Date   

Re: Not Just For Automobiles

Tony Thompson
 

Bob Chaparro wrote:

 
This photo link below is from a website (http://dalakarl.com/project00.html)
about the restoration of a Aeronca KCA-14 airplane.
I know very little about airplanes but I can certainly identify a boxcar:


Caption: “The way in which Aeroncas travelled to California in those days was by boxcar. There is a picture of one such sister ship being loaded at the factory in one of the Aeronca books.”

    Terrific photo, Bob, and another reason to operate double-door box cars on one's layout, other than automobiles and lumber .

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Not Just For Automobiles

thecitrusbelt@...
 

This photo link below is from a website (http://dalakarl.com/project00.html)

about the restoration of a Aeronca KCA-14 airplane.

 

I know very little about airplanes but I can certainly identify a boxcar:

 

http://dalakarl.com/boxcar.jpg

 

Caption: “The way in which Aeroncas travelled to California in those days was by boxcar. There is a picture of one such sister ship being loaded at the factory in one of the Aeronca books.”

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Re: PRR X29D box car questions (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Mike;

I do not have a photo at hand with that low a car number. If you can share it with me via my email address I can provide any insights I might have. That series is one of those that had a mix of high end tack boards and low door tack boards...

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 11:04 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] Re: PRR X29D box car questions (UNCLASSIFIED)



Thank you for your feedback, Elden----

My statement,


"I have come to suspect (maybe I read it) that at least the last block, perhaps all three blocks, were numbered downward, that is, newer cars were assigned lower numbers."



was based in part by two details, perhaps neither of which proves anything. First, the three blocks of car numbers were assigned in 'reverse' order. Each was the next lower block for each new group. Perhaps this is nothing unusual.

What had caused me to look further however was the discovery of car 23178 in service on March 19, 1956. This would have been perhaps just 8-10 weeks after the start of the program which ran from January to July. Car 23178 is much closer to the top end of the series than to the low end. This too perhaps proves nothing as actual manufacturing production schedules might not always coincide with what are listed as the 'financial' record. Anything you might tell me about X29D's construction timing would be welcome such as completion time, first re-weigh, etc. I have a Wright Trak model I would like to stencil for this car.

Thanks----Mike Schleigh



On Monday, August 10, 2015 10:03 AM, "'Gatwood, Elden SAW' elden.j.gatwood@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:




Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Guys;

The X29D are a very complicated class. The X29D had a lot of little detail differences than have been generally discussed, either for the kit research, or in the RPCyc article, IIRC. While some of the standard details have been talked out, there are still things like the "high tackboard/low tackboard" discussion that never made it to press. The brake equipment story also does not have a final answer, but some interesting leads.

I am not sure I understand your question, Mike. Series 25501-26500 were indeed the highest numbered block, but were all produced first, and in sequence, as-built, with stenciling stating "BLT. 8 24" (rebuilt 1952), not "rebuilt" as in the later series. They do all appear to have been numbered upwards in each series.

There is also the issue of which cars got the "Don't Stand Me Still" logo, and in what color.

If you're interested, I can dig up my "to-date" data package.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 7:10 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] Re: PRR X29D box car questions



Hello Group!

There was a difference, a distinctive one, between early and late production X29D cars.

The first group of 1000 cars (25501-26500, 9/1952-4/1953) were built with the "short taper" 1-3-4 ID ends. Groups two and three (23601-25500, 6/1955-1/1956 and 22301-23500, 1/1956-7/1956, 1900 and 1200 cars respectively, were made with the "long taper" 1-3-4 ID ends. The earlier noted F&C model covers the first block of cars. Not mentioned is the Wright Trak model which captured that difference with a nicely done model of the newer two blocks. These X29D distinctions are well covered in RP CYC 26.

I have come to suspect (maybe I read it) that at least the last block, perhaps all three blocks, were numbered downward, that is, newer cars were assigned lower numbers. Can anyone verify this?

Regards to all----Mike Schleigh



On Sunday, August 9, 2015 4:31 PM, "obermeyern@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:




Ben,

Thank you for the information. Any chance that you know the PC number?

Thanks!
Nate





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE








Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Re: PRR X29D box car questions (UNCLASSIFIED)

Schleigh Mike
 

Thank you for your feedback, Elden----

My statement,

"I have come to suspect (maybe I read it) that at least the last block, perhaps all three blocks, were numbered downward, that is, newer cars were assigned lower numbers."

was based in part by two details, perhaps neither of which proves anything.  First, the three blocks of car numbers were assigned in 'reverse' order.  Each was the next lower block for each new group.  Perhaps this is nothing unusual.

