Date   

Re: Some Kind Of Walkway?

Dave Nelson
 

Looking again I believe you are correct.  At this time there were no building son the east side of the street at that location.

 

Dave Nelson

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2014 3:57 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Some Kind Of Walkway?

 




Are you sure sure the "buildings are on the east side of Michigan Avenue"?  I think they are on the west side.

 

Roy Wojahn

 

On Tuesday, September 2, 2014 12:25 PM, "'Dave Nelson' Lake_Muskoka@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

 

That is correct.  All those tall buildings you see are on the east side of Michigan Ave and behind the photographer is Lake Michigan.  IIRC off to the right is the big beer sign that appears in some of the Delano photos from 1943.

 

Dave Nelson

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2014 5:19 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Some Kind Of Walkway?

 



The location appears to be the South Water Street market on the east side of downtown Chicago, just south of the Chicago river. The Prudential building (at 42 stories, the tallest building in Chicago when I was a kid) was later built on air rights over part of this, and Millennium Park (home of "the Bean") now occupies the rest. In the background you can see Chicago South Shore & South Bend interurban trains at their Randolf St. terminal.
Dennis Storzek

 

 





Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

Douglas Harding
 

Don a quick look at a google satellite view of Union IA will show the tracks do run north-south on the far east side of town. There is an east-west road through the center of town that crosses the tracks, county road D65. The north-south road through town, county road S62, is four blocks to the west, or half way across town. Most businesses in town are along D65 west towards the center of town. The railroad is no longer the center. There is one extremely large modern grain complex with metal bins to the north, and a second facility to the south which still has the older wood framed grain elevator covered with corrugated iron.

 

According to the Sanborn map the depot sat halfway between Center and Commercial Streets, between the tracks and Railroad St. East of the tracks, beyond the railroad served buildings are farm fields and the Iowa river, no town or development. Remember this is a small town in Iowa, population is under 400.

 

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Union,+IA+50258/@42.2438075,-93.0625359,1687m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x87efcb05b7e03f11:0x7f8661b79bd47c9e

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


Re: Rosters

John Sykes III
 

Whooo!  Cool it down.  The idea I originally had was to look at the railroads in my home area (Pennsylvania & New Jersey) and see how the freight car fleets changed over the period I was modeling.  The selections I made were primarily fixed by the resources at hand.  I had a complete 1954 ORER and a complete 1958 ORER.  I have some later ones, but the last 1944 and 1949 ORERs that came up on E-bay went for over $100 each - out of my price range.  Also, time and again, surveys show the 1950's steam to diesel transition era is the most popular one with (I hate to admit it) older or should I say "mature" modelers.


Since PRR listed their car classes in the ORER entries, it made that quite easy (except for the 183,000 cars listed).  I found an Erie diagram book from 1956 and a DL&W diagram book from 1952,  which covered 90% of their cars in the mid-50's.  I am considering doing B&O for reasons I previously listed plus the fact that there is a large, active group of B&O modelers or aficionados with lots of photos online and diagram books available at reasonable prices.


The other major factor is that I wanted the database to be easily modified by fans, not locked down in a PDF, HTML or some other format that cannot be easily manipulated by the end user.  So I selected Excel, which any PC with MS Office has (and, I understand, is available for the Mac).


Finally, the File folder I created for these rosters is open to anyone.  I have posted three rosters there, but have yet to see anyone here post a roster for the TAG, Southern, D&H or whatever.  Tony, where's an editable PFE roster?  Let's see more railroads and more time frames, here.  My only request is to make them OPEN and EDITABLE so we can all make changes if we so desire and easily search and sort them to fill our own needs.


P.S.  The online files are only editable by the owner who posted them, but anyone can download and edit them on their own PC.  As far as my files are concerned, if you see errors or have suggestions, send them to me.  I have made a bunch of changes to the DL&W roster based on Mike Del Vecchio's input.


-- John


   


Re: Some Kind Of Walkway?

roy wojahn
 

Are you sure sure the "buildings are on the east side of Michigan Avenue"?  I think they are on the west side.

