-G, H, K, L, N, and P all had that look at one time with the top boards on the side. Many were rebuilt later in life without the upper boards. Westerfield makes kits of some of these. Most had caswell drop bottoms (not a good way to unload cattle!) and hatches in the roof so they could haul coke back west.
You can see the N and P models at http://old.atsfrr.org/resources/Sandifer/Clinics/Stk/Mod/Westfld.htm
__________________________________________________ J. Stephen Sandifer
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 11:38 PM To: STMFC@... Subject: [STMFC] What is this car?
Hi guys, |
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Re: Pennsy X29
Todd Horton
I think you mean the rivet heads are 3/4" in diameter, a 3/4" rivet isn't going into a 5/8" hole, at least not without a LOT of force. Todd Horton From: "Mark Landgraf mark_landgraf@... [STMFC]" To: "'Robert J. Amsler, Jr.' mpfan1@... [STMFC]" Sent: Tuesday, March 7, 2017 1:50 PM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Pennsy X29 Bob According to a PRR plan sheet for ladders, the X29 has The vertical Styles are 1-3/4 by 1-3/4 by 3/16 Outside to outside the ladder width is 20 The rungs have the rivet holes 18-1/4 apart The rungs are 3/4 inch in diameter The rivets fit into a 5/8 hole The vertical spacing, rung to rung is 15-3/4 Hope this helps Mark
Good morning: I am hope someone on the list may know this information. I looking for the width of the ladders on Pennsy X29 box cars so I can get the correct ladder from Pierre. I looked at the all steel book from Speedwitch and the drawings show the distance between the rungs but not the stiles. Thanks, Bob Amsler Saint Louis, Missouri |
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Re: What is this car?
Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
Friends, ATSF Sk-K class cars, as in the second photo, are depicted in Gregg's TRAIN SHED CYCLOPEDIA No. 36, "Freight Cars (Part 2) from the 1919 Car Builders Dictionary. The illustrations include a side view and two interior views. This particular volume also includes a photo and drawings of an more conventional SK-M stock car, plus a side view and end drawing of an Sk-N. Add a photo and drawings of a SFRD Rr-T, and this volume becomes a must for early 20th century Santa Fe modelers. Yours Aye,
Garth Groff
On 3/7/17 1:16 PM, 'Bruce F. Smith'
smithbf@... [STMFC] wrote:
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Re: Pennsy X29
mark_landgraf
Bob According to a PRR plan sheet for ladders, the X29 has The vertical Styles are 1-3/4 by 1-3/4 by 3/16 Outside to outside the ladder width is 20 The rungs have the rivet holes 18-1/4 apart The rungs are 3/4 inch in diameter The rivets fit into a 5/8 hole The vertical spacing, rung to rung is 15-3/4 Hope this helps Mark
Good morning:
I am hope someone on the list may know this information. I looking for the width of the ladders on Pennsy X29 box cars so I can get the correct ladder from Pierre. I looked at the all steel book from Speedwitch and the drawings show the distance between the rungs but not the stiles.
Thanks,
Bob Amsler Saint Louis, Missouri
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Re: What is this car?
ATSF Sk-L & N/P had this configuration: https://id18538.securedata.net/westerfieldmodels.com/merchantmanager/index.php?cPath=130_436
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Thanks! -- Brian Ehni From: STMFC List <STMFC@...> on behalf of STMFC List <STMFC@...> Reply-To: STMFC List <STMFC@...> Date: Tuesday, March 7, 2017 at 12:18 PM To: STMFC List <STMFC@...> Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: What is this car? That pattern of exterior boards was not that uncommon. ATSF had some: see Westerfield's 11500 series. Westerfield also has a similar car from the PRR: the 8700 series. Richard Townsend Lincoln City, OR -----Original Message-----
From: jimbetz jimbetz@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> To: STMFC <STMFC@...> Sent: Tue, Mar 7, 2017 10:02 am Subject: [STMFC] Re: What is this car? Jim Gates and all, I agree with all of your analysis - but that stock car still has me wondering. It is obvious, even to me, that it started life as a stock car. But I've never seen a stock car that has those boards on the top of the sides/ends (on any RR). Is it possible that the roof was removed, the inside of the car lined with wood, extensions added, and it is used in chip hopper service? I don't think so - the location and the entire train would seem to argue otherwise. But the top of the sides (and ends) are something I've never seen anywhere on any RR's stock car. Is there an ATSF guy (I am not) on this list who can confirm that it is a stock car? Probable number? Probable date for the photo? - Jim B. |
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Re: What is this car?
Richard Townsend
That pattern of exterior boards was not that uncommon. ATSF had some: see Westerfield's 11500 series. Westerfield also has a similar car from the PRR: the 8700 series.
Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR
-----Original Message----- From: jimbetz jimbetz@... [STMFC] To: STMFC Sent: Tue, Mar 7, 2017 10:02 am Subject: [STMFC] Re: What is this car? Jim Gates and all,
I agree with all of your analysis - but that stock car still has me wondering. It is obvious, even to me, that it started life as a stock car. But I've never seen a stock car that has those boards on the top of the sides/ends (on any RR). Is it possible that the roof was removed, the inside of the car lined with wood, extensions added, and it is used in chip hopper service? I don't think so - the location and the entire train would seem to argue otherwise. But the top of the sides (and ends) are something I've never seen anywhere on any RR's stock car. Is there an ATSF guy (I am not) on this list who can confirm that it is a stock car? Probable number? Probable date for the photo? - Jim B. |
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Re: What is this car?
Jim,
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Here are some stock car photos that confirm that the car in the photo is a stock car.
1943 photo by Jack Delano
AC&F builder’s photo of class Sk-K #57143
http://sfrhms.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/SK-K-A2005-0050-Temple-Railroad-Heritage-Museum-046.jpg
Note that the Sk-K was designed to back haul coke.
Here’s a CGW car with a similar appearance
Regards Bruce
Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
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Stock car interiors
Jared Harper
Were the interiors of stock cars painted or were they natural wood? Jared Harper |
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Re: What is this car?
Jim Gates and all,
I agree with all of your analysis - but that stock car still has me wondering. It is obvious, even to me, that it started life as a stock car. But I've never seen a stock car that has those boards on the top of the sides/ends (on any RR). Is it possible that the roof was removed, the inside of the car lined with wood, extensions added, and it is used in chip hopper service? I don't think so - the location and the entire train would seem to argue otherwise. But the top of the sides (and ends) are something I've never seen anywhere on any RR's stock car. Is there an ATSF guy (I am not) on this list who can confirm that it is a stock car? Probable number? Probable date for the photo? - Jim B. |
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