What had caused me to look further however was the discovery of car 23178 in service on March 19, 1956.  This would have been perhaps just 8-10 weeks after the start of the program which ran from January to July.  Car 23178 is much closer to the top end of the series than to the low end.  This too perhaps proves nothing as actual manufacturing production schedules might not always coincide with what are listed as the 'financial' record.  Anything you might tell me about X29D's construction timing would be welcome such as completion time, first re-weigh, etc.  I have a Wright Trak model I would like to stencil for this car.

Thanks----Mike Schleigh



On Monday, August 10, 2015 10:03 AM, "'Gatwood, Elden SAW' elden.j.gatwood@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Guys;

The X29D are a very complicated class. The X29D had a lot of little detail differences than have been generally discussed, either for the kit research, or in the RPCyc article, IIRC. While some of the standard details have been talked out, there are still things like the "high tackboard/low tackboard" discussion that never made it to press. The brake equipment story also does not have a final answer, but some interesting leads.

I am not sure I understand your question, Mike. Series 25501-26500 were indeed the highest numbered block, but were all produced first, and in sequence, as-built, with stenciling stating "BLT. 8 24" (rebuilt 1952), not "rebuilt" as in the later series. They do all appear to have been numbered upwards in each series.

There is also the issue of which cars got the "Don't Stand Me Still" logo, and in what color.

If you're interested, I can dig up my "to-date" data package.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 7:10 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] Re: PRR X29D box car questions



Hello Group!

There was a difference, a distinctive one, between early and late production X29D cars.

The first group of 1000 cars (25501-26500, 9/1952-4/1953) were built with the "short taper" 1-3-4 ID ends. Groups two and three (23601-25500, 6/1955-1/1956 and 22301-23500, 1/1956-7/1956, 1900 and 1200 cars respectively, were made with the "long taper" 1-3-4 ID ends. The earlier noted F&C model covers the first block of cars. Not mentioned is the Wright Trak model which captured that difference with a nicely done model of the newer two blocks. These X29D distinctions are well covered in RP CYC 26.

I have come to suspect (maybe I read it) that at least the last block, perhaps all three blocks, were numbered downward, that is, newer cars were assigned lower numbers. Can anyone verify this?

Regards to all----Mike Schleigh



On Sunday, August 9, 2015 4:31 PM, "obermeyern@... [STMFC]" wrote:




Ben,

Thank you for the information. Any chance that you know the PC number?

Thanks!
Nate





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE





Re: vacuum

Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 8/10/2015 7:22 AM, 'Steve Sandifer' steve.sandifer@... [STMFC] wrote:
How about a pressure cooker?

    Probably work.  You could drill and tap for the connection.  Not sure what their max psi is, probably around 20.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: vacuum

Steve SANDIFER
 

How about a pressure cooker?

 

__________________________________________________

J. Stephen Sandifer

Minister Emeritus, Southwest Central Church of Christ

Webmaster, Santa Fe Railway Historical and Modeling Society

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 9:21 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] vacuum

 

 

On 8/10/2015 6:54 AM, Alfred Westerfield westerfieldalfred@... [STMFC] wrote:

Doug - Thanks for the info.  I have several plastic chambers I used initially in the business.  They end to implode with heavy use, something that I don't contemplate. - Al Westerfield


    If you can find an old paint pot you can use a compressor like Tom does.  If I remember correctly you only need about 40/50psi.



-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: vacuum

Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 8/10/2015 6:54 AM, Alfred Westerfield westerfieldalfred@... [STMFC] wrote:
Doug - Thanks for the info.  I have several plastic chambers I used initially in the business.  They end to implode with heavy use, something that I don't contemplate. - Al Westerfield

    If you can find an old paint pot you can use a compressor like Tom does.  If I remember correctly you only need about 40/50psi.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Re: PRR X29D box car questions (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Guys;

The X29D are a very complicated class. The X29D had a lot of little detail differences than have been generally discussed, either for the kit research, or in the RPCyc article, IIRC. While some of the standard details have been talked out, there are still things like the "high tackboard/low tackboard" discussion that never made it to press. The brake equipment story also does not have a final answer, but some interesting leads.

I am not sure I understand your question, Mike. Series 25501-26500 were indeed the highest numbered block, but were all produced first, and in sequence, as-built, with stenciling stating "BLT. 8 24" (rebuilt 1952), not "rebuilt" as in the later series. They do all appear to have been numbered upwards in each series.