Roy Wojahn


On Tuesday, September 2, 2014 12:25 PM, "'Dave Nelson' Lake_Muskoka@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
That is correct.  All those tall buildings you see are on the east side of Michigan Ave and behind the photographer is Lake Michigan.  IIRC off to the right is the big beer sign that appears in some of the Delano photos from 1943.
 
Dave Nelson
 
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2014 5:19 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Some Kind Of Walkway?
 


The location appears to be the South Water Street market on the east side of downtown Chicago, just south of the Chicago river. The Prudential building (at 42 stories, the tallest building in Chicago when I was a kid) was later built on air rights over part of this, and Millennium Park (home of "the Bean") now occupies the rest. In the background you can see Chicago South Shore & South Bend interurban trains at their Randolf St. terminal.
Dennis Storzek
 



Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

riverman_vt@...
 

   Something doesn't sound quite right here, Doug. I have a number of ancestors buried

in Union, Iowa and get there on occasion. I believe the the tracks through town are

basically on a north/south axis with the main street in town parallel to them on their

west side. There is one street running east/west that crosses the tracks and ends on

the main street mentioned that also has some business and provides access to a grain

elevator. I believe the depot was once off this street as well but none of this sounds much

like what you describe as Union, Iowa.

 

Cordially, Don Valentine


Re: Some Kind Of Walkway?

Dave Nelson
 

That is correct.  All those tall buildings you see are on the east side of Michigan Ave and behind the photographer is Lake Michigan.  IIRC off to the right is the big beer sign that appears in some of the Delano photos from 1943.

 

Dave Nelson

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2014 5:19 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Some Kind Of Walkway?

 



The location appears to be the South Water Street market on the east side of downtown Chicago, just south of the Chicago river. The Prudential building (at 42 stories, the tallest building in Chicago when I was a kid) was later built on air rights over part of this, and Millennium Park (home of "the Bean") now occupies the rest. In the background you can see Chicago South Shore & South Bend interurban trains at their Randolf St. terminal.
Dennis Storzek

 


Re: Rosters

Tony Thompson
 

Clark Propst wrote:

 
It was 1947 not 49  ; )
What that statement taught me was to be more productive with my time by concentrating on what I’ve chosen to model. The hobby, to me, is all about time management.

  Certainly true about modeling, Clark, no argument. But luckily there are historians among us who learn BEYOND the narrow focus of their own exact era (Richard's October 1947 comes to mind) and not only know more, but share it.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: Chicago past . . . GREAT!

water.kresse@...
 

Real neat website!
!.



Re: STMFC member in the news! Congrats!!!

water.kresse@...
 

Bruce,
 
Nice to be recognized and quoted.
 
Al Kresse . . . now with my seventh Airedale Terrier that keeps me off the PC by demanding "his" walks regularly every few hours
 
.



Re: Some Kind Of Walkway?

np328
 

There are some other photos of this area on the Chicago Past site.

Here are a few links: Note that the photo of the first and second link the first link is found on page 7 here:

http://chicagopast.com/tagged/Michigan+Avenue/page/7  

 

and clicking on the photo takes us to the same here again with other info such as where one would go to get a high resolution print.  

http://encyclopedia.chicagohistory.org/pages/10405.html

more of the area identified as the IC South Water Street Terminal in the photos

http://collections.carli.illinois.edu/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/uic_caps&CISOPTR=105

 

clicking on the links below the photos like the Chicago River photo on the Chicago past link brings up the photo:

http://encyclopedia.chicagohistory.org/pages/10473.html

and one wonders about the fruit auction house or the UP/CNW station behind it. And the reefers lined up right of the overcrossing bridge.

Again, I have posted this link prior: http://chicagopast.com/archive, there is a lot of railroading here.

The prior posted walkway question photo is also found in the Chicago past site.

 

Jim Dick - St. Paul

 

 


Re: STMFC member in the news!

Bruce Smith
 

Well of course I mentioned both steam era freight cars and Bruceford (something about studying inbreeding amongst the locals there), but for some inexplicable reason, they cut that part of the story!

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."



On Sep 2, 2014, at 10:37 AM, 'Mike Brock' brockm@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

Charlie Vlk, clearly out of scope, writes:


"Off topic, but kudos to STMFC member and PRR expert Bruce Smith.   He is
quoted in a USA TODAY article 'CSI' meets AKC with doggie DNA in which came
today as part of our local paper.
However,  either he was not able to work in steam era PRR freightcars into
the interview or that part was edited out."

But, more importantly, did he manage to work in a comment or two about
Bruceford?

Mike Brock...also clearly out of scope




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Re: STMFC member in the news!

Mikebrock
 

Charlie Vlk, clearly out of scope, writes:


"Off topic, but kudos to STMFC member and PRR expert Bruce Smith. He is quoted in a USA TODAY article 'CSI' meets AKC with doggie DNA in which came today as part of our local paper.
However, either he was not able to work in steam era PRR freightcars into the interview or that part was edited out."

But, more importantly, did he manage to work in a comment or two about Bruceford?

Mike Brock...also clearly out of scope


Re: Rosters

Clark Propst
 

It was 1947 not 49  ; )
 
What that statement taught me was to be more productive with my time by concentrating on what I’ve chosen to model. The hobby, to me, is all about time management.
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


STMFC member in the news!

Charlie Vlk
 

Off topic, but kudos to STMFC member and PRR expert Bruce Smith.   He is quoted in a USA TODAY article ‘CSI’ meets AKC with doggie DNA in which came today as part of our local paper. 

However,  either he was not able to work in steam era PRR freightcars into the interview or that part was edited out.

Charlie Vlk


Re: Rosters

Tony Thompson
 

Clark Propst wrote:

 
Richard Hendrickson put prototype modeling in prospective for me way back. There was a thread on auto license plates. Richards comment was “I know what the California plates looked like in 1949 and that’s all the matters.”
It’s all about focus and discipline. Focus on the freight cars you want to model, not the whole railroad.

      Luckily for us all, Clark, Richard didn't really believe in the kind of focus you describe, in the case of freight cars. Otherwise he could not have been so helpful to so man with information about cars over a wide range of eras. But it's true that his knowledge went rapidly downhill after about 1954. 

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: Rosters

Tony Thompson
 

Richard Hendrickson put prototype modeling in prospective for me way back. There was a thread on auto license plates. Richards comment was “I know what the California plates looked like in 1949 and that’s all the matters.”
It’s all about focus and discipline. Focus on the freight cars you want to model, not the whole railroad.

     That would, of course, be 1947 in Richard's case. Not, as it happens, that he had ever APPLIED such license plates to any vehicle models, but he did have a very good photo of a 1947 California plate.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

Douglas Harding
 

Steve that is one of the photos I have. Here is the link to the bric-block replacement depot at Union.

http://digital.lib.uiowa.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/railroadiana/id/734/rec/51

 

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Tuesday, September 2, 2014 12:05 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

 

 

Here is a link to a photo of the old Union, IA M&StL Depot.  It doesn’t look like the building in Ted’s photos, unfortunately.

 

http://digital.lib.uiowa.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/railroadiana/id/736/rec/52

 

This collection has lots of Iowa depot photos, in case someone wants to take pot luck,

 

Regards,

Steve Hile

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2014 11:32 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

 

 

I have not yet acquired the book in question, but this discussion has intrigued me because of the possible M&StL context. Based upon the book’s description, I assume all the photos were taken in the same location/town between 1938 -1941. Now as to the suggestion of Union IA being the location of the photos, I have photos of both depots Gene mentions. Neither has horizontal siding, and the later bric-block structure was constructed after WWII, circa 1948/9, after the photos were taken. Now there were M&StL depots with horizontal siding, but not in Union IA. Looking at the book’s cover photo, I can tell you the chimney does not match the location or style of the chimney on the M&StL wood depot in Union, IA.

 

M&StL stations signs were typically white with black outline and letters. Some had the station/town name, others show M&StL or Minneapolis & St Louis. Early signs were wood, later ones were porcelain covered metal. Photos show the Union depot does have the town name sign.