There is also the issue of which cars got the "Don't Stand Me Still" logo, and in what color.

If you're interested, I can dig up my "to-date" data package.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 7:10 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] Re: PRR X29D box car questions



Hello Group!

There was a difference, a distinctive one, between early and late production X29D cars.

The first group of 1000 cars (25501-26500, 9/1952-4/1953) were built with the "short taper" 1-3-4 ID ends. Groups two and three (23601-25500, 6/1955-1/1956 and 22301-23500, 1/1956-7/1956, 1900 and 1200 cars respectively, were made with the "long taper" 1-3-4 ID ends. The earlier noted F&C model covers the first block of cars. Not mentioned is the Wright Trak model which captured that difference with a nicely done model of the newer two blocks. These X29D distinctions are well covered in RP CYC 26.

I have come to suspect (maybe I read it) that at least the last block, perhaps all three blocks, were numbered downward, that is, newer cars were assigned lower numbers. Can anyone verify this?

Regards to all----Mike Schleigh



On Sunday, August 9, 2015 4:31 PM, "obermeyern@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:




Ben,

Thank you for the information. Any chance that you know the PC number?

Thanks!
Nate





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: vacuum

 

Doug - Thanks for the info.  I have several plastic chambers I used initially in the business.  They end to implode with heavy use, something that I don't contemplate. - Al Westerfield



On Monday, August 10, 2015 12:27 AM, "dmacleod@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
 Al,  I used a Sears and Roebuck 3/4 hp portable running it backwards on the plumbing to achieve the vacuum needed to debubble the investment for lost wax casting.  It had enough vacuum to cause water to boil at room temperature.  That should be more the enough for your needs.  That  arrangement was later replaced with a used vacuum pump.found for sale in a local newspaper. 
If you shop vacuum will pulled enough vacuum to boiler water at room temperature that should work. 
Vacuum bells can be found at the wholesale jewelry suppliers.  They are kind of expensive.
Doug Macleod



 Posted by: "Alfred Westerfield" westerfieldalfred@... al_westerfield
    Date: Sat Aug 8, 2015 8:08 pm ((PDT))

While resuming my modeling efforts I find I need some additional castings that are too fine to fill molds without vacuum. Obviously I now have no access to a high quality vacuum pump and don't wish to pay for one. Does anyone know if I can get away with a $100 pump? I'll be using very thin urethane resin. And I can accept a high percentage of rejects. - Al Westerfield



Re: ACL Freight Car Roster

golden1014
 

Hi John,


John Golden here in St. Louis.  How's it going?  I'm preparing a fairly extensive presentation on ACL Box Cars for Naperville and other RPM events.  I'm working with Buddy and Larry Goolsby on it.  I'd appreciate seeing your information.  Would you mind sending it to me at Golden1014@..., please?  I'll send you a copy of the presentation.  I'm about halfway done with it--got some great photos from all around.  I can send you an in-progress copy if you'd like--just let me know.


John


John Golden

O'Fallon, IL


Re: PRR X29D box car questions

Schleigh Mike
 

Hello Group!

There was a difference, a distinctive one, between early and late production X29D cars.

The first group of 1000 cars (25501-26500, 9/1952-4/1953) were built with the "short taper" 1-3-4 ID ends.  Groups two and three (23601-25500, 6/1955-1/1956 and 22301-23500, 1/1956-7/1956, 1900 and 1200 cars respectively, were made with the "long taper" 1-3-4 ID ends.  The earlier noted F&C model covers the first block of cars.  Not mentioned is the Wright Trak model which captured that difference with a nicely done model of the newer two blocks.  These X29D distinctions are well covered in RP CYC 26.

I have come to suspect (maybe I read it) that at least the last block, perhaps all three blocks, were numbered downward, that is, newer cars were assigned lower numbers.  Can anyone verify this?

Regards to all----Mike Schleigh



On Sunday, August 9, 2015 4:31 PM, "obermeyern@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
Ben,

Thank you for the information. Any chance that you know the PC number?

Thanks!
Nate



Re: B&O container chassis question

riverman_vt@...
 

Tim,

     What would be so surprising about that? The Boston & Maine was offering "Freightainer"
service in 1928 with containers about twice the size of those the Youngstown offered some
ten years later. It was given up from a lack of demand and the fact that no other reailroads
really seemed interested at that time.

Cordially, Don Valetnine


Re: vacuum

dmacleod@...
 

 Al,  I used a Sears and Roebuck 3/4 hp portable running it backwards on the plumbing to achieve the vacuum needed to debubble the investment for lost wax casting.  It had enough vacuum to cause water to boil at room temperature.  That should be more the enough for your needs.  That  arrangement was later replaced with a used vacuum pump.found for sale in a local newspaper. 
If you shop vacuum will pulled enough vacuum to boiler water at room temperature that should work. 
Vacuum bells can be found at the wholesale jewelry suppliers.  They are kind of expensive.
Doug Macleod



 Posted by: "Alfred Westerfield" westerfieldalfred@... al_westerfield
    Date: Sat Aug 8, 2015 8:08 pm ((PDT))

While resuming my modeling efforts I find I need some additional castings that are too fine to fill molds without vacuum. Obviously I now have no access to a high quality vacuum pump and don't wish to pay for one. Does anyone know if I can get away with a $100 pump? I'll be using very thin urethane resin. And I can accept a high percentage of rejects. - Al Westerfield


Re: B&O container chassis question

rwitt_2000
 

Tim,

Yes it is. In the late 1950s, the B&O and the MP instituted a special Baltimore to St. Louis COFC service using custom designed containers and special flat cars to carry them.

Part of the need for COFC was the low clearances on the B&O Parkerburg sub: Grafton to Parkersburg.

It was short lived service because the B&O day-lighted all the tunnels by the early 1960s allowing regular TOFC traffic.

There are some photos on the web for the MP equipment. I will look for the link. There were some articles published in the trade press when the service started.

An side the B&O recovered the relatively new underframes applied in ~1955 to the rebuilt M-15 wagon-top boxcars and converted some to TOFCEE and COFC service.

Regards,

Bob Witt


Re: B&O container chassis question

Paul Koehler
 

Tim:

 

This is not a standard container chassis, not there is no provision for locking/attaching the container to the chassis.  This is for a special unit that attaches to it.  Not for regular COFC service.

 

Paul C. Koehler

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2015 6:03 PM
To: stmfc@...
Subject: [STMFC] B&O container chassis question

 

 


could this be the correct date -- 1957 ? did the B&O operate COFC this early?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/381256721186

Tim O'Connor


Re: ACL Freight Car Roster

John Sykes III
 

Reposted the file with corrections provided by the ACL/SAL group (Buddy Hill), added an IH column for the appropriate cars & corrected formatting errors.  This last issue was created when I converted the file from XLSX to XLS format.  If anyone has to have XLS format, let me know off-group and I will see if I can correct the formatting problems.  Again, let me know if you find any other errors.

-- John


New file uploaded to STMFC

STMFC@...
 

Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC
group.


File : /Freight Car Rosters/ACL_1954-1958_Freight_Roster.xlsx
Uploaded by : johnsykesiii <johnsykesiii@...>
Description : From Jan 1954 & Apr 1958 ORERs w/data from 1957 ACL diagram book & other sources - w/corrections 8/9/15. Bonus ACL freight truck class list.


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/STMFC/files/Freight%20Car%20Rosters/ACL_1954-1958_Freight_Roster.xlsx


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


johnsykesiii <johnsykesiii@...>


Re: Overexposed, but still, freight cars

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Thanks. Much better images. Steamtown will be advised.



Schuyler



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2015 8:05 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Overexposed, but still, freight cars





Schuyler,

Believe the link to the Harlem Transfer scan is printed backwards. Several
links to this and other scans of Harlem Transfer were posted by Mike Del
Vecchio to the STMFC back on 9-28-12. That link is:

http://lists.railfan.net/listthumb.cgi?erielack-09-28-12

Matt Herson

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2015 12:52 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Overexposed, but still, freight cars

http://lists.railfan.net/erielackphoto.cgi?erielack-08-09-15/C1417.jpg

Harlem Transfer, DL&W, date unknown

Schuyler


B&O container chassis question

Tim O'Connor
 

could this be the correct date -- 1957 ? did the B&O operate COFC this early?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/381256721186

Tim O'Connor


Re: KCS #20820 and 20834 missing from 1949 ORER?

mopacfirst
 

This is probably a pointless note, but since I have six or eight of the Life-Like original kits I went to check if any were KCS.  Sorry to report none are, they're mostly NYC and SP.  Still, there are more of them here than I am ever likely to need.

PS they strip pretty well.


Ron Merrick

60621 - 60640 of 196872