 

Nor am I familiar with the “typical M&StL black and white "barber pole" painting of the post on the railroad crossing sign”. I had to search my photos to see any, not too many of them visible. None I could find on former Iowa Central trackage, ie Union.

 

Union IA had no tracks behind the depot. Sanborn maps show the depot sat on the west side of the tracks south of Center St, at the far east side of town. The Methodist Church (which no longer exists) was located at the corner of Davis and Main, some distance from the tracks.

 

Guess I need to get a copy of Ted’s book.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Here is a link to a photo of the old Union, IA M&StL Depot.  It doesn’t look like the building in Ted’s photos, unfortunately.

 

http://digital.lib.uiowa.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/railroadiana/id/736/rec/52

 

This collection has lots of Iowa depot photos, in case someone wants to take pot luck,

 

Regards,

Steve Hile

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2014 11:32 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

 

 

I have not yet acquired the book in question, but this discussion has intrigued me because of the possible M&StL context. Based upon the book’s description, I assume all the photos were taken in the same location/town between 1938 -1941. Now as to the suggestion of Union IA being the location of the photos, I have photos of both depots Gene mentions. Neither has horizontal siding, and the later bric-block structure was constructed after WWII, circa 1948/9, after the photos were taken. Now there were M&StL depots with horizontal siding, but not in Union IA. Looking at the book’s cover photo, I can tell you the chimney does not match the location or style of the chimney on the M&StL wood depot in Union, IA.

 

M&StL stations signs were typically white with black outline and letters. Some had the station/town name, others show M&StL or Minneapolis & St Louis. Early signs were wood, later ones were porcelain covered metal. Photos show the Union depot does have the town name sign.

 

Nor am I familiar with the “typical M&StL black and white "barber pole" painting of the post on the railroad crossing sign”. I had to search my photos to see any, not too many of them visible. None I could find on former Iowa Central trackage, ie Union.

 

Union IA had no tracks behind the depot. Sanborn maps show the depot sat on the west side of the tracks south of Center St, at the far east side of town. The Methodist Church (which no longer exists) was located at the corner of Davis and Main, some distance from the tracks.

 

Guess I need to get a copy of Ted’s book.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

Douglas Harding
 

I have not yet acquired the book in question, but this discussion has intrigued me because of the possible M&StL context. Based upon the book’s description, I assume all the photos were taken in the same location/town between 1938 -1941. Now as to the suggestion of Union IA being the location of the photos, I have photos of both depots Gene mentions. Neither has horizontal siding, and the later bric-block structure was constructed after WWII, circa 1948/9, after the photos were taken. Now there were M&StL depots with horizontal siding, but not in Union IA. Looking at the book’s cover photo, I can tell you the chimney does not match the location or style of the chimney on the M&StL wood depot in Union, IA.

 

M&StL stations signs were typically white with black outline and letters. Some had the station/town name, others show M&StL or Minneapolis & St Louis. Early signs were wood, later ones were porcelain covered metal. Photos show the Union depot does have the town name sign.

 

Nor am I familiar with the “typical M&StL black and white "barber pole" painting of the post on the railroad crossing sign”. I had to search my photos to see any, not too many of them visible. None I could find on former Iowa Central trackage, ie Union.

 

Union IA had no tracks behind the depot. Sanborn maps show the depot sat on the west side of the tracks south of Center St, at the far east side of town. The Methodist Church (which no longer exists) was located at the corner of Davis and Main, some distance from the tracks.

 

Guess I need to get a copy of Ted’s book.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


Re: Speedwitch's "Freight Cars in Context" Mystery

genegreen1942@...
 

First, I clearly need to buy the book.

Second, none of you can imagine how much I would like the location to be Union, Iowa.  I have a couple of strong connections to the second depot in Union.   My drawings of that depot were published in North Western Lines and the last agent there was my cousin.

I don't recall a track behind the depot in recent years but . . .  

There was sufficient slope ( more or less to the west) away from the track in front of the depot to permit a small truck to back up to the depot and have the truck bed about level with the depot floor.  It all could have been different in earlier times.

My next task is to prove there was once a depot in Union, Iowa, with horizontal siding.

Gene Green

67181 - 67200 of 